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Vanek to Islanders for Moulson, 2014 1st, 2015 2nd *Part 2*

View Poll Results: How do you feel about the Vanek - Moulson trade? was it...
Good 16 50.00%
Bad 13 40.63%
Lateral move 4 12.50%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 32. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-30-2013, 02:01 PM
  #51
Isles Junkie
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does it even work that way in hockey? are contracts not guaranteed? If they waive Carkner don't they still have to pay him?

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10-30-2013, 02:04 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Isles Junkie View Post
does it even work that way in hockey? are contracts not guaranteed? If they waive Carkner don't they still have to pay him?
if he was on a 2 way contract (which he isnt) they could waive him and pay him less in the AHL, but since he is on a 1way deal, the only way they can "waive him" and take him off the books would be the amnesty buyout (and still have to pay him, it just wont count against the cap), which they wont do......so either way they will have to pay him

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Old
10-30-2013, 02:29 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
dan petriw, the new blogger for hockeybuzz said he has heard that garth is not done with the roster...not sure how reliable he is, but he seems like an astute guy that leaves emotion out of his blogs....lets hope this is true

he also kinda hints that cappy may be on the way out
Sounds like a true fan, not someone blowing smoke.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?p...4#.UnFNY3DUBJY

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Originally Posted by Isles Junkie View Post
Are you really putting any stock into the 1 game each team played for their new teams?

Sabres lost
Islanders lost

Would you feel better if Vanek also scored 2 goals but the Isles still lost? What if they won & he didn't score any goals? You people are starting to sound like this is the islanders message board over at ESPN.com
Thank God for HFBoards. I left that message board about 6/7 years ago for this exact same reason. Please don't make me go back


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Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
i understand some people on these boards have different opinions....in fact, that is what makes these boards great and sparks the debate.....but some of you are just delusional and impossible to have a debate with....there has to be rationality in order to debate......if you are debating that you would rather have the 1st and 2nd round picks in order to grab a defenseman, FINE, i can live with that argument....but to suggest youd rather have moulson than vanek (and then cement that opinion with his 2 goal performance)----simply assinine

i am starting to sift thru threads and when i see certain names, i refrain from even reading their posts....i suggest some others take that approach

when we lose, people complain that we need a legit 1st line winger
when we get a first line winger, people complain we need the draft picks
when we win, people will complain the ticket prices are too high
when we have our stanley cup parade eventually, people will cmoplain that it wasnt on a sunday

at a certain point people have to realize that they are simply insufferable
Don't forget the argument about calling up the kids.
When we don't call up a kid we are letting them rot in Bridgeport.
When we call up a kid (Donovan) he should have no learning curve and should be expected to be the answer to all our problems.

Lose/Lose comes to mind at the Islanders board.


Last edited by MattMartin: 10-30-2013 at 03:17 PM.
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Old
10-30-2013, 03:05 PM
  #54
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Some of the people on this board get it. When an elite player becomes available to you and you can acquire him without losing an elite player, you do it. Moulson's NOT elite, sorry to break it to you.
Can someone please furnish a list of the defensemen and goalies who were available via trade over the weekend and were Vaneks caliber of player or better so we could debate who Snow SHOULD'VE traded Moulson(or anyone else and whatever picks) for?
I get the feeling we could trade Matt Carkner straight up for Crosby and the same old posters on this board would find something to ***** and moan about.


Last edited by lazycop: 10-30-2013 at 03:24 PM.
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10-30-2013, 03:12 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
i understand some people on these boards have different opinions....in fact, that is what makes these boards great and sparks the debate.....but some of you are just delusional and impossible to have a debate with....there has to be rationality in order to debate......if you are debating that you would rather have the 1st and 2nd round picks in order to grab a defenseman, FINE, i can live with that argument....but to suggest youd rather have moulson than vanek (and then cement that opinion with his 2 goal performance)----simply assinine

i am starting to sift thru threads and when i see certain names, i refrain from even reading their posts....i suggest some others take that approach

when we lose, people complain that we need a legit 1st line winger
when we get a first line winger, people complain we need the draft picks
when we win, people will complain the ticket prices are too high
when we have our stanley cup parade eventually, people will cmoplain that it wasnt on a sunday

at a certain point people have to realize that they are simply insufferable
Yea, basically this. I value a lot of opinions on this board and that is why I like reading. But every move causes whining no matter what it is. It's so annoying to sift through. We all know who the negative nellys are. And a post like mine or enigmatic will be met with... "That's because you just tolerate mediocrity... this is what Wang and Snow have done to you." It's a fool proof way to never be satisfied with anything and ensure your 'argument' is always correct.

I'm stuck in the middle of filling up my ignore list with people that just regurgitate the same agenda but not wanting to have zero polarization that causes useful debate because of differing opinions.

Sometimes I wish some posters would just start a blog so I can read it without having to read everyday that Okposo is the worst player in the NHL, or that our GM is an idiot for not trading for a top pairing defensemen from that magical team that has too many and can't wait to get rid of some so they don't win too many Stanley Cups, or that we will never get a big name player and when we do it was a dumb trade because we gave up someone's friend.

It's like some of you people have never been in a business situation ever. Every choice is so obvious... 100% pro, no con. Nino gets traded for someone -- bad asset management. Nino doesn't get traded and stinks it up -- now his value is so low what an idiot Snow is for not trading him. Nino lights it up on the Island -- why do we have ANOTHER winger when we need d men. Nino breaks an ankle getting out of the shower -- is Snow an idiot? Why is Nino showering without a mat. Nino plays on the Island and is a decent player -- why did we waste a 5th round pick on him? Bla bla bla.

Oh wait, I forgot. I'm just used to mediocrity.

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Old
10-30-2013, 03:20 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
can we lock this thread and re-open it in 15 games?
Ha. Not a bad idea. Maybe lock it until two weeks before the trade deadline to not only see how Vanek/Moulson have been playing until then, but also to see if we've resigned Vanek by then or what we're going to have to flip him for if we don't.

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Old
10-30-2013, 03:22 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Isles Fan View Post
So let me understand this if I can.

Moulson goes to Buffalo, nets two and finds immediate chemistry with his new line mates.

Vanek comes here and all we hear is about how it's going to take some time for he and his line mates to build chemistry.

How's that work?

...And if over the next 50 games Vanek scores 30 goals and Moulson scores 15 you'll be saying what exactly...?

I don't care either way, but if I took your post and applied it to dating, you just married the first girl you ever kissed.

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10-30-2013, 03:25 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by TeamKidd View Post
I really don't get why some of you are islander fans.
I honestly believe some of us have a need for pain and in that regard the Isles are like comfort food. If I'm right, then if the Isles do anything right some fans must still find things to complain about because if you have a need for pain, then you must create pain even when there isn't any.

That said...The Isles rarely do anything right.

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10-30-2013, 03:27 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
dan petriw, the new blogger for hockeybuzz said he has heard that garth is not done with the roster...not sure how reliable he is, but he seems like an astute guy that leaves emotion out of his blogs....lets hope this is true

he also kinda hints that cappy may be on the way out

Do you know anyone who called a Snow trade/signing BEFORE it happened?

Quite easy to say that the Isles are not done with their roster and that Cappy "may be" fired. I might be fired. You might be fired. Means nothing.

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10-30-2013, 03:28 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by BloFan4Life View Post
Islanders fans: Be patient with Vanek. He is a very streaky scorer. It may take time for him to understand the whole style of NY, but once he gets it, he will score in bunches. Please don't be naive people, Vanek is by far the better player over Moulson. Vanek has skills that can't be taught. Moulson scored two goals in the opener, but I have a feeling it was more beginners luck than anything.
I don't even know if you're correct, but your tone is so calm and rational that alone makes me believe you.

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10-30-2013, 03:30 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by periferal View Post
...And if over the next 50 games Vanek scores 30 goals and Moulson scores 15 you'll be saying what exactly...?

I don't care either way, but if I took your post and applied it to dating, you just married the first girl you ever kissed.
I also love how goals = chemistry.

I guarantee that poster didn't even watch the Sabres game. Just looked at the stat sheet and saw 2 goals. Must have been chemistry! Vanek had one chance that Talbot made a pretty good save on. If that goes in and Moulson hits the post... we both have chemistry. Amazing!

No need to watch the games when all of my preconceived notions can be proven by a stat that I can cherry pick.

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10-30-2013, 03:38 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by lazycop View Post
Some of the people on this board get it. When an elite player becomes available to you and you can acquire him without losing an elite player, you do it. Moulson's NOT elite, sorry to break it to you.
This.

Its a no-brainer that if we want to progress as a team, we need to upgrade some of the players. To get an elite upgrade for basically a bunch of draft picks, when we have more good prospects then we can even fit on our team in our system, that's an easy trade to make.

It would have been great if Snow could have solved our Defense/Goalie problems instead, but its obvious he couldn't with this trade. He was given an opportunity to make our team better and took it. There will be other trades, and hopefully sooner then later.

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Old
10-30-2013, 03:48 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Hipietro View Post
Go look at fan comments on the Isles Facebook/twitter pages, it only gets worse. Some of the most uneducated comments I've ever seen.

"OMG, moulson scored 2 goals and vanek scored 0. Moulson is obvs better, snow is so dumb. I'm not going to games till moulson comes back"

I know, their the worst. I don't look it anymore because I just get angry when all of the posts are retarded.

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10-30-2013, 04:15 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by lazycop View Post
Some of the people on this board get it. When an elite player becomes available to you and you can acquire him without losing an elite player, you do it. Moulson's NOT elite, sorry to break it to you.
Can someone please furnish a list of the defensemen and goalies who were available via trade over the weekend and were Vaneks caliber of player or better so we could debate who Snow SHOULD'VE traded Moulson(or anyone else and whatever picks) for?
I get the feeling we could trade Matt Carkner straight up for Crosby and the same old posters on this board would find something to ***** and moan about.
Is Vanek elite? Different players/different strengths for sure, but he strikes me as more Alexei Yashin level. Yashin had a superior skillset to Moulson but i wouldn't have traded Matt + picks for a 29 year old Yashin.

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10-30-2013, 04:19 PM
  #65
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Is Vanek elite? Different players for sure, but he strikes me as more Alexei Yashin level. Yashin had a superior skillset to Moulson but i wouldn't have traded Matt for a 29 year old Yashin.
first off, he is a completely different player than yashin....and second of all.....yashin was pretty damn good....id take yashin in his prime on this team.....

what do you define as elite? do you have to be in the top 5 of goals scored in the nhl since 2006 to be considered elite? OH WAIT....VANEK IS!!!

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10-30-2013, 04:20 PM
  #66
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can someone create a macro and link posts in this thread saying moulson is just as good/better than vanek to the thread where we listed people's ages?

id imagine most/all of the people are under 20 and moulson is the best finisher they have ever seen

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Old
10-30-2013, 04:34 PM
  #67
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I love the Fact that we got Vanek.

The only thing that seems odd to me Is the timing of the trade..

This seems like it should have been done in augast. also deadline or draft....

I don't mind what gave up but at the time we did it I confusing...Our offense was good and our PP was top5... would have thought for sure if a move was ig to be made it would have been for a defenseman or goalie...

that being said, Vanek is an Islander and Im happy about it..I really hope we can resign him...

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10-30-2013, 04:51 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by StrongIslanders90 View Post
I love the Fact that we got Vanek.

The only thing that seems odd to me Is the timing of the trade..

This seems like it should have been done in augast. also deadline or draft....

I don't mind what gave up but at the time we did it I confusing...Our offense was good and our PP was top5... would have thought for sure if a move was ig to be made it would have been for a defenseman or goalie...

that being said, Vanek is an Islander and Im happy about it..I really hope we can resign him...
I think this just points to the fact that trades are much more complicated than people make them out to be and are not like pushing a button on EA Sports. (I'm not saying you are saying this).

They mentioned that this trade was in talks for months... and Toronto was involved as well. I would not be surprised if multiple sides wanted to see how the season starts -- which teams are desperate for what and the projection of where picks are going to be. Also add in all the wrinkles that we don't know about, and the wrinkle about the condition on the 1st round pick (which pretty much solidifies that we aren't giving a lottery pick to Buffalo because I doubt we finish in the lottery for the next two years).

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10-30-2013, 05:31 PM
  #69
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So let me understand this if I can.

Moulson goes to Buffalo, nets two and finds immediate chemistry with his new line mates.

Vanek comes here and all we hear is about how it's going to take some time for he and his line mates to build chemistry.

How's that work?
This is hysterical. Based on this logic, the fact that Tavares didn't score would lead you to believe that JT owes his success to Matt Moulson.

Dude, I got news for you, John Tavares is a great player, despite what you're infering here.

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10-30-2013, 05:40 PM
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10-30-2013, 05:58 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by 13th Floor View Post
Yea, basically this. I value a lot of opinions on this board and that is why I like reading. But every move causes whining no matter what it is. It's so annoying to sift through. We all know who the negative nellys are. And a post like mine or enigmatic will be met with... "That's because you just tolerate mediocrity... this is what Wang and Snow have done to you." It's a fool proof way to never be satisfied with anything and ensure your 'argument' is always correct.

I'm stuck in the middle of filling up my ignore list with people that just regurgitate the same agenda but not wanting to have zero polarization that causes useful debate because of differing opinions.

Sometimes I wish some posters would just start a blog so I can read it without having to read everyday that Okposo is the worst player in the NHL, or that our GM is an idiot for not trading for a top pairing defensemen from that magical team that has too many and can't wait to get rid of some so they don't win too many Stanley Cups, or that we will never get a big name player and when we do it was a dumb trade because we gave up someone's friend.

It's like some of you people have never been in a business situation ever. Every choice is so obvious... 100% pro, no con. Nino gets traded for someone -- bad asset management. Nino doesn't get traded and stinks it up -- now his value is so low what an idiot Snow is for not trading him. Nino lights it up on the Island -- why do we have ANOTHER winger when we need d men. Nino breaks an ankle getting out of the shower -- is Snow an idiot? Why is Nino showering without a mat. Nino plays on the Island and is a decent player -- why did we waste a 5th round pick on him? Bla bla bla.

Oh wait, I forgot. I'm just used to mediocrity.
On the 1st bold: Tell me about it. It's ALWAYS after a loss.

On the 2nd bold: I said the same EXACT thing as you about Nino when he was traded. You can't win, fans are always going to complain about something. They think they know everything when they really don't know ****.


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Old
10-30-2013, 06:06 PM
  #72
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I also love how goals = chemistry.

I guarantee that poster didn't even watch the Sabres game. Just looked at the stat sheet and saw 2 goals. Must have been chemistry! Vanek had one chance that Talbot made a pretty good save on. If that goes in and Moulson hits the post... we both have chemistry. Amazing!

No need to watch the games when all of my preconceived notions can be proven by a stat that I can cherry pick.
See you need to be careful when stating something you don't know.

You are correct, goals don't equal chemistry but chemistry does equal goals.

I did watch the game. Did you? In fact I made a point of it just to see how Moulson would fit in. What I saw was a guy who fit in pretty good and did have some chemistry with his new line mates. Was it the chemistry he had with Tavares, no far from it, but the line jelled well and the results speak for themselves.

Unlike the vast majority of people here, I wait, watch and then give opinion instead of giving opinion first and then scrambling to try and prove myself right at the expense of looking a bit foolish.

So before you go accusing someone of cherry picking a stat or watching or not watching a game perhaps you should think things through first.

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Old
10-30-2013, 06:06 PM
  #73
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mismanagement...

does anyone recall last year when we had acquired Tim Thomas just to reach the salary cap floor? Embarrassing. do you think we'll open up the check book? nah those days are over
A $16 million loss for NYI for the season. More embarrassing than Thomas. They've already opened up the checkbook and are spending more than they take in. Funny how those minor details don't matter to some.

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10-30-2013, 06:10 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by LAIslanderFan View Post
This is hysterical. Based on this logic, the fact that Tavares didn't score would lead you to believe that JT owes his success to Matt Moulson.

Dude, I got news for you, John Tavares is a great player, despite what you're infering here.
Your logic is quite a skew.

My post had nothing to do with nor did it infer anything about, John Tavares.

Talk about reading something that is so not there.........

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10-30-2013, 06:33 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by enigmatic View Post
i understand some people on these boards have different opinions....in fact, that is what makes these boards great and sparks the debate.....but some of you are just delusional and impossible to have a debate with....there has to be rationality in order to debate......if you are debating that you would rather have the 1st and 2nd round picks in order to grab a defenseman, FINE, i can live with that argument....but to suggest youd rather have moulson than vanek (and then cement that opinion with his 2 goal performance)----simply assinine

i am starting to sift thru threads and when i see certain names, i refrain from even reading their posts....i suggest some others take that approach

when we lose, people complain that we need a legit 1st line winger
when we get a first line winger, people complain we need the draft picks
when we win, people will complain the ticket prices are too high
when we have our stanley cup parade eventually, people will cmoplain that it wasnt on a sunday

at a certain point people have to realize that they are simply insufferable
I've done that for a while. It's primarily a select few over and over. They say things just to stir things up and attention to themselves. They can't really believe what they say and are serious, can they? If so, that's even scarier they're so out there. The only kicker is their responses to others are seen. Still working on a way around that one - guess I should read the names on top of the reply so I know who to avoid.

Some of it is Wang hate, some of it is spoiledness, some of it is ******** over the move, some of it is unrealistic expectations, some of it is what's gone on for ages in that one expects everything back in a trade and don't want to give up anything, some is as you say just delusional and can't be explained at all.


Snow's hammered for never making a trade
Snow makes a trade and it's terrible even if we got the best player
Wang is cheap.....while losing $16 million the previous season and tons for 10 years
Keep draft picks...while JT's prime gets put on hold some more
Brooklyn's money is speculation........while it's been confirmed
Denial of valid quoted sources.......as it can't be accepted
Barclay's is losing money.......while it's making tons more than NVMC and projections were too agressive but still making tons
1 game defines EVERYTHING.......because 1 game is eternity
Buff paying some of Vanek's salary means Wang is screwing us.........while he currently loses millions and bad business offset procedures are ignored
Vanek isn't JT's best friend so MM should've stayed........even if Vanek is better
There's no winger for MM and JT.........because great things are gotten with nothing given up
Salary only increased $1.5 million and will be offset soon.........while NYI loses millions
Revenue sharing small amount should put NYI in middle salary range.......while NYI loses millions more than that covers
They'll believe it when they see it.......except they never do as it always something in addition just for the sake of complaining
Nothing changes.......while things are better than they were 2 years ago and the future has never been brighter

It NEVER ends. I hear Charlie Brown's teacher going WAH WAH WAH listening to it.


Some does provide humor in it's absurdity. Most provides just absurdity.


Last edited by Bert Marshall days: 10-30-2013 at 06:49 PM.
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