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Jordan Eberle (around the league vs Edmonton)

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11-19-2013, 10:31 AM
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Jordan Eberle (around the league vs Edmonton)

What's Jordan Eberle's value in the eyes of Edmonton fans? I've read quite a few posts where Edmonton fans are low on the guy. His point totals seem to be solid. What's the problem? Is this a situation where Edmonton fans feel his value is higher around the league then it would be if the league saw him play every day?

Also to the league, what do you guys view Eberle as? Top line player? Top 6 player? Top 9 player?

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11-19-2013, 10:44 AM
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It's a situation where after a bad game his value is low and after a good game his value is high (like almost everyone does around here). Lot's of holes in the team but they haven't been playing like we thought they should so more low than high right now from Oilers fans and other fans hoping to pry him for cheap or acting like he wouldn't make their team better.

He is a top line player and his actual value is maybe not as high as when he has a good game but somewhere much closer to that. Also, if the rest of the league saw him play more they would value him higher, not lower (as it is with a lot of players).

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11-19-2013, 10:54 AM
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He is a capable top line player. I don't think any Oiler fans really dislike him, I think it's a slow coming realization that we're going to have to trade one of our small skilled players, and Hall and RNH are much more important, either because of position (RNH) or because of intangibles and drive (Hall). Considering that everyone here thinks Gagner sucks and Yakupov is going to Russia, the only discussion we can really have on HF is Eberle or Eberle+ for a top pair defenseman. Nobody wants to move him, some of us realize we will probably have to eventually.

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11-19-2013, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by ManofSteel55 View Post
He is a capable top line player. I don't think any Oiler fans really dislike him, I think it's a slow coming realization that we're going to have to trade one of our small skilled players, and Hall and RNH are much more important, either because of position (RNH) or because of intangibles and drive (Hall). Considering that everyone here thinks Gagner sucks and Yakupov is going to Russia, the only discussion we can really have on HF is Eberle or Eberle+ for a top pair defenseman. Nobody wants to move him, some of us realize we will probably have to eventually.
Pretty much this. I think we can get a #1-2 D with Eberle as the main piece, adding in a D prospect like Klefbom or Marincin. Heck, Eberle+EDM 2014 1st is a pretty monster package to get a good D man.

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11-19-2013, 11:11 AM
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Pretty much this. I think we can get a #1-2 D with Eberle as the main piece, adding in a D prospect like Klefbom or Marincin. Heck, Eberle+EDM 2014 1st is a pretty monster package to get a good D man.
Not that it would happen, but as a Canuck fan, I'd consider moving Edler for Eberle. Value-wise, I think it's pretty close. Both have a lot of great years ahead of them.

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11-19-2013, 11:20 AM
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Not that it would happen, but as a Canuck fan, I'd consider moving Edler for Eberle. Value-wise, I think it's pretty close. Both have a lot of great years ahead of them.
It is very close. The division rival thing throws a bit of a wrench in there, as I would want more due to that fact, and so would you.

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11-19-2013, 11:21 AM
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It's a situation where after a bad game his value is low and after a good game his value is high (like almost everyone does around here). Lot's of holes in the team but they haven't been playing like we thought they should so more low than high right now from Oilers fans and other fans hoping to pry him for cheap or acting like he wouldn't make their team better.

He is a top line player and his actual value is maybe not as high as when he has a good game but somewhere much closer to that. Also, if the rest of the league saw him play more they would value him higher, not lower (as it is with a lot of players).
I don't know if he is a top line player on a contender. Keep in mind that Edmonton has had complete and utter lack of depth for about the past 5 years. He has been playing top line minutes (20 minutes plus per night) on a bad team. He isn't very strong in his dzone and fits into a run and gun type player. He doesn't play a heavy game.

Teams in the Western Conference, tend to be made up of very good 2 way players that also produce points. He won't get 20 minutes a game on a contender with depth. More like 15 and the question is would he produce as much in a more structured system with a bit of dump and chase? And I personally don't think he would.

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11-19-2013, 11:22 AM
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So Eberle isn't a guy you would be willing to move for picks and prospects? Is the fan base projecting managements vision or is management moving towards a youth movement/rebuild?

A top pairing young D is rare in this league. So if you're looking for a top pairing D it's likely an older player (late 20s, early 30s). Is that someone management would realistically target? Are there realistic players that the Oilers are looking to move Eberle + for? By realistic both teams have to have the motivation to execute the deal.

My impression from reading around these parts and the Edmonton forums is that a lot of fans are frustrated with Eberle but his stats look solid. Is it his defense that causes frustration?

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11-19-2013, 11:23 AM
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The one deal that always comes up is Buff for Eberle. I was always on board for that but Buff has been playing like a BEAST this season. I am sure there is still a deal to be made there but not while Bogo and Trouba are out.

I just don't know what we do. We have 3 very capable RD players. Buff is arguably the best of the 3 yet he appears to be the first one that we would trade.

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11-19-2013, 11:23 AM
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Josi + Spaling for Eberle.

Oilers get a top 4 D with top pairing upside as well as a very, very good third line player that is wicked on the penalty kill.

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11-19-2013, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by ThePSEGPowerPoster View Post
My impression from reading around these parts and the Edmonton forums is that a lot of fans are frustrated with Eberle but his stats look solid. Is it his defense that causes frustration?
No one is really frustrated with Eberle, they're frustrated with the team. The reason that Eberle is the one to be brought up in more trade proposals is because between Yakupov and Hemsky they have some offensive depth on the RW and with Yakupov getting crapped on by everyone right now his value round these parts is low so that means Eberle is the one to move. There's no depth at centre or LW in Edmonton so Hall and RNH don't get brought up. Process of elimination leads to Eberle being the one offered up.

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11-19-2013, 11:26 AM
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I don't know if he is a top line player on a contender. Keep in mind that Edmonton has had complete and utter lack of depth for about the past 5 years. He has been playing top line minutes (20 minutes plus per night) on a bad team. He isn't very strong in his dzone and fits into a run and gun type player. He doesn't play a heavy game.

Teams in the Western Conference, tend to be made up of very good 2 way players that also produce points. He won't get 20 minutes a game on a contender with depth. More like 15 and the question is would he produce as much in a more structured system with a bit of dump and chase? And I personally don't think he would.
This is very concerning for a team like New Jersey. Considering our team plays a very organized dump and chase. I know a lot of Edmonton fans are frustrated with Eberle and I wonder if this is the bulk of the frustration. How would Eberle fit in NJ (before we talk about offers)?

Further what's management thinking here? Is management rebuilding or reloading?

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11-19-2013, 11:28 AM
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Josi + Spaling for Eberle.

Oilers get a top 4 D with top pairing upside as well as a very, very good third line player that is wicked on the penalty kill.
Also very close. I think it needs a little tweaking, probably a little add on both sides, but I like the idea.

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11-19-2013, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by missinthejets View Post
No one is really frustrated with Eberle, they're frustrated with the team. The reason that Eberle is the one to be brought up in more trade proposals is because between Yakupov and Hemsky they have some offensive depth on the RW and with Yakupov getting crapped on by everyone right now his value round these parts is low so that means Eberle is the one to move. There's no depth at centre or LW in Edmonton so Hall and RNH don't get brought up. Process of elimination leads to Eberle being the one offered up.
I must have caught you guys after some bad losses then . I've read quite a few posts from EDM fans, to quote, "let's trade Eberle before the rest of the league realizes he sucks."

I was surprised by that and we were talking about Eberle over on our board and wanted to know really what the fans though, what management is thinking, and what the rest of the league thinks.

Before we even talk about players moving from each side. I think it's far more productive to talk about the players ability and what system he might fit in, what he does well and what he does poorly, and what the team's goals are before you can make an intelligent offer.

I know a lot of EDM fans want a top pairing D but I wonder if that's really what management wants to do here.

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11-19-2013, 11:32 AM
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Like every player of every team go to the team board and the player is awful , horrible, trade him!

Then go to the trade forum and watch the same people think he is worth double anything anyone offers.

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11-19-2013, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by ManofSteel55 View Post
He is a capable top line player. I don't think any Oiler fans really dislike him, I think it's a slow coming realization that we're going to have to trade one of our small skilled players, and Hall and RNH are much more important, either because of position (RNH) or because of intangibles and drive (Hall). Considering that everyone here thinks Gagner sucks and Yakupov is going to Russia, the only discussion we can really have on HF is Eberle or Eberle+ for a top pair defenseman. Nobody wants to move him, some of us realize we will probably have to eventually.
What about something around Eberle and Zibanejad? I know defence is a priority, but getting someone like Zibanejad who is a big, strong, defensively responsible centre with offensive upside would help.

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11-19-2013, 11:40 AM
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Like every player of every team go to the team board and the player is awful , horrible, trade him!

Then go to the trade forum and watch the same people think he is worth double anything anyone offers.
Which is why I don't even want to talk about specific players (yet). Just talk to me about the player and his value to the Oilers (which seems to be low considering their surplus of skilled forwards), what management wants to do, and what his value is to other teams around the league.

Vague statements like "top-pairing D" don't really do much of anything to further the discussion. I don't watch Eberle nightly so before I give up a huge package for him I want to actually know if he's worth it to my team.

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11-19-2013, 11:44 AM
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What about something around Eberle and Zibanejad? I know defence is a priority, but getting someone like Zibanejad who is a big, strong, defensively responsible centre with offensive upside would help.
I like Zibanejad but their would have to be a decent + from Sens.

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11-19-2013, 11:48 AM
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This is very concerning for a team like New Jersey. Considering our team plays a very organized dump and chase. I know a lot of Edmonton fans are frustrated with Eberle and I wonder if this is the bulk of the frustration. How would Eberle fit in NJ (before we talk about offers)?

Further what's management thinking here? Is management rebuilding or reloading?
Most Oilers fans hate dump and chase, it's not "Oilers hockey". Personally, I see it as a waste of talent when you force players who can create space by passing and puck movement to play in that kind of system without the linemates and defensive support players who play well in that kind of system.

Also, Oilers fans are not down on Eberle, by any stretch of the imagination, he's our only real high-end trade chip, since we'd get totally fleeced in any deal involving Yakupov.

As for management, Craig MacTavish had a press conference last Thursday, and mentioned that he didn't want to trade what he considers our 7 or so core players. He'd rather move next year's first pick.

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11-19-2013, 11:49 AM
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I like Zibanejad but their would have to be a decent + from Sens.
Zibanejad + Gryba/Greening maybe.

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11-19-2013, 11:58 AM
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Zibanejad + Gryba/Greening maybe.
IMO it would be more something like

Eberle + Maracinin +a roster D not named Ference/J. Schultz/Petry/Belov

for

Zibanejad + Cowen + Greening still don't think I do it.

Only real time I see MacT trading Eberle would be in a Package with this years pick for a top pairing defensemen under 28 and their are not many of them available so don't see it happening

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11-19-2013, 12:10 PM
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IMO it would be more something like

Eberle + Maracinin +a roster D not named Ference/J. Schultz/Petry/Belov

for

Zibanejad + Cowen + Greening still don't think I do it.

Only real time I see MacT trading Eberle would be in a Package with this years pick for a top pairing defensemen under 28 and their are not many of them available so don't see it happening
What about something like Zibanejad, Cowen and Greening for Eberle and Klefbom?

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11-19-2013, 12:22 PM
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Eberle is the most overrated Oiler by fans of other teams. That doesn't mean he's that overrated though. Since the Oilers are so terrible and play in the WC, fans of other teams tend to underrate almost everyone on the roster.

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11-19-2013, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ThePSEGPowerPoster View Post
So Eberle isn't a guy you would be willing to move for picks and prospects? Is the fan base projecting managements vision or is management moving towards a youth movement/rebuild?


My impression from reading around these parts and the Edmonton forums is that a lot of fans are frustrated with Eberle but his stats look solid. Is it his defense that causes frustration?
You don't move 24 yr old PPG players (or close to it) for picks and prospects. Even if Edmonton was going to a youth movement/rebuild (which they've been doing for 4 years)... you don't move Eberle for picks/prospects - unless those prospects are guys like Jones or Mickinnon.

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Originally Posted by Frenzy1 View Post
I don't know if he is a top line player on a contender. Keep in mind that Edmonton has had complete and utter lack of depth for about the past 5 years. He has been playing top line minutes (20 minutes plus per night) on a bad team. He isn't very strong in his dzone and fits into a run and gun type player. He doesn't play a heavy game.

Teams in the Western Conference, tend to be made up of very good 2 way players that also produce points. He won't get 20 minutes a game on a contender with depth. More like 15 and the question is would he produce as much in a more structured system with a bit of dump and chase? And I personally don't think he would.
He is. Even on a team like LA. There's a couple teams who have a full complement of scoring forwards on their top 2 lines, but other than that, he would easily fit as one of the top 4 wingers on 90% of the teams in the league. I say top 6 forward, as with most contending teams, they don't really have a 1st or 2nd line (SJ, LA and Boston for example). Both scoring lines get almost the same icetime, and the players likely get moved a bit depending on what fits better (chemistry and strength/weakness wise), who's on, etc.

From the few games I've seen, his D isn't awful. I think it's more that most of their top 6 forwards (Hall, RNH, Eberle, Gagner, Yak, Perron) do not play great defensively individually. Add in that Hall and RNH are the biggest at 6-1, while the rest are all 5-11, and can be pushed around.

I wouldn't be worried about any of those players defensive game individually... Pair them (Hall or Ebs) with any top line in the west, and things will be fine. Besides defense CAN be taught. Its just that it really gets exposed when the entire forward group is average - at best.

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11-19-2013, 12:43 PM
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I don't know if he is a top line player on a contender. Keep in mind that Edmonton has had complete and utter lack of depth for about the past 5 years. He has been playing top line minutes (20 minutes plus per night) on a bad team. He isn't very strong in his dzone and fits into a run and gun type player. He doesn't play a heavy game.

Teams in the Western Conference, tend to be made up of very good 2 way players that also produce points. He won't get 20 minutes a game on a contender with depth. More like 15 and the question is would he produce as much in a more structured system with a bit of dump and chase? And I personally don't think he would.
He is a top line player on any team in the league. That doesn't mean that he is better than every other RW in the league, but any he could replace any other top line right wing in the NHL, and still look like a top line right winger. You can poke holes at his few flaws if you like, no player is perfect, but he is still a top line guy.

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