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11-04-2013, 02:36 PM
  #226
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadrupleDeke View Post
You failed to read the part where I mentioned that the top teams didn't overpay for their quarterbacks. Who cares when they were originally drafted? Manning and Brees were free agent signings. Throw in Indy if you want (I just went by ESPN league standings), and none of those quarterbacks still come anywhere near what the Redskins gave up for Griffin.
Drew Brees = Signed a 6 year/60 mil deal with NO before proving his surgically repaired throwing shoulder was sound.

Peyton Manning = Signed a 5 year/96 mil deal with Den before proving his multiple surgeries on his neck were successful, and his arm strength fully recovered.

There is a fine line between over payment and a sound player acquisition decision. Signing FA QB's coming off significant injuries is a risk. So is trading away two 1st's and a 2nd for a potential franchise QB. Both NO and Denver needed to take the risk to compete. Same goes for the Skins. Griffin finally showed yesterday what we fell in love with last year. 95% of NFL players take a while to fully recover from major knee surgery. Griffin is no different. Patience is a virtue.

And spare me the Alex Smith BS. He is Trent Dilfer with mobility. Take away KC's great defense and Alex Smith doesn't lead KC to a 9-0 record.

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11-04-2013, 02:48 PM
  #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WetHog View Post
Drew Brees = Signed a 6 year/60 mil deal with NO before proving his surgically repaired throwing shoulder was sound.

Peyton Manning = Signed a 5 year/96 mil deal with Den before proving his multiple surgeries on his neck were successful, and his arm strength fully recovered.

There is a fine line between over payment and a sound player acquisition decision. Signing FA QB's coming off significant injuries is a risk. So is trading away two 1st's and a 2nd for a potential franchise QB. Both NO and Denver needed to take the risk to compete. Same goes for the Skins. Griffin finally showed yesterday what we fell in love with last year. 95% of NFL players take a while to fully recover from major knee surgery. Griffin is no different. Patience is a virtue.
Both the Manning and Brees contracts had outs after the first season where the team could completely end the contract with no further guaranteed money. There was very little risk to either of those contracts. Either the player isn't fully healed and they've done no harm to their cap or pick situation, or the player has proven that they're worth the contract, and the team has gotten a top QB without using any assets.

The Redskins' picks are gone, whether RG3 pans out or not. Show me an NFL contender that spend anywhere near the assets that Washington did on their QB.

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And spare me the Alex Smith BS. He is Trent Dilfer with mobility. Take away KC's great defense and Alex Smith doesn't lead KC to a 9-0 record.
That's my point. My "Alex Smith is 9-0." comment was a direct response to BobRouse's "In the NFL these days, with the rules, you are not winning without a top end QB." comment. It was to show that you don't necessarily need a top end QB to win in the current NFL. You need sound asset management. And to illustrate that, I showed that none of the current top teams in the NFL used anywhere near the assets that the Skins did to acquire their starting QB.

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11-04-2013, 02:53 PM
  #228
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Finally:

Fla. man convicted in killing of Redskins' Taylor

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...11-04-15-00-51

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11-04-2013, 02:57 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadrupleDeke View Post
Better hope he doesn't get Chris Pronger'd by then.
The Redskins are a team I root for, so this will happen.

Sorry in advance, guys.

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11-04-2013, 03:08 PM
  #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadrupleDeke View Post
The Redskins' picks are gone, whether RG3 pans out or not. Show me an NFL contender that spend anywhere near the assets that Washington did on their QB.
NY Giants: Traded two 1st's and a 3rd for Eli Manning. Seemed to work out well for them.

Atlanta Falcons: Traded a 1st and a 3rd for Michael Vick. Worked out well for the Falcons until Vick's treatment of dogs done him in in Atlanta.

And it can be said the Skins traded more picks than the Giants and Falcons, but just like salaries go up year by year, so does draft pick compensation.

I cringed when I heard how much the Skins traded to get up to Griffin, but it was worth the risk based on the Skins past experience with QB's. Griffin could very well turn into a flop, but its much to early to complain about the picks given up to get him. Lets see where he is after year 3, going into year 4.

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11-04-2013, 03:11 PM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
The Redskins are a team I root for, so this will happen.

Sorry in advance, guys.
Either that, or Griffin and Family go full blown Diva and LiL Danny bows to all that Griffin and Family demand. So yeah, we are screwed.

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11-04-2013, 03:25 PM
  #232
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Chicago Bears = Two 1st's, 3rd and Kyle Orton for Jay Cutler.

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11-04-2013, 03:28 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by WetHog View Post
Chicago Bears = Two 1st's, 3rd and Kyle Orton for Jay Cutler.
And Cutler has been running for his life ever since (that is, when he's not injured from the 6 times a game that the defense catches him).

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11-04-2013, 03:29 PM
  #234
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WetHog pretty much nailed what I was trying to say but too lazy to research.

Invictus, mind if I ask how you're Capitals and Eagles fan?

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11-04-2013, 03:31 PM
  #235
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Denver Broncos = Traded two 1st's and a back up QB for John Elway.

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11-04-2013, 03:31 PM
  #236
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Also, the Browns spent two first round picks on Brandon Weeden and Trent Richardson, neither of whom will be on the roster 2 years after they were drafted. There is a level of risk involved with any transaction dealing with top draft picks.

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11-04-2013, 03:33 PM
  #237
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I'm failing to see your point, QD. Are you upset we drafted Griffin specifically or that we traded to get him?

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11-04-2013, 03:35 PM
  #238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkinsANDCaps View Post
WetHog pretty much nailed what I was trying to say but too lazy to research.

Invictus, mind if I ask how you're Capitals and Eagles fan?
Haha, you got it backwards. Flyers and Redskins.

My family is from the Philly area and moved down to Richmond. My dad got me to follow the Flyers, Phillies, and Sixers early on. He just assumed I would naturally follow the Eagles. I started Junior Kindergarden in 1990, so I was swept along with the Redskins Superbowl hype and haven't turned back. My dad has considered himself a failure as a father ever since.

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11-04-2013, 03:38 PM
  #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WetHog View Post
Denver Broncos = Traded two 1st's and a back up QB for John Elway.
Traded the 19th overall pick the next year and a backup QB to move from 4th to 1st to take John Elway.

Traded the 39th overall pick the same year, the 22nd overall pick the next year and the (currently) 11th overall pick the year after to move from 6th to 2nd to take the second best quarterback in the draft, one pick after when many pro scouts were calling the best QB prospect since John Elway was taken.

Not to mention that the first scenario was in a non-capped league, while the second was in a capped league with a new rookie salary scale (which increased the value of first round picks tremendously) by a team who had just been hit with a $36 million cap penalty.

Great comparison, there.

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11-04-2013, 03:42 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Haha, you got it backwards. Flyers and Redskins.

My family is from the Philly area and moved down to Richmond. My dad got me to follow the Flyers, Phillies, and Sixers early on. He just assumed I would naturally follow the Eagles. I started Junior Kindergarden in 1990, so I was swept along with the Redskins Superbowl hype and haven't turned back. My dad has considered himself a failure as a father ever since.
Haha, my mistake.

That's a good story. My father is from NY but I was raised in MD. I wanted to follow his teams (Rangers, Knicks, Mets, Jets) but he told me he didn't want to set me up for a life of failure and disappointment (LOL in hind sight) so I stuck with the Skins, Caps, and Mets (). We must be the same age -- I was 6 when we won the Super Bowl. Other than that, nothing but heartache.

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11-04-2013, 03:43 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by SkinsANDCaps View Post
I'm failing to see your point, QD. Are you upset we drafted Griffin specifically or that we traded to get him?
The total value of the assets spent to get him.

Especially considering the cap bind the team was in due to the penalties, and the increased value of first round picks with the new rookie salary scale.

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11-04-2013, 03:45 PM
  #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkinsANDCaps View Post
Haha, my mistake.

That's a good story. My father is from NY but I was raised in MD. I wanted to follow his teams (Rangers, Knicks, Mets, Jets) but he told me he didn't want to set me up for a life of failure and disappointment (LOL in hind sight) so I stuck with the Skins, Caps, and Mets (). We must be the same age -- I was 6 when we won the Super Bowl. Other than that, nothing but heartache.
Yeah, you're only a few months older than me.

It's not like I've missed out on any awesome success by picking the Skins over the Eagles anyways. Both DC and Philly sports exist solely to disappoint.

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11-04-2013, 03:45 PM
  #243
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Minnesota = Traded 24th overall (Larry Jacobson), 1973 2nd (Brad Van Pelt), Norm Snead, Bob Grim, and Vince Clements for Fran Tarkenton.

Washington = Traded a 1st round pick (17th) for Joe Theismann.

LA Rams = Traded two 1st's, 5th and multiple players to Houston for Jim (Chris) Everett.

Washington = Traded a 1st, 2nd and 3rd for Brad Johnson.

Philly = Traded two 1st's, 3rd and two players to the LA Rams for Roman Gabriel.

SF = Traded three 1st's, a 2nd and a player to NE for Jim Plunkett.

These are just the ones I found that most people would know the QB traded for. There are more listed here: http://thebiglead.com/2013/04/24/qua...ty-in-between/

So yeah some of the trades didn't work out, but its all about risk versus reward. No risk means no reward.

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11-04-2013, 03:46 PM
  #244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadrupleDeke View Post
The total value of the assets spent to get him.

Especially considering the cap bind the team was in due to the penalties, and the increased value of first round picks with the new rookie salary scale.
The Griffin trade was made before the cap penalties were handed down. If Shanallenhan would of known what was coming with the cap penalties there is a good chance they don't trade for Griffin.

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11-04-2013, 03:47 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by QuadrupleDeke View Post
The total value of the assets spent to get him.

Especially considering the cap bind the team was in due to the penalties, and the increased value of first round picks with the new rookie salary scale.
So what was your preferred method? I wanted Manning, but that wasn't happening. I wanted nothing to do with Gabbert, Locker, or Ponder, and you don't start (typically) a 3rd round + as a rookie. Wilson would not have been nearly as successful in DC than he's been in Seattle. We could not roll Grossman or Beck out there again. Hindsight is always 20-20 but I was ok with the trade then and I'm ok with it now.

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11-04-2013, 03:48 PM
  #246
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I had no problem with the trades and I still don't. We were getting Luck or Griffin...that's worth the risk. I would have preferred Luck, but it's not like RG3 is a slouch either. I'm not worried about his downturn this year. He's coming off a major injury, one that kept him from doing any meaningful offseason work. I'll be watching a lot closer in years 3 and 4, that's where we'll start to know what he really is.

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11-04-2013, 03:50 PM
  #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WetHog View Post
The Griffin trade was made before the cap penalties were handed down.
False.

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/sta...83923803713536 @ 3:13 PM - 12 March 2012

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7668243/ from the article announcing the trade: "The trade, first reported by FoxSports.com, cannot be signed off on, turned in and processed until the new league year starts at 4 p.m. ET Tuesday [13 March 2013]"

Quote:
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If Shanallenhan would of known what was coming with the cap penalties there is a good chance they don't trade for Griffin.
Clearly they knew, and clearly they had no idea what they were doing.

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11-04-2013, 03:52 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Yeah, you're only a few months older than me.

It's not like I've missed out on any awesome success by picking the Skins over the Eagles anyways. Both DC and Philly sports exist solely to disappoint.
Ain't that the truth. I have to admit, I loathe Philly sports. I did a year of prep school right outside of Philly. It was the year the Eagles went to the Super Bowl and the Redskins were terrible per usual. I had to listen to "Fly Eagles Fly" more times than any man should. Just a miserable year as a DC sports fan.

DB Nnamdi Asomugha placed on waivers today.

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11-04-2013, 04:00 PM
  #249
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Nnamdi Asomugha on waivers...

worth taking a chance on him?

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11-04-2013, 04:02 PM
  #250
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It doesn't help that Eagles fans are the lowest common denominator amongst Philly fans.

Edit: on Asomugha...eh. I wouldn't be opposed to taking him on as an experiment, but I don't expect anything of it.

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