HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

What the HELL is going on with Henrik Lundqvist?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-08-2014, 07:29 AM
  #701
patnyrnyg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,212
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
Well, you asked if Lundvist cost the team points, I simply pointed out that Talbot has too. Just because Lundqvist has been bad, doesn't mean that Talbot hasn't lost the team points in the standings. It's okay to be objective about Talbot. People act like Talbot is standing on his head and stealing games the Rangers had no chance at winning.

People are too busy tearing down Lundqvist, and pumping up Talbot's tires. Lundqvist has been bad, but not as bad as people have made him out to be, given the team's performance in front of him. Talbot's been good, but not as good as people have made him out to be, given the team's performance in front of him. If you go by stats only, fans on here would conclude that Talbot is the best goaltender playing in the NHL, by a fair margin. And I know most people on here aren't naive enough to believe that (well, I could be wrong given out deluded our fan base is).

Talbot also hasn't had to steal a game for the team. He has played well, generally, when the team plays well. As good as he was against Toronto, when your team scores 7 goals, you're not stealing a game. Unless you can think of a game the Rangers had no chance of winning without Talbot? I can't think of any, because the team normally does pretty well with him. That said, I was able to point out two games where his performance cost the team.

That said, Lundqvist has probably cost the team points in five or six games.

But you can't always blame goaltenders either for losing games. There is a team that plays too. And for every point Lundqvist/Talbot has cost the Rangers by letting in untimely goals, Nash, Richards, Callahan, Girardi, Del Zotto, etc, have all cost the team plenty of points in the standings.

It's easy to point to a goalie for losing the team points because they're the one who lets up a soft go ahead goal. But a lot of times, the team had no business winning in the first place.
As someone pointed out earlier in the thread, Talbot is 9-3 and has given up 2 goals or less in 10 of his games. He is also 3-3 in games the Rangers scored 2 goals or less. In all of his losses the Rangers scored 2 or less. Not once have they scored 3 for Talbot and still lost. When was the last time Lundqvist surrendered 2 or less? When was the last time he won when the Rangers only scored 2?

patnyrnyg is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:04 AM
  #702
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 16,466
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mint View Post
I think people expecting Hank to be on those level of goalies were set to be disappointed. It's too bad he wasted his elite seasons on those crappy Ranger teams, but he only has himself to blame for signing those 2 long-term contracts to stay with this garbage management team. I was in the mindset that Henrik deserved better than the Rangers, but he has to maintain his elite level of play that he's displayed now that he's committed long term to this franchise.

I think by the end of Lundqvist's career, he'll be thinking what could've been.
Hasek and Roy both carried a team to the SCF. Lundqvist is partly responsible for the loss to the Devils who were by no means the superior team.

GWOW is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:10 AM
  #703
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 16,466
vCash: 500
Rangers backup goalies since the lockout are 64-57-15.

GWOW is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:14 AM
  #704
McD27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 419
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Hasek and Roy both carried a team to the SCF. Lundqvist is partly responsible for the loss to the Devils who were by no means the superior team.
I was there in person for Game 5 of that ECF. The whole place was so pumped and he laid an egg. 3 goals on 5 shots in about 10 minutes. Then we came back and tied it in the 3rd only to have him give up another goal to their 4th liner. Granted, he did steal game 2 for us but to me, he was just average in the playoffs. He's no Roy or Marty yet.

McD27 is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:14 AM
  #705
shinchanyo
Registered User
 
shinchanyo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 2,497
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
People act like Talbot is standing on his head and stealing games the Rangers had no chance at winning.

Lundqvist has been bad, but not as bad as people have made him out to be, given the team's performance in front of him. Talbot's been good, but not as good as people have made him out to be, given the team's performance in front of him. If you go by stats only, fans on here would conclude that Talbot is the best goaltender playing in the NHL, by a fair margin. And I know most people on here aren't naive enough to believe that
How dare you be objective and realize there are other factors at play. Quality of competition is important too. Compare Hank to a previous year of his OWN play. He's been bad compared to that and that is a problem.

He's still good this year. Like all the years that he's been here if he had an actually good team in front of him then the team would be at the top of the standings even in this down year for Lundqvist. But the GM has failed miserably on all accounts to even come close to assembling a team that is actually elite. I can't throw any stones at one of the best NYR to ever play the game knowing this.

A sense of entitlement and extraordinary impatience is what allows the fanatics to hurl verbal diarrhea at Lundqvist to such a degree this year.

shinchanyo is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:16 AM
  #706
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Hasek and Roy both carried a team to the SCF. Lundqvist is partly responsible for the loss to the Devils who were by no means the superior team.
So Lundqvist is not one of the top 5 goalies that ever lived. What a bum.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:17 AM
  #707
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinchanyo View Post
How dare you be objective and realize there are other factors at play. Quality of competition is important too. Compare Hank to a previous year of his OWN play. He's been bad compared to that and that is a problem.

He's still good this year. Like all the years that he's been here if he had an actually good team in front of him then the team would be at the top of the standings even in this down year for Lundqvist. But the GM has failed miserably on all accounts to even come close to assembling a team that is actually elite. I can't throw any stones at one of the best NYR to ever play the game knowing this.

A sense of entitlement and extraordinary impatience is what allows the fanatics to hurl verbal diarrhea at Lundqvist to such a degree this year.
Hating on Lundqvist is the cool, contrarian thing to do.

Folks with more level heads realize hes struggling, that the team in front of him stinks, and that Talbot would likely eventually be exposed with increased starts/minutes.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:18 AM
  #708
shinchanyo
Registered User
 
shinchanyo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 2,497
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by McD27 View Post
I was there in person for Game 5 of that ECF. The whole place was so pumped and he laid an egg. 3 goals on 5 shots in about 10 minutes. Then we came back and tied it in the 3rd only to have him give up another goal to their 4th liner. Granted, he did steal game 2 for us but to me, he was just average in the playoffs. He's no Roy or Marty yet.
I just don't feel too awful about it considering how the team was disgraced during the entire PO's. Watching them get butt******* by the 8 and 7 seeds consecutively and barely walk away with their dignity intact ruined the entire reg season. Seeing the Devs run the team off the ice was just the anticlimactic ending to a story we've seen for decades. Even last year we needed something like 150 minutes of consecutive shutout streak to get to the next round where we were again summarily plugged. Then there was that wonderful 3-1 series lead on Wsh where the team decided it was high past time they went golfing. Boy was it fun watching Henrik make saves for 60 minutes straight while having almost nothing happening offensively on the other end in that game 7. I think that might have been the series where they got shutout 2 or 3 times. This team has been a pathetic piece of dog crap for a long time.

I take solace in knowing I get to at least watch one all time ranger great stick around even through losing. Quite frankly I'd love to watch him fail this team all year and maybe even next year too. I can't get any joy from winning bc we never do it so for this season at least I'm content to watch with sick, perverted glee as the best goalie the NYR franchise has ever had finally tells the team to go **** itself and dig themselves out of HIS holes through his shoddy performance


Last edited by shinchanyo: 01-08-2014 at 09:24 AM.
shinchanyo is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 09:33 AM
  #709
McD27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 419
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinchanyo View Post
I just don't feel too awful about it considering how the team was disgraced during the entire PO's. Watching them get butt******* by the 8 and 7 seeds consecutively and barely walk away with their dignity intact ruined the entire reg season. Seeing the Devs run the team off the ice was just the anticlimactic ending to a story we've seen for decades. Even last year we needed something like 150 minutes of consecutive shutout streak to get to the next round where we were again summarily plugged. Then there was that wonderful 3-1 series lead on Wsh where the team decided it was high past time they went golfing. Boy was it fun watching Henrik make saves for 60 minutes straight while having almost nothing happening offensively on the other end in that game 7. I think that might have been the series where they got shutout 2 or 3 times. This team has been a pathetic piece of dog crap for a long time.

I take solace in knowing I get to at least watch one all time ranger great stick around even through losing. Quite frankly I'd love to watch him fail this team all year and maybe even next year too. I can't get any joy from winning bc we never do it so for this season at least I'm content to watch with sick, perverted glee as the best goalie the NYR franchise has ever had finally tells the team to go **** itself and dig themselves out of HIS holes through his shoddy performance
Great example of a perspective of fan of an individual player vs a fan of a team. Rather see the team fail at the glee of an individual player who's not playing up to par. I think Hank takes more solace in his fat extension than failure of the team. At least I hope he's better than that.

McD27 is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 11:25 AM
  #710
Fataldogg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 7,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
As someone pointed out earlier in the thread, Talbot is 9-3 and has given up 2 goals or less in 10 of his games. He is also 3-3 in games the Rangers scored 2 goals or less. In all of his losses the Rangers scored 2 or less. Not once have they scored 3 for Talbot and still lost. When was the last time Lundqvist surrendered 2 or less? When was the last time he won when the Rangers only scored 2?
I did not say that. I said that Talbot too has cost the team points. People on here are really grasping right now to bolster Talbot's image. You won't find anyone on here who thinks he didn't lose the game against the Capitals. Or that he wasn't a huge contributor to the loss against the Jets.

Just because Talbot has been better than Lundqvist this season, in his 13 games played, against lower seeded teams, doesn't mean you can't admit that he hasn't cost the team a couple of games despite his record.

And of his nine wins, I can honestly say, Talbot has not had to steal a single one of those nine, nor did he have to be the best player in any of the nine. Even his two shutouts, against MTL and especially against NSH were as easy as they get. And there is a reason, despite posting the shutout, that he wasn't the first star in either game, because he legitimately had it that easy. If he allowed a goal in either game or lost either game, it would have been a BAD game.

Fataldogg is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 11:27 AM
  #711
Fataldogg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 7,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Hasek and Roy both carried a team to the SCF. Lundqvist is partly responsible for the loss to the Devils who were by no means the superior team.
Rangers were outplayed, by a fair margin, by the 8th seed Senators. Rangers were than outplayed, by a fair margin, by the 7th seed Capitals. It took clutch goaltending from Lundqvist, and several extremely clutch goals by Richards and one by Gaborik to get the team into the ECF.

The Rangers were, by no means, the better team in either of the first two rounds.

In the ECF, the only games that Lundqvist won, were his two shutouts. The team did not win a single game where he allowed a goal.

Without Lundqvist, the high and mighty 1st seed Rangers, don't even get past the Senators, who were the better team that series.

One player can only do so much.

By the way, last year, when the Rangers faced the Capitals, AGAIN, Lundqvist closed out the series with back to back shutouts. In Game 7 he didn't have to be anything special, as I recall, it was a 5-0 game, but Game 6 he took the team on his back, in an elimination game, and got it done. They lost last year to the Bruins because... Well, they're a much better team.

Fataldogg is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 12:03 PM
  #712
Thesensation19
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,535
vCash: 500
Watch Hank and Sweden win Gold at the Olympics. I wont be shocked for him to win MVP or best goalie

Thesensation19 is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 04:50 PM
  #713
shinchanyo
Registered User
 
shinchanyo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 2,497
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by McD27 View Post
Great example of a perspective of fan of an individual player vs a fan of a team. Rather see the team fail at the glee of an individual player who's not playing up to par. I think Hank takes more solace in his fat extension than failure of the team. At least I hope he's better than that.
You literally couldn't be more wrong if you think that's how I'm approaching this. I hold the rest of the team accountable for their errors because they have been CONSISTENTLY been commiting them with much greater quantity and quality throughout every reg season and PO run.

Any attacks on Lundqvist WHILE the rest of the team continues to ALSO play poorly is simply a show of ungratefulness and impatience. Hold Lundqvist accountable bc he's sucked but I don't think we should really care all that much if he sucks for a single year especially if the rest of the team HAS and IS also sucking

You gotta realize that winning isn't everything. So I have accepted that we are going to have a down season every so often. Rather than ***** and moan I just decided to look at it in a vindictive way. People can be spiteful and vindictive toward their own family members. In this case my personal way of dealing with this season isn't even hurting anyone and has no effect on anything other than preservation of my sanity.

After all rooting for this team year after year expecting a different result other than mediocrity is the literal definition of insanity. Clearly the point of my post is not to worship at the alter of any individual OR team it is instead about learning not to give a **** and instead find pleasure where you can. Hopefully you understand better now

Quote:
Originally Posted by shinchanyo View Post
I can't get any joy from winning bc we never do it so for this season at least I'm content to watch with sick, perverted glee as the best goalie the NYR franchise has ever had finally tells the team to go **** itself and dig themselves out of HIS holes through his shoddy performance
I'd much rather we won. We won't. Gets old every so often but I'd rather not engage in a bout of pathetically ranting and raving about the whole team anymore. I'd rather just make fun of them


Last edited by shinchanyo: 01-08-2014 at 05:02 PM.
shinchanyo is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 05:51 PM
  #714
Blueshirt Special
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Blueshirt Special's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,247
vCash: 500
I wish they were playing Talbot aginst the Hawks tonight. I'd like to see what he does against elite talent like that.

Not to diss Hank, on the contrary, we might find out just what Talbot is all about.

__________________
WIN NOW
Blueshirt Special is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 06:03 PM
  #715
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,269
vCash: 500
Awards:
From what I see, he looks like he's fighting the puck — trying to make saves instead of letting the puck hit him. His "be there and be square" has been inconsistent and he seems to be scrambling around in the crease more. I don't know if he doesn't trust the new system. But he doesn't seem as relaxed as he usually is.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 08:00 PM
  #716
GbgRanger
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Göteborg/Budapest
Country: Sweden
Posts: 212
vCash: 500
Anybody know who was coaching Vancouver when Luongo was struggling?

GbgRanger is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 08:35 PM
  #717
BobMarleyNYR
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Alphabet
Country: Iraq
Posts: 3,103
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BobMarleyNYR
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
From what I see, he looks like he's fighting the puck — trying to make saves instead of letting the puck hit him. His "be there and be square" has been inconsistent and he seems to be scrambling around in the crease more. I don't know if he doesn't trust the new system. But he doesn't seem as relaxed as he usually is.
YES, and as a result, he's guessing where the puck will go instead of tracking it, which is his claim to fame. I can't fathom how anyone can say he's been average, fare, so-so when he drops to his knees as a puck flies over his shoulder. That's bad.

This game, so far, so good. I'm the first guy pulling for him, believe me.

BobMarleyNYR is offline  
Old
01-08-2014, 08:47 PM
  #718
haohmaru
#bdwyblueshirts
 
haohmaru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Fleming Island, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 6,119
vCash: 500
Going back to CBJ game, he's stopped at least the last 34 shots against him. (19 in 3rd and OT, 15 tonight. Don't know about 2nd vs. CBJ's)

haohmaru is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 10:32 AM
  #719
patnyrnyg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,212
vCash: 500
Wow, he managed to not screw one up. Although, Lundqvist sure tried to do just that. Not sure about any of you, but when Hagelin scored last night I did not think Lundqvist would hold up under the pressure that was about to come from Chicago. Thought of football when a team goes ahead with 2 1/2 minutes left and everyone thinks they left too much time on the clock.

patnyrnyg is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 10:33 AM
  #720
patnyrnyg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,212
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
Watch Hank and Sweden win Gold at the Olympics. I wont be shocked for him to win MVP or best goalie
Big deal. Not a Team Sweden fan.

patnyrnyg is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 11:20 AM
  #721
CharlieCharleschuk
Registered User
 
CharlieCharleschuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 214
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
Wow, he managed to not screw one up. Although, Lundqvist sure tried to do just that. Not sure about any of you, but when Hagelin scored last night I did not think Lundqvist would hold up under the pressure that was about to come from Chicago. Thought of football when a team goes ahead with 2 1/2 minutes left and everyone thinks they left too much time on the clock.
He held up because his team held up. Great D, even though it was a little scrambly.

He backed them up and they backed him up.

Nice to see it coming together.

CharlieCharleschuk is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 11:25 AM
  #722
Ice Hockey
Registered User
 
Ice Hockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: CT
Country: United States
Posts: 775
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
So Lundqvist is not one of the top 5 goalies that ever lived. What a bum.
he gets paid like it.

Ice Hockey is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 11:31 AM
  #723
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Hockey View Post
he gets paid like it.
Well, he is the best goalie of the past 8 years, so thats why he gets paid a lot. I could get into the evolution of markets and talk about why Lundqvist makes more money than Hasek or Roy did, but that seems like a feckless endeavor.

But yea, anyway, Im sure Cam Talbot would've won that game prettier last night.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 11:32 AM
  #724
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
Wow, he managed to not screw one up. Although, Lundqvist sure tried to do just that. Not sure about any of you, but when Hagelin scored last night I did not think Lundqvist would hold up under the pressure that was about to come from Chicago. Thought of football when a team goes ahead with 2 1/2 minutes left and everyone thinks they left too much time on the clock.
LOL. Spoiled brat

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
01-09-2014, 11:52 AM
  #725
patnyrnyg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,212
vCash: 500
How am I a spoiled brat? I have been a Mets and Rangers fan for 30+ years. How can ANYONE like that be deemed, "spoiled"?

patnyrnyg is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:53 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.