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Old
12-11-2013, 05:35 PM
  #576
Portable Mink
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I think Ovi tries to play defensive position too much in the O-zone.
Backstrom and MoJo get down low and start a cycle but Ovi makes sure hes high in the zone and backpeddling and cant support the puckcarrier.

Its Backstrom's role to ensure he covers the C breaking out, not Ovi's.

Look at the way guys like Ward, Chimera, Erat & even Wilson SUPPORT the wall play. Ovi can do that, he just needs to stay in those plays longer instead of being hovering in no-mans-land where sure, he takes up space and can help on the backcheck, but it doesnt really have any major positives.

Backstrom is so good in protecting the puck and winning board battles. Mojo is starting to play with some of Nickys skills in these situations but when the two opposing defenders are helped out by the centre and a winger, its 2 on 4 because Ovi is covering the breakout instead of playing support. To me, thats got a lot to do with their lack of extensive zone time ending in Backstrom and Mojo goals.

Oates needs to tell him to play offense when were are in the O-zone, right now hes not sure when to commit down low and when not to.

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12-11-2013, 05:50 PM
  #577
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Portable Mink View Post
I think Ovi tries to play defensive position too much in the O-zone.
Backstrom and MoJo get down low and start a cycle but Ovi makes sure hes high in the zone and backpeddling and cant support the puckcarrier.

Its Backstrom's role to ensure he covers the C breaking out, not Ovi's.

Look at the way guys like Ward, Chimera, Erat & even Wilson SUPPORT the wall play. Ovi can do that, he just needs to stay in those plays longer instead of being hovering in no-mans-land where sure, he takes up space and can help on the backcheck, but it doesnt really have any major positives.

Backstrom is so good in protecting the puck and winning board battles. Mojo is starting to play with some of Nickys skills in these situations but when the two opposing defenders are helped out by the centre and a winger, its 2 on 4 because Ovi is covering the breakout instead of playing support. To me, thats got a lot to do with their lack of extensive zone time ending in Backstrom and Mojo goals.

Oates needs to tell him to play offense when were are in the O-zone, right now hes not sure when to commit down low and when not to.
That's very generous, lol.

IMO, he's thinking about how to be open for a shot once his teammates win the puck. Actually winning the puck takes a lot of energy, and he doesn't want to do it.

To some extent all goal-scorers try to stay at least somewhat fresh for offensive opportunities, but Ovi is pretty extreme in this..

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12-11-2013, 06:02 PM
  #578
Portable Mink
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If Ovi loses the puck in the O-Zone he almost exclusively ensures that he isnt caught out of position, he stands up in his skating style and glides towards and often over the blue line.

Yesterday, he gets on a roll, thinks he can score on every shift and stuck fat in the o-zone a lot more. sure we were down by a few goals which also contributes to this, but its something ive watched very closely this season.

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12-11-2013, 06:21 PM
  #579
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Portable Mink View Post
I think Ovi tries to play defensive position too much in the O-zone.
Backstrom and MoJo get down low and start a cycle but Ovi makes sure hes high in the zone and backpeddling and cant support the puckcarrier.

Its Backstrom's role to ensure he covers the C breaking out, not Ovi's.

Look at the way guys like Ward, Chimera, Erat & even Wilson SUPPORT the wall play. Ovi can do that, he just needs to stay in those plays longer instead of being hovering in no-mans-land where sure, he takes up space and can help on the backcheck, but it doesnt really have any major positives.

Backstrom is so good in protecting the puck and winning board battles. Mojo is starting to play with some of Nickys skills in these situations but when the two opposing defenders are helped out by the centre and a winger, its 2 on 4 because Ovi is covering the breakout instead of playing support. To me, thats got a lot to do with their lack of extensive zone time ending in Backstrom and Mojo goals.

Oates needs to tell him to play offense when were are in the O-zone, right now hes not sure when to commit down low and when not to.
You are absolutely right and most people will probably think that you're crazy saying Ovi plays too defensively. But the fact is that he is probably the worst player on the team in terms of winning board battles. Nick and Mojo are much more suited for being down low in the zone and grinding it out. Part of it is Ovi being lazy but he also realizes his weaknesses and is trying to help out by being in position defensively. Somebody has to do it on that line because there can't be three guys down below the goal line. This would result in so many odd man rushes the other way.

I wouldn't change anything because I would rather have Ovi at the top of the circles waiting for a pass or waiting to go on the backcheck rather than turning the puck over trying to cycle and trying to win board battles.

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12-11-2013, 07:08 PM
  #580
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Thanks for posting this.
You're welcome.

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x2

Grind-it-out Oates needs to understand that with more work put into transition and passing execution the game doesn't have to be about dump & chase all the time. That combined with lazy/poor gap control are tough obstacles to overcome when facing opponents that can sustain a higher pace.

It's partially why the top line hasn't been overly effective. Not enough of an emphasis on tempo and creating space.
For what it's worth, my data show that Tampa Bay is a very strong neutral zone team. Teams haven't been able to gain the zone with control very frequently against them.

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I could be wrong but isn't tampa bay playing a trap? thought I heard locker refer to it several times. doesn't trap dare you to try and carry in and create turnovers for transition the other way? isn't the recommended way to beat the trap to dump the puck in deep and not turn over the puck?
Tampa bay allows 24.44 entries with possession against per game on average. That's the second fewest in the Atlantic division after Detroit. 43.48% of the entries against them are controlled - fourth best in the division. You're not wrong in saying that they limit clean entries into their zone. On the flip side, they allow only 0.32 shot attempts per dump-in on average, which is quite low. Teams haven't had significant success playing dump-and-chase against them.

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12-11-2013, 07:37 PM
  #581
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Panik suspended 2 games.

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12-11-2013, 08:01 PM
  #582
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For what it's worth, my data show that Tampa Bay is a very strong neutral zone team. Teams haven't been able to gain the zone with control very frequently against them.
How does Washington stack up? I'm guessing fairly poor in both areas and likely worse at prevention overall.

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12-11-2013, 08:08 PM
  #583
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How does Washington stack up? I'm guessing fairly poor in both areas and likely worse at prevention overall.
No pressure backchecking... You'll see it all game, they just wave their stick around and the only times they try to make contact is when the player dumps the puck in.

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12-11-2013, 08:38 PM
  #584
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Panik suspended 2 games.
Wow, I didn't think that hit was worth anything more than the 5 minute major. Does he have a prior history or what?

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12-11-2013, 08:43 PM
  #585
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Wow, I didn't think that hit was worth anything more than the 5 minute major. Does he have a prior history or what?
Its because the Capitals are a rich team in comparison to the Lightning.

They also suspend Phaneuf for 2 for a lot more innocent boarding of a guy who fell half a second before contact was made whereas Panik pushed through his arms on a player that was leaning and stumbling.

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12-11-2013, 09:11 PM
  #586
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You're welcome.



For what it's worth, my data show that Tampa Bay is a very strong neutral zone team. Teams haven't been able to gain the zone with control very frequently against them.



Tampa bay allows 24.44 entries with possession against per game on average. That's the second fewest in the Atlantic division after Detroit. 43.48% of the entries against them are controlled - fourth best in the division. You're not wrong in saying that they limit clean entries into their zone. On the flip side, they allow only 0.32 shot attempts per dump-in on average, which is quite low. Teams haven't had significant success playing dump-and-chase against them.
I really liked what I saw from Tampa. They moved the puck well and pressure the other team strongly. I wish we had Cooper instead of Oates

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12-12-2013, 08:56 AM
  #587
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
I could be wrong but isn't tampa bay playing a trap? thought I heard locker refer to it several times. doesn't trap dare you to try and carry in and create turnovers for transition the other way? isn't the recommended way to beat the trap to dump the puck in deep and not turn over the puck?

changing lanes. I am loving the main board fighting over whether Ovechkin is good or not. That is just a one dimensional player now and all he can do is shoot. Maybe things aren't as bad as we thought if league wide fans cant except that Ov is working on another Hart Trophy season.....oh, yea....and now the Hart Trophy is a joke because Ov wins it.
Tampa was trapping. In fact they've been a trapping team for the most part of the last decade and reached the pinnacle of clogging up the neutral zone with Boucher.

More and more teams will have to switch to the trap and they are. That is a strong reason why scoring is going down as the neutral zone is being clogged up and it becomes a dump and chase game of chess.

Lame

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12-12-2013, 04:11 PM
  #588
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Tampa was trapping. In fact they've been a trapping team for the most part of the last decade and reached the pinnacle of clogging up the neutral zone with Boucher.

More and more teams will have to switch to the trap and they are. That is a strong reason why scoring is going down as the neutral zone is being clogged up and it becomes a dump and chase game of chess.

Lame
Trapping? IDK about that, to me it looked like they were playing keep away and if not for the guy with a cannon on PP this game would've been lost.

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12-12-2013, 04:14 PM
  #589
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I didn't really notice the trapping in person, just that they clogged up the passing lanes really well in the neutral zone. Just seemed like smart efficient defensive coverage.

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12-12-2013, 07:26 PM
  #590
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Originally Posted by Langway View Post
How does Washington stack up? I'm guessing fairly poor in both areas and likely worse at prevention overall.
I track entries for the Atlantic division, so unfortunately I don't have much data for Washington. That game against the Lightning was one of the very worst even-strength performances I've tracked all season, so there's that.

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Originally Posted by Koized View Post
I really liked what I saw from Tampa. They moved the puck well and pressure the other team strongly. I wish we had Cooper instead of Oates
My findings really flatter Tampa Bay. Their numbers are second only to Detroit in the Atlantic. It's not only their defence against clean entries, but also their ability to gain the offensive zone with control that makes them a strong neutral zone team.

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12-12-2013, 08:29 PM
  #591
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If people should covet a coach, it should be the one doing good things with the Predators AHL affiliate.

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12-12-2013, 08:48 PM
  #592
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If people should covet a coach, it should be the one doing good things with the Predators AHL affiliate.
Why wouldn't we covet a coach who is doing good things in the NHL with arguably a weaker roster than ours? Especially considering he did great things in the AHL already?

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12-12-2013, 09:26 PM
  #593
SimplySensational
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Why wouldn't we covet a coach who is doing good things in the NHL with arguably a weaker roster than ours? Especially considering he did great things in the AHL already?
Tampa always starts hot. The coach I'm referring to is Evason.

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12-12-2013, 09:52 PM
  #594
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Tampa always starts hot. The coach I'm referring to is Evason.
Seriously???

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12-12-2013, 11:13 PM
  #595
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Seriously???
Next Caps coach.

Caps alumni? Check.
No NHL head coaching experience? Check.
What do you need more from a candidate?

He could have have a plan also.

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12-13-2013, 04:25 PM
  #596
SimplySensational
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Seriously???
Why the **** not? His team is the 2nd best defensive team in the AHL with the drafting skill of Poile helping and on top of all the injury problems the Predators have.

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