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Ducks shopping the 2nd overall pick

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Old
07-26-2005, 08:57 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the jpageman
think about this one.

3 way deal including Phily, Anaheim. Montreal

Anaheim gets Zednick, Hossa and or Hainsey , 2nd round choice from Mtl

Phily gets Montreal first 5th overall pick

Monteral gets Simon Gagné and the second overall pick!!

everybody would gain from this deal.
Phily would get 2 first round picks and unload a contract ( witch they need now)
Anaheim gets a very good winger along with potentialy great prospect
Montreal gets it all...

That'd be great...but obviously very unlikely. Great nonetheless though

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07-26-2005, 09:00 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the jpageman
Phily would get 2 first round picks and unload a contract ( witch they need now)
Philly just bought out LeClair and Amonte... they aren't going to have a firesale.

You think that Clarke would rather have a second round pick over Simon Gagne? Dream on.

The Flyers are already hard pressed to sign some of their draft picks before the deadline.

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07-26-2005, 09:00 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsArea
Im all for getting the #2 overall pick.

I would offer Zednik + Ribeiro + Hainsey.

Habs get Jonhson and Ryan
You love prospects far too much. I'm a fan of prospects and following them also but trading all chances we have this season away is plain stupid.

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07-26-2005, 09:01 PM
  #54
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I think we have to assume that Burke is thinking about swapping draft picks. It wouldn't surprise me if he and his newly hired cronies prefer (or find close to equal) Staal to Johnson (it's not that crazy of a projection), and would like to move down to a spot where he feels he can still grab Staal while picking up another second round pick. Anaheim has the 31st pick and the 59th pick in the second round already...imagine if they added another in the 30's, even the 40's...perhaps there are a few players he and his scouting staff have an eye on that are not necessarily projected as first rounders by most lists/teams. He gets a great young d-man, and an extra pick in the 2nd round.

I really think Staal is underrated on this board. The kid has amazing wheels, and I can assure you that folks in the Ottawa area appreciate his talent having seen him in the playoffs.

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07-26-2005, 09:39 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs13
Trade Zednik? Ribeiro?? What the hell is this all about? TRADE KOIVU?? This thread has gone beyond stupid now.

I think I take back my original idea and just draft Ryan at 5th...
As I said numerous times, you guys overrate Ribs thats not even funny... Pleks can replace him easily...

As for Z, we have better wingers in the system... Ryder passed him in the depth chart last season, Perezhogin and Higgins are gonna be more effective as soon as the game resume... Zednik is a speedy corridor winger... Perezhogin is as fast if not faster with the creative side.. Higgins is also a quick winger btw..

We are not talking about a good prospect... We are talking about an amazing one in Johnson.

Gainey just has to sign another experimenty winger to replace Z. That would be the price to pay for Johnson and it may not even be enough..

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07-26-2005, 10:03 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsArea
As I said numerous times, you guys overrate Ribs thats not even funny... Pleks can replace him easily...

As for Z, we have better wingers in the system... Ryder passed him in the depth chart last season, Perezhogin and Higgins are gonna be more effective as soon as the game resume... Zednik is a speedy corridor winger... Perezhogin is as fast if not faster with the creative side.. Higgins is also a quick winger btw..

We are not talking about a good prospect... We are talking about an amazing one in Johnson.

Gainey just has to sign another experimenty winger to replace Z. That would be the price to pay for Johnson and it may not even be enough..

As was mentioned earlier, why would Burke trade his pick for players when he can just sign them (one or more of hundreds of UFA's)? This would be a "move down in the first round" trade, and wouldn't involve a Ribeiro, who was 23/24 when he scored 65 points in the last NHL season. You are suggesting that Plekanec, who turns 23 at the start of this season, can "easily" replace 65 points at the NHL level. Might be nice if he could score more than that at the AHL level first, wouldn't you think? You expect a 65-point scorer from the AHL to come into the NHL and in his first season "easily" score 65 points?

I think you overrate Plekanec, and I haven't said it numerous times....yet.

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07-26-2005, 10:30 PM
  #57
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I know this is cliché but I'm glad some of you aren't Nhl Gm's. Especially ours!

The only thing I'd offer Burk is the 5th round and one kid from our farm...nothing else. IF he doesn't accept it, it won't matter because we'll get to draft an impact player at the 5th position who could potentially have a greater impact than the number 2 rated prospect.

Some of you here place unproven prospects on a pedestral even regular Nhl players can't reach. It's quite humorous.


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07-26-2005, 10:39 PM
  #58
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I look at it this way. Only four players (after Crosby, naturally) seem to stand out from the crowd. I think Burke would want to draft one of them. If he wants a veteran, I don't think Zednik would be high on his list because Zednik isn't far from free agency. He would want someone younger but with proven NHL credentials. Several other teams, such as the Sens, could easily match the Habs in any trade that involved only players in their prime. I'm not sure Burke would want Ribeiro. Besides, that would leave the Habs with just Koivu and Bonk , and Johnson probably wouldn't be ready for the NHL right away.

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07-26-2005, 10:46 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turnbuckle
As was mentioned earlier, why would Burke trade his pick for players when he can just sign them (one or more of hundreds of UFA's)? This would be a "move down in the first round" trade, and wouldn't involve a Ribeiro, who was 23/24 when he scored 65 points in the last NHL season. You are suggesting that Plekanec, who turns 23 at the start of this season, can "easily" replace 65 points at the NHL level. Might be nice if he could score more than that at the AHL level first, wouldn't you think? You expect a 65-point scorer from the AHL to come into the NHL and in his first season "easily" score 65 points?

I think you overrate Plekanec, and I haven't said it numerous times....yet.

First and foremost, I just want to point out that everyone who posts here knows already that NHA badly overrates Plekanec, and brings it up just about every oportunity he gets. This thread is nothing to do with that, so let's just ignore it instead of rehashing the debate again.

Now, I agree that Burke dealing the pick for a roster player at this point doesn't seem too clever. However:

Burke: "We will shop this pick. We have a lot of kids ready to step in for us -- Corey Perry, Ryan Getzlaf, Joffrey Lupul and Ladislav Smid -- and if we can trade the (No. 2) pick outright for an established player who is a good fit for us, we will do it. And if we get offers to move down a few spots and we can get another (draft) pick, we can do that too. It's really wide open. We want to see what's out there."

http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=131498

So I guess I don't think Burke is all that clever.

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07-26-2005, 10:53 PM
  #60
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I have faith in Gainey to do what we need to get done to have a cup in Montreal for 06

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07-26-2005, 11:05 PM
  #61
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I think it is clear that what Burke wants is established players not a Plekanek type of guy. He would likely need a LW. Its not that bad to trade up to get the player you want but i think that there is no consesus on who is realy the second best player in that draft so I would not trade a whole lot to go up three spots... our 5th and a 3rd round selection would be my offer.

Now If we center a trade arround Zednik then I hope its not just to draft higher then 5th but more to acquire there second.

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07-26-2005, 11:06 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turnbuckle
As was mentioned earlier, why would Burke trade his pick for players when he can just sign them (one or more of hundreds of UFA's)? This would be a "move down in the first round" trade, and wouldn't involve a Ribeiro, who was 23/24 when he scored 65 points in the last NHL season. You are suggesting that Plekanec, who turns 23 at the start of this season, can "easily" replace 65 points at the NHL level. Might be nice if he could score more than that at the AHL level first, wouldn't you think? You expect a 65-point scorer from the AHL to come into the NHL and in his first season "easily" score 65 points?

I think you overrate Plekanec, and I haven't said it numerous times....yet.
No... I debated several times about Ribs' 65 pts of last season... I stated some factors that favorised Ribs to put those numbers... such as the way he was used on every first PP unit versus our lack of talents compared to what is coming this fall.. He also replaced Koivu while injured at some point in the season... Any second line center playing on the first PP unit will reach more points than others getting second PP unit time... Thats an important factor to consider... How much teams use 2 centers on the first powerplay wave? Numbers are'nt everything... What Im saying is that Pleks can bring more to the table talking about overall efficiency, thats all. Pleks is the type of player you can face any opponents' lines against, he will use his quickness, smart, intensity and skills to outwork and outplay the opposition.. A bit like Koivu if you see... Who would you rather have on your team, Koivu or Ribeiro? Ribs is slow and weak, you just cant match him against anyones... The way I see it, Julien is looking to have 3 strong and well balanced lines so that he can outplay the opposition.. We will have a better idea about Ribs' efficiency even strength this year when matched against top other teams lines... Be sure Plekanec will be ready to impress coatchs and fans if there are any let down by Ribs or if he just fail to outplay guys like Carter, Fisher, Richards (Brad or Mike), Parise, Peca, Briere.. even stregth to name a few...


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07-26-2005, 11:17 PM
  #63
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Seeing that the Ducks are thin on the right side (so are we after Ryder if we don't re-sign Kovalev) I think they would be interested in Zednik. He is an established winger in the NHL and probably would produce well on a line with Fedorov and Sykora.

I think it would take more than Zednik to get the 2nd pick because he isn't an elite player so another player like Hossa a player who can play now and seemed to do well this year in the Swedish Elite league may be enough to broker a deal with Burke.

If Gainey makes a deal like the one above I'm sure his interest in the UFA market is to address our RW side too.

I'm sure Gainey will make an offer to Burke, hell he said he was gonna propose a trade to Pittsburgh for the top pick so one would have to think he would offer Burke a trade because a deal is more likely to happen here because Burke wants to deal.

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Old
07-26-2005, 11:33 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsArea
No... I debated several times about Ribs' 65 pts of last season... I stated some factors that favorised Ribs to put those numbers... such as the way he was used on every first PP unit versus our lack of talents compared to what is coming this fall.. He also replaced Koivu while injured at some point in the season... Any second line center playing on the first PP unit will reach more points than others getting second PP unit time... Thats an important factor to consider... How much teams use 2 centers on the first powerplay wave? Numbers are'nt everything... What Im saying is that Pleks can bring more to the table talking about overall efficiency, thats all. Pleks is the type of player you can face any opponents' lines against, he will use his quickness, smart, intensity and skills to outwork and outplay the opposition.. A bit like Koivu if you see... Who would you rather have on your team, Koivu or Ribeiro? Ribs is slow and weak, you just cant match him against anyones... The way I see it, Julien is looking to have 3 strong and well balanced lines so that he can outplay the opposition.. We will have a better idea about Ribs' efficiency even strength this year when matched against top other teams lines... Be sure Plekanec will be ready to impress coatchs and fans if there are any let down by Ribs or if he just fail to outplay guys like Carter, Fisher, Richards (Brad or Mike), Parise, Peca, Briere.. even stregth to name a few...
I hope you're not expecting Plekanec to dominate physically at the NHL level; I think that's the one reason many of us doubt that he'll ever be a regular Hab center. Sure he's a bit better defensively than Ribeiro (he isn't great in his own zone either, especially trying to tie up his opponent), but there's no way that you can say he's better offensively. Second and first line players are normally your offensive players. Ribs has come a long way with his skating, strength and defence in the last four years and there's no evidence to suggest that he won't continue to improve those parts of his game, just as Yzerman, Sakic, Modano and many others did in their mid- 20's.

I get the feeling you're one of those guys that has been saying Ribeiro is "weak and slow" for the past five years, and even though it's obvious that he's a competent NHL skater now, especially laterally, you will alway dub him as "weak and slow."

It's fine to predict tha a career minor leaguer will be better than a present point producer - we'll see in a decade or so whehter you were right, because if he's all that and a bag of chips" as you seem to think so, then he'll be wowing us for years.

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Old
07-26-2005, 11:38 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzYNiNe
I have faith in Gainey to do what we need to get done to have a cup in Montreal for 06
If that's the case, Gainey had better get cracking on building up the D. It looks mediocre and lacks depth.

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07-26-2005, 11:40 PM
  #66
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I hope all of the posters here arent going to be too upset when the Habs draft Brule vice Ryan.... Ryan cant skate and in the new NHL speed is going to be the name of the game. BOOK IT

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07-26-2005, 11:50 PM
  #67
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This Ryan reminds me of Terry Ryan. Remember him?

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07-26-2005, 11:51 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey
If that's the case, Gainey had better get cracking on building up the D. It looks mediocre and lacks depth.
Exactely. He doesn't need to give up anything to move up to #2 and draft Johnson, with the new liberalized free agencey he will be able to address all the teams short comings over the next few years provided he manages his cap space properly. By the time Johnson develops into a regular NHLer defense may be the least of our problems. This guy isn't going to step in this year or even next year and produce. As far as this Plekanec thing goes, if he doesn't get traded, which he probably will, he's never going to be better than a third line center, I've seen him play also and if it weren't for Higgins showing up game in and game out he wouldn't even have got 64 points in the AHL never mind the NHL. Half the games I saw him in he was practically invisible, in no way did he dominate at that level. Hell, even Jason Ward won the MVP in the AHL, what the heck did Plekanec do?

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07-26-2005, 11:53 PM
  #69
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Book it...Is there a more annoying saying in existence? Book what? Book a gig? Book your mother? WTF?

Interesting that "West Coast Habs fan" would be an expert on an OHL player.

No; his skating does not suck. It sucks about as much as Rick Nash's. That is why he's a consensus top five pick. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it, and whatever you do, don't book it!

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07-26-2005, 11:55 PM
  #70
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book my balls bitc*es!

I'm a west-coast Habs fan too and I watched Brule play this year, he's inconsistent, I would be sad if we waist the 5th pick on him.

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07-27-2005, 12:11 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habruti!
Now If we center a trade arround Zednik then I hope its not just to draft higher then 5th but more to acquire there second.
Burke don't want a draft pick, but some player to fit some hole in the organisation. The bigest need for the Ducks is on the LW. Zednik have a small salary (1,8M) and Burke will need money to keep Federov in town. It's why I think he could be a good fit for them. You have to give more for a second pick, but it could be a good start.

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07-27-2005, 12:19 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fred2792
Burke don't want a draft pick, but some player to fit some hole in the organisation. The bigest need for the Ducks is on the LW. Zednik have a small salary (1,8M) and Burke will need money to keep Federov in town. It's why I think he could be a good fit for them. You have to give more for a second pick, but it could be a good start.
Agreed that it would take Zednik+ to acquire the duck's 2nd pick. The only thing I was pointing out is that people who say we will move from five to 2 by trading Zednik are suggesting things that would be realy bad for the organization... these two prospects (who ever is available at 5 and who ever will be picked at 2) are very close.

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Old
07-27-2005, 12:44 AM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey
If that's the case, Gainey had better get cracking on building up the D. It looks mediocre and lacks depth.
How is our D that bad? We gave up the same goals against last campaign as the Lightning I think they won the cup, not sure, my memory is awful

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07-27-2005, 01:22 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habruti!
Agreed that it would take Zednik+ to acquire the duck's 2nd pick. The only thing I was pointing out is that people who say we will move from five to 2 by trading Zednik are suggesting things that would be realy bad for the organization... these two prospects (who ever is available at 5 and who ever will be picked at 2) are very close.
Your right. And the interresting thing is that Burke don't want a draft pick. I don't really understand, maybe he think he could get a young star like Simon Gagne, but he could dream on...

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07-27-2005, 01:31 AM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fred2792
Your right. And the interresting thing is that Burke don't want a draft pick. I don't really understand, maybe he think he could get a young star like Simon Gagne, but he could dream on...
Let me quote a post I made earlier tonight, and highlight a different sentence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky
Burke: "We will shop this pick. We have a lot of kids ready to step in for us -- Corey Perry, Ryan Getzlaf, Joffrey Lupul and Ladislav Smid -- and if we can trade the (No. 2) pick outright for an established player who is a good fit for us, we will do it. And if we get offers to move down a few spots and we can get another (draft) pick, we can do that too. It's really wide open. We want to see what's out there."

http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=131498
It's like a three sentence quote that Burke gave, and he said that he'll move the pick for a player to help right away, or trade down, or anything pretty much.

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