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Boyd Gordon vs the West

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Old
06-19-2014, 01:45 PM
  #1
The Nuge
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Boyd Gordon vs the West

I know people seem to think Boyd Gordon is a #4C, but statistically, he lines up well with the other 3C's, trading a bit of offense for big step up defensively. The only person who plays even remotely as hard of minutes is Kruger, and he's yet to break Gordon's career high of 29 points. If you want any data added, let me know

Name Games Played Goals Assists Points Faceoff % Offensive Zone Starts Defensive Zone Starts Hits Blocked Shots SH TOI/G
Saku Koivu 65 11 18 29 50.4% 29.1% 25.2% 29 30 1:34
Sean Monahan 75 22 12 34 46.0% 33.6% 27.9% 42 23 0:15
Marcus Kruger 81 8 20 28 56.7% 13.4% 50.7% 22 70 2:33
Max Talbot 81 8 19 27 42.2% 30.9% 35.8% 105 38 2:36
Vern Fiddler 76 6 17 23 52.2% 27.3% 37.2% 45 52 2:00
Boyd Gordon 74 8 13 21 56.5% 13.1% 59.7% 27 89 2:47
Jarret Stoll 78 8 19 27 54.7% 33.8% 30.1% 202 60 2:06
Kyle Brodziak 81 8 16 24 48.2% 22.1% 43.7% 73 41 2:37
Colin Wilson 81 11 22 33 48.4% 34.2 29.0% 49 35 1:34
Kyle Chipchura 80 5 15 20 53.2% 24.5% 37.2% 116 9 0:02
James Sheppard 67 4 16 20 45.1% 29.9% 29.8% 105 34 0:02
Patrik Berglund 78 14 18 32 47.6% 35.7% 28.4% 88 30 1:31
Brad Richardson 73 11 12 23 55.2% 22.9% 48.0% 63 52 2:02
Mark Scheifele 63 13 21 34 42.2% 32.0% 29.1% 63 39 0:02
           
Name GP Goals Assists Points FO % OZS DZS Hits BS SH TOI/G
Average 75.2 8.86 17 25.86 49.9% 27.3% 36.6% 73.5 40.2 1:33
Boyd Gordon 74 8 13 21 56.5% 13.1% 59.7% 27 89 2:47
Gordon vs Average -1.2 -0.86 -4 -4.86 +6.6% +14.2% +23.1% -46.3 +48.8 +1:14
+is better results or harder minutes
- is worse results or easier minutes

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06-19-2014, 01:55 PM
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rickyrunfar
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He scored 4 goals in his first 6 games then 4 the rest of the season. Had a stretch of 32 games at the end of the year without a goal. That's pretty horrible. I guess he looks pretty close to average based on your list, but as a fan of exciting hockey this guy doesn't cut it as a third liner.

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06-19-2014, 01:56 PM
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Groucho
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MacT's comments on Oilers now suggest 3 scoring lines and 1 defensive juggernaut handling line. This is pretty telling for Gordon and Hendricks being 4C/W and handling pretty much every Dzone faceoff they can. I don't disagree that Gordon could be a capable 3C but if you take MacT at face value he won't be for this team next season barring injuries.

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06-19-2014, 02:06 PM
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Hall2Nuge2Ebs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
MacT's comments on Oilers now suggest 3 scoring lines and 1 defensive juggernaut handling line. This is pretty telling for Gordon and Hendricks being 4C/W and handling pretty much every Dzone faceoff they can. I don't disagree that Gordon could be a capable 3C but if you take MacT at face value he won't be for this team next season barring injuries.
I could see us rolling with something like this next season

Hall/RNH/Eberle
Kulemin/Grabovski/Gagner
Perron/Draisaitl/Yakupov
/Gordon/Hendricks

3 scoring lines and 1 checking line

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06-19-2014, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
MacT's comments on Oilers now suggest 3 scoring lines and 1 defensive juggernaut handling line. This is pretty telling for Gordon and Hendricks being 4C/W and handling pretty much every Dzone faceoff they can. I don't disagree that Gordon could be a capable 3C but if you take MacT at face value he won't be for this team next season barring injuries.
3 scoring lines is great in a perfect universe, but right now the Oilers only have the scoring depth to roll two scoring lines and that second one of Perron-Gagner-Yakupov is pretty weak.

I'm just not quite sure where MacT thinks he is going to add 3 offensively capable players to add to the top 9.

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06-19-2014, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
3 scoring lines is great in a perfect universe, but right now the Oilers only have the scoring depth to roll two scoring lines and that second one of Perron-Gagner-Yakupov is pretty weak.

I'm just not quite sure where MacT thinks he is going to add 3 offensively capable players to add to the top 9.
He already has one in Arcobello. Give him Kulemin and Downie, and that's a legit offensive threat.

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06-19-2014, 03:20 PM
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The Nuge
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
MacT's comments on Oilers now suggest 3 scoring lines and 1 defensive juggernaut handling line. This is pretty telling for Gordon and Hendricks being 4C/W and handling pretty much every Dzone faceoff they can. I don't disagree that Gordon could be a capable 3C but if you take MacT at face value he won't be for this team next season barring injuries.
I'm good with that as long as it's not our 3rd overall pick playing above Gordon. If our depth coming out of free agency is good enough that Gordon is on the 4th line, that's awesome. I'm not saying he can't play on the 4th line. I'm just saying he's as capable as any of the other 3C's in the Western Conference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyrunfar View Post
He scored 4 goals in his first 6 games then 4 the rest of the season. Had a stretch of 32 games at the end of the year without a goal. That's pretty horrible. I guess he looks pretty close to average based on your list, but as a fan of exciting hockey this guy doesn't cut it as a third liner.
Well Sheppard only scored 4 all year, so I wouldn't get too hung up on that. Gordon also didn't get to play with people that are even slightly a threat offensively in the 2nd half

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06-19-2014, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
3 scoring lines is great in a perfect universe, but right now the Oilers only have the scoring depth to roll two scoring lines and that second one of Perron-Gagner-Yakupov is pretty weak.

I'm just not quite sure where MacT thinks he is going to add 3 offensively capable players to add to the top 9.
Go hard after Kulemin and Grabovski. Draft Drasaitl and we are almost there.

Hall - Nuge - Ebs
Perron - Grabovski - Kulemin
xxxxx - Drasaitl - Yakupov (sheltered minutes)
Hendricks - Gordon - Pitlick/Gazdic/Pinizotto

Don't mind that forward group one bit. Only problem is trying to sign Grabovski and Kulemin. Apparently they are both a package deal this offseason and I have a feeling that Kulemin joins Grabo in Washington but signing those two would be huge for, especially since we have cap space.

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06-19-2014, 04:10 PM
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AUAIOMRN
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Sorry but nothing in that chart indicates how WELL he plays defensively. Yeah we know he is used defensively and is good at faceoffs. But hits and blocked shots are not an indication of defensive ability.

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06-19-2014, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
MacT's comments on Oilers now suggest 3 scoring lines and 1 defensive juggernaut handling line. This is pretty telling for Gordon and Hendricks being 4C/W and handling pretty much every Dzone faceoff they can. I don't disagree that Gordon could be a capable 3C but if you take MacT at face value he won't be for this team next season barring injuries.
You can read MacT's comments any way you want. I would consider the juggernaut handling line to be the "2nd line" at worst if not 1b line based on minutes they would be playing.

To me MacT wants guys who can score instead of energy line as the 4th line.

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06-19-2014, 07:49 PM
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Groucho
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The 2nd line won't be who is thrown over the boards to take Dzone faceoffs, soooooo

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06-19-2014, 08:30 PM
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Steve BachIntyre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AUAIOMRN View Post
Sorry but nothing in that chart indicates how WELL he plays defensively. Yeah we know he is used defensively and is good at faceoffs. But hits and blocked shots are not an indication of defensive ability.
How about takeaways and giveaways?

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06-19-2014, 09:57 PM
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Mr Positive
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Imo Gordon is one of the players on team that needs some help. We just don't know how great he could be for us because we are burying him in terms of zone starts and quality of opposition. Of course that cools him offensively, and it can be hard to gain traction and contribute to offense in that situation. With two roughly equal checking lines maybe we can start seeing Gordon get some offense zone starts and get some offense, and then maybe the fans will warm up to him more.

However, I do think that the rule changes on faceoffs might hurt Gordon. He'll probably still be very good though

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06-20-2014, 12:50 AM
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The Nuge
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AUAIOMRN View Post
Sorry but nothing in that chart indicates how WELL he plays defensively. Yeah we know he is used defensively and is good at faceoffs. But hits and blocked shots are not an indication of defensive ability.
Wait, seriously? If there's anything that clearly doesn't need proof, it's Gordon's high end defensive ability. The point of this is just to help prove he is similar to other 3rd line centers

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06-20-2014, 01:02 AM
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Blackhawkswincup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nuge View Post
I know people seem to think Boyd Gordon is a #4C, but statistically, he lines up well with the other 3C's, trading a bit of offense for big step up defensively. The only person who plays even remotely as hard of minutes is Kruger, and he's yet to break Gordon's career high of 29 points. If you want any data added, let me know

Name Games Played Goals Assists Points Faceoff % Offensive Zone Starts Defensive Zone Starts Hits Blocked Shots SH TOI/G
Saku Koivu 65 11 18 29 50.4% 29.1% 25.2% 29 30 1:34
Sean Monahan 75 22 12 34 46.0% 33.6% 27.9% 42 23 0:15
Marcus Kruger 81 8 20 28 56.7% 13.4% 50.7% 22 70 2:33
Max Talbot 81 8 19 27 42.2% 30.9% 35.8% 105 38 2:36
Vern Fiddler 76 6 17 23 52.2% 27.3% 37.2% 45 52 2:00
Boyd Gordon 74 8 13 21 56.5% 13.1% 59.7% 27 89 2:47
Jarret Stoll 78 8 19 27 54.7% 33.8% 30.1% 202 60 2:06
Kyle Brodziak 81 8 16 24 48.2% 22.1% 43.7% 73 41 2:37
Colin Wilson 81 11 22 33 48.4% 34.2 29.0% 49 35 1:34
Kyle Chipchura 80 5 15 20 53.2% 24.5% 37.2% 116 9 0:02
James Sheppard 67 4 16 20 45.1% 29.9% 29.8% 105 34 0:02
Patrik Berglund 78 14 18 32 47.6% 35.7% 28.4% 88 30 1:31
Brad Richardson 73 11 12 23 55.2% 22.9% 48.0% 63 52 2:02
Mark Scheifele 63 13 21 34 42.2% 32.0% 29.1% 63 39 0:02
           
Name GP Goals Assists Points FO % OZS DZS Hits BS SH TOI/G
Average 75.2 8.86 17 25.86 49.9% 27.3% 36.6% 73.5 40.2 1:33
Boyd Gordon 74 8 13 21 56.5% 13.1% 59.7% 27 89 2:47
Gordon vs Average -1.2 -0.86 -4 -4.86 +6.6% +14.2% +23.1% -46.3 +48.8 +1:14
+is better results or harder minutes
- is worse results or easier minutes
Actually Kruger is Hawks 4th line C

Shaw was 3rd line C the past 2 years

Hawks 4th line is used in more traditional checking role with 3rd line a more offensive unit

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06-20-2014, 01:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Actually Kruger is Hawks 4th line C

Shaw was 3rd line C the past 2 years

Hawks 4th line is used in more traditional checking role with 3rd line a more offensive unit
Ah, thanks. For some reason I was under the impression Kruger was bumped up to the 3C this year

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06-20-2014, 01:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
3 scoring lines is great in a perfect universe, but right now the Oilers only have the scoring depth to roll two scoring lines and that second one of Perron-Gagner-Yakupov is pretty weak.

I'm just not quite sure where MacT thinks he is going to add 3 offensively capable players to add to the top 9.
That might be fixed during free agency. Sign Kulemin, Grabovski, move Gagner to RW.

Kulemin-Grabo-Yak
Perron-Arco-Gagner

Then sign Moss for 4th line.

Hendricks-Gordon-Moss

Does nothing to address our need for size but the team will be similar to the 2006 Buffalo Sabres. 3 scoring lines, 1 checking line, defence by committee.

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06-20-2014, 02:31 AM
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He already has one in Arcobello. Give him Kulemin and Downie, and that's a legit offensive threat.
I'm not even sure Arcobello is an NHL caliber hockey player. Let alone an offensive threat.

He wasn't one in the NHL last year outside of his first 12 games or so.

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06-20-2014, 09:25 AM
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I've been incredibly happy with Gordon. When people rag on him I assume that they don't actually pay full attention to this awesome sport.

He doesn't have Kesler's offensive upside. If he did, he'd be making 6M.

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06-20-2014, 11:58 AM
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I've been incredibly happy with Gordon.
Same. Fits his role perfectly. Zero complaints. Hopefully, we'll sign Brodziak/Kulemin/Bolland for bottom-6 duty

OTOH... why does the Golden Boy (Eberle) get a free pass? I'm a huge fan of his but last season he was a passenger. He doesn't have the injury/youth excuse of RNH...

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06-20-2014, 02:46 PM
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Same. Fits his role perfectly. Zero complaints. Hopefully, we'll sign Brodziak/Kulemin/Bolland for bottom-6 duty

OTOH... why does the Golden Boy (Eberle) get a free pass? I'm a huge fan of his but last season he was a passenger. He doesn't have the injury/youth excuse of RNH...
Eberle..80 games played

28 goals

37 assists

65 points.

What's the problem?

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06-21-2014, 09:45 AM
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Props to the OP for putting together that chart. Pretty hard to complain about Gordon after looking at that.
I honestly had no idea that he was looking at 60% DZS.
That's a pretty staggering number. And it says a lot about how little the coach trusts the rest of his centers.
Anyway, good thread, and thanks for the effort.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
I'm not even sure Arcobello is an NHL caliber hockey player. Let alone an offensive threat.
Second coming of Marty St Louis. Slot this guy into our second line and we are golden ... I'm telling ya.

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06-21-2014, 11:07 AM
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Dorian2
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|Gordon is probably one of the very few reasons we are not picking first in the draft this year.

Can you imagine where the Oilers would be in the standings without him?

Unsung hero for this team AFAIC. Gordon doesn't get the respect he should be getting from a few fans.

Most of the HF poster's know what the rub is though.

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06-21-2014, 11:44 AM
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Gordon is a stud. He lays his body on the line every game. Hendricks and Gordon are shot blocking machines. Very happy to have him on the roster.

He does however need help. The Oilers need to sign a 3C who can win draws to take some of the heavy lifting off of him.

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06-23-2014, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
I'm not even sure Arcobello is an NHL caliber hockey player. Let alone an offensive threat.

He wasn't one in the NHL last year outside of his first 12 games or so.
People are quick to mention Gagner being injured as an excuse for terrible play in general. People forget Arco was dealing with injuries as well. Ribs take forever to heal and really impact your overall play.

Plus he got shuffled down to fourth line duties/ice time. Makes it very hard to produce anything.

From what I have seen his overall game is 100% NHL caliber. He has a decent shot too but I think he just needs a bit more confidence in it.

Tore the AHL a new one when he got sent back down.

Could take a turn for the worse but everything he has shown in the AHL and NHL says he should have a solid career as a top 9 forward.

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