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Penguins 2013-14 cap/roster building discussion (Contract chart in Post #1)

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Old
01-15-2014, 06:25 PM
  #201
Jag68Sid87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger for Hire View Post
I'll see your Subban situation and raise you Tyler Myers. There's times when it works and times when it doesn't.

I also think the bridge contract is also a good compromise tool when a first time RFA has a decent year and tries to cash in huge and the team is still leery.
That's the thing, though. Myers was clearly a case of too much, too soon. The Sabres should have seen that coming, and signed him to a one-year deal to prove he can do it again.

Subban's progression has been far more deliberate than Myers'. It was obvious where this guy was headed...obvious to everybody but the Habs' organization, it seems.

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01-15-2014, 06:35 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Absolutely. If the player is up for debate about a bridge contract or not, it means he is talented and a core player for the team's future. He SHOULD NOT flop. If he does, people (not just the player) didn't do their homework.
That's just simply not the thought process of any GM, and for good reason.

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Old
01-15-2014, 06:54 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
That's the thing, though. Myers was clearly a case of too much, too soon. The Sabres should have seen that coming, and signed him to a one-year deal to prove he can do it again.

Subban's progression has been far more deliberate than Myers'. It was obvious where this guy was headed...obvious to everybody but the Habs' organization, it seems.
You're clearly calling the Myers case from hindsight... his first 2 years we pretty damn good, 11-37-48 and 10-27-37. On top of being a 6'8" physical defender.

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01-15-2014, 07:03 PM
  #204
Jag68Sid87
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Originally Posted by Winger for Hire View Post
You're clearly calling the Myers case from hindsight... his first 2 years we pretty damn good, 11-37-48 and 10-27-37. On top of being a 6'8" physical defender.
You have a point. Aside from the physical part. Myers' physicality was more myth than anything. It was more assumed than real.

But your point stands. I just think teams should know what they have and take a stand a little more often, instead of sitting on the fence. It doesn't say much for their player evaluation skills if they can't figure out what they have after a player's ELC. Oh sure, players progress and regress continuously, year to year. I get that.

In fact, that is partly why they should crap or get off the pot sooner rather than later. Because you can be as conservative as possible with these things, and it may still end up coming back to haunt you. None of this is an exact science, no matter how many bridge contracts you implement.

Anyway, it's IMO.

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01-15-2014, 07:05 PM
  #205
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Myers has been pretty damn good this year. It looks like he has sorted everything out and is playing better than his rookie season. Good for him.

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01-15-2014, 07:22 PM
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
You have a point. Aside from the physical part. Myers' physicality was more myth than anything. It was more assumed than real.

But your point stands. I just think teams should know what they have and take a stand a little more often, instead of sitting on the fence. It doesn't say much for their player evaluation skills if they can't figure out what they have after a player's ELC. Oh sure, players progress and regress continuously, year to year. I get that.

In fact, that is partly why they should crap or get off the pot sooner rather than later. Because you can be as conservative as possible with these things, and it may still end up coming back to haunt you. None of this is an exact science, no matter how many bridge contracts you implement.

Anyway, it's IMO.
Fair enough. And point taken.

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Old
03-02-2014, 05:09 PM
  #207
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Fix the Penguins Bottom 6

I feel like we're pretty much all in agreement that the Penguins achilles heel is the bottom 6. Our current bottom six contributes little offensively and doesn't really have any cohesive purpose other than being a hodge podge of fringe ahl'ers and veterans here mostly to penalty kill.

So how would you fix it?

Show us your roster for opening night of the 2014-2015 season. Assume a $71 million salary cap (seem reasonable to me). Do your best to keep things realistic.

What would you guys do?

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03-02-2014, 05:10 PM
  #208
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1. Get rid of anyone older than 30.
2. Eat some pizza.

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03-02-2014, 05:16 PM
  #209
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1. Get rid of anyone older than 30.
2. Eat some pizza.
3. Fire Shero

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Old
03-02-2014, 05:56 PM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimos View Post
I feel like we're pretty much all in agreement that the Penguins achilles heel is the bottom 6. Our current bottom six contributes little offensively and doesn't really have any cohesive purpose other than being a hodge podge of fringe ahl'ers and veterans here mostly to penalty kill.

So how would you fix it?

Show us your roster for opening night of the 2014-2015 season. Assume a $71 million salary cap (seem reasonable to me). Do your best to keep things realistic.

What would you guys do?
Personally I think you fill top 6 holes and have that trickle down to the bottom 6.

Crosby Kunitz Kesler

Malkin Kulemin Neal

Goc Dupuis Bennett

Vitalie Megna Engallend
Gibbons

Letang Scuderi

Martin Matta

Bortuzzo Depres/Dumoulin
Samuelsson

Fleury Zatkoff

That should be about a 70m payrole, and if Fleury breaks through in the playoffs is a legit contender that can grind, skate, score, and play D.

But it's probably all a lost cause without change on the coaching staff.


Last edited by Gallatin: 03-02-2014 at 07:28 PM.
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03-02-2014, 07:12 PM
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimos View Post
I feel like we're pretty much all in agreement that the Penguins achilles heel is the bottom 6. Our current bottom six contributes little offensively and doesn't really have any cohesive purpose other than being a hodge podge of fringe ahl'ers and veterans here mostly to penalty kill.

So how would you fix it?

Show us your roster for opening night of the 2014-2015 season. Assume a $71 million salary cap (seem reasonable to me). Do your best to keep things realistic.

What would you guys do?
Acquire Kesler.

Demote Dupuis.

Sign Legwand.

Ease Bennett in with 3rd line minutes.

Promote within.


Kunitz-Crosby-Kesler
XXX-Malkin-Neal
Bennett-Legwand-Dupuis
Sill-Vitale-Payerl
Adams

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Old
03-04-2014, 11:24 AM
  #212
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Salary Cap Next Year Likely To Be Lower (Than Expected) - Pens Offseason Discussion

I'm just watching HockeyCentral on Sportsnet, and Nick Kypreos and Doug MacLean are talking about how the league is now expecting that the salary cap for next season is probably NOT going to be as high as they first thought, and that it could be $2 million less, or even lower.


This has significant implications for our entire roster: Sutter needs to be re-signed (if he's here), the Pens "REALLY want to re-sign Niskanen" (according to P. Maguire, and I believe him and agree they should), Malkin's & Letang's extension kick in, and then there's the prospect of whoever we may trade for, which would add more $$ to our payroll.


Mods feel free to merge this thread if you want, but this is a significant development that not only affects our trading strategy, but also our existing players we need to re-sign. It's a serious issue.

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03-04-2014, 11:29 AM
  #213
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I assume lower than the expected 71M not what it is now.

That's got to be the case since it can't get lower than what it is according to the CBA

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03-04-2014, 11:33 AM
  #214
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It will go up to at least 68 million, that's obviously not as high as 71 million but at least 68. I'd be shocked otherwise.

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03-04-2014, 11:47 AM
  #215
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Originally Posted by stefanh View Post
I assume lower than the expected 71M not what it is now.

That's got to be the case since it can't get lower than what it is according to the CBA
Yes, sorry if that wasn't clear. They were sayingthat it could be $2 million lower (or even less) than the $71 million expected.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael8771 View Post
It will go up to at least 68 million, that's obviously not as high as 71 million but at least 68. I'd be shocked otherwise.

That's correct. They said it could be as low as $68 million.

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03-04-2014, 01:26 PM
  #216
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In almost every sport with a cap, there is a midseason report that the cap isnt going up as much as expected... outside of a few cases where it was held down artificially through CBA items, like the past couple seasons of the NFL or this year in the NHL it ends up being wrong... usually when everything is counted it goes higher than expected... wait till the final numbers are out, especially with all the outdoor games this year

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03-04-2014, 01:32 PM
  #217
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It's been assumed and speculated that the cap was going to be lower for awhile now. It's the Canadian dollar. Lost a lot of ground on the dollar and since the Canadian teams make up so much of the revenue in this league, it drags everybody down.

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03-04-2014, 01:35 PM
  #218
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I don't buy it. I think Bettman told them this to encourage prudence.

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03-04-2014, 01:44 PM
  #219
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On the bright side, this all but eliminates the possibility that we can afford to give Orpik a raise, right? Tell me I'm right. Please.

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03-04-2014, 01:59 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by sf expat71 View Post
On the bright side, this all but eliminates the possibility that we can afford to give Orpik a raise, right? Tell me I'm right. Please.
Where there's a will, there's a way...

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Old
03-04-2014, 04:39 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by sf expat71 View Post
On the bright side, this all but eliminates the possibility that we can afford to give Orpik a raise, right? Tell me I'm right. Please.

We were never retaining Orpik anyway. The concern is: how will this affect our ability to retain Niskanen? Niskanen is a priority over Orpik, and will command around $4-4.5 million/year.

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03-04-2014, 05:26 PM
  #222
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I don't buy it. I think Bettman told them this to encourage prudence.
Certainly possible.

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03-04-2014, 06:55 PM
  #223
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Not to worry, they can always trade Malkin for a 7th. That would free up money to sign Brooks.

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Old
03-05-2014, 10:16 PM
  #224
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Early look forward to the offseason. Moves, Draft and Cap Situation.

I know it is way early guys. A lot of hockey left, and you never know what will happen with things like injuries etc.

But i was just interested in a little early pre-offseason look at things like the draft and any trades you guys think would be plausible, Free Agency including our own guys (who stays and who goes) and finally how do we work it all under the Salary cap which at the moment is not written in stone yet.

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03-05-2014, 10:17 PM
  #225
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I know there is more UFA and RFA out there but i just put the guys that cost the most cause i feel the most of the other guys will sign with us.

So UFA will be

Orpik 3.75
Stempniak 2.5
Nisky 2.3
Juciy J (forget how much with CAR paying some of it)
TV 2
Goc 1.7
Pyatt 1.55
Glass 1.1

Sutter being a RFA at 2

The salary cap is roughly 64 mil right now and i'll be a pessimist and say it's only going to go up to 68 mil.

What do you guys think we do? Noting Letang and Malkins Contract kicks in next yr.

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