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Old
10-24-2013, 02:49 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by deeshamrock View Post
.

Because other than limited time in the Olympics for a specific reason (too many centers) he can't handle wing and Sutter has tried it before and it did't work, and won't this time unless it's short term for a few shifts.
He's much more effective at center.

You would think with all theses messages Sutter is sending out, including the veiled one about putting AMart there, DL would move some pieces and either trade for one or get Pearson an airline ticket.
And maybe he is working on that.
After Sutter's "you have to play someone at LW" I think he may be busting DL balls a little.... Must be frustrating for Sutter to have someone like Pearson blowing up preseason... then you get to chose between King/Carcillo.....

Edit: DS: I'll do it.... I'LL *** do it... I'll put Martinez on 2LW.... don't think I won't DL!!!! lol

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10-24-2013, 02:59 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by deeshamrock View Post
.



You would think with all theses messages Sutter is sending out, including the veiled one about putting AMart there, DL would move some pieces and either trade for one or get Pearson an airline ticket.
And maybe he is working on that.
It takes two to trade. And with us being at 23 on the roster and not having a single player that can be sent down without having to clear wavers. It will take an injury or a trade to clear the spot. Is it really worth the risk of losing someone for nothing just to find out IF Pearson is the answer? I know I don't think it is.

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10-24-2013, 03:10 PM
  #153
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It takes two to trade. And with us being at 23 on the roster and not having a single player that can be sent down without having to clear wavers. It will take an injury or a trade to clear the spot. Is it really worth the risk of losing someone for nothing just to find out IF Pearson is the answer? I know I don't think it is.
The glaring weakness is LW and they are overloaded at D. DL has to recognize by now that shifting bottom liners every other game to accoomdate that hole isn't going to work long term or in the playoffs. So if he can find a trading partner and get a top 6 LW, he'll have to do lose a piece or two from the current roster.
And depending on the player coming back, it's worth the risk, because the LW is glaring need.

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10-24-2013, 03:29 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by deeshamrock View Post
The glaring weakness is LW and they are overloaded at D. DL has to recognize by now that shifting bottom liners every other game to accoomdate that hole isn't going to work long term or in the playoffs. So if he can find a trading partner and get a top 6 LW, he'll have to do lose a piece or two from the current roster.
And depending on the player coming back, it's worth the risk, because the LW is glaring need.
Are we really loaded at D though? At this point we only have 2 bona fide top 4 d men. Regehr is done and Mitchell is a question mark. And it's not like we're bursting at the seams with d prospects either. I'd say we're loaded at RW and C, not defense.

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10-24-2013, 06:46 PM
  #155
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That was a really long explanation. Here is my short answer: You win championships with players like Richards and you win Fantasy Hockey with players like Carter.
Agree completely. Guys like Richards are invaluable. How many players in the nhl have the ability to be a game changer?

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10-24-2013, 06:57 PM
  #156
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He's a game changer that's for sure, but for me, what Carter lacks in being a guy like Richards is less than what Richards lacks in being a skilled forward like Carter. Honestly, you guys can like Richards. Just I feel that Carter is the better player.

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10-24-2013, 07:15 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
He's a game changer that's for sure, but for me, what Carter lacks in being a guy like Richards is less than what Richards lacks in being a skilled forward like Carter. Honestly, you guys can like Richards. Just I feel that Carter is the better player.
There's a difference between thinking someone is the better player and acting like he is completely out of Mike's league and that Richards is the only one benefiting from Carter. You called Richards just a good locker room guy and that his point production would significantly drop without Carter. Like all Mike has to do is make a little pass to Carter and he'll do the tough stuff. There is so much more going on. There's a reason Carter was on pace for a career high in goals last year and Richards had a lot to do with it.

You can praise Carter while still recognizing the value of Richards on his line and not insulting Mike as just some guy riding Carter's coat tails.

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10-24-2013, 07:23 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by tsanuri View Post
It takes two to trade. And with us being at 23 on the roster and not having a single player that can be sent down without having to clear wavers. It will take an injury or a trade to clear the spot. Is it really worth the risk of losing someone for nothing just to find out IF Pearson is the answer? I know I don't think it is.
I would absolutely move Fraser/Ellerby through waiver to the AHL to find out if Pearson or DesLaurier can fill that 2nd line hole.... If they can't fill the hole then at that point the Kings know they need to make a trade.

lol.. kings will never be able to replace Fraser... (Andy/Vey cough)

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10-24-2013, 07:25 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by jml87 View Post
There's a difference between thinking someone is the better player and acting like he is completely out of Mike's league and that Richards is the only one benefiting from Carter. You called Richards just a good locker room guy and that his point production would significantly drop without Carter. Like all Mike has to do is make a little pass to Carter and he'll do the tough stuff. There is so much more going on. There's a reason Carter was on pace for a career high in goals last year and Richards had a lot to do with it.

You can praise Carter while still recognizing the value of Richards on his line and not insulting Mike as just some guy riding Carter's coat tails.
You can believe what you want.

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10-24-2013, 08:14 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
You can believe what you want.
KK11 - I understand where you are coming from on this, really I do. Carter has been a fantastic player for the Kings and I think a lot of that has come from an even better work ethic and maturation since he got here. Richards has been slowed by injuries the past couple years and has occasionally not looked like himself. However, he was one of the only guys in last year's playoff run that really had a major impact on the outcome of games. I say he was the MVP next to Quick.

Don't get me wrong, Carter was extremely valuable as well...but I really put those guys on equal footing as far as how valuable they are to the team.

I really think the Kings are missing an injection of youth right now on the offensive end. I think that is going to come from 1 of Toffoli or Pearson. Kind of like when Puig went to the Dodgers. Sometimes the team just needs a burst of enthusiasm to get the other players going.

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10-25-2013, 12:35 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
He's a game changer that's for sure, but for me, what Carter lacks in being a guy like Richards is less than what Richards lacks in being a skilled forward like Carter. Honestly, you guys can like Richards. Just I feel that Carter is the better player.
So, about this post...

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10-25-2013, 01:04 AM
  #162
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Carter > Richards. This shouldn't even be questioned, regardless of Richard's shorty tonight.

Are you guys going to tell me that you'd take Richards over Carter???

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10-25-2013, 01:15 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
So, about this post...
What about it? He's right. Richards and Carter are both outstanding players, but if you could only choose one right now it's got to be Carter.

But this debate is pointless, cause well, the Kings get to have their cake, and eat it too by having BOTH.

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10-25-2013, 03:28 AM
  #164
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
Interesting, I don't think so. What do you think his value is? What would a GM realistically give up for a 32 year old winger? Do you believe we can get a very good left winger for him?
What did minny give up for pominville? Therein lies your answer.

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10-25-2013, 03:45 AM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Rhino 350 View Post
I would absolutely move Fraser/Ellerby through waiver to the AHL to find out if Pearson or DesLaurier can fill that 2nd line hole.... If they can't fill the hole then at that point the Kings know they need to make a trade.

lol.. kings will never be able to replace Fraser... (Andy/Vey cough)
Frasers a tough guy. Cough cough. He's big too. Cough cough. And he's been in the thick of it for awhile too. Cough cough.

Do u really want to bring up a rook to take over 4th line duties? O well I forgot, the 4th line is so damn easy and non physical. ****, where's that moller guy, I bet he could really tear **** up in that 4th line center spot. Better tell cliff to protect him.

Dam amateurs. Learn a thing or two about the structure of hockey before u go tinkering with the depth. Ya make me sick!!! All of yous!

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10-25-2013, 04:19 AM
  #166
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Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
So, about this post...
Still true. Even fox was amazed with Carter today.

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10-25-2013, 04:46 AM
  #167
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Carter > Richards? Yes. Does it matter? No. Why? We have both of them. Why you guys are arguing about it?

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10-25-2013, 05:19 AM
  #168
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Frasers a tough guy. Cough cough. He's big too. Cough cough. And he's been in the thick of it for awhile too. Cough cough.

Do u really want to bring up a rook to take over 4th line duties? O well I forgot, the 4th line is so damn easy and non physical. ****, where's that moller guy, I bet he could really tear **** up in that 4th line center spot. Better tell cliff to protect him.

Dam amateurs. Learn a thing or two about the structure of hockey before u go tinkering with the depth. Ya make me sick!!! All of yous!
http://kings.nhl.com/club/roster.htm

Got Fraser listed at 190... only Justin Williams is smaller at 189...

4th line played about 5 mins tonight.... Fraser, while I do like him, is replaceable. Don't think we have any rookies that can handle those sort of minutes.

My guess is this is his last year with the team. Will be replaced by Vey or Adreoff by next year. Also can be replaced by Lewis now...

Amateurs: People who don't understand what the captain of the team Dustin Brown bring?

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10-25-2013, 08:29 AM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Black1963 View Post
Carter > Richards. This shouldn't even be questioned, regardless of Richard's shorty tonight.

Are you guys going to tell me that you'd take Richards over Carter???
Yes. If there had to be a choice, I would take Richards. He's a proven leader, unbelievable in the playoffs, and has a tremendous hockey IQ. In both games this season where they Kings gave up their big leads, Ottowa and Phoenix, Richards has been the main guy to step up and get the team back on the rails. Yes, Carter>Richards in natural skill and shooting ability, but I value Richards traits as a player more. I feel like if I was building a team, I could probably find another Carter, but it would be much more difficult to find a guy like Richards with that winning pedigree.

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10-25-2013, 08:46 AM
  #170
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Yes. If there had to be a choice, I would take Richards. He's a proven leader, unbelievable in the playoffs, and has a tremendous hockey IQ. In both games this season where they Kings gave up their big leads, Ottowa and Phoenix, Richards has been the main guy to step up and get the team back on the rails. Yes, Carter>Richards in natural skill and shooting ability, but I value Richards traits as a player more. I feel like if I was building a team, I could probably find another Carter, but it would be much more difficult to find a guy like Richards with that winning pedigree.
My sense is if either one is chosen, Richards will be on the Canadian Olympic team before Carter for exactly this reason. MR wasn't having that great a season with Philly last Olympics and was still chosen (if you believe the rumours, over Carter to boot) cause hockey people know and understand what he brings to the game. I like Jeff Carter but players like him are a dime a dozen; players like Mike Richards are few and far between.

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10-25-2013, 11:42 AM
  #171
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My sense is if either one is chosen, Richards will be on the Canadian Olympic team before Carter for exactly this reason. MR wasn't having that great a season with Philly last Olympics and was still chosen (if you believe the rumours, over Carter to boot) cause hockey people know and understand what he brings to the game. I like Jeff Carter but players like him are a dime a dozen; players like Mike Richards are few and far between.
I'm sorry but 40 goal scorers with excellent two way play are absolutely NOT a dime a dozen.

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10-25-2013, 12:23 PM
  #172
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Carter > Richards. This shouldn't even be questioned, regardless of Richard's shorty tonight.
Of course it should be questioned. That subjective and up to each fan individually not something that you alone decide 'shouldn't be questioned'. Your opinion on that is equal in value to any other posters., not better.
Quote:
Are you guys going to tell me that you'd take Richards over Carter???
I would, Yes, because winning a championship takes a whole lot more scoring goals. When the Flyers lost their premier goal scorers Gagne and Carter in 2010 as the playoffs began, Richards was the guy that got them to the SCF and esp for his play during the first 2 rounds, which went a lot further and deeper than the 17 points he put up in the first 2 rounes -12 games. he owned every shift, he physically dominated other players and irritated the key players on other teams off their game. He bared every fang he had and snarled, every shift. He did what he's known for = he was the leader.
Had Richards gone down before those playoffs started instead of Carter or Gagne the Flyers wouldnt' have made it out of NJ. It takes a WHOLE LOt more than scoring goals.

Carter is an elite goal scorer who since he's come o the Kings has developed into a solid 2 way player. WHat you have seen since he's arrived is 100% not the JC the Flyers had., he's matured and filled out his game.
He is the more naturally skilled player but Richards is the more complete player, the better player for everything that you won't see on a scoresheet but continues to win championships

And you wont' find many GM's that wouldn't agree. IN Jan 2012 at the GM's meetings in FLa, one of the TSN radio guys did an informal poll of the GMN's and got 20 to reply to would they have traded MR, not only did they say no, most of them said they would have traded for him, if given the opportunity.
As a Kings fan, be glad that DL was the only call Homer made that fateful day in May .

So it's up to each fan to make that choice and most definitely not 'something that shouldn't even be questioned'

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10-25-2013, 12:27 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by Black1963 View Post
Carter > Richards. This shouldn't even be questioned, regardless of Richard's shorty tonight.

Are you guys going to tell me that you'd take Richards over Carter???
DL made that decision in June of 2011.

They are different players that each bring needed elements to the team

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10-25-2013, 12:50 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by deeshamrock View Post
Of course it should be questioned. That subjective and up to each fan individually not something that you alone decide 'shouldn't be questioned'. Your opinion on that is equal in value to any other posters., not better.


I would, Yes, because winning a championship takes a whole lot more scoring goals. When the Flyers lost their premier goal scorers Gagne and Carter in 2010 as the playoffs began, Richards was the guy that got them to the SCF and esp for his play during the first 2 rounds, which went a lot further and deeper than the 17 points he put up in the first 2 rounes -12 games. he owned every shift, he physically dominated other players and irritated the key players on other teams off their game. He bared every fang he had and snarled, every shift. He did what he's known for = he was the leader.
Had Richards gone down before those playoffs started instead of Carter or Gagne the Flyers wouldnt' have made it out of NJ. It takes a WHOLE LOt more than scoring goals.

Carter is an elite goal scorer who since he's come o the Kings has developed into a solid 2 way player. WHat you have seen since he's arrived is 100% not the JC the Flyers had., he's matured and filled out his game.
He is the more naturally skilled player but Richards is the more complete player, the better player for everything that you won't see on a scoresheet but continues to win championships

And you wont' find many GM's that wouldn't agree. IN Jan 2012 at the GM's meetings in FLa, one of the TSN radio guys did an informal poll of the GMN's and got 20 to reply to would they have traded MR, not only did they say no, most of them said they would have traded for him, if given the opportunity.
As a Kings fan, be glad that DL was the only call Homer made that fateful day in May .

So it's up to each fan to make that choice and most definitely not 'something that shouldn't even be questioned'
I don't put as much emphasis on winning championships as much as you do. Just because you win championships doesn't mean you're a great player, and conversely, just because you don't win championships makes you a lesser player. This is a team sport, not golf or tennis.

I will say that Richards is probably a better leader and the grittier player of the two, but I clearly see Carter as the better player. I think Carter is probably a top 50 nhl player in the league and Richards probably somewhere in the top 100.

Richards is a solid player, but he's a bit overvalued by a lot of kings fans on here.

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Originally Posted by Julius Caesar Milan View Post
DL made that decision in June of 2011.

They are different players that each bring needed elements to the team
Indeed they have their own way of contributing to the team, and I love having both on the team. I just think that Carter at this point is the better player of the two.

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10-25-2013, 01:39 PM
  #175
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Indeed they have their own way of contributing to the team, and I love having both on the team. I just think that Carter at this point is the better player of the two.
Stats wise yes.

Ask any player or Bob or Jim why we won the series with the Canucks and later the cup and they will tell you it was because of the intensity of Mike Richards. His charisma and intensity were contagious and a16 wins later....wham, bam, thank you Bettman!



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