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Why is Andrew MacDonald playing with Provorov?

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Old
12-31-2016, 07:36 AM
  #1
Absolut
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Why is Andrew MacDonald playing with Provorov?

I am not a Flyers fan, but catch quiet a few games. Was at the game last night in SJ. I have not seen an NHL d as incompetent as MacDonald in a really long time. He's basically an AHL-quality player. Nothing personal against him, seems like a great guy. Watching the game live, he might as well be a lead collar around Provorov's neck. Provorov has to not only pay attention to his man, he also has to try to defend against inevitable MacDonald blunders at ALL TIMES. Provorov was constantly trying to look both ways, essentially defending against 2 man + MacDonald who can't get out of his own way, forget defending anything. I am sure you all are aware of MacDonald's deficiencies. Whether it's getting into a teammates way, screening his own goalie, turning the puck over, being in a wrong position (90% of the time), losing his man, etc. It's just an endless array of creating difficulties for his partner.

Provorov is 19 and a rookie. What is the rational behind playing him with someone who's that much of a liability? How can a young player develop offensively if he knows that he's the only D on the ice? It is painful to watch. It's like an exorcist with IPs head turning and turning to look at his man and MacDonalds man. Surprised he's not IR'd with a neck injury yet.

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12-31-2016, 07:39 AM
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CanuckistanFlyerfan
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Philly is trying a new technique that may develop Provorov twice as fast.

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12-31-2016, 07:43 AM
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This is funny

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12-31-2016, 07:44 AM
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LegionOfDoom91
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Hakstol paired MacDonald with Gostisbehere last year as it went on too. It's seemingly the right of passage for Flyers' rookie defensemen.

So I guess Sam Morin will be the next in line to have that honor bestowed upon him.

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12-31-2016, 07:57 AM
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Bobby Orr's Knees
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Provy is playing with AMac because Ivan, the 10-yr vet perennial all-star 1D, is the only player who neutralize his hapless defensive partner.

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12-31-2016, 08:01 AM
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PALE PWNR
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You know how in Dragonball Z everyone wears weighted clothing so that they can become way stronger way quicker because they are just doing their normal routines in weighted gear and also working out in it too? It's the same thing, Hakstol wants to make him the GOAT.

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12-31-2016, 08:07 AM
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BillDineen
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Great OP. To be fair though, AMac has been competent for a few games this season. Majority are minor league quality though.

It is Haklogic.

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Old
12-31-2016, 08:26 AM
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MickeyMelchiondo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PALE PWNR View Post
You know how in Dragonball Z everyone wears weighted clothing so that they can become way stronger way quicker because they are just doing their normal routines in weighted gear and also working out in it too? It's the same thing, Hakstol wants to make him the GOAT.
yes
russian machine need game played on setting: expert level

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12-31-2016, 08:37 AM
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Captain Dave Poulin
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Hakstok, in his very confused state, thinks "I must break you," not realizing it is Ivan's line.

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12-31-2016, 08:54 AM
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RebelBully
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Originally Posted by Absolut View Post
I am not a Flyers fan, but catch quiet a few games. Was at the game last night in SJ. I have not seen an NHL d as incompetent as MacDonald in a really long time. He's basically an AHL-quality player. Nothing personal against him, seems like a great guy. Watching the game live, he might as well be a lead collar around Provorov's neck. Provorov has to not only pay attention to his man, he also has to try to defend against inevitable MacDonald blunders at ALL TIMES. Provorov was constantly trying to look both ways, essentially defending against 2 man + MacDonald who can't get out of his own way, forget defending anything. I am sure you all are aware of MacDonald's deficiencies. Whether it's getting into a teammates way, screening his own goalie, turning the puck over, being in a wrong position (90% of the time), losing his man, etc. It's just an endless array of creating difficulties for his partner.

Provorov is 19 and a rookie. What is the rational behind playing him with someone who's that much of a liability? How can a young player develop offensively if he knows that he's the only D on the ice? It is painful to watch. It's like an exorcist with IPs head turning and turning to look at his man and MacDonalds man. Surprised he's not IR'd with a neck injury yet.
Thank you for asking this.

The answer is simple, our coach is a ****ing moron.

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12-31-2016, 08:56 AM
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Captain Dave Poulin
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Thank you for asking this.

The answer is simple, our coach is a ****ing moron.
lolz

Happy New Year, bro

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12-31-2016, 08:59 AM
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LegionOfDoom91
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Fire Davw Hastok!

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12-31-2016, 09:03 AM
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RebelBully
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Originally Posted by Captain Dave Poulin View Post
lolz

Happy New Year, bro
Happy New Year! Hopefully a new year brings a new Hakstok and he figures out the simple aspects of coaching:

1 - Dress your best players
2 - Dont overuse your worst players
3 - Find some semblance of consistency with who plays with who
4 - Stop using forwards on their offwing on PP2

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12-31-2016, 09:08 AM
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Captain Dave Poulin
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Originally Posted by RebelBully View Post
Happy New Year! Hopefully a new year brings a new Hakstok and he figures out the simple aspects of coaching:

1 - Dress your best players
2 - Dont overuse your worst players
3 - Find some semblance of consistency with who plays with who
4 - Stop using forwards on their offwing on PP2
and ...

5 - Stop being a coward, grow a sack, and chuck the prevent D in the can

That is one of my two worries going forward - Hextall will give him better players very soon as our prospects ripen, and then his whacky cluster****ing of the lines will have less effect, but if he still plays afraid at the end of games, we are going to drop more points than we should. Having said that, my other worry is that Hakstok will convince Hexstok to resign PEB and VDV, and I can barely tolerate the thought of that.

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12-31-2016, 09:08 AM
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Curufinwe
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The actual answer to this question is that Prorovov-MacDonald are conceding goals against at half the rate Provorov-Streit did while getting tougher matchups and 46.9% OZ starts versus 61.9%. Their possession numbers are much lower, but Hakstol is more concerned with conceding goals than conceding shot attempts. And he's been trying to use Gudas to carry the 2nd pairing to respectability while MDZ is struggling, which means he can't have his two best defensive dmen together.

Provorov's GA/60 with Streit was 3.56, with MacDonald it's 1.73.

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12-31-2016, 09:11 AM
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Captain Dave Poulin
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
The actual answer to this question is that Prorovov-MacDonald are conceding goals against at half the rate Provorov-Streit did while getting tougher matchups and 46.9% OZ starts versus 61.9%. Their possession numbers are much lower, but Hakstol is more concerned with conceding goals than conceding shot attempts.

Provorov's GA/60 with Streit was 3.56, with MacDonald it's 1.73.
That's all well and good, bud - and I know this is going to fall on deaf ears - but no statistics in the world can convince anyone besides your good self that Andy is anything but a bumbling, stumbling, awkward, confused, dimwitted disaster on blades.

I reiterate my wish for the signing of a dead bird to take his place. League minimum salary and fewer errors lying there all rigid in the middle of the ice.

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12-31-2016, 10:06 AM
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I thought Provy and Manning didn't look too bad together.

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12-31-2016, 10:10 AM
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MacDonald is going to play, so he's got to play with somebody.

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12-31-2016, 10:16 AM
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RebelBully
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MacDonald is going to play, so he's got to play with somebody.
He should get 3rd pairing sheltered minutes. Thats it. He shouldnt be playing more ES minutes than Ghost in a game they are trailing throughout. Disgraceful.

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12-31-2016, 10:33 AM
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dats81
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They are stuck with Mac Donald and somehow still try to find him a spot in the lineup where he can manage not being a liability every shift out there. It worked for half a dozen of games during the winning streak but everybody knew it would not last. It defies all logic.

Unfortunately they have only one defensive top-4 NHL defenseman on the roster in Gudas, which hurts the ability to set up proper pairings. The collective D is actually worse than the individual players at times because the pieces don't fit together.

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12-31-2016, 11:10 AM
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GKJ
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Originally Posted by RebelBully View Post
He should get 3rd pairing sheltered minutes. Thats it. He shouldnt be playing more ES minutes than Ghost in a game they are trailing throughout. Disgraceful.
He should be not playing at all. But you like Del Zotto and Gudas together, Manning has been doing alright with Ghost, and Provorov does not yet have a rapport with anybody, plus they're not going to put him with Ghost. Otherwise, you're waiting for an injury, or the revelation by Hakstol and Hextall that he is a bad player - and there is no evidence that they believe this. Somebody else is probably going to sit when Streit returns, including the possibility of it being Streit himself.

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Old
12-31-2016, 11:15 AM
  #22
Adam Warlock
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Loved seeing this post from a non-flyers fan because it baffles us too.

Id like to eventually see:
Provorov-Ghost
MDZ - Gudas
Amac-Streit

With Amac/Streit treated like a 3rd pairing. If MDZ can get back to he was last year then I would pair him with Ghost again and Prov with Gudas.

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Old
12-31-2016, 11:35 AM
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BillDineen
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Originally Posted by Adam Warlock View Post
Loved seeing this post from a non-flyers fan because it baffles us too.

Id like to eventually see:
Provorov-Ghost
MDZ - Gudas
Amac-Streit

With Amac/Streit treated like a 3rd pairing. If MDZ can get back to he was last year then I would pair him with Ghost again and Prov with Gudas.
Exactly, and distribute the minutes how other teams do, with Provorov-Ghost closer to 19 minutes per game even strength, Gudas getting extra shifts (with Provorov in the d zone), averaging above 18 and the rest getting sheltered minutes.

Current:

1- Gudas 17:38
2- MDZ 17:14
3- AMac 16:54
4- Streit 16:49
5- Provorov 16:40
6- Ghost 16:11
7 - Manning 16:11

Target:

1- Provorov 19:30
2- Ghost 18:45
3- Gudas 18:45
4- MDZ 16:00
5- Streit 14:30
6- AMac/Manning 14:00

Again EVERY single team plays their better defensemen proportionally more than Hakstol who goes with the easy roll-em method.

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Old
12-31-2016, 11:41 AM
  #24
Tripod
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
The actual answer to this question is that Prorovov-MacDonald are conceding goals against at half the rate Provorov-Streit did while getting tougher matchups and 46.9% OZ starts versus 61.9%. Their possession numbers are much lower, but Hakstol is more concerned with conceding goals than conceding shot attempts. And he's been trying to use Gudas to carry the 2nd pairing to respectability while MDZ is struggling, which means he can't have his two best defensive dmen together.

Provorov's GA/60 with Streit was 3.56, with MacDonald it's 1.73.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar65 View Post
I thought Provy and Manning didn't look too bad together.
Defend your guys to the end!


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Old
12-31-2016, 11:41 AM
  #25
MacDonald4MVP
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Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
They are stuck with Mac Donald and somehow still try to find him a spot in the lineup where he can manage not being a liability every shift out there. It worked for half a dozen of games during the winning streak but everybody knew it would not last. It defies all logic.

Unfortunately they have only one defensive top-4 NHL defenseman on the roster in Gudas, which hurts the ability to set up proper pairings. The collective D is actually worse than the individual players at times because the pieces don't fit together.
Gudas isn't anything special himself, where he shines the most are offensive zone keeps and neutral zone.

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