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Old
07-11-2005, 11:25 PM
  #26
Big Phil
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I think if you throw in two or three Cups for Rick Middleton then he'd be in the Hall of Fame. He played in 3 Cup finals. He had believe it or not 33 points in the '83 playoffs by not even making the Cup final. If the Bruins win a Cup then he's probably a Conn Smythe winner and they almost always get in there.

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07-12-2005, 12:02 AM
  #27
Fish on The Sand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada
I've said it once, I'll say it again: the difference between Mike Gartner and Bernie Nichols is Gartner is the owner of what will likely be one of hockey's most enduring and respected records. 15, 20, maybe even 25 years from now, Gartner's string of 30 goal seasons will still be talked about in the highest regard. It's a record that will be one of the hardest to break, right up there with some of Gretzky's and Glenn Hall's consecutive games streak. (Which SI once listed as the hardest to break in sports). That's what got Gartner into the Hall. Longevity and consistency is one thing. Lots of players not in the Hall have that. Longevity and consistency that reach mind-boggling, historic levels are another. Gartner did what Gretzky, Howe, Hull (both of them), Kurri, Richard and all the others couldn't do. That's why he's in the Hall.

Nicholls, sadly, doesn't have that on his resume. He was a heck of a player before Gretzky arrived, an even better player with Gretzky, and a very good player after the trade, but Bernie Nichols doesn't have anything on his resume that lifts him into an HHOF class.
that streak will be broken very, very soon by Jaromir Jagr. He is at 13, that streak is as good as done.

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07-12-2005, 12:06 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogopogo
Here is a list of centers that were given significant Hart Trophy consideration during Gretzky and Lemieux's era. The surname Nicholls is noticeably absent. Can Bernie really be considered great?

Dale Hawerchuk 2nd 1985
Peter Stastny 7th 1986
Doug Gilmour 5th, Dale Hawerchuk 6th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1987
Steve Yzerman 4th, Denis Savard 5th Dale Hawerchuk 7th 1988
Steve Yzerman 3rd 1989
Mark Messier 1st, Pat Lafontaine 5th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1990
Joe Sakic 7th 1991
Mark Messier 1st, Jeremy Roenick 6th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1992
Doug Gilmour 2nd, Pat Lafontaine 3rd, Adam Oates 4th, Pierre Turgeon 5th 1993
Sergei Fedorov 1st, Doug Gilmour 4th 1994
Eric Lindros 1st 1995
Mark Messier 2nd, Eric Lindros 3rd, Sergei Fedorov 5th, Joe Sakic 7th 1996
Mike Modano 7th 1997

My mistake. There were actually 15 other centers during Gretzky and Lemieux's era that stood out.
You can't define Gretzkey's era as anything post 1995. He just simply wasn't the same player.

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07-12-2005, 01:22 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
You can't define Gretzkey's era as anything post 1995. He just simply wasn't the same player.
Say what????

The guy led the NHL in assists in 1997 and 1998. He was 5th in the scoring race in 1997 and 4th in 1998.

Gretzky was great right to the end.


Last edited by Ogopogo*: 07-12-2005 at 10:27 AM.
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07-12-2005, 03:04 AM
  #30
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Beside all star votes he had impressive stats over all years (Nicholls) and the oddities: he left LA before they reached the finals, he left NY shortly before they won the cup, he joined the Oilers shortly after they won their last Cup and finally left NJ the season before they won their first Cup in 95. No relationship with Dame Fortune that man!

I always sympathized with him and wanted him to get the Cup and apart from that he was an high talented center.

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Old
07-12-2005, 10:37 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPF
Beside all star votes he had impressive stats over all years (Nicholls) and the oddities: he left LA before they reached the finals, he left NY shortly before they won the cup, he joined the Oilers shortly after they won their last Cup and finally left NJ the season before they won their first Cup in 95. No relationship with Dame Fortune that man!
On another point of view:

All teams did well after he left....or before he arrived.... any conclusion ?

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07-12-2005, 01:13 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakos
On another point of view:

All teams did well after he left....or before he arrived.... any conclusion ?

Good point.. I can tell you not many Oilers fans were sad to see Bernie go..

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Old
07-12-2005, 08:22 PM
  #33
Fish on The Sand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogopogo
Say what????

The guy led the NHL in assists in 1997 and 1998. He was 5th in the scoring race in 1997 and 4th in 1998.

Gretzky was great right to the end.
he wasn't the same player. Do you honestly expect a 35 year old Bernie Nichols to be able to compete with guys who werent his contemporaries like Modano, Yashin, Forsberg, Fedorov and Sakic? He didn't have a chance. All the guys I listed hit their prime as gretzkey was leaving his. Nichols didn't have a chance. By the time Gretz slowed down, Nichols was slowing down too.

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Old
07-12-2005, 10:03 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogopogo
Here is a list of centers that were given significant Hart Trophy consideration during Gretzky and Lemieux's era. The surname Nicholls is noticeably absent. Can Bernie really be considered great?

Dale Hawerchuk 2nd 1985
Peter Stastny 7th 1986
Doug Gilmour 5th, Dale Hawerchuk 6th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1987
Steve Yzerman 4th, Denis Savard 5th Dale Hawerchuk 7th 1988
Steve Yzerman 3rd 1989
Mark Messier 1st, Pat Lafontaine 5th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1990
Joe Sakic 7th 1991
Mark Messier 1st, Jeremy Roenick 6th, Steve Yzerman 7th 1992
Doug Gilmour 2nd, Pat Lafontaine 3rd, Adam Oates 4th, Pierre Turgeon 5th 1993
Sergei Fedorov 1st, Doug Gilmour 4th 1994
Eric Lindros 1st 1995
Mark Messier 2nd, Eric Lindros 3rd, Sergei Fedorov 5th, Joe Sakic 7th 1996
Mike Modano 7th 1997

My mistake. There were actually 15 other centers during Gretzky and Lemieux's era that stood out.

Fish, I think you missed the above post. Nicholls played until 1999. So, his prime was from about 1987 - 1993. I still don't see any sign of Bernie being great.

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