HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

2013-14 Adirondack Phantoms (AHL), ECHL, NCAA, Juniors, International, etc. part II

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-04-2014, 11:59 AM
  #226
BillyShoe1721
Terriers
 
BillyShoe1721's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 17,233
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to BillyShoe1721
Quote:
SWE have distributed the ice time around, but if anyone has been a shutdown pair for them, it's been Norell-Hagg.
-Corey Pronman

BillyShoe1721 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 12:15 PM
  #227
Funf
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 1,215
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Appleyard View Post
He is actually scoring at exactly the same pace as Brodin did in the SHL at his age... with far less minutes and no PP time.

Brodin:

GP:49 G:0 A:8 P:8 PIM:14 SOG:56 Hits:5 +: 22 -:16 +/-:6 TOI: 17:27

Hägg:

GP:33 G:1 A:4 P:5 PIM:16 SOG:32 Hits:38 +:11 -:14 +/-:-3 TOI: 13:08

Their skating is similar, both very good, maybe Brodin has the edge, and Hägg has the better shot and is far, far nastier and more physical.

That being said Brodin has better puck skills and was far more consistent at that age, he is also more cerebral at reading the game (although Hägg is good, Brodin is pretty special in that regard, the guy has insane IQ, I think I remember his brain and decision making tests at the combine were just off the charts, like the best by far and it was not even close) and I think will always be the better player.
I've never heard about these kinds of tests at the draft! Does anybody have any more reading on them? What they are, how they work, players results?

To be perfectly honest about Hagg, I'm really excited about the kid, but his hockey IQ worries me a bit. In my opinion, it's the most important quality a player can have. They say the best players think the game ahead 2, even 3 steps, and all that jazz. He might be one of those guys that has all the tools (like Coburn, Pitkanen) but can't put it all together, all of the time. Unlike Pitkanen, however, his coaches say he listens very well.

I will say, that I haven't actually seen him play a full game yet, so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt! Just basing this off of what I've read.

Funf is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 12:26 PM
  #228
Stizzle
Registered User
 
Stizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,131
vCash: 500
Laughton and Ristolainen going nose-to-nose at center ice during the pregame warmups was pretty classic. Laughton brings the crazy.

Stizzle is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 12:29 PM
  #229
Appleyard
HFB Partner
 
Appleyard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manc/Shef/Utrecht
Country: Netherlands
Posts: 15,755
vCash: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf View Post
I've never heard about these kinds of tests at the draft! Does anybody have any more reading on them? What they are, how they work, players results?

To be perfectly honest about Hagg, I'm really excited about the kid, but his hockey IQ worries me a bit. In my opinion, it's the most important quality a player can have. They say the best players think the game ahead 2, even 3 steps, and all that jazz. He might be one of those guys that has all the tools (like Coburn, Pitkanen) but can't put it all together, all of the time. Unlike Pitkanen, however, his coaches say he listens very well.

I will say, that I haven't actually seen him play a full game yet, so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt! Just basing this off of what I've read.
Watching Hagg quite a bit in the SHL (I think I have seen 12 of his games this year, defo in the 10-14 range.) I would say his IQ is quite good when he is 'on'... the problem is he sometimes just seems to switch off, if that makes sense.

They do a Wingate test, then a Vo2max test, then a Neuro-cognitive test straight after them I believe. They do a whole bunch more than that though.

Here are the top results from the 2012 one:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=80653

and 2013:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/blogpost.htm?id=18183

Appleyard is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 12:37 PM
  #230
Funf
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 1,215
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Appleyard View Post
Watching Hagg quite a bit in the SHL (I think I have seen 12 of his games this year, defo in the 10-14 range.) I would say his IQ is quite good when he is 'on'... the problem is he sometimes just seems to switch off, if that makes sense.

They do a Wingate test, then a Vo2max test, then a Neuro-cognitive test straight after them I believe. They do a whole bunch more than that though.

Here are the top results from the 2012 one:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=80653

and 2013:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/blogpost.htm?id=18183
Gotcha. I guess that's par for the course with an 18 year old playing in a men's league. Hopefully he keeps improving.

Thanks for the link. Interesting results. I see Morgan Rielly leading the draft in the right hand grip category. I guess it's true what they say about the leafs being a bunch of jerk-offs.

Edit: No surprise seeing Stolarz leading in the wingspan category, and nice to see Morin leading in peak power!

Funf is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 12:50 PM
  #231
Appleyard
HFB Partner
 
Appleyard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manc/Shef/Utrecht
Country: Netherlands
Posts: 15,755
vCash: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf View Post
Gotcha. I guess that's par for the course with an 18 year old playing in a men's league. Hopefully he keeps improving.

Thanks for the link. Interesting results. I see Morgan Rielly leading the draft in the right hand grip category. I guess it's true what they say about the leafs being a bunch of jerk-offs.

Edit: No surprise seeing Stolarz leading in the wingspan category, and nice to see Morin leading in peak power!
Yeh, Stolarz should become a boxer with that span! His VO2 max results are pretty impressive as well!

Laughton is also there for push strength.

Morin in top ten for VO2 and vertical jump as well.

Just read Cousins destroyed the Wingate fatigue test when he did it (1st overall), and Noebels was great on the VO2 max as well. (8th)

Appleyard is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 01:59 PM
  #232
Psuhockey
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,488
vCash: 500
From the hockey news:
Quote:
Robert Hagg, Philadelphia (41st in 2013) – Very cool out there. Top PK unit, also plays physical. Cleared out the crease on a Valentin Zykov chance, then popped him one for good measure. Was usually out there against Grigorenko, especially on a four-minute penalty-kill to start the third period. Also saw duty in the last minute as the Swedes fought off a penalty and a Russian onslaught with Vasilevski pulled for an extra attacker. Plays for Modo in Sweden.
http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/wo...russia-report/

Also this:
Quote:
While Grigorenko had his chances for Russia, his line was shut out by a defense led by Robert Hagg

Psuhockey is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 02:14 PM
  #233
Jtown
Registered User
 
Jtown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Fairfax, Virginia
Posts: 17,858
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stizzle View Post
Dude, I'm not sure what game you were watching. I thought Hagg was a bad ass today. He played with tons of piss and vinegar. Hagg was super physical all game. It was really encouraging. I loved when the Russian got called for goalie interference and Hagg stood over the Russian and jawed at him.
he is physical as hell, but thats about it.

I was more impressed with him last year.

Jtown is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 02:25 PM
  #234
flyershockey
Registered User
 
flyershockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,226
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
he is physical as hell, but thats about it.

I was more impressed with him last year.
He was a 17 year old playing easier minutes. A year later, and he's playing some of the most difficult minutes in the tournament. Nearly everyone else, professionals that cover the tournament included, disagrees with you. You must be onto something though.

flyershockey is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 02:43 PM
  #235
Jtown
Registered User
 
Jtown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Fairfax, Virginia
Posts: 17,858
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyershockey View Post
He was a 17 year old playing easier minutes. A year later, and he's playing some of the most difficult minutes in the tournament. Nearly everyone else, professionals that cover the tournament included, disagrees with you. You must be onto something though.
So he is Sweden's best shutdown guy. I see that. But when has he ever been advertised as such? He has been touted as a jack of trades master of none and has shown so far this tournament that is not true.

Listen im not one to bash a prospect but im not going to throw praise blindly. IN this tournament so far i have been really unimpressed with him although i do like his physicality.

Jtown is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 02:46 PM
  #236
moorg
The Secret Weapon
 
moorg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Nj
Country: United States
Posts: 226
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
So he is Sweden's best shutdown guy. I see that. But when has he ever been advertised as such? He has been touted as a jack of trades master of none and has shown so far this tournament that is not true.

Listen im not one to bash a prospect but im not going to throw praise blindly. IN this tournament so far i have been really unimpressed with him although i do like his physicality.
Well I don't really know what you are looking for in him but i think he's done fairly well.

moorg is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:01 PM
  #237
flyershockey
Registered User
 
flyershockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,226
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
So he is Sweden's best shutdown guy. I see that. But when has he ever been advertised as such? He has been touted as a jack of trades master of none and has shown so far this tournament that is not true.

Listen im not one to bash a prospect but im not going to throw praise blindly. IN this tournament so far i have been really unimpressed with him although i do like his physicality.
It's pretty clear that he's been tasked with playing in a conservative defensive role.

flyershockey is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:03 PM
  #238
Flyerss
Registered User
 
Flyerss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 5,527
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
So he is Sweden's best shutdown guy. I see that. But when has he ever been advertised as such? He has been touted as a jack of trades master of none and has shown so far this tournament that is not true.
Quote:
A very all-round two-way defenseman. Hägg is capable of playing a pure defensive role, logging big minutes on the penalty kill, as well as contributing offensively and being valuable in power play situations. Furthermore, Hägg has good size and strength, very good vision, a heavy release and is also a mobile defenseman. Some consistency issues, although Hägg usually makes smarter plays while playing in the big league, rather than in the juniors. Lots of potential (EP, 2013)
http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=27397

Flyerss is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:24 PM
  #239
bennysflyers16
Registered User
 
bennysflyers16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 26,347
vCash: 890
Hagg was a beast out there. Looked like a strong mean version of kimmo.

bennysflyers16 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:34 PM
  #240
Broad Street Elite
Registered User
 
Broad Street Elite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,996
vCash: 500
Will be really interesting to see if the Flyers try to transition Morin, Hagg or Gostisbehere to the NHL next season. The case can certainly be made for each returning to their current situation, but any of the 3 could come out with an exceptional camp and make the team really re-evaluate. I suppose our offseason plans impact this greatly... If we add a defenseman to replace Mez or Kimmo (or re-sign kimmo), there isn't a spot to let a kid play a lot.

If we were handicapping, who is the best shot to make an NHL transition in 2014-2015? Morin > Gostisbehere > Hagg?

Unlikely for all 3, but the Flyers are notoriously unpredictable about their prospects.

Broad Street Elite is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:36 PM
  #241
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 16,903
vCash: 500
Unless Morin has a very disappointing camp and preseason next year, I think he is on the big squad. I am in the minority but it seems like the Flyers liked what the saw in the kid and he took advantage of the ice time he got in the preseason. Ghost needs a year in the AHL and Hagg will play in Sweden next year are my guesses.

Prongo is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:36 PM
  #242
jabba2
GoulBourne Supremacy
 
jabba2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 588
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Will be really interesting to see if the Flyers try to transition Morin, Hagg or Gostisbehere to the NHL next season. The case can certainly be made for each returning to their current situation, but any of the 3 could come out with an exceptional camp and make the team really re-evaluate. I suppose our offseason plans impact this greatly... If we add a defenseman to replace Mez or Kimmo (or re-sign kimmo), there isn't a spot to let a kid play a lot.

If we were handicapping, who is the best shot to make an NHL transition in 2014-2015? Morin > Gostisbehere > Hagg?

Unlikely for all 3, but the Flyers are notoriously unpredictable about their prospects.
I think Alt would make the team before those 3. Hagg right now has the most NHL ready size of the 3 you mentioned. He weights over 200. For that reason if they had to choose one of them it would likely be Hagg.

jabba2 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:39 PM
  #243
jabba2
GoulBourne Supremacy
 
jabba2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 588
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
Unless Morin has a very disappointing camp and preseason next year, I think he is on the big squad. I am in the minority but it seems like the Flyers liked what the saw in the kid and he took advantage of the ice time he got in the preseason. Ghost needs a year in the AHL and Hagg will play in Sweden next year are my guesses.
I hope they dont rush any of them up for the sake of being the best choice for a 6th dman.

jabba2 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:50 PM
  #244
FLYguy3911
Registered User
 
FLYguy3911's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 15,203
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Will be really interesting to see if the Flyers try to transition Morin, Hagg or Gostisbehere to the NHL next season. The case can certainly be made for each returning to their current situation, but any of the 3 could come out with an exceptional camp and make the team really re-evaluate. I suppose our offseason plans impact this greatly... If we add a defenseman to replace Mez or Kimmo (or re-sign kimmo), there isn't a spot to let a kid play a lot.

If we were handicapping, who is the best shot to make an NHL transition in 2014-2015? Morin > Gostisbehere > Hagg?

Unlikely for all 3, but the Flyers are notoriously unpredictable about their prospects.
First, I would say I'm not counting on any of them in my opening day lineup. Assuming he signs and plays out the rest of the season in Adirondack, I would pick Gostisbehere if I was pressured into picking one. Hagg I would say is the least likely. Morin could step in next year, if he tears it up down the stretch and carries it over into training camp, but I think another year in the Q, playing big minutes in all situations, would be huge much like Laughton this season.

Reason I would pick Gostisbehere is because I have a feeling this team is going to be in need of a puck mover and a guy to provide offense from the backend. There's not much skill back there as it is now, add to that the possibility of Timonen not coming back, and the uncertainty of finding someone in FA/trade.

FLYguy3911 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 03:52 PM
  #245
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 16,903
vCash: 500
Morin has 1 goal-1 assist for Rim through the first period of the game today against Val-D'or. Offense is picking up hopefully. I want a couple multi point games from him, then people will really start to notice him.

Goal was on the PP.

Prongo is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 04:01 PM
  #246
SolidSnakeUS
Registered User
 
SolidSnakeUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pipersville, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 36,952
vCash: 500
Got a link to the game?

SolidSnakeUS is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 04:14 PM
  #247
Broad Street Elite
Registered User
 
Broad Street Elite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
Morin has 1 goal-1 assist for Rim through the first period of the game today against Val-D'or. Offense is picking up hopefully. I want a couple multi point games from him, then people will really start to notice him.

Goal was on the PP.
23 points in 31.3 games. Really coming in big.

Broad Street Elite is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 04:18 PM
  #248
Broad Street Elite
Registered User
 
Broad Street Elite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
First, I would say I'm not counting on any of them in my opening day lineup. Assuming he signs and plays out the rest of the season in Adirondack, I would pick Gostisbehere if I was pressured into picking one. Hagg I would say is the least likely. Morin could step in next year, if he tears it up down the stretch and carries it over into training camp, but I think another year in the Q, playing big minutes in all situations, would be huge much like Laughton this season.

Reason I would pick Gostisbehere is because I have a feeling this team is going to be in need of a puck mover and a guy to provide offense from the backend. There's not much skill back there as it is now, add to that the possibility of Timonen not coming back, and the uncertainty of finding someone in FA/trade.
I agree that it most likely is and should be none of the above, but found it interesting to consider because the 3 players are so vastly different (different countries, leagues, size, style, rounds of selection, etc). All three are clearly progressing, but play in wildly different conditions, so I wanted to see who people thought was the closest today.

Broad Street Elite is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 04:37 PM
  #249
BillyShoe1721
Terriers
 
BillyShoe1721's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 17,233
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to BillyShoe1721
The Flyers won't leave a roster spot open going into training camp with the hope that one of them plays well enough to earn it. There will be six experienced NHL defensemen on the roster. We've got four under contract already, and Gus as an RFA. I don't think any of them deserve to be on the team next season.

BillyShoe1721 is offline  
Old
01-04-2014, 04:38 PM
  #250
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 123,855
vCash: 756
I think Hågg gets another year, I still like him better than Morin, but that's not to say I don't think Morin is good/


The Flyers will try to shoehorn Morin onto the NHL roster next year. They didn't want to send him back this year.

__________________
Philadelphia's Real Alternative
(ynotradio.net)

My 50 Favorite Albums of 2015

"I wonder if Norstrom has Forsberg's spleen mounted on his wall." - KINGS17
GKJ is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:59 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2016 All Rights Reserved.