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Vanek to NYI for Moulson, 2014 Conditional 1st, 2015 2nd (BUF retains 20% salary)

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Old
10-30-2013, 04:55 PM
  #726
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Originally Posted by SabresAreScaryGood View Post
Yeah, and I would actually rather have the 2015 pick.
Me too. Especially because if they defer that means they stank this year, and what are the chances they get better without Vanek, Moulson, Bouchard or Nabakov?

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10-30-2013, 04:58 PM
  #727
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Originally Posted by jc17 View Post
Me too. Especially because if they defer that means they stank this year, and what are the chances they get better without Vanek, Moulson, Bouchard or Nabakov?
Those last 2 players could be seen as a positive.

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10-30-2013, 05:27 PM
  #728
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The Thomas Vanek trade to the Islanders was interesting enough, but even more intriguing is where Vanek could have gone. The Sabres did offer him to the Toronto Maple Leafs, but was the asking price too high?

Darren Dreger: Yes. The Sabres were believed to be asking for a key forward from the Toronto Maple Leafs and financially the deal didn't work either, even though the Buffalo Sabres were willing to retain salary as they did in making the deal with the New York Islanders. They're believed to have retained somewhere between $1.3 and $1.4 million. It was not a fit for the Leafs, so the negotiation or conversation between Darcy Regier and Dave Nonis didn't take all that long. It was not a good fit from a player perspective, either, with Vanek being a winger.

Pierre LeBrun: The other wrinkle that came out today from that deal was not only that the Islanders got Buffalo to eat some of the salary but also they got some protection on that first round pick that they sent to the Sabres, or at least perceived protection. If it's a top-10 pick come June, they can defer for the Sabres to draft in 2015 instead, a decision that the Islanders can make at that draft.

Who gets drafted in 2015? I think Connor McDavid … is that his name? We've heard about him.

So, really, to me, even if it is a top-10 pick for Garth Snow that he's giving away to the Sabres, I just don't know how you can defer that to 2015.

James Duthie: Almost everybody wants to hold onto that pick, just in case they're down there and, remember, every team that doesn't make the playoffs has a shot at that number one pick.
would be very curious to see what NYI would do if that pick were in the 5-10 range.

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10-30-2013, 05:59 PM
  #729
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Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
would be very curious to see what NYI would do if that pick were in the 5-10 range.
If the pick was in that range it means they had a bad year. That means whatever chances they had of re-signing Vanek goes out the window. So it's likely they would struggle through 2015 as well. In that scenario they would be nuts to defer.

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10-30-2013, 06:17 PM
  #730
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So what are the guesses at the roster FW on Toronto that Regier wanted?

I guess it would come down to Kadri or JVR.

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10-30-2013, 06:19 PM
  #731
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
If the pick was in that range it means they had a bad year. That means whatever chances they had of re-signing Vanek goes out the window. So it's likely they would struggle through 2015 as well. In that scenario they would be nuts to defer.
I think that's likely as well. If they're bad enough to be top 10 this year, they will likely think it's possible they're there in 2015, which case, they'd be wise to hold onto 2015.

I just don't like that the deferment can happen right up until the pick is made. That really makes it hard to plan. It should be the day before the draft or something. I'm sure they want to see who is still on the board if they have a top 10 pick, though.

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10-30-2013, 06:38 PM
  #732
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
So what are the guesses at the roster FW on Toronto that Regier wanted?

I guess it would come down to Kadri or JVR.
They have wanted Bolland for years, which also makes sense for not an ideal trade for Toronto.

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10-30-2013, 07:03 PM
  #733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
would be very curious to see what NYI would do if that pick were in the 5-10 range.
That would be very interesting. Ignoring any differences in quality of players available at the same slot in different years...

Say the Isles pick between #1 to #10 in 2014 and have options.
If the Isles trade their 2014 pick and the team improves in 2015, they were foolish.
If the Isles trade their 2014 pick and the team regresses or wins the lottery in 2015, they were wise.
If the Isles keep their 2014 pick and the team improves in 2015, they were wise.
If the Isles keep their 2014 pick and the team regresses or wins the lottery in 2015, they were foolish.


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10-30-2013, 08:02 PM
  #734
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Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Islanders will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.

In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??


Last edited by The Washer: 10-30-2013 at 08:14 PM.
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10-30-2013, 08:13 PM
  #735
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowgothemo View Post
Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Jersey will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.

In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??


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10-30-2013, 09:58 PM
  #736
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowgothemo View Post
Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Islanders will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.

In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??
I just...I don't...what?

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10-30-2013, 10:12 PM
  #737
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowgothemo View Post
Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Islanders will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.

In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??
I like what I'm reading here...can I get some of whatever you're having?

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10-30-2013, 10:28 PM
  #738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowgothemo View Post
Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Islanders will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.

In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??
I mean, why the **** not. Go Sabres.

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10-31-2013, 02:10 AM
  #739
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Must admit this was a masterful deal. Well done.

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10-31-2013, 02:13 PM
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Don't know if this was already posted, but it's a really good writeup on Moulson.

No Pizza For Spicoli: Saying Goodbye to Matt Moulson: http://www.lighthousehockey.com/2013...buffalo-sabres

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10-31-2013, 02:51 PM
  #741
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowgothemo View Post
Im was bored and decided to think alternatively instead:

- Bettman hand in Vanek to LI. Sell new stadium.
- Sends Moulson back to score goals and help placate an unruly fanbase for the year.
- Moulson walks in UFA back to LI. Sell new stadium. (Fire Darcy!!! Let him walk for nothing...wait on it)
- Protects 1st RD pick. Islanders will opt (part of the plan) to use their 2014 pick. (Dont want 2015 to look to obvious...gotta get those odds up)
- Sabres get 2nd overall in 2014. (to soon to win the lottery and winning it next year would seem fixish) Whaa Whaa Whaa God hates the Sabres...wait on it
- After delivery of his new oil\gas well, Bettman says Sabres not Florida. Mcdavids a Sabre.


In dealing with my emotions, I found that I dont easily discount things like Pegula bucks, Penguins connections (and not just Black...Bankruptcy...the string of high draft picks leading up to Crosbys draft...new ownership roughly 2 yrs before the high picks start rolling in) and invisible hands. Crosbys selection technically finished the rebuild of the Penguins. And turned that city around and made them FA friendly. Previous to this Pittsburgh was not a desired destination, much like the Sabres supposedly are today. I see alot of similarities between then and now. Mcdavid would finish the team (remember, we are getting #2 in 2014) much in the same way Crosby did. I would then expect future success to be rapidly around the corner. This would also put, Buffalo's "City" rebuild over the top. Again, much like it did for Pittsburgh.

All wildy fkd up and IMO, with absolutely no verifiable facts. And cmon, its another "we get Mcdavid" scenario that I am sure we will see thousands more of, so I dressed the ****** up a bit...lol.....so take this as my attempt to add good juju to the "Save it for Mcdavid" campaign...because you cant deny that we are definitely putting our pieces in position, for check mate!!

One last question: Is it just me, or can anyone else feel that??
Ironically, the cynic in me thinks the exact opposite will happen. That is, we win the lottery this year--"See, Buffalo, the NHL doesn't hate you!"--only to see McDavid gifted to somewhere like Philadelphia or New Jersey (organization saver...sound familiar?).


Last edited by Zip15: 10-31-2013 at 03:00 PM.
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10-31-2013, 02:56 PM
  #742
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Originally Posted by 26CornerBlitz View Post
Don't know if this was already posted, but it's a really good writeup on Moulson.

No Pizza For Spicoli: Saying Goodbye to Matt Moulson: http://www.lighthousehockey.com/2013...buffalo-sabres
Most impressed. Thanks for sharing this. My kind of player. I think we win this deal!

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10-31-2013, 03:08 PM
  #743
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Ironically, the cynic in me thinks the exact opposite will happen. That is, we win the lottery this year--"See, Buffalo, the NHL doesn't hate you!"--only to see McDavid gifted to somewhere like Philadelphia or New Jersey (organization saver...sound familiar?).
As depressing as that sounds, if we're able to walk away with #1 in 2014 and #2 in 2015, with additional picks in the first 2 rounds in both years, it'd be objectively awesome.

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10-31-2013, 03:31 PM
  #744
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As depressing as that sounds, if we're able to walk away with #1 in 2014 and #2 in 2015, with additional picks in the first 2 rounds in both years, it'd be objectively awesome.
Objectively awesome doesn't even begin to cover it.

I think it's more likely we get #2 this year and #5 or so next year, but if we spend those picks really well, we can still build a champion. We need a top line winger and a top line center.

Or: we get 2 and 3 this year, like Vancouver's 1999. When we finish unloading 3 UFAs, we should have the picks to make it plausible.

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10-31-2013, 04:44 PM
  #745
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Objectively awesome doesn't even begin to cover it.

I think it's more likely we get #2 this year and #5 or so next year, but if we spend those picks really well, we can still build a champion. We need a top line winger and a top line center.

Or: we get 2 and 3 this year, like Vancouver's 1999. When we finish unloading 3 UFAs, we should have the picks to make it plausible.
Either we get Reinhart at 1(BPA) allowing Grigs to slide over to wing and a winger or two wingers. Current mock drafts have 5-14 with being very wing heavy. You still have the bust factor but it should help shore up the top line wing futures.

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10-31-2013, 04:52 PM
  #746
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Either we get Reinhart at 1(BPA) allowing Grigs to slide over to wing and a winger or two wingers. Current mock drafts have 5-14 with being very wing heavy. You still have the bust factor but it should help shore up the top line wing futures.
It's a good draft in the top half for guys who are wingers or will likely be NHL wingers. We could certainly use a couple dynamic wingers. That's the biggest need alongside the somewhat nebulous 'franchise center' role.

The bad thing about the conditional 1st is that we cant trade it up from it, unless perhaps they choose to make a decision earlier than they need to.

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10-31-2013, 06:59 PM
  #747
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It's a good draft in the top half for guys who are wingers or will likely be NHL wingers. We could certainly use a couple dynamic wingers. That's the biggest need alongside the somewhat nebulous 'franchise center' role.

The bad thing about the conditional 1st is that we cant trade it up from it, unless perhaps they choose to make a decision earlier than they need to.
Reinhart with pick 1 and Barbashev/Goldobin type with pick 15-20

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10-31-2013, 07:05 PM
  #748
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
It's a good draft in the top half for guys who are wingers or will likely be NHL wingers. We could certainly use a couple dynamic wingers. That's the biggest need alongside the somewhat nebulous 'franchise center' role.

The bad thing about the conditional 1st is that we cant trade it up from it, unless perhaps they choose to make a decision earlier than they need to.
I don't think that's really an issue.

If the pick is outside the top 10, then there is no deferring and the Sabres will have the pick and are free to trade up.

If it is a top 10 pick, the Sabres likely wouldn't need to trade up, having a pick earlier in the round anyways. Sure, maybe you could try and slide up 1 or 2 picks, but if there's a guy you really want, you grab him with that earlier pick.

And if they defer, well then trading up is irrelevant for this draft.

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10-31-2013, 08:12 PM
  #749
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I don't think that's really an issue.

If the pick is outside the top 10, then there is no deferring and the Sabres will have the pick and are free to trade up.

If it is a top 10 pick, the Sabres likely wouldn't need to trade up, having a pick earlier in the round anyways. Sure, maybe you could try and slide up 1 or 2 picks, but if there's a guy you really want, you grab him with that earlier pick.

And if they defer, well then trading up is irrelevant for this draft.
Not that I think it is too likely but there is a scenario where Buffalo has #1 and the Isles have #9. If that is the case and the Isles dont protect it you might want to burn a 2nd rounder to move from 9th overall to 5th overall to get your guy who you dont want to pick at 1.

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10-31-2013, 08:36 PM
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Not that I think it is too likely but there is a scenario where Buffalo has #1 and the Isles have #9. If that is the case and the Isles dont protect it you might want to burn a 2nd rounder to move from 9th overall to 5th overall to get your guy who you dont want to pick at 1.
Hmm...yeah I suppose.

I guess it will depend on where the Sabres see the dropoff in talent on their board. Although teams don't usually trade down in the top 10, so finding a dance partner might require vast overpayment.

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