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Who's better, really?

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Old
10-11-2013, 04:14 PM
  #1
Kriss E
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Who's better, really?

As much as a goof Tony Marinaro can be, he said something this morning that I started thinking at the end of the CGY game. He said PK is the best Dman in the world right now, and you know what, I have to agree.

The way this kid can be dominant in every single facet of the game is just crazy.
One thing I never thought I'd see from him is how he literally took a completely lifeless team and absolutely revived it on his own. It was just a beautiful thing to see.
When he took the puck and carried it from end to end, it didn't matter how many guys was in front of him, he was getting through. So much passion and intensity. Maybe he had a tad too much of it, which is why he took that stupid penalty, but man, how dominant was he.

Every game he just gets better. It's incredible.

Chara would probably be a #1 consensus, but that's mainly because people are in love with his size and they're obsessed with toughness. Overall however, I don't put him ahead of PK.
PK-Keith-Doughty to me are the best three, I guess you can flip them around. But I don't think they dominate like PK.

As much as what Therrien said after the game in CGY wasn't really bad. I'm very annoyed with his response. It seems nobody can ever stick up for PK. He's always being blamed for whatever. People were talking about PK's penalty and completely disregard the fact he's the one that lifted this dead team up. I would have liked to see Therrien step up for his stud Dman. Ya, he can acknowledge that it was a stupid penalty, but add that PK wasn't to blame for the loss, that he's the one that lifted the team, that he wasn't the problem.

A few days ago, Wilde was on and they were talking about what Darren Dreger said. That the penalty PK took is exactly why people shouldn't be surprised that PK isn't on Team Canada's roster. What kind of stupid BS is that? Late stupid penalties happen to everyone, even the most seasoned veterans. To hold this over his head is just completely unfair and I have to wonder what that's really about. It's like people are always looking for reasons to bring him down and justify criticizing him. He needs to be absolutely perfect, 100% of the time. Even then, some won't give him credit.

But in all seriousness, if people are still saying that x Dmen are better, I'm just curious to know why.


Mods can merge this into a PK appreciation thread, couldn't find it.


Last edited by Kriss E: 10-11-2013 at 04:23 PM.
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Old
10-11-2013, 04:17 PM
  #2
Beaker
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Agree with everything

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10-11-2013, 04:19 PM
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Phil Parent
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I wonder if people still think he's not really a lock for Sochi...?

The other night, he just pushed on the gas and carried the puck from one end of the ice to the other... the other players looked like they were in slow-motion.

Franchise D. Franchise players can take the opposition's best's best and shove it back up their *****. With PK, Galchenyuk and Price, we have somebody who can do that in all three tiers of the game.

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10-11-2013, 04:21 PM
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Lord and Saviour Erik Karlsson is better. Duh.

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10-11-2013, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
I wonder if people still think he's not really a lock for Sochi...?

The other night, he just pushed on the gas and carried the puck from one end of the ice to the other... the other players looked like they were in slow-motion.

Franchise D.
That TSN Olympic preview show...

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Old
10-11-2013, 04:25 PM
  #6
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I really wish there was a way for Subban to start playing the right wing. Our top 6 could look like this:

Pacioretty Eller Subban --> All 24 years old, big, and primed to dominate for years to come.
Bournival Galchenyuk Gallagher --> All younger, primed to dominate even longer (jury's still out for Bournival tho)

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10-11-2013, 04:26 PM
  #7
Vsevolod Bobrov
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Shea Weber is better.

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Old
10-11-2013, 04:26 PM
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Kriss E
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Originally Posted by mudpunch View Post
I really wish there was a way for Subban to start playing the right wing. Our top 6 could look like this:

Pacioretty Eller Subban --> All 24 years old, big, and primed to dominate for years to come.
Bournival Galchenyuk Gallagher --> All younger, primed to dominate even longer (jury's still out for Bournival tho)
And leave who for defense exactly?
If you're going to wish for things, just wish for a forward version of Subban.

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10-11-2013, 04:27 PM
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Phil Parent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudpunch View Post
I really wish there was a way for Subban to start playing the right wing. Our top 6 could look like this:

Pacioretty Eller Subban --> All 24 years old, big, and primed to dominate for years to come.
Bournival Galchenyuk Gallagher --> All younger, primed to dominate even longer (jury's still out for Bournival tho)
I know what you're thinking... and I'm sure he'll play at least one shift on the wing one day... but it's not a good idea to mess with somebody's position like this!

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10-11-2013, 04:28 PM
  #10
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I tend to agree with pretty much everything. Edmonton had 3 #1 pick on the ice yesterday, and there isn't one I'd trade Subban for.

I'm also quite annoyed at how quick people are to bring him down and how so few tend to step up to defend him. Maybe he's annoying, maybe he's a pain in the locker room, I dunno and I don't really care. On the ice, he's quite often THE best player, pretty much no matter who else is playing.

If I had the choice to keep Galchenyuk or PK, I'd keep PK, and that says a lot cause I think Galchenyuk is amazing. But I think that a Dman of his caliber has simply more impact on the game than any forward can ever have.

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10-11-2013, 04:31 PM
  #11
fromthepast
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
And leave who for defense exactly?
If you're going to wish for things, just wish for a forward version of Subban.
I wasn't thinking for this season, but eventually, it'd be nice no? Subban is so offensively oriented, it just might work. We just have to hope that our young guys (Tinordi and Beaulieu) fulfill their potential and that we hire big names to fill the hole for defense, etc.

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10-11-2013, 04:32 PM
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Also have to agree and have been saying this for a year now

and its VERY hard not to sound like a complete homer whenever talking about subban

but jesus christ does it EVER feel good.

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10-11-2013, 04:34 PM
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Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Vsevolod Bobrov View Post
Shea Weber is better.
I guess you didn't see the ''Why?'' part in my post.
Why is Weber better? Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge Weber fan, he definitely was better than PK before. But today, I just don't see why. What makes Weber better?

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10-11-2013, 04:37 PM
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Vsevolod Bobrov
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Better defensively, more intimidating, less good at rushing the puck but has better shot, so about even offensively.

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10-11-2013, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I guess you didn't see the ''Why?'' part in my post.
Why is Weber better? Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge Weber fan, he definitely was better than PK before. But today, I just don't see why. What makes Weber better?
Love weber too but he cant skate HALF as fast as subban.

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10-11-2013, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vsevolod Bobrov View Post
Better defensively, more intimidating, less good at rushing the puck but has better shot, so about even offensively.
We will see in this years skills competition just how much of a better shot he has over subban

shea hit 106 i believe? im sure pk can hit 103!

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10-11-2013, 04:43 PM
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Karlsson, Chara, maybe Weber

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10-11-2013, 04:46 PM
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Vsevolod Bobrov
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I guess you didn't see the ''Why?'' part in my post.
Why is Weber better? Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge Weber fan, he definitely was better than PK before. But today, I just don't see why. What makes Weber better?
Speaking of being outdated, your top3 is not very good. Keith Doughty have not been in their Norris days for a while.

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10-11-2013, 04:48 PM
  #19
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
As much as a goof Tony Marinaro can be, he said something this morning that I started thinking at the end of the CGY game. He said PK is the best Dman in the world right now, and you know what, I have to agree.

The way this kid can be dominant in every single facet of the game is just crazy.
One thing I never thought I'd see from him is how he literally took a completely lifeless team and absolutely revived it on his own. It was just a beautiful thing to see.
When he took the puck and carried it from end to end, it didn't matter how many guys was in front of him, he was getting through. So much passion and intensity. Maybe he had a tad too much of it, which is why he took that stupid penalty, but man, how dominant was he.

Every game he just gets better. It's incredible.

Chara would probably be a #1 consensus, but that's mainly because people are in love with his size and they're obsessed with toughness. Overall however, I don't put him ahead of PK.
PK-Keith-Doughty to me are the best three, I guess you can flip them around. But I don't think they dominate like PK.

As much as what Therrien said after the game in CGY wasn't really bad. I'm very annoyed with his response. It seems nobody can ever stick up for PK. He's always being blamed for whatever. People were talking about PK's penalty and completely disregard the fact he's the one that lifted this dead team up. I would have liked to see Therrien step up for his stud Dman. Ya, he can acknowledge that it was a stupid penalty, but add that PK wasn't to blame for the loss, that he's the one that lifted the team, that he wasn't the problem.

A few days ago, Wilde was on and they were talking about what Darren Dreger said. That the penalty PK took is exactly why people shouldn't be surprised that PK isn't on Team Canada's roster. What kind of stupid BS is that? Late stupid penalties happen to everyone, even the most seasoned veterans. To hold this over his head is just completely unfair and I have to wonder what that's really about. It's like people are always looking for reasons to bring him down and justify criticizing him. He needs to be absolutely perfect, 100% of the time. Even then, some won't give him credit.

But in all seriousness, if people are still saying that x Dmen are better, I'm just curious to know why.


Mods can merge this into a PK appreciation thread, couldn't find it.
1) Perception lags reality. PK will be the new Chara in 2 years, with the respect it gets if he keeps this level up. Eventually it will be to the detriment of anyone's credibility to slag PK. Right now PK's armour is not impermeable because...

2) You never get a second chance to make a first impression - PK was criticized early in his career, Cherry and others have made a permanent dent in Subban's reputation. It takes time to overcome this.

3) PK is different, he represents change. Hockey is a stasis world, see the ridiculous Hertl dossier. There are people who don't like him.

4) The 24/7 sports world needs fresh information and things to talk about. This represented a new angle to a top athlete. Fodder for the soap opera script makers.

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10-11-2013, 04:49 PM
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You nailed it Kriss E, I for one hope the media only motivates him more, because those ****ing clowns can run almost anyone out of town with such repeated unwarranted negative attention.

As far as MT is concerned, he needs to realize that PKs going to be here much longer than he is so in his best interest he should stick up for his prodigy instead of letting his ego drive his statements.

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Old
10-11-2013, 04:49 PM
  #21
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Vsevolod Bobrov View Post
Better defensively, more intimidating, less good at rushing the puck but has better shot, so about even offensively.
Better defensively? Can't say I agree. Perhaps you haven't seen much of Weber since Suter left, and vice versa, but they aren't as solid. Gonna have to disagree there.

More intimidating? I wasn't aware that intimidation was a skill. But okay, I guess..

Less good at rushing the puck is an understatement. And how does him having a more powerful shot evens it out???
Weber does not come close to having the offensive instincts or skills of PK. Not to mention the skating abilities.

I love Weber, but some of the things you said aren't even true, and you disregard other things.

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10-11-2013, 04:50 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by couris View Post
Karlsson, Chara, maybe Weber
Karlsson career high 78 points
Chara career high 52 points
Weber career high points 53 and 23 goals

ill be monitoring subban and hope he can topple these numbers!

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10-11-2013, 04:51 PM
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couris
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Originally Posted by Redux91 View Post
Karlsson career high 78 points
Chara career high 52 points
Weber career high points 53 and 23 goals

ill be monitoring subban and hope he can topple these numbers!
Chara is more than points. We all saw last playoffs that he was the best Dman by far, a little bit like Pronger.

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10-11-2013, 04:52 PM
  #24
Agnostic
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Originally Posted by Redux91 View Post
We will see in this years skills competition just how much of a better shot he has over subban

shea hit 106 i believe? im sure pk can hit 103!
This is like the 95mph fastball in baseball. Everyone in baseball can easily hit one at that speed yet it's somehow a gold standard that makes a pitcher "elite".

Like a hockey shot it's all about location, and deception. Not speed.

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10-11-2013, 04:52 PM
  #25
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It's because he is black. If he looked like Karlsson all of this would not be an issue.

God I hate Dreger.

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