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Kulemin to Pittsburgh

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Old
11-04-2013, 09:05 AM
  #1
KTanger58
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Kulemin to Pittsburgh

To Toronto : Niskanen and Jeffrey
To Pittsbugh : Kulemin

Kulemin : Pittsburgh get a good defensive player who can play on the Malkin line (Kulemin-Malkin-Neal) , will help this line get more time on the offensive zone . He can also play on the PK .

Niskanen : A good player who seems to be on his prime . He can help on the scoring department (Good shot and ability to start the offensive play) and he can be good on the defense if he play with a defensive player or a physical one .

Jeffrey : Staying in pittsburgh is killing his NHL career . He is a good defensive C/W (Type of player who never make big defensive mistake) . He can replace Kulemin .


Last edited by KTanger58: 11-04-2013 at 09:15 AM.
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11-04-2013, 09:10 AM
  #2
Vokouna Maattata
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Niskanen isn't the D that Toronto needs. I think in one of the other million Kulemin to Pittsburgh threads that Orpik for Kulemin and a 2nd/3rd was fair. In other words, you're beating a dead horse that has been beat for 3 years.

But hell, if they want to do this, I take this deal and run. Great deal for the Pens.


Last edited by Vokouna Maattata: 11-04-2013 at 09:16 AM.
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11-04-2013, 09:14 AM
  #3
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I'd actually do this trade, I think Niskanen would be good on the 3rd pair with Fraser...

Plus Jeffrey would be a decent 3rd liner to cover for injuries and he's great on draws. I'm not a huge Kule fan though, I do like him, but I doubt we sign him in the offseason.

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Old
11-04-2013, 09:18 AM
  #4
KTanger58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmError29 View Post
Niskanen isn't the D that Toronto needs. I think in one of the other million Kulemin to Pittsburgh threads that Orpik for Kulemin and a 2nd/3rd was fair. In other words, you're beating a dead horse that has been beat for 3 years.
We never mentioned Niskanen on the Kulemin Trade . Plus , Niskanen seems to be on his prime this year . I'am sure Orpik will not get moved and Niskanen seems to be on the trading block . Pittsburgh must stop trading their picks and actually work on drafting forwards .

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Kulemin-Malkin-Neal
Jokinen-Sutter-Bennet/D'agostini
Glass-Vitale-Adams

Orpik-Martin
Scuderi(When he come back)-Letang
Maatta-Bort

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11-04-2013, 09:20 AM
  #5
Vokouna Maattata
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KTanger58 View Post
We never mentioned Niskanen on the Kulemin Trade . Plus , Niskanen seems to be on his prime this year . I'am sure Orpik will not get moved and Niskanen seems to be on the trading block . Pittsburgh must stop trading their picks and actually work on drafting forwards .
I don't disagree with you, I would love to do this as a Pens fan. It's just that I highly doubt that the Leafs would be interested in Niskanen with Franson, Rielly, Phaneuf and Gardiner. But hey, if they want to do it, I'll drive both to Toronto. It's not that I don't want to do it, but I don't think Toronto would do this. Niskanen isn't the kind of D that they need.

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11-04-2013, 09:23 AM
  #6
KIRK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FishManSam View Post
I'd actually do this trade, I think Niskanen would be good on the 3rd pair with Fraser...

Plus Jeffrey would be a decent 3rd liner to cover for injuries and he's great on draws. I'm not a huge Kule fan though, I do like him, but I doubt we sign him in the offseason.
My other suggestion was Jussi Jokinen, 1 for 1 deal.

If one doesn't see Niskanen as a fit on the Leafs defense (and I wonder how expendable Scuderi's injury makes him right now), then Jokinen definitely fits a need.

Unlike Jeffrey or sliding Kessel/Raymond, in Jokinen you'd get someone who can play 2C for a short period (like he did last year for the Pens with Crosby out), slide up and down the lineup at C or W, and currently has a goal total than would tie him for 2nd of the Leafs.

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11-04-2013, 09:31 AM
  #7
Tender Rip
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KIRK..... for heavens sake! You have repeated that 100 times now in different threads. Toronto are not looking for a long term solution at C, and if they were, they would want someone other than Jokinen. The benefit of Jokinen is that he can also perform on the wing, but that is the last thing Toronto needs.

The trade suggested here.... well, it does fit magically for the Pens, at least to those of us who believe that Despres is a better fit with Letang than Niskanen.

For Toronto, obviously Kulemin is one of their best PK'ers and probably the best winger defensively. As such they'd not like to trade him, but on the other hand - with Toronto he is a third liner in the end, and they cannot be sure that he will stay past UFA this Summer.
Jeffrey matches a current need, and is a better player than Letestu who left the Pens in a similar situation to what Jeffrey's is now. Niskanen would clearly be among the Leafs best 6 D-men if traded there, and could/should help them become a better possession team.

I think the trade makes sense, but at the same time it is more of a bulls eye move for the Pens than Toronto. At least unless/until Jeffrey becomes the player many of us thinks he could be.

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11-04-2013, 09:33 AM
  #8
Vokouna Maattata
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I'd rather just have Jokinen on Malkin's LW honestly. If I'm acquiring Kulemin, it would to play on the 3rd line with Sutter and Bennett. Jokinen has looked fantastic on Malkin's LW so far this year. I wouldn't trade him for Kulemin. If we can get him for Niskanen and Jeffery, then I'd do that. But if it involves anyone else significant on the NHL roster, I wouldn't do it. My ideal lineup would be:

Kunitz-Crosby-Bennett
Kulemin-Malkin-Neal
Jokinen-Sutter-Dupuis
Glass-Vitale-Adams

Letang-Scuderi
Orpik-Martin
Maatta-Bortuzzo

Dat 3rd line, just orgasmic.

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11-04-2013, 09:34 AM
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It's going to sound far fetch but I think if you want Kulemin and can sign him to long term deal, like sign and trade, then you'll have to part with Sutter.

He's the big body center Toronto needs, even if that means if we have to add another piece with Kulemin.

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11-04-2013, 09:36 AM
  #10
KIRK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fahad203 View Post
It's going to sound far fetch but I think if you want Kulemin and can sign him to long term deal, like sign and trade, then you'll have to part with Sutter.

He's the big body center Toronto needs, even if that means if we have to add another piece with Kulemin.
Sutter isn't a big body. But, as a Pens fan, I'd now gladly give up Staal for Kulemin.

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11-04-2013, 09:37 AM
  #11
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Originally Posted by IAmError29 View Post
I'd rather just have Jokinen on Malkin's LW honestly. If I'm acquiring Kulemin, it would to play on the 3rd line with Sutter and Bennett. Jokinen has looked fantastic on Malkin's LW so far this year.

----

My ideal lineup would be:

Kunitz-Crosby-Bennett
Kulemin-Malkin-Neal
Jokinen-Sutter-Dupuis
Glass-Vitale-Adams

Dat 3rd line, just orgasmic.
Either you are living up to your user name, or you came to your senses midway through. Of course, I hope the latter, because the first segment above is just so dreadfully wrong .

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11-04-2013, 09:39 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fahad203 View Post
It's going to sound far fetch but I think if you want Kulemin and can sign him to long term deal, like sign and trade, then you'll have to part with Sutter.

He's the big body center Toronto needs, even if that means if we have to add another piece with Kulemin.
Why would the Pens trade Sutter for a signed Kulemin when they can just sign him once he hits FA? The Leafs aren't in a position to make outrageous demands. It's either they take what the Pens offer or keep him and hope he re-signs. It's more likely that not that Kulemin would sign in FA with Pittsburgh, so I highly doubt that the Pens would trade anything of significant value or importance for him. Also, the Pens don't even really need him that badly.

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11-04-2013, 09:43 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tender Rip View Post
Either you are living up to your user name, or you came to your senses midway through. Of course, I hope the latter, because the first segment above is just so dreadfully wrong .
Eh, I'm kinda split on where I'd play Kulemin. On one hand, his grit and defensive play would prove to be incredible on Malkin's line. He would be that line's Kunitz with better defense, which is exactly what we need for Malkin's LW. However, at the same time, a Jokinen-Sutter-Bennett line is super soft. A teddy bear could probably beat them up. Also, Bennett and Jokinen are kinda redundant on the same line. They both play a similar game. Putting Kulemin on that line adds physicality to that line that has been lost since Cooke left. I'm not too sure, I think the chemistry between Malkin and Kulemin from the KHL is way overblown.

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11-04-2013, 09:46 AM
  #14
KIRK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tender Rip View Post
KIRK..... for heavens sake! You have repeated that 100 times now in different threads. Toronto are not looking for a long term solution at C, and if they were, they would want someone other than Jokinen. The benefit of Jokinen is that he can also perform on the wing, but that is the last thing Toronto needs.

The trade suggested here.... well, it does fit magically for the Pens, at least to those of us who believe that Despres is a better fit with Letang than Niskanen.

For Toronto, obviously Kulemin is one of their best PK'ers and probably the best winger defensively. As such they'd not like to trade him, but on the other hand - with Toronto he is a third liner in the end, and they cannot be sure that he will stay past UFA this Summer.
Jeffrey matches a current need, and is a better player than Letestu who left the Pens in a similar situation to what Jeffrey's is now. Niskanen would clearly be among the Leafs best 6 D-men if traded there, and could/should help them become a better possession team.

I think the trade makes sense, but at the same time it is more of a bulls eye move for the Pens than Toronto. At least unless/until Jeffrey becomes the player many of us thinks he could be.
Jeffrey matches a current need but Jokinen doesn't? The current need is a guy who can play 2C for as long as Bozak and Bolland are out and perhaps 3C thereafter until the other returns and then perhaps have value after all the forwards are healthy.

Jokinen played 2C for the Pens last year with Crosby out, actually produces points, and has a history of playing C and W up and down a lineup. To my knowledge, Jeffrey has started 2 games this year as the Pens 4C, has 1 assist in 8 games, for his career has 28 points in 99 games as a 10 minute a night player.

No offense, but if I'm the Leafs, I'd feel a lot better sliding Kessel or Raymond or even Kulemin to center than I would feel starting Jeffrey at 2C for a month. I surely wouldn't start him over McClement at 3C when Bozak returns. And, by the time everyone comes back, he'd be waiver fodder.

At least with someone like Jokinen, there is a player of sufficient caliber that you wouldn't feel a need to slide a player to C or force McClement to to play 2C.

But, they'll give up Kulemin because he may walk for an 'answer' for the Leafs short term issues at C like Jeffrey but will see Kulemin as irreplaceable for a guy who fills no 'long term need' at C like Jokinen? Sorry, but this time I don't follow.

Now, as for Niskanen, I'm not sure HE is the type of defenseman the Leafs would want. BUT, when Paul Ranger and Mark Fraser are your 6/7, Niskanen definitely would be an upgrade.

Either way, cap and value, Kulemin for Jokinen OR Jeffrey/Niskanen makes sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmError29 View Post
Eh, I'm kinda split on where I'd play Kulemin. On one hand, his grit and defensive play would prove to be incredible on Malkin's line. He would be that line's Kunitz with better defense, which is exactly what we need for Malkin's LW. However, at the same time, a Jokinen-Sutter-Bennett line is super soft. A teddy bear could probably beat them up. Also, Bennett and Jokinen are kinda redundant on the same line. They both play a similar game. Putting Kulemin on that line adds physicality to that line that has been lost since Cooke left. I'm not too sure, I think the chemistry between Malkin and Kulemin from the KHL is way overblown.
It may be. The fact that Malkin has been his most productive with people who play like Kulemin-- Staal, Malone, Talbot for the cup run, Kunitz (compare him with Neal with Kunitz and without)-- is not overblown.

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11-04-2013, 09:51 AM
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Last time this got brought up (and it has been brought up alot), I think the deal revolved around Kulemin for Orpik.

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11-04-2013, 10:06 AM
  #16
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I just dont understand why people believe Jeffery has any trade value what so ever. He wasnt particullary good before his knee injury and has been completely invisable and replaceable in every single way since. This is the same guy that has sat in favor of Derek Engellend and Zac Boychuk. He is waiver fodder if there ever was one.

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11-04-2013, 10:53 AM
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I think this is pretty fair

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11-04-2013, 10:57 AM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
It may be. The fact that Malkin has been his most productive with people who play like Kulemin-- Staal, Malone, Talbot for the cup run, Kunitz (compare him with Neal with Kunitz and without)-- is not overblown.
I give you Talbot, but Staal and Kunitz are in no way comparable offensive players to Kulemin. And, sorry, I'd play him with Malkin too (that is the only reason to acquire him in the first place, he isn't THAT great), but I would not ever ever expect a production = Kunitz out of him.

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11-04-2013, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
Sutter isn't a big body. But, as a Pens fan, I'd now gladly give up Staal for Kulemin.
Sutter is a tall body .

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11-04-2013, 11:48 AM
  #20
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Niskanen is very underrated player here. That also includes some PIT fans. The fact is that he´s very useful for the Pens (especially with Letang´s injury and now with Scuderi injured). Niskanen has 9 points already, while being +11 and playing very reliable hockey for the Pens.

That said, the OP proposal is not that far off, value-wise..

If I had to choose between Orpik & Niskanen going into the next season, I would probably re-sign Nisky. (Not that Nisky is that much better right now, but he´s still improving slightly, while Orpik is slowly but surely going the other way).

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11-04-2013, 01:05 PM
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Leafs need a big minute, physical defenseman and his name is Orpik. Niskanen is not needed, as the roster is stacked with similar defensemen.

With Fraser having been out of the line up, we've been screaming for just a solid, dependable, physical stay-at-home d-man we can pair long-term with a puck mover.

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11-04-2013, 01:17 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
My other suggestion was Jussi Jokinen, 1 for 1 deal.
Yeeaah... No.

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11-04-2013, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BonMorrison View Post
Last time this got brought up (and it has been brought up alot), I think the deal revolved around Kulemin for Orpik.
Pens wouldn't deal Orpik during the season, he's the guy you keep for the run, then you assess your situation in the off season and either try to sign him or give more confidence to Bortuzzo's play and hope the others can pick up the physical slack. Orpik is probably not going anywhere unless he asks to or refuses to sign and walks in the summer.

I do want to see Jeffrey succeed though, in Toronto he could maybe, depends on how dire that 3rd line C situation is, if he were to get that pot while Bolland is out indefinitely and were to cement himself a roster spot...awesome, I kind of wanted him to be that guy when Staal was likely getting moved, but then we got Sutter and well, he's a better fit there for now and Jeffrey is shafted.

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11-04-2013, 01:42 PM
  #24
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If the Pens could get Ott in a trade, I'd be all for Sutter for Kulemin.

Kulemin-Ott-Dupuis could be one hell of a line.

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11-04-2013, 01:44 PM
  #25
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Sorry pens fans, Kulemin not avail. Maybe as UFA but not via trade

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