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WHy didn't we offer Roy a job when looking for a new HC?

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Old
10-05-2013, 02:08 PM
  #126
Agnostic
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Well everytime we have an opinion is because we believe in something. He doesn't believe in Roy. Until proven otherwise. What could be my weaker horse for him, is surely not my weaker horse for me.....Anyway, people....please keep it in English Franco oriented....thanks. Thanks Agnostic for the lesson. But please...never use Justin Trudeau's name ever again....
Agreed.

I thought about using the example "Bob Gainey hitched his wagon to Carey Price" but I thought it would be more controversial than Trudeau.

You are very articulate in written English, I wish I could say the same for my French. In my next life , assuming I am re-incarnated in something that stands upright, I will learn better French.

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10-05-2013, 02:10 PM
  #127
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Bowman did not have meltdowns the way Roy has, first game, pushing the divider between benches at the opposing coach, come on, Bowman was a nut job to the players at times, but helped get us 5 cups in 7 yrs...
I think you'd better go back through the hockey archives and look at a few Bowman meltdowns, before continuing with your argument any further.

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10-05-2013, 02:11 PM
  #128
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Agreed.

I thought about using the example "Bob Gainey hitched his wagon to Carey Price" but I thought it would be more controversial than Trudeau.

You are very articulate in written English, I wish I could say the same for my French. In my next life , assuming I am re-incarnated in something that stands upright, I will learn better French.
Though, if you would have been using the Gainey experience...I would have TOTALLY understand it the first time....ask Lafleur Guy....

I do my best. Just that some expressions for me are just way too much. AS far as learning french, I have the utmost respect for the ones who do it and do a fairly well job at it. 'Cause it is a freakin tough language to learn.

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10-05-2013, 02:15 PM
  #129
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You're becoming much more entertaining in your older age. Even your anti-Price rants are entering the realm of reality. Keep it up!
You're hung over , when you get back to feeling normal you'll hate me again.

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10-05-2013, 02:21 PM
  #130
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You're hung over , when you get back to feeling normal you'll hate me again.
Hungover, munching on some food and watching the Klitschko fight. Life's good.

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10-05-2013, 02:24 PM
  #131
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Pat Burns did...was he a worst coach? Michel Therrien did it, is he a worst coach for you? Others have done it...why is it OK for others to do it but not Roy, please tell me.

By the way....do we know exactly what Bowman was all about...did we have replays, and Twitter and whatever at that time so we know exactly what he's all about. Also, Bowman was known for humiliating his players...ask Mario Tremblay amongst a thousand of others players...do you think a coach like him would do great nowadays? I have no idea why people keep comparing different eras...
Yeah, Pat Burns did it and was a great coach, but he couldn't keep a job more than 4 years...

I think that it can work, but not for long on the same team, see John Tortorellla, Mike Keenan, Pat Burns etc. It can be effective, but it give the coach an expiration date.

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10-05-2013, 02:44 PM
  #132
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Yeah, Pat Burns did it and was a great coach, but he couldn't keep a job more than 4 years...

I think that it can work, but not for long on the same team, see John Tortorellla, Mike Keenan, Pat Burns etc. It can be effective, but it give the coach an expiration date.
As every other coach out there. The more quiet guys also gets the boot at some point.

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10-05-2013, 04:00 PM
  #133
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http://articles.philly.com/1997-05-3...an-stanley-cup

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10-05-2013, 04:31 PM
  #134
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f@cken ******** posts, one after the other.

Roy wasn't offered a job cause when he left this town, he burned all of his bridges. And he isn't the kinda dude that will try to make amends. I loved Roy when he was our goalie. Now, who cares. He may be a great coach, he may not. I wish him all the best, like I would wish any non-haineous individual.

Go HABS go!

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10-05-2013, 05:31 PM
  #135
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The stanchions wouldn't be able to withstand the tantrums.

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10-05-2013, 06:03 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Coaches are going to freak out... that's just the nature of the game.

In this case though, there was no reason to freak out here and even less to keep hammering on that partition after it was clear that it was giving way. His first game and he acts like a clown.

It was totally unnecessary and way over the top. But that's Patrick Roy for you. And this is EXACTLY the kind of thing I was afraid of when we were talking about hiring him and he goes and does it.
Something about his being that fiery, combined with being a former Hab just seems like it would be a really bad combo here. If we hit a slump and the media was getting on his back, I could see him being pretty rash. Roy may be a good coach. I don't know. But I don't think he belongs in our pressure cooker. I think we should move away from hiring people just because they used to be Habs.

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10-05-2013, 06:03 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
As every other coach out there. The more quiet guys also gets the boot at some point.
The guys that are authoritarians and who likes to loose it aren't the ones that coach during a long time with the same team, unlike guys like Ruff, Trotz, Babcock, Martin, etc. some of theses guys shows emotions, but they still can restrain themselves.

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10-05-2013, 06:27 PM
  #138
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In the 1970s there were 5 newspapers covering the habs yes there was no twitter bit all gossip came out.Scotty Bowman dirt Guy Lafleur dirt.In 1977 there were over 650 stories about lafleur.

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10-05-2013, 06:39 PM
  #139
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In the 1970s there were 5 newspapers covering the habs yes there was no twitter bit all gossip came out.Scotty Bowman dirt Guy Lafleur dirt.In 1977 there were over 650 stories about lafleur.
Yeah, and I know Bowman was supposed to be a hard coach too and he did well here. But I still think Roy is a bad combo. If he is smashing stuff in his first NHL game, what's he going to do when his nerves are being tortured here. And for some reason I could actually see Roy being kinda like Tremblay and creating a rift with a player.

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10-05-2013, 06:44 PM
  #140
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No reasons as if it's acceptable to let the opponents intentionnally severely injure your players? Or at least that's what he thought too. Besides, which fault was it that the goons were on the ice for the last 6 seconds? Boudreau did put his goons out so....was Roy suppose to do a Carlye out of himself and put his skills guys there to not start something but yet see his skilled players get jumped? The whole thing was started because of that scrum in the end. Boudreau started it. Roy finished it.
And yet nobody agrees with Roy and he was fined ten grand. You have to REALLY try hard to make it seem like Roy was in the right here man. If he was really upset about it there are better ways of handling it, the game was already over for Pete's sake. And if he was upset with Boudreau to begin with then why didn't he go after him first?

He yaps at the players on the ice, then gets into it with Perry and then with Boudreau. And then he totally loses it and starts pushing the partition over.
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As far as your bolded comment, again, you can't be serious. So what you saw in that game was exactly the reason why you didn't want him?
Yes.

In my opinion he's an unpredictable hothead. This incident only reinforces my beliefs. Why would this be hard to see? And even if you disagree with me (and that's fair enough) you don't see where I'd be coming from on this? Really?

Dude, for months I said the guy's a hothead and we shouldn't hire him. He goes out and blows a fuse... YES it reinforces my beliefs (even if you don't see things that way.)
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And what if he is enough of a good teacher of the game and what if his emotions makes his team play with emotion and maybe become a winning team....wouldn't that be enough? But no...he loses his temper sometimes so we don't want him? Give me 5 little crisis like that a year, a winning regular season and a great playoff performance and I'd take that for the next 3 years. Then....at year 4, if he's that bad and players want him to be replaced....so be it. Time for another one....as if we didn't do that before even with the most calm coaches we had...
Of course it would be. And as I said I could be wrong about him. Maybe this will help his team, maybe they'll respect him for it. And maybe he'll be a great coach.

But then again even if the above is true, maybe he has another blowup again and undoes a lot of the good things that he's done. And that's the problem with this guy, you just never know.

There are other coaches out there who I'm sure would be "good teacher" and would be passionate and "emotional" without the freak factor.

Like I said, maybe he'll be a great coach. Then again he could be a disaster. I personally think that you can get emotion and passion somewhere else without the risk. Obviously you think Roy is worth the risk... I don't.
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I would have liked to see that scenario though.....Boston vs Habs.....and Julien badmouthing PK and Roy just snapping at Julien and the rest of the bruins players...Everybody here would raise a statue out of Roy for standing up and closing Julien big ****ing mouth. Julien and his diving press conference was one of the worst junior stuff ever and yet it worked. He discredited our entire organization. And here the only thing Therrine had to say is to ask Julien to mind his own business.....Sorry, that deserved way more.
Sure, we all want to see somebody yell at Julien. I'd love to see George Parros beat the tar out of Brad Marchand... Doesn't mean it's the smart thing to do though.

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10-05-2013, 08:31 PM
  #141
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And yet nobody agrees with Roy and he was fined ten grand. You have to REALLY try hard to make it seem like Roy was in the right here man. If he was really upset about it there are better ways of handling it, the game was already over for Pete's sake. And if he was upset with Boudreau to begin with then why didn't he go after him first?

He yaps at the players on the ice, then gets into it with Perry and then with Boudreau. And then he totally loses it and starts pushing the partition over.
Well what's not right for your opponent or for the league is not always what's not right for your own team. Sometimes, you will understand that taking a penalty, or yapping at the refs or whatever "illegal" might start something in your team that will make it benefit from it. I mean isn't that what fighting also should be about? Or hard hits, all moves potentially illegal?

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Yes.

In my opinion he's an unpredictable hothead. This incident only reinforces my beliefs. Why would this be hard to see? And even if you disagree with me (and that's fair enough) you don't see where I'd be coming from on this? Really?

Dude, for months I said the guy's a hothead and we shouldn't hire him. He goes out and blows a fuse... YES it reinforces my beliefs (even if you don't see things that way.)
But being a hothead means what in reality? That if he can,t contain himself behind a bench that he'll be as harsh with his players, losing the room in 2 weeks and so on? Or just that you don't like people with emotions behing a bench that you prefer Jacques Martin style?

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Of course it would be. And as I said I could be wrong about him. Maybe this will help his team, maybe they'll respect him for it. And maybe he'll be a great coach.

But then again even if the above is true, maybe he has another blowup again and undoes a lot of the good things that he's done. And that's the problem with this guy, you just never know.

There are other coaches out there who I'm sure would be "good teacher" and would be passionate and "emotional" without the freak factor.

Like I said, maybe he'll be a great coach. Then again he could be a disaster. I personally think that you can get emotion and passion somewhere else without the risk. Obviously you think Roy is worth the risk... I don't.
I don't believe Therrien will bring us to the promised land. So I was indeed ready to take the risk. I think that his character is blown out of proportion. Of course, he is not helping himself, doing what he does in his 1st game. But I'm not expecting him to do that every game.

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Sure, we all want to see somebody yell at Julien. I'd love to see George Parros beat the tar out of Brad Marchand... Doesn't mean it's the smart thing to do though.
It's hockey. Pretty sure every team doesn't everytime do the smart thing. Not sure why it's that much of a problem. Emotions cannot be the only thing that drives you....but you still need some in your game.

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10-05-2013, 08:37 PM
  #142
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Well what's not right for your opponent or for the league is not always what's not right for your own team. Sometimes, you will understand that taking a penalty, or yapping at the refs or whatever "illegal" might start something in your team that will make it benefit from it. I mean isn't that what fighting also should be about? Or hard hits, all moves potentially illegal?
As I told you, it's possible that this was a calculated move. Personally I don't really see what he gains from it but sure it's possible.


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But being a hothead means what in reality? That if he can,t contain himself behind a bench that he'll be as harsh with his players, losing the room in 2 weeks and so on? Or just that you don't like people with emotions behing a bench that you prefer Jacques Martin style?



I don't believe Therrien will bring us to the promised land. So I was indeed ready to take the risk. I think that his character is blown out of proportion. Of course, he is not helping himself, doing what he does in his 1st game. But I'm not expecting him to do that every game.



It's hockey. Pretty sure every team doesn't everytime do the smart thing. Not sure why it's that much of a problem. Emotions cannot be the only thing that drives you....but you still need some in your game.
He's gone beyond just being emotional though... Quits on the Habs in the middle of a game, sends his son to fight an unwilling opponent, belittles kids in the minors, has an unnecessary meltdown in game one. He can't keep his emotions in check. There's evidence of this and I don't want him anywhere near our team which has enough drama as it is.

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10-05-2013, 08:41 PM
  #143
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He's gone beyond just being emotional though... Quits on the Habs in the middle of a game, sends his son to fight an unwilling opponent, belittles kids in the minors, has an unnecessary meltdown in game one. He can't keep his emotions in check. There's evidence of this and I don't want him anywhere near our team which has enough drama as it is.
You're talking about a period of how many years now. And quitting on the Habs? No....Habs dixit Tremblay quit on him. Guy almost alone won us 2 cups and he's treated that way? No way. As far as belittles kids....he helped way more than he psychologically troubled some. Not sure there are a whole lot of proofs than he did that on a regular basis as well.

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10-05-2013, 09:07 PM
  #144
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1) Mtl wanted a coach Roy wanted more power than just coach.
2) Mtl don't need to big name Coach to put people in the stands.
3) Mtl need to developpe are young player Roy bring to much Drama
4) Price is the center piece of the team he been under way to much pressure and a lot of Situation just being in Roy shadow image if Roy was behind the bench.

Roy might of been a great Coach / GM but I still feel that long term Bergevin and is coach will be better.

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10-05-2013, 09:11 PM
  #145
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You're talking about a period of how many years now. And quitting on the Habs? No....Habs dixit Tremblay quit on him. Guy almost alone won us 2 cups and he's treated that way? No way. As far as belittles kids....he helped way more than he psychologically troubled some. Not sure there are a whole lot of proofs than he did that on a regular basis as well.
Again though... he quit IN THE MIDDLE OF A GAME.

This wasn't something that was thought out. This wasn't something where he was upset (and I agree justifiably so) and went to management in a professional way and asked for a trade.

No.

He did something that NOBODY in history has done. He quit in the middle of a game. Made a point of humiliating the President and then sat there. He didn't think this out, he just acted on emotion. So YES he's a hothead. That is indisputable. Then later on (years later) sends his son in to fight. Then two nights ago we get another show in his debut... this isn't years ago, this is a pattern of behaviour.

And I don't want a guy like this near my team. You are free to disagree. You might even be right. He might be perfect for us. But you aren't going to convince me of this. I don't think he's a horrible person, I just don't trust the guy.

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10-05-2013, 09:21 PM
  #146
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Anyone remember the Memorial Cup that Roy won?


You remember all the pressure on the players, guess who took the pressure of his players by antics? Who outcoached Nolan that game? Nolan was a great coach and got black balled from the NHL. But who outcoached him without getting black balled?

Roy has a team full of young underperforming stars, a bunch of #1 should have been's, whether its Duchene, Landsdog, or McKinnon, Roy has successfully pulled the pressure off of them and put it on his shoulders and made believers out of them.

I would bet everything that is important to me, that the Avs will win a cup in the next 5 years. I honestly don't see them not winning a cup in 5 years. He may pull a Therrien and be the coach that is fired in the year of victory but he will be a big part of them winning.

Who would bet against the Avs winning a cup in 5 years. I will tell you something, Patrick can spot a winner and you can call him whatever but he can spot winners. The Avs will be winners again.

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10-05-2013, 09:26 PM
  #147
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He did something that NOBODY in history has done. He quit in the middle of a game. Made a point of humiliating the President and then sat there. He didn't think this out, he just acted on emotion. So YES he's a hothead. That is indisputable. Then later on (years later) sends his son in to fight. Then two nights ago we get another show in his debut... this isn't years ago, this is a pattern of behaviour.
.
That's just it. There is such a thing as good passion. But Roy is definitely a hothead. I think Tremblay was wrong to leave him in goal so long that night, but I think one was as stubborn as the other.

The other things is I hate bringing back these former Habs legends only to have dump them when it doesn't work out. Gainey is no longer just a great Habs player. He is the GM who traded for Gomez.

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10-05-2013, 09:27 PM
  #148
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Anyone remember the Memorial Cup that Roy won?


You remember all the pressure on the players, guess who took the pressure of his players by antics? Who outcoached Nolan that game? Nolan was a great coach and got black balled from the NHL. But who outcoached him without getting black balled?

Roy has a team full of young underperforming stars, a bunch of #1 should have been's, whether its Duchene, Landsdog, or McKinnon, Roy has successfully pulled the pressure off of them and put it on his shoulders and made believers out of them.

I would bet everything that is important to me, that the Avs will win a cup in the next 5 years. I honestly don't see them not winning a cup in 5 years. He may pull a Therrien and be the coach that is fired in the year of victory but he will be a big part of them winning.

Who would bet against the Avs winning a cup in 5 years. I will tell you something, Patrick can spot a winner and you can call him whatever but he can spot winners. The Avs will be winners again.
The Avs have some of the best young talent in the league. Duchene, Mackinnon... and they also have Erik Johnson who was projected to be a generational blueliner before his injuries... Very good group over there. They might win no matter who's coaching them.

If Roy does lead them to a cup though, I'll be here to congratulate him and depending on how things go even admit I was wrong.

But the Avalanche being contenders I think would have a lot more to do with the talent on that roster than anything else.

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10-05-2013, 09:28 PM
  #149
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Who would bet against the Avs winning a cup in 5 years. I will tell you something, Patrick can spot a winner and you can call him whatever but he can spot winners. The Avs will be winners again.
I wouldn't put it past him. The guy is a champion. I would actually love to see him be successful. But I think he is a far better fit in that environment.

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10-05-2013, 09:32 PM
  #150
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The Avs have some of the best young talent in the league. Duchene, Mackinnon... and they also have Erik Johnson who was projected to be a generational blueliner before his injuries... Very good group over there. They might win no matter who's coaching them.

If Roy does lead them to a cup though, I'll be here to congratulate him and depending on how things go even admit I was wrong.

But the Avalanche being contenders I think would have a lot more to do with the talent on that roster than anything else.
Well with all that talent, they finished dead last, last year.


Somehow I have a feeling EJ will have his best career year. MD and MacK probably won't fair too bad either.

But the Avs being contenders will largely be, because Patrick brought them together unlike the same awesome core they had last year that cared more about a vegas off season trip.

Night and Day.

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