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Should the Wild consider going after Vanek?

View Poll Results: Should we try and sign Vanek next year?
Yes, absolutely. We need him. 20 19.80%
Yes, it couldn't hurt. 51 50.50%
No, doesn't matter. 19 18.81%
No way, he wouldn't even fit in our lineup. 11 10.89%
Voters: 101. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-14-2013, 07:30 PM
  #176
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Why does our 3rd line have to grind? Why not speed and skill?
Because the NHL plays on an NHL sheet and plays an 82 game season. There is so much value in being able to wear teams down and beat them up over the course of a season, and that quality is downright essential in playoff hockey. That's when it jumps up a notch out there, and you have to be able to beat your opponent up before they get you first.

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10-14-2013, 07:32 PM
  #177
J22
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Originally Posted by tomthestone View Post
Watched a ton of him at Denver. I see every team in the NHL play. A small guy like Zucker, who tries to focus on the offensive side of the red line and play a game predicated on his wheels is not about to become an effective grinder type.

Zucker fancies himself a scoring-line player, and will try to crack an NHL lineup as such for the next couple years. The Wild should trade him this spring for immediate help instead of hoping he learns to play a defensive game. Small, fast guys like him aren't all that difficult to find.

Maybe its just me, but If I knew as little about a player as you clearly do about Zucker, I probably wouldnt speak with such certainty as to what he might be able to become.

Zucker made a WJC team as an underager as a checking line player. Zucker was projected as a quality 3rd line prospect when he was drafted. The top 6 talk didnt even begin until he blew up at Denver

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10-14-2013, 07:32 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by tomthestone View Post
Because the NHL plays on an NHL sheet and plays an 82 game season. There is so much value in being able to wear teams down and beat them up over the course of a season, and that quality is downright essential in playoff hockey. That's when it jumps up a notch out there, and you have to be able to beat your opponent up before they get you first.
If you're deep enough, you can make that 4th line your grinder/shut down line.

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10-14-2013, 07:34 PM
  #179
Dr Jan Itor
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If you're deep enough, you can make that 4th line your grinder/shut down line.
Exactly. Who would have a problem with this:

Parise - Koivu - Nino
Vanek - Granlund - Pominville
Zucker - Coyle - Mitchell
Cooke - Brodziak - Fontaine

Essentially we'd be replacing Konopka with Zucker. Unless Konopka does a whole lot that I don't see, I don't see the harm.

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10-14-2013, 07:36 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Exactly. Who would have a problem with this:

Parise - Koivu - Nino
Vanek - Granlund - Pominville
Zucker - Coyle - Mitchell
Cooke - Brodziak - Fontaine

Essentially we'd be replacing Konopka with Zucker. Unless Konopka does a whole lot that I don't see, I don't see the harm.
Not me.


Last edited by MuckOG: 10-14-2013 at 07:42 PM.
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10-14-2013, 07:37 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Exactly. Who would have a problem with this:

Parise - Koivu - Nino
Vanek - Granlund - Pominville
Zucker - Coyle - Mitchell
Cooke - Brodziak - Fontaine

Essentially we'd be replacing Konopka with Zucker. Unless Konopka does a whole lot that I don't see, I don't see the harm.
I got no problem with this what so ever.

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10-14-2013, 08:20 PM
  #182
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i think the whole third line=grind line comes from the fact that it's hard to financially field a team full of players who are both offensively potent and defensively responsible. so we could have a speed n skill third line probably, yeah, but what good is that going to do if they get scored on twice as much as they score? that's the theory, anyway.

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10-14-2013, 08:24 PM
  #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Exactly. Who would have a problem with this:

Parise - Koivu - Nino
Vanek - Granlund - Pominville
Zucker - Coyle - Fontaine
Cooke - Brodziak - Mitchell

Essentially we'd be replacing Konopka with Zucker. Unless Konopka does a whole lot that I don't see, I don't see the harm.
Or even...

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10-14-2013, 08:35 PM
  #184
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are we taking more penalties this year than the last couple or does it just seem like it?

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10-14-2013, 08:47 PM
  #185
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are we taking more penalties this year than the last couple or does it just seem like it?
Feels like it.

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10-14-2013, 09:40 PM
  #186
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Maybe its just me, but If I knew as little about a player as you clearly do about Zucker, I probably wouldnt speak with such certainty as to what he might be able to become.

Zucker made a WJC team as an underager as a checking line player. Zucker was projected as a quality 3rd line prospect when he was drafted. The top 6 talk didnt even begin until he blew up at Denver
Easy on the WJC talk. That's an international tourney played by kids. Speed and a willingness to battle can be most of what you need to play an effective checking role on that stage.

These video game lineups you guys keep posting would get steamrolled by an NHL team that is willing to get nasty.

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10-14-2013, 09:44 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by tomthestone View Post
Easy on the WJC talk. That's an international tourney played by kids. Speed and a willingness to battle can be most of what you need to play an effective checking role on that stage.

These video game lineups you guys keep posting would get steamrolled by an NHL team that is willing to get nasty.
All I did was take out Konopka. He's not going to keep us from being "steamrolled".

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10-14-2013, 09:50 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
All I did was take out Konopka. He's not going to keep us from being "steamrolled".
Zucker and Fontaine together on a bottom six line in the NHL. So brittle.

Edit: seeing now that I messed up and Zucker+Fontaine on the third is a tweak to the lineup you posted.

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10-14-2013, 10:07 PM
  #189
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Zucker and Fontaine together on a bottom six line in the NHL. So brittle.

Edit: seeing now that I messed up and Zucker+Fontaine on the third is a tweak to the lineup you posted.
So fast.

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10-14-2013, 10:31 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Exactly. Who would have a problem with this:

Parise - Koivu - Nino
Vanek - Granlund - Pominville
Zucker - Coyle - Mitchell
Cooke - Brodziak - Fontaine

Essentially we'd be replacing Konopka with Zucker. Unless Konopka does a whole lot that I don't see, I don't see the harm.
Me neither. Love it.

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10-14-2013, 10:34 PM
  #191
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Vanek really didn´t care at all this game.

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10-14-2013, 10:39 PM
  #192
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If he were a couple of years younger...

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10-14-2013, 11:21 PM
  #193
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Something kind of interesting I've been looking into. I've assumed that when/if Vanek would make it UFA, his demands would start at the 7 year, $7m+ per year point. I'm not so sure anymore. His 2nd contract, I believe largely due to an offer sheet, was for $50m. He has already made $50m+ in the league. For comparison, up until Parise, Suter, Getzlaf and Perry signed their new deals (using them because of similar age) they had made the following on their 2nd contracts:

Parise: $18.5m
Suter: $14m
Getzlaf: $26.6m
Perry: $26.6m

Vanek: $50m

If he wants a money grab, I'm sure he'll be able to get it somewhere, but if he really wants to come here, then I wouldn't say that it would be a total shocker for him to leave some money on the table. Something like 5-6 years @ $5.5m per or even 7 years at $5m per could be enough.

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10-14-2013, 11:31 PM
  #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Something kind of interesting I've been looking into. I've assumed that when/if Vanek would make it UFA, his demands would start at the 7 year, $7m+ per year point. I'm not so sure anymore. His 2nd contract, I believe largely due to an offer sheet, was for $50m. He has already made $50m+ in the league. For comparison, up until Parise, Suter, Getzlaf and Perry signed their new deals (using them because of similar age) they had made the following on their 2nd contracts:

Parise: $18.5m
Suter: $14m
Getzlaf: $26.6m
Perry: $26.6m

Vanek: $50m

If he wants a money grab, I'm sure he'll be able to get it somewhere, but if he really wants to come here, then I wouldn't say that it would be a total shocker for him to leave some money on the table. Something like 5-6 years @ $5.5m per or even 7 years at $5m per could be enough.
...and we would have Kevin Lowe to thank for that as he was the one who got Vanek to sign that offersheet from Edmonton. Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong but that might have been right after Heatley refused the trade to Edmonton. And then after they failed to get Vanek, he went out and offersheeted Dustin Penner.

I just remember how pissed Darcy Regier was in that press conference announcing that the Sabres would match the deal.

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10-15-2013, 10:36 AM
  #195
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Only on a short term deal. 4-5 years with the big money. Wild could definitely used a goal scorer but I don't want to see Dany Heatley 2.0 from 2016-2020 at $8m a pop.

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10-15-2013, 03:16 PM
  #196
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Brennan Klak ‏@nhlupdate 50m
Like Elliotte Friedman reported, it's tougher to move Thomas Vanek for a better return cause many expect him to try for Minny on July 1

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10-15-2013, 03:24 PM
  #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Something kind of interesting I've been looking into. I've assumed that when/if Vanek would make it UFA, his demands would start at the 7 year, $7m+ per year point. I'm not so sure anymore. His 2nd contract, I believe largely due to an offer sheet, was for $50m. He has already made $50m+ in the league. For comparison, up until Parise, Suter, Getzlaf and Perry signed their new deals (using them because of similar age) they had made the following on their 2nd contracts:

Parise: $18.5m
Suter: $14m
Getzlaf: $26.6m
Perry: $26.6m

Vanek: $50m

If he wants a money grab, I'm sure he'll be able to get it somewhere, but if he really wants to come here, then I wouldn't say that it would be a total shocker for him to leave some money on the table. Something like 5-6 years @ $5.5m per or even 7 years at $5m per could be enough.
Dang. I didn't think it'd be anywhere close to that. Those are some eye-popping differences. Nice catch.

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Originally Posted by HamiltonOHL View Post
Brennan Klak ‏@nhlupdate 50m
Like Elliotte Friedman reported, it's tougher to move Thomas Vanek for a better return cause many expect him to try for Minny on July 1
Hmmm...it gets even more interesting when somewhat reliable sources say that. I only say somewhat because I don't know him, and reliable since he is on HNIC.

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10-15-2013, 03:28 PM
  #198
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Brennan Klak ‏@nhlupdate 50m
Like Elliotte Friedman reported, it's tougher to move Thomas Vanek for a better return cause many expect him to try for Minny on July 1
Haha we have wrecked Vanek's trade value and we didn't even do anything.

Man we are making a habit of ripping the hearts out of other teams fanbases. First Nashville and Jersey, now we're probably gonna do it to Buffalo. And I don't hate them so that makes me kind of sad

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10-15-2013, 03:34 PM
  #199
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Haha we have wrecked Vanek's trade value and we didn't even do anything.

Man we are making a habit of ripping the hearts out of other teams fanbases. First Nashville and Jersey, now we're probably gonna do it to Buffalo. And I don't hate them so that makes me kind of sad
Muwahaha. Who's next?

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10-15-2013, 03:37 PM
  #200
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Muwahaha. Who's next?
Toews and Spezza are UFA's in 2015...

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