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Official Perron Watch Thread (Mod warning #341 copied to OP)

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Old
09-27-2013, 04:09 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2 Minute Minor View Post
It seems like some Blues fans feel threatened by Perron having success elsewhere.

Even if MPS contributes NOTHING, if the Blues make a serious run at a Cup I'll view the move as a success on the whole. I think its going to come down more to team chemistry. There are some new pieces this year (Roy, Morrow, etc) and frankly even Bouwmeester/Leopold were only here briefly last season.

I with Perron all the success, but I'm pretty skeptical of that Edmonton core. Some high-end offensive talent, but I just don't see how it can stand up to a physical game.
I don't really think any of us are threatened by Perron having success elsewhere.

He's a good player but he has flaws and is pretty frustrating.

If that wasn't true he wouldn't have been on the block.

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09-28-2013, 11:43 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Alklha View Post
Wait for a better deal? He was very publicly on the market for close to 2 weeks and that was the best offer we got when every team had their chance to make an offer. It is safe to say we were listening to offers for Halák as well, and didn't like anything we got there. Armstrong gave it plenty of time and that was the offer he decided best going forward.

We could wait and wait and wait, but at some point a trade needed to be made, and if you want to talk cents on the dollar then being forced to offload a player in the 2 weeks before the opening night would have been worse.

We got a 2nd round pick and a player with some solid upside to contribute to this teams style of play for a number of years. It isn't a horrific deal.

If you want to break it down to simply that Doug Armstrong thought Jordan Leopold was more important to this team for this coming season... fair enough. We won't have an answer to that until the end of the year, but with the likes of Jaškin sitting in the AHL then you can certainly see his point of view.
The deal only needed to be made because of the signing of Leopold. If Armstrong and Hitchcock believe that a 33 year old defenseman that was basically run out of a bad team like Buffalo who was embarrassing bad in the playoffs for us is more valuable to a franchise than a young offensive-minded forward, it would be grounds for their immediate dismissal.

The "Blues listened to offers and took the best one because they felt they needed to trade him" plan sure worked out great in the Pronger deal. I am not comparing Perron's value or level of play to Pronger before anyone wants to build a straw man off of that. I am merely comparing the circumstances around their departures. When a trade is made from a position of weakness, you don't get fair value in return. Doug Armstrong badly misplayed his hand and allowed the Blues to get taken for a player that should have had more trade value.

Had the Blues not rushed out foolishly to bring back a bad NHL defenseman like Leopold, they wouldn't have needed to trade Perron. If they chose to trade him or wanted to trade him, they could have then been patient and gotten more than a pressbox spectator and a 2nd round pick

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09-28-2013, 12:05 PM
  #28
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So should we ignore the aspect of them wanting to give more minutes to Schwartz and Tarasenko?

Or the fact that if we didn't bring Leopold back, we would've spent similar money on a similar player? There is no way Cole would have been the opening day #6 with some random cheap vet as the 7th.

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09-28-2013, 12:08 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
So should we ignore the aspect of them wanting to give more minutes to Schwartz and Tarasenko?
If they actually follow through on that. Problem is that with the Morrow signing, I have the feeling that Hitchcock will be going with his veteran, familiar players rather than young guys again.

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09-28-2013, 12:31 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by GrandPapillon View Post
If they actually follow through on that. Problem is that with the Morrow signing, I have the feeling that Hitchcock will be going with his veteran, familiar players rather than young guys again.
If he does, I don't want any part of Hitch anymore. Tarasenko has to develop. People always complain about us not getting a prime goal scorer. Tarasenko is our real hope of having one, and at a lower cost than signing a free agent which is even unlikely. I don't want Tarasenko to be another grinder. That's not his game at all.

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09-28-2013, 12:50 PM
  #31
Alklha
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandPapillon View Post
The deal only needed to be made because of the signing of Leopold. If Armstrong and Hitchcock believe that a 33 year old defenseman that was basically run out of a bad team like Buffalo who was embarrassing bad in the playoffs for us is more valuable to a franchise than a young offensive-minded forward, it would be grounds for their immediate dismissal.

The "Blues listened to offers and took the best one because they felt they needed to trade him" plan sure worked out great in the Pronger deal. I am not comparing Perron's value or level of play to Pronger before anyone wants to build a straw man off of that. I am merely comparing the circumstances around their departures. When a trade is made from a position of weakness, you don't get fair value in return. Doug Armstrong badly misplayed his hand and allowed the Blues to get taken for a player that should have had more trade value.

Had the Blues not rushed out foolishly to bring back a bad NHL defenseman like Leopold, they wouldn't have needed to trade Perron. If they chose to trade him or wanted to trade him, they could have then been patient and gotten more than a pressbox spectator and a 2nd round pick
Leopold was far from great, but I think he'll be a good player for us if he is used correctly (3rd pairing with Polák). This isn't about Armstrong viewing Leopold as more valuable than Perron, but the fact that the need for LHD was more important than what Perron was offering on the LW. We had another option internally (Jaškin), we added another via the trade and getting Pietrangelo signed at the price we did allowed us to bring in another option with Morrow. And, as bleedblue1223 pointed out, even if he wasn't signed the money was still needed for his replacement.

Pääjärvi is still only 22 and has been stuck on a crap team with crap coaching for a few years now. Some of us are rushing to judgement on him for no real reason, our team allows us to be a little more patient with responsible players.

We all like to view trades in a vacuum, but that isn't how it works. It is all about making the team better without mortgaging the future. We done that this summer. I'm sure Armstrong wishes it could have went another way (maybe trading Halák instead, maybe being able to trade Perron+ for a centre, maybe getting one of his other choices in FA at C), but there is only so much within your control when looking to do that.

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09-28-2013, 03:12 PM
  #32
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One of the reasons Perron was traded was because they don't believe he was a good fit, they'll never say it, but I believe it to be true.

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09-28-2013, 04:34 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandPapillon View Post
The deal only needed to be made because of the signing of Leopold. If Armstrong and Hitchcock believe that a 33 year old defenseman that was basically run out of a bad team like Buffalo who was embarrassing bad in the playoffs for us is more valuable to a franchise than a young offensive-minded forward, it would be grounds for their immediate dismissal.

The "Blues listened to offers and took the best one because they felt they needed to trade him" plan sure worked out great in the Pronger deal. I am not comparing Perron's value or level of play to Pronger before anyone wants to build a straw man off of that. I am merely comparing the circumstances around their departures. When a trade is made from a position of weakness, you don't get fair value in return. Doug Armstrong badly misplayed his hand and allowed the Blues to get taken for a player that should have had more trade value.

Had the Blues not rushed out foolishly to bring back a bad NHL defenseman like Leopold, they wouldn't have needed to trade Perron. If they chose to trade him or wanted to trade him, they could have then been patient and gotten more than a pressbox spectator and a 2nd round pick
How do you suggest Armstrong should have played his hand? The Blues did have to make some type of move, it was pretty obvious to everyone.

It is not at all Leopold vs. Perron. It was re-signing Pietrangelo AND having depth guys like Paajarvi, Morrow, and Leopold vs. Perron. I would argue we are better without him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OCTA8ON View Post
If he does, I don't want any part of Hitch anymore. Tarasenko has to develop. People always complain about us not getting a prime goal scorer. Tarasenko is our real hope of having one, and at a lower cost than signing a free agent which is even unlikely. I don't want Tarasenko to be another grinder. That's not his game at all.
Sorry what does this have to do with Tarasenko? From what I've seen, Paajarvi will be the one most effected by the Morrow signing, at least at first. Tarasenko's position has not changed at all. He has always been with Berglund, and it used to be Paajarvi but now it looks like Schwartz might be the LW there (which is an upgrade on Paajarvi).

I think Tarasenko has great potential but let's stop acting like he's the second coming of Jesus that Hitch is certainly going to ruin because that isn't the case at all. As we saw last season, Tarasenko will see as much ice as his play dictates. For most of last season he was not very good once you look past his hot start, that's just a fact. He's a young kid. Once he adapts better to the NHL game, he will see more opportunity. That's exactly what happened with Schwartz, to a T.

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09-28-2013, 05:37 PM
  #34
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I have no ill will towards Perron and I wish him all the best. I think he will be a decent point producer in edm but his game was not a fit with our organization. He holds onto the puck too much, takes dumb offensive zone penalties, and lacks the defensive play our forwards are expected to have.

I don't see why fans are going on and on about this, we have a deeper team than last yr and younger/cheaper players to put in that spot that have a good possibility of being better than Perron Jaskins/Swartz/ Tarasanko.. And we still have not seen what Paajarvi has to offer.

If we were going to keep our improved defense and add a top 6 center somebody had to go to make cap room. We knew it would be a winger and I believe Armstrong made the right choice in moving a guy who needed a change of scenery as bad as Perron did.

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09-28-2013, 10:41 PM
  #35
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I will enjoy following him in edm and I hope he performs well for them. It just seems he did not fit in here with the other players.

This trade is one that will be interesting to evaluate in a couple years.

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09-29-2013, 05:15 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by bluesman11 View Post
One of the reasons Perron was traded was because they don't believe he was a good fit, they'll never say it, but I believe it to be true.
This.

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Old
09-29-2013, 12:02 PM
  #37
Daley Tarasenkshow
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Originally Posted by bluesman11 View Post
One of the reasons Perron was traded was because they don't believe he was a good fit, they'll never say it, but I believe it to be true.
This is what everyone's been saying; it's not to hard to believe.

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09-29-2013, 12:50 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Daley Tarasenkshow View Post
This is what everyone's been saying; it's not to hard to believe.
Not everyone or there would be no need for this thread, I would say that some don't see the big picture as well as some, and are going to harp on this all season long. It's their right but I'm sure I'll be ignoring this thread in the near future.

It's like when he was a rookie some only wanted to talk about his great hands, but completely ignored that he didn't have a complete game and could be selfish. I also hoped he would grow into a more complete player, but he really only had that good run after the concussion. I wish him well, but if he has a good year and Edmonton is average at best we'll still have some say we told you so.

This is why I believe it's best to be a sports fan, and don't fall in love with anyone player. The reasoning is we'll be sports fans much longer than these guys careers will ever last, and over time you realize these guys are just guys.

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09-29-2013, 01:41 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OCTA8ON View Post
If he does, I don't want any part of Hitch anymore. Tarasenko has to develop. People always complain about us not getting a prime goal scorer. Tarasenko is our real hope of having one, and at a lower cost than signing a free agent which is even unlikely. I don't want Tarasenko to be another grinder. That's not his game at all.
I think hitchcock has a lot of faith in schwartz as he should, schwartz has done everything right in his time in the NHL. He deserves Hitchcocks trust. As for Tarasenko I hear he came to camp in much better shape this year which is a big plus, I think he should and will get top PP minutes this year. He got a very good amount of time on the PP before his injury last season.

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09-29-2013, 05:37 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by BlueDream View Post
How do you suggest Armstrong should have played his hand? The Blues did have to make some type of move, it was pretty obvious to everyone.

It is not at all Leopold vs. Perron. It was re-signing Pietrangelo AND having depth guys like Paajarvi, Morrow, and Leopold vs. Perron. I would argue we are better without him.


Sorry what does this have to do with Tarasenko? From what I've seen, Paajarvi will be the one most effected by the Morrow signing, at least at first. Tarasenko's position has not changed at all. He has always been with Berglund, and it used to be Paajarvi but now it looks like Schwartz might be the LW there (which is an upgrade on Paajarvi).

I think Tarasenko has great potential but let's stop acting like he's the second coming of Jesus that Hitch is certainly going to ruin because that isn't the case at all. As we saw last season, Tarasenko will see as much ice as his play dictates. For most of last season he was not very good once you look past his hot start, that's just a fact. He's a young kid. Once he adapts better to the NHL game, he will see more opportunity. That's exactly what happened with Schwartz, to a T.
I don't think you're being very honest with Tarasenko's abilities here. I think he actually has the ability to be as good as Jeff Carter, which is the difference between getting eliminated in the second round and making the stanley cup finals. We all saw Tarasenko not play as well after his concussion, and that was largely due to him being overwhelmed with how many games he played including the frequency between games. Everyone here is so high on Jaskin and Rattie as of recently, but Tarasenko has a much higher likelihood than either of those 2 to become a pretty good player. Hopefully, Hitch doesn't bog Tarasenko down with too much defensive responsibility like I feel he does with Backes, personally.


Last edited by OCTA8ON: 09-29-2013 at 05:42 PM.
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Old
09-29-2013, 06:27 PM
  #41
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Playing on the third line on this team doesnt give you third line minutes. Schwartz and Tarasenko will both play plenty minutes along with being on a PP unit

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10-05-2013, 06:51 PM
  #42
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And the Perron-MPS trade continues to look like a failure.

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10-05-2013, 07:48 PM
  #43
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And the Perron-MPS trade continues to look like a failure.
Please explain. MPS hasn't even seen any ice time yet because he's still adjusting to Hitch's system. Plus the 2nd round pick speaks volumes.

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10-05-2013, 08:01 PM
  #44
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Yeah bro didn't you hear? Perron has played 1 more game than Paajarvi so far. Edmonton clearly destroyed us.

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10-05-2013, 09:46 PM
  #45
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Perron has more points now than seconds that Paajarvi has played for the Blues. Last time the Blues made a trade this terrible at least there was a babysitter involved.

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10-05-2013, 09:51 PM
  #46
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Lol gotta stick up for your boy, huh?

Maybe the Oilers will win a game soon, until then the Blues are 2-0 and Derek "Blues shouldn't have signed him!!!" Roy has 3 points, Brenden "washed up" Morrow has 2 points, and Alex "who cares if we got him signed or not, should have kept Perron" has 3 points and the Blues have won easily in both games.

Perron has that assist though! So Edmonton has nothing to worry about unlike the Blues.

Please.

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10-05-2013, 09:51 PM
  #47
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And look what our replacements have been doing. I understand the point of this thread, but it will never end well, regardless of how the Blues do.

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10-05-2013, 09:53 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandPapillon View Post
Perron has more points now than seconds that Paajarvi has played for the Blues. Last time the Blues made a trade this terrible at least there was a babysitter involved.
Yeah you're right. This was the worst trade ever! Good lord man. We get it. You love Perron and think he was treated poorly. The fact of the matter is, he was never going to breakout here. They made the decision to move him and took the best deal they could. Move on.

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10-05-2013, 09:54 PM
  #49
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And look what our replacements have been doing. I understand the point of this thread, but it will never end well, regardless of how the Blues do.
It can. It will just take some self-control both ways. I hate the trade. The Blues got taken, but as of right now, the team looks impressive. If Perron goes on to score 35-40 in Edmonton but we win a Cup, it worked well

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10-05-2013, 09:54 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandPapillon View Post
Perron has more points now than seconds that Paajarvi has played for the Blues. Last time the Blues made a trade this terrible at least there was a babysitter involved.
We're two games into the season. We won't know how good or bad this trade is until at least 3 years down the road. If the 2nd round pick turns into nothing, and PRV never becomes a roster player, then yes it's terrible. If PRV becomes a solid 3rd liner, and the 2nd round pick is used to take someone the quality of Jaskin or Rattie, I don't see how this could be viewed as a bad trade. We just don't know yet.

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