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Do the Flyers have enough playmakers on offense?

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07-14-2005, 08:10 PM
  #1
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Do the Flyers have enough playmakers on offense?

Simple question.

I've been looking at the line combinations and possible lineups and it's had me wondering. I know with the new CBA most teams probably won't have as many star players, but I'm not sure I get a warm fuzzy feeling about the Flyers' scoring ability for this upcoming season.

Start at center. Carter and Richards are obviously two great prospects with top-6 forward potential, but I don't think it's the greatest of ideas to place all of our hopes in two rookies. Furthermore, the other two centerman, Primeau and Handzus, have never been offensive dynamos; Especially Primeau.

On the wing they have some playmakers in Gagne and Roenick, and I have high hopes for Knuble, but we still need another top 6 winger, and unless someone particularly strong is added I don't see this offense striking a whole lot of fear in to opposing defenses.

I don't know, at this point I'm just trying to size up the team and look at all the possibilities so I very well could be mistaken about this. I'm just not sure this team has a lot of offensive firepower. That's not to say they aren't good, because I believe this will be a solid contending team, but I'd like to see a little more offense.

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07-14-2005, 08:17 PM
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I agree we do need to bring in someone else to play wing. We'll have a few holes to fill when free agency starts and I'm sure Clark knows what he is doing, hopefully. Who ever we sign for a winger, I'm hoping he has above average speed. Adding speed to this line up will make the offense play better.

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07-14-2005, 09:21 PM
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This team is going to look alot like last years. We'll have a handful of players netting twenty goals and noone breaking that thirty, that is unless Roenick can stay healthy. As for Primeau, he'll score when it counts.

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07-14-2005, 09:57 PM
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I wouldn't mind having another guy with speed, I think thats the area we lack...of course Kapanen, but he isnt top 6...I'm excited to see Knuble, and what kind of "goal scoring" element he brings to the team

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07-15-2005, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan McGillis 03
I wouldn't mind having another guy with speed, I think thats the area we lack...of course Kapanen, but he isnt top 6...I'm excited to see Knuble, and what kind of "goal scoring" element he brings to the team

If you're looking for team speed, counting on Mike Knuble isn't doing you any favors

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07-15-2005, 06:32 AM
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IMO we need one more top 6 forward, preferable a playmaking winger, ala a Corey Stillman.

I'd be ready to go to war with Roenick, Gagne, Carter, Handzus, Stillman and Knuble in my top 6. Having a mobile defense corps that can all omve the puck is a big help as well (KJ, Pitkanen, Seidenberg, plus possibly Desjardins and another mobile ufa defenseman)

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07-15-2005, 07:39 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth
This team is going to look alot like last years. We'll have a handful of players netting twenty goals and noone breaking that thirty, that is unless Roenick can stay healthy. As for Primeau, he'll score when it counts.
I'll take a team of 20 goal scorers, more so than one guy in the 30's, and the rest 15-20. I much prefer a balanced attack, rather than one superstar line. We've been down that road with the LOD. The dropoff after them was incredible.
We are in great shape when the UFA season starts. I mean the Flyers need to plug 2 holes, instead of reconstructing their entire team. For those who critize Clarke, myself being one of them, he's done a great job, pre-lockout!

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07-15-2005, 07:44 AM
  #8
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I think we'd have to wait until the dust settles from the buyouts. Right now, I think the Flyers need another play maker at forward. They're gonna need one no matter what happens with other teams. But depending on what happens with other teams in the conference, the degree of need could lessen. If NJ loses Nieds, Toronto loses Mogilny (EDIT: TB loses Bulin, St. Louis)... then it's not as pressing a need. A dman should be the #1 priority though.


Last edited by Dr Love: 07-15-2005 at 07:55 AM.
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07-15-2005, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Love
I think we'd have to wait until the dust settles from the buyouts. Right now, I think the Flyers need another play maker at forward. They're gonna need one no matter what happens with other teams. But depending on what happens with other teams in the conference, the degree of need could lessen. If NJ loses Nieds, Toronto loses Mogilny... then it's not as pressing a need. A dman should be the #1 priority though.
I still think it's amazing that we only need 2 players, when everything settles. I mean there are teams with under 10 players signed. It's unbelievable.
We have 5 solid d-man, and a need for a playmaking winger. Hat's off to our management for having the foresight to see post lockout!!

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07-15-2005, 07:51 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers26
I still think it's amazing that we only need 2 players, when everything settles. I mean there are teams with under 10 players signed. It's unbelievable.
We have 5 solid d-man, and a need for a playmaking winger. Hat's off to our management for having the foresight to see post lockout!!
Didn't you get the memo? We're screwed! Small market teams will now suddenly start spending, just because! And everyone wants to sign with (insert team name here) or play with (insert player name here)! There's no way the Flyers can compete! Big market clubs are doomed, doomed I tell you!

THE SKY IS FALLING!

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07-15-2005, 08:01 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers26
I'll take a team of 20 goal scorers, more so than one guy in the 30's, and the rest 15-20. I much prefer a balanced attack, rather than one superstar line. We've been down that road with the LOD. The dropoff after them was incredible.
We are in great shape when the UFA season starts. I mean the Flyers need to plug 2 holes, instead of reconstructing their entire team. For those who critize Clarke, myself being one of them, he's done a great job, pre-lockout!
But there isn't anything wrong with having a 35 - 40 goal scorer in the lineup. Balance isn't everything. We truly lack an offensively gifted player. I could care less about a team full of two way players. I want someone on the team who is pure offense and who can put the puck in the net at least 40 times and assist others in putting the puck in the net. Sometimes, two way play is overrated and it's kind of refreshing to have an offensive dynamo on your team.

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07-15-2005, 08:06 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GagneScores12
But there isn't anything wrong with having a 35 - 40 goal scorer in the lineup. Balance isn't everything. We truly lack an offensively gifted player. I could care less about a team full of two way players. I want someone on the team who is pure offense and who can put the puck in the net at least 40 times and assist others in putting the puck in the net. Sometimes, two way play is overrated and it's kind of refreshing to have an offensive dynamo on your team.
Gagne might be that guy though. Certainly has the ability and opportunity to. And how many 30-40 goal guys are going to be available?

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07-15-2005, 08:24 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GagneScores12
But there isn't anything wrong with having a 35 - 40 goal scorer in the lineup. Balance isn't everything. We truly lack an offensively gifted player. I could care less about a team full of two way players. I want someone on the team who is pure offense and who can put the puck in the net at least 40 times and assist others in putting the puck in the net. Sometimes, two way play is overrated and it's kind of refreshing to have an offensive dynamo on your team.
I'd still take a balanced attack over a superstar and role players.
Look at how the Devils & Lightning teams were constructed...one word.. balance!

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07-15-2005, 08:33 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers26
I'd still take a balanced attack over a superstar and role players.
Look at how the Devils & Lightning teams were constructed...one word.. balance!
Maybe. But fact of the matter is that: A) Elias is a superstar player; B) St.Louis is a superstar player; C) Richards is a superstar player. It's almost like there's a degree of shame in having a superstar player on the team. I know that with the system we play, it strips the superstars of their natural talent and ability, but damn, for once I'd love to see us have a purely offensive player. We have a ton of two way players that maybe, just maybe, an purely offensive player might be what this system needs.

As for Gagne being that guy, I have no confidence that he'll even be moved off the line with Primeau and Kapanen. There isn't an incentive to move him. Think of it. You can have Knuble on a line with Carter and Roenick. You have the Handzus line with probably Somik and Radivojevic and then you have the Primeau line and finally the scrub line that unfortunately, Richards will have to center.

You can bet that all the defensive minded coaches will find systems that will neuter the "new" offensive rules that the NHL is adopting. I just don't see things changing. They've said the same for years and the moment penalties start getting called, refs get called out by various teams, and then the refs stop making the calls.

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07-15-2005, 08:35 AM
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i think Gagne can net 30.

i'll be sorta surprised if the Roenick/Primeau/Kapanen line sticks together simply because i think we will need Roenick in a scoring role... however, that line WILL get some good offense. Primeau creates a lot of chances, just isn't a great finisher anymore, and Kapanen seems to have the same problem... having a guy like Roenick on that line will help them pop a few more as a group.

Carter... i could see him getting like 25-30 goals... guy has a GREAT wrist shot, if he's got some good players around him creating space to let that thing go, he'll get some. prolly won't contribute greatly in assists, but if he's on a line that gets him snap shots from the slot, he'll get his.

Handzus is a pretty good passer, and he's been on some consistently good lines here... never offensive dynamo level, but solid contributors. If we were to sign Demitra, the two had good chemistry together in St. Louis.

obviously we need to sign a top-two line wing... that will help considerably.

KJ, Pitkanen, Seids, Desjardins can all provide some offense from the D too.

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07-15-2005, 09:24 AM
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If Gagne remains in a defensive role it will be the worst choice Hitch can make. The news rules are opening up the game, meaning you have to let your goal scorers score because they'll be able to now more freely.

Also if you keep Roenick, Sami, and Prims on the same line perhaps that could be an offense line and have Richards center the checking line? Carter then would get second line duty which would leave a trade of Handzus open. I'd rather keep him but it might be hard to find a spot for him at center.

Having that 40 goal guy will certainly help this offense. If Gagne can be that guy then I don't care how good he is at playing defense. Unforchunetly, I'm not the guy wearing a suit and tie on the bench.

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07-15-2005, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyersProspect2
Also if you keep Roenick, Sami, and Prims on the same line perhaps that could be an offense line and have Richards center the checking line?
Why in the world would you have Primeau center a scoring line and Richards center the checking line? Primeau has established himself as an elite shutdown center, and you'd be putting Richards on the ice vs the opposition's top line.

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07-15-2005, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
I'd be ready to go to war with Roenick, Gagne, Carter, Handzus, Stillman and Knuble in my top 6.
So would I, I just hope they will be able to secure another offensive minded winger like Stillman. Carter seems to be a real wildcard for this year, his upside for this season is alot higher than his downside. He could surprise.

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07-15-2005, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Brad
So would I, I just hope they will be able to secure another offensive minded winger like Stillman. Carter seems to be a real wildcard for this year, his upside for this season is alot higher than his downside. He could surprise.
Carter is going to be real good, real soon. I think he'll put up better numbers than Gagne did as a rookie (20 & 28).

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07-15-2005, 10:07 AM
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I think people forget that it was only three seasons ago that Primeau had 73 points. The man can play an offensive game, if given an opportunity. Because his job has been to shut down the opposition's top line, he has no need to play an offensive game. That being said, if Primeau were to play an offensive game, at the very most, you can expect maybe 50 to 60 points at the most out of him.

His playoff performance was an exception, not a rule. If you look back at Primeau's career, he has a dominating playoffs when he's playing for a contract. No difference here. He was playing for a contract. It's too bad that he can't carry that playoff performance over to the regular season though because it was a dominating performance. Someone on here called it a Mark Messier-esque performance. I probably wouldn't go that far though.

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07-15-2005, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers26
I'll take a team of 20 goal scorers, more so than one guy in the 30's, and the rest 15-20. I much prefer a balanced attack, rather than one superstar line. We've been down that road with the LOD. The dropoff after them was incredible.
We are in great shape when the UFA season starts. I mean the Flyers need to plug 2 holes, instead of reconstructing their entire team. For those who critize Clarke, myself being one of them, he's done a great job, pre-lockout!
Bobby only looks sweeter when you consider that he got the class of '03 to stick with this team longer because of the new cba. [sarcasm]I bet he'll still take crap for the Lindros trade though[/sarcasm].


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07-15-2005, 10:37 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GagneScores12
I think people forget that it was only three seasons ago that Primeau had 73 points. The man can play an offensive game, if given an opportunity. Because his job has been to shut down the opposition's top line, he has no need to play an offensive game. That being said, if Primeau were to play an offensive game, at the very most, you can expect maybe 50 to 60 points at the most out of him.

His playoff performance was an exception, not a rule. If you look back at Primeau's career, he has a dominating playoffs when he's playing for a contract. No difference here. He was playing for a contract. It's too bad that he can't carry that playoff performance over to the regular season though because it was a dominating performance. Someone on here called it a Mark Messier-esque performance. I probably wouldn't go that far though.
he's been leading the team in shots and not getting those numbers... primeau's problem hasn't been lack of offensive opportunities, he just stopped finishing. he starts finishing, while playing the same he is now, he'll get a lot of points.

hopefully he keeps finishing... that's all that really changed in the playoffs.

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07-15-2005, 10:38 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth
Bobby only looks sweeter when you consider that he got the class of '03 to stick with this team longer because of the new cba. I bet he'll still take crap for the Lindros trade though.
the one where he ripped off the Rangers? cuz Clarke didn't make the original deal.

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07-15-2005, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
i think Gagne can net 30.
I'm interested to see how the new rule changes will affect Gagne, hopefully he can get down the ice ahead of the defense and score some extra goals

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07-15-2005, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
the one where he ripped off the Rangers? cuz Clarke didn't make the original deal.
Maybe I should use the smilies. Nah

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