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KHL Expansion part III

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Old
10-05-2013, 06:48 PM
  #126
FreshFruit
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Originally Posted by Sokil View Post
how so? european markets like hockey and have money, asian markets dont care about hockey and have no money

how is asian expansion "worth much more" to the KHL?
Unexplored market of more than a billion people which is mad for about anything coming from the west.



.

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10-05-2013, 08:12 PM
  #127
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If there ever will be a Norwegian team in the KHL, it would & should be in Oslo for two reasons.

1. There are about 2 million people living in an area of 1 hour radius (each way around the area).
2. This is the only place where they can sustain a high enough amount of spectators if it becomes popular(both regulars and visitors).

For temporary solutions when it comes to a stadium. Telenor Arena could be used.

Norway(well, Oslo...) are looking to apply for the Olympics in 2022. If that becomes a reality. As said before, two stadiums would get built.

I think the suggestion of those two stadiums is to use the place where Jordal Amfi is now, and build a new one at Stubberud.

Now, if you ask me. The best place to build a good and big enough arena would be at the eastside of Oslo. But, one could also look at using the old Frogner Stadium as a place to build an arena? Though, I'm not sure if there are enough room there?

If so, you would get pretty easy access from the Subway, and it wouldn't be far to the other areas for other Winter Sports. Like Holmenkollen. And it would be fairly close to the best cinema theater in Norway (Colosseum, which is placed nearby Majorstua). It would also be only 15 min away from downtown city center area with the subway.

The difficult part is to get a real sponsor. Statoil would never do that, because it's as said before government-owned. So, then it comes down to some of the rich lads in Norway to put of the money. The only guys I could see do this is Petter Stordalen(who owns a bunch of Hotels) or Christian Ringnes. But I don't really know how much money they got.

Then we also have John Fredriksen(who owns Frontline, Seadrill and some other companies. Worth almost $10 Billion dollars) and Olav Thon(who owns a lot of city centres/supermarkeds and hotels). But they doesn't seem to care for sports.

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Old
10-05-2013, 11:07 PM
  #128
Sokil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreshFruit View Post
Unexplored market of more than a billion people which is mad for about anything coming from the west.



.
Then Bettman should expand the NHL to Brazil. No, no that won't do.

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10-06-2013, 02:14 AM
  #129
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Then Bettman should expand the NHL to Brazil. No, no that won't do.
If I remember correctly, long ago there were plans to expand the NHL to Puerto Rico and Caracas.

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10-06-2013, 02:34 AM
  #130
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.............


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10-06-2013, 01:55 PM
  #131
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Do we have some members from Asia to explain us the situation from China or other big Asian markets?

How would let's say Shangai Dragons with most of the NA and Russian players go and what kind of marketing would be needed for that project to be successful? Should the 5k, 10k, or 20k arena be in commodity for the team or is that too low/big? Do the Chinese people care for the sport as long its aggressively and actively marketed? Can the population of Shangai sustain one more sport team?

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10-06-2013, 03:20 PM
  #132
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What's with your obsession about khl in Asia?

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10-07-2013, 02:59 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Hockeyfan31 View Post
What's with your obsession about khl in Asia?
Maybe I think that they have more potential than Europe.

I'm in favor of an Asian expansion only when the KHL is consolidated with a strong foothoold in Europe.

But I think that potential Chinese market can have more good than Britan or France.

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10-07-2013, 03:09 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by FreshFruit View Post
Unexplored market of more than a billion people which is mad for about anything coming from the west.



.

Don't exaggerate.

Yes China is looking to the West for many things, but it's crazy to say they're "mad for everything". I mean relatively speaking, hockey isn't even big in the west.

KHL would do better looking at Japan as a market before China.

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10-07-2013, 03:18 PM
  #135
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You talk like me when playing Risk board game. Expansion, expansion..

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Old
10-07-2013, 03:22 PM
  #136
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Don't exaggerate.

Yes China is looking to the West for many things, but it's crazy to say they're "mad for everything". I mean relatively speaking, hockey isn't even big in the west.

KHL would do better looking at Japan as a market before China.
or korea. olympics will be there in 2018.

this year the play with an 3rd team in Asia league. a team build of 100% korean players located in seoul. in korea every men have to go to army for 2 years. that mean every player lose 2 years to play. now these player have the oportunity to play these 2 years for the military team in seoul.

its a first step to increase the quality of the players. maybe they will send a team in KHL in 2017/18 to be well prepared for olympics. after olympics the team could use the new arena which is going to be built.

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10-07-2013, 06:04 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by FreshFruit View Post
Unexplored market of more than a billion people which is mad for about anything coming from the west.
IMHO China is one of the worst markets for professional sports in the whole world. Especially for team sports.

In Asia I would go with Japan who have successful football and baseball leagues or as second choice Korea.

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10-07-2013, 07:09 PM
  #138
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you need kids playing the sport in a region/country first before thinking people will want to pay to watch it at events/ on tv

you need to grow the game in china first, you can't just plop a russian team in some city, throw money at marketing and expect the urban population to just give a ****

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Old
10-07-2013, 08:45 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by FreshFruit View Post
If hockey could boom in China that would be really helpful for both leagues and hockey as a whole.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreshFruit View Post
Do we have some members from Asia to explain us the situation from China or other big Asian markets?

How would let's say Shangai Dragons with most of the NA and Russian players go and what kind of marketing would be needed for that project to be successful? Should the 5k, 10k, or 20k arena be in commodity for the team or is that too low/big? Do the Chinese people care for the sport as long its aggressively and actively marketed? Can the population of Shangai sustain one more sport team?
Yes I agree with you, as a long-term project China is always attractive. Just to attract hockey to a minority of China would mean millions of people. It's difficult to not see this.

There are usually around 50-200 attendance who watch the Dragons in the Asian league. Hardcore fans/family members/friends I would assume since I lost my interest long ago. The team always lose and REALLY suck. They will never win and everyone knows this because they don't have good enough imports and the Chinese players are not good enough on their own, especially as the Japanese and Korean teams has great imports in comparison.

The rest I don't know but am wondering about myself. If a better team with great imports could attract the average Chinese to watch them play.

And once again I agree with you with what you said earlier, Chinese are very interested in Western style, and products from the USA.

And I said before in the other thread that if they made this and advertised it as more of a "product", a Western sport attraction, I think this could actually have a chance.

Like "come an watch genuine American ice-hockey!". I believe many Chinese would be very interested to watch this. But several times a month? I am not sure.

Perhaps play half of the games in Beijing and half in Shanghai.

Regarding Japan or Korea this would also be good expansions, similar to Italy in my opinion. And could prove more successful on a short-term perspective compared to China.

Sweden, Switzerland and Germany is #1 priority though, and should be also. Norway and those "middle"-hockey countries should be #2 in priority and Asia should be #3, if KHL still wants to expand.

And maybe as someone mentioned a VHL team in Harbin-region could be better as they already have some hockey culture there, and would be easier to gain and increase interest there. Also they could use some Chinese players which the KHL team could not(if they don't wanta 4th line that ****s up).

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Old
10-08-2013, 06:42 AM
  #140
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robwangjing, you are right that Asia should be #3 priority fo KHL. I think that KHL will try to get asian clubs for MHL. MHL announced that teams from Shakalin, Vladivostok joins MHL next year. There is a desire to have asian (japan, korea) teams within a few yrs and make full-far east division.

KHL tries to get into asian tv market. Still no tv deal in Japan/China/Korea??? Eurosport Asia should broadcast KHL but not in those 3 countries. Right?

KHL will have clubs from Sweden, Germany, Switzerland, it will be sooner than we can imagine. Then will strart the process of reducing russian clubs. That will be interesting. Novokuznetsk can be replaced by Krasnoyarsk (I dont think so, long proces) or the spot can be for asian team? Still, not near future.

Can anybody tell me what has been happening in city of Novokuznetsk? Population has declined for yrs. No industry?

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10-08-2013, 07:12 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
KHL will have clubs from Sweden, Germany, Switzerland, it will be sooner than we can imagine. Then will strart the process of reducing russian clubs.
this would be awesome...

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Old
10-08-2013, 09:18 AM
  #142
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I think they have Eurosport in Hong Kong in Cantonese and English. But if KHL or any other hockey is shown there I don't know.

Don't know about Japan or Korea either, but here in Mainland China they don't broadcast Eurosport at all, I can guarantee that by 99,99%.

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10-08-2013, 10:05 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by robwangjing View Post
I think they have Eurosport in Hong Kong in Cantonese and English. But if KHL or any other hockey is shown there I don't know.

Don't know about Japan or Korea either, but here in Mainland China they don't broadcast Eurosport at all, I can guarantee that by 99,99%.
I talked about this tv deal

Quote:
The games will be broadcast live on Eurosport Asia-Pacific across 15 territories: Brunei, Cambodia, South Korea, Hong Kong, Indonesia, Malaysia, Mongolia, Myanmar, Papua New Guinea, Singapore, Sri Lanka, Taiwan, Thailand, Tonga and Vietnam.
No China, no Japan. I guess KHL works on tv deals in both countries, at least KHL would like to sign such deals sooner or later.

I dont follow NBA and its tv deals and policy but I heard that NBA invested to China to make basketball boon here. Now NBA has big/solid tv deals here??? KHL tries to do the same with hockey in Asia. KHL hired company for this job, the company has experiance with basketball in China (maybe Infront or so)

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Old
10-08-2013, 04:22 PM
  #144
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What for does the KHL keep sponsoring Hockey Milano Rossoblu?
Does the league continue to consider Milan as a possible expansion team or does the league want to do IIHF's job of developing hockey in other countries?
If Medvedev said that the KHL will only be expanding to hockey countries, might Italy be called one of them or is Rossoblu just a reserve plan for the case of failing to place a team to some other hockey countries?

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10-08-2013, 06:07 PM
  #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sucrologist View Post
What for does the KHL keep sponsoring Hockey Milano Rossoblu?
Does the league continue to consider Milan as a possible expansion team or does the league want to do IIHF's job of developing hockey in other countries?
If Medvedev said that the KHL will only be expanding to hockey countries, might Italy be called one of them or is Rossoblu just a reserve plan for the case of failing to place a team to some other hockey countries?
if they call Croatia a hockey country, then Italy is certainly way more of a hockey country

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10-08-2013, 06:57 PM
  #146
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lol we are Hockey enthusiasts lol hear us cheer lmao. But seriously now since 80's we actually were, it was as popular as it is now with Anisin and co playing fr Medvescak and it was becomeing a major sport but before it could properly develop n infrastructure be built war came and threw us back to the dark ages till Medvescak came to EBEL and now KHL. now its a little bit harder times but same fan will fr stuff to happen. just current clubs r not sponsored well yet n we need more closed ice rinks.

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10-08-2013, 07:16 PM
  #147
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And as for Italy it is in top division of the world hockey champ, so how would you not call it a hockey country? Or is the criteria only the top countries so basically sweden finland norway and switzerland and maybe germany? what about denmark, france, slovenia n austria all top tear teams? (ok slovenia was for a while in top tier not at the moment) If it isnt about the team is it the amount of fans or infrastructure? question is what is meant by a Hockey country and where do you draw the line.

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Old
10-08-2013, 07:48 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
I talked about this tv deal



No China, no Japan. I guess KHL works on tv deals in both countries, at least KHL would like to sign such deals sooner or later.

I dont follow NBA and its tv deals and policy but I heard that NBA invested to China to make basketball boon here. Now NBA has big/solid tv deals here??? KHL tries to do the same with hockey in Asia. KHL hired company for this job, the company has experiance with basketball in China (maybe Infront or so)
Sounds like a good first strategy to do this, just a shame they did not cover Japan as well. I wonder if the viewing in Korea is good? I hope so. Also Mongolia sounds like a good idea.

Should perhaps focus on those areas; Mongolia, China, Japan, Korea and HK. Japan and Korea has today the biggest hockey nations in Asia for sure. Mongolia is located very good to Russian border, HK is very international, anything is possible there. And China will be more difficult, but if successful KHL has a lot to gain.

Yes NBA is the biggest foreign league in China, and the most popular today. There are news about it everyday.

How to convince to the Chinese that NBA is the devil and KHL is the savior?

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10-08-2013, 09:33 PM
  #149
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It helped a lot that China had their own star in the NBA in Yao Ming and also other players. Yao Ming was an automatic All-Star game starter when he played due to the Chinese voting for him.

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10-09-2013, 04:54 AM
  #150
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Originally Posted by robwangjing View Post
Sounds like a good first strategy to do this, just a shame they did not cover Japan as well. I wonder if the viewing in Korea is good? I hope so. Also Mongolia sounds like a good idea.

Should perhaps focus on those areas; Mongolia, China, Japan, Korea and HK. Japan and Korea has today the biggest hockey nations in Asia for sure. Mongolia is located very good to Russian border, HK is very international, anything is possible there. And China will be more difficult, but if successful KHL has a lot to gain.

Yes NBA is the biggest foreign league in China, and the most popular today. There are news about it everyday.

How to convince to the Chinese that NBA is the devil and KHL is the savior?
Thx for posting robwangjing always nice to read your posts.

As stated many time, Asian expansion comes only when the KHL is consolidated and has a strong gain in Europe, but maybe KHL should right now make some moves on that market like MHL and VHL clubs to "fertilize" ground for the real deal.

One of many positive things in asian expansion is that there's no local patriotic feelings for the local leagues( due to low interes in hockey, but...) like we see in Europe where some clubs even if they think of the KHL are bashed big time( example Jokerit).

Don't know about Mongolia, it doesn't seem like a very profitable or exploitable market, but some triangle of China-Korea-Japan could be very very profitable for the KHL in the future.

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