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Old
07-13-2005, 10:15 PM
  #51
zeke
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heh.

Witt instead of McCabe.

Trade the guy who finished 4th in Norris voting for a bottom pair defender.

unbelievable.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:18 PM
  #52
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Witt is not a bottom pair d-man

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07-13-2005, 10:19 PM
  #53
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Let's trade Sundin for Draper.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:22 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke
Let's trade Sundin for Draper.
Witt is excellent, but Washington will not give him up. McCabe is fun to have around anyway, imo.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:23 PM
  #55
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Witt is a bottom pair dman on any decent team.

Like he was just two years ago, when leafs Klee and Johansson both played ahead of him.

good god.

McCabe for Witt.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:26 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke
Witt is a bottom pair dman on any decent team.
Sorry zeke, but this is just patently untrue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke
Like he was just two years ago, when leafs Klee and Johansson both played ahead of him.
I don't remember. But those are two very good defencemen. And, after all, it was a couple of years ago. A couple of years ago I could still fit into my favourite pants. Doesn't mean mcuh.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:31 PM
  #57
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Klee is a solid #4 defenseman.

And Witt was significantly behind him on the same team, just 2 seasons ago.

Last year, Witt was getting less icetime than Boumedienne.

Of course on that 95point Caps team, Klee was actually their #2 defenseman....but for a good team like the leafs, #4 is about as high as you want him on the depth charts.

Witt is below that.

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07-13-2005, 10:33 PM
  #58
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Witt is like a younger Marchement, but not quite as nasty.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:34 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke
Witt is like a younger Marchement, but not quite as nasty.
We just don't agree. But I'm not alone in my thinking. I have heard many others praising Witt. Ask about him on the Caps board.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:42 PM
  #60
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Look, I'm not a McCabe fan, but you don't trade a guy with that amount of talent for a guy with a lot less talent. McCabe is a solid #3 defenceman on a good team, Witt is a #5.

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Old
07-13-2005, 10:45 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepNCheese
Look, I'm not a McCabe fan, but you don't trade a guy with that amount of talent for a guy with a lot less talent. McCabe is a solid #3 defenceman on a good team, Witt is a #5.
No doubt McCabe is a much better player but this is about Cap Space plain and simple and getting the type of Dman Witt that adds toughness to the lineup ..

Washington has lots of prospects .. perhaps the deal is not 1-1 and you get one back in exchange .. WHL scoring champ Eric Fehr comes to mind .. Which means that TO may have to add something as well ..

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Old
07-13-2005, 11:12 PM
  #62
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I guess it comes down to this....$3.5 mil for a McCabe calibre defenseman is a pretty decent price.

He also happens to be a UFA next season, so we can just as easily drop him next year, and take advantage of another bumper crop coming through next season.


I think people forget something......next year, with the UFA age going down to 29, the UFA market will be just as flooded, perhaps with even more attractive high-end talent. At the same time, the Leafs will have much more money available next year (McCabe/Klee/Belfour etc. all come off the books).

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:04 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke
I guess it comes down to this....$3.5 mil for a McCabe calibre defenseman is a pretty decent price.

He also happens to be a UFA next season, so we can just as easily drop him next year, and take advantage of another bumper crop coming through next season.


I think people forget something......next year, with the UFA age going down to 29, the UFA market will be just as flooded, perhaps with even more attractive high-end talent. At the same time, the Leafs will have much more money available next year (McCabe/Klee/Belfour etc. all come off the books).
How about McCabe to Carolina for Jeff O'Neill ?.

O'Neill is at 2.8 mil in the new NHL and only 29 ..

Might make a good winger for Mats .. and our top line ..

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:26 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Messenger
How about McCabe to Carolina for Jeff O'Neill ?.

O'Neill is at 2.8 mil in the new NHL and only 29 ..

Might make a good winger for Mats .. and our top line ..
I like that.


I was about to say a trade to get Travis Green. But he's a UFA right now and wouldn't command much money. I liked when he played for us, he really could win us face offs.

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:44 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skittles.TML
I like that.


I was about to say a trade to get Travis Green. But he's a UFA right now and wouldn't command much money. I liked when he played for us, he really could win us face offs.
How old is Travis?

Hold off, there are going to be younger, equal players.

Don't rush it, take a good look around the landscape before buying.

If you could find anyone to take McCabe's salary and return a younger player go for it.

How much money can you include with a deal? Find a team with lots of cap, but could use help paying the frieght, and send McCabe and cash for a younger _fill_in_the_blank player.

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:47 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55
How old is Travis?

Hold off, there are going to be younger, equal players.

Don't rush it, take a good look around the landscape before buying.

If you could find anyone to take McCabe's salary and return a younger player go for it.

How much money can you include with a deal? Find a team with lots of cap, but could use help paying the frieght, and send McCabe and cash for a younger _fill_in_the_blank player.
32 or something. Travis was/is my favourite player.

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:49 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55
How old is Travis?

Hold off, there are going to be younger, equal players.

Don't rush it, take a good look around the landscape before buying.

If you could find anyone to take McCabe's salary and return a younger player go for it.

How much money can you include with a deal? Find a team with lots of cap, but could use help paying the frieght, and send McCabe and cash for a younger _fill_in_the_blank player.
Anyone believe that McCabe a 2nd team NHL All-star is worth a 1st round pick ??

Once the lottery is held and teams know where they are picking and what they are trading could these teams that need players to get above the low water mark and Cap floor be interested in making such a deal ??

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:50 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Messenger
How about McCabe to Carolina for Jeff O'Neill ?.

O'Neill is at 2.8 mil in the new NHL and only 29 ..

Might make a good winger for Mats .. and our top line ..

It is very possible Carolina will not make a qualifying offer to O'Neill based upon financial considerations and his poor performance in the last season. In that case we can pick up O'Neill as a UFA.

In any case I would not make this trade because we need a solid defenseman more than another sniper.

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:51 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skittles.TML
32 or something. Travis was/is my favourite player.
IMO Skittles ..

Travis Green is old enough to be your Dad .... I think the Leafs would be better off if they found a player that was more like your older brother in age..

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Old
07-15-2005, 09:57 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Messenger
IMO Skittles ..

Travis Green is old enough to be your Dad .... I think the Leafs would be better off if they found a player that was more like your older brother in age..
Like who? I think Nieuwy was a best faceoff man last season (how long ago), who else was there?

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Old
07-15-2005, 10:01 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skittles.TML
Like who? I think Nieuwy was a best faceoff man last season (how long ago), who else was there?

Travis Green is an excellent face-off men who was otherwise fairly mediocre when he was in the blue-and-white. I see no reason to sign him again.

Perhaps we can instead go after Yannic Perrault < > or, even more cheaply, lure Peter Zezel out of retirement (did we really let him go to get Craig signed).

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07-15-2005, 10:02 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Recidivist
It is very possible Carolina will not make a qualifying offer to O'Neill based upon financial considerations and his poor performance in the last season. In that case we can pick up O'Neill as a UFA.

In any case I would not make this trade because we need a solid defenseman more than another sniper.
The Fan 590 in fact this morning is suggesting the same thing that O'Neill may be not qualified .. Personally I don't see it because they only have so few players under contract and are miles below the new NHL floor ..

If it happens though that way in the new NHL something to think about is always the Cap and space .. So as strange as it seems trading a player to free cap room may be better then just signing him as a UFA.

If you keep McCabe ($3.5) and then sign O'Neill for say 3.0 mil then you have $6.5 mil against the Cap .. The catch in the trade is if you think you can do better them McCabe on the UFA market by freeing the room .. If Adam Foote is prepared to come to TO or any other UFA dman for that money say ..

Then

Trading McCabe for O'Neill allows you to add Foote as well.
Signing O'Neill (if he is not qualified) and keeping McCabe (or then trading him for some other asset)


Which is better ?? Who would you rather have as the best pair for the Leafs ..

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Old
07-15-2005, 10:04 AM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Messenger
The Fan 590 in fact this morning is suggesting the same thing that O'Neill may be not qualified .. Personally I don't see it because they only have so few players under contract and are miles below the new NHL floor ..

If it happens though that way in the new NHL something to think about is always the Cap and space .. So as strange as it seems trading a player to free cap room may be better then just signing him as a UFA.

If you keep McCabe ($3.5) and then sign O'Neill for say 3.0 mil then you have $6.5 mil against the Cap .. The catch in the trade is if you think you can do better them McCabe on the UFA market by freeing the room .. If Adam Foote is prepared to come to TO or any other UFA dman for that money say ..

Then

Trading McCabe for O'Neill allows you to add Foote as well.
Signing O'Neill (if he is not qualified) and keeping McCabe

Which is better ?? Who would you rather have as the best pair for the Leafs ..
McCabe and O'Neill.

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Old
07-15-2005, 10:08 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Messenger
The Fan 590 in fact this morning is suggesting the same thing that O'Neill may be not qualified .. Personally I don't see it because they only have so few players under contract and are miles below the new NHL floor ..

If it happens though that way in the new NHL something to think about is always the Cap and space .. So as strange as it seems trading a player to free cap room may be better then just signing him as a UFA.

If you keep McCabe ($3.5) and then sign O'Neill for say 3.0 mil then you have $6.5 mil against the Cap .. The catch in the trade is if you think you can do better them McCabe on the UFA market by freeing the room .. If Adam Foote is prepared to come to TO or any other UFA dman for that money say ..

Then

Trading McCabe for O'Neill allows you to add Foote as well.
Signing O'Neill (if he is not qualified) and keeping McCabe (or then trading him for some other asset)


Which is better ?? Who would you rather have as the best pair for the Leafs ..

You added an assumption (Adam Foote wants to come here and we can sign him) that of course changes conclusions. Would I rather have O'Neill and Foote than O'Neill and McCabe? Sure. First, sign Foote then see if we have some way to keep McCabe and trade someone of lesser usefulness to Carolina for O'Neill.

But trade McCabe for O'Neill even up? Nah.

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Old
07-15-2005, 10:10 AM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skittles.TML
Like who? I think Nieuwy was a best faceoff man last season (how long ago), who else was there?
How about Jason Allison or Paul Kariya??

They could be your Favs on the Leafs ..

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