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Sportsnet News: Zubov re-signs with DAL

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07-31-2005, 09:11 PM
  #26
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well first of all, is that a reliable source? i havent seen that listed anywhere else. dallasstars.com said the contract was indisclosed. second of all its not way too overpriced. he was one of the best 3 players on the stars last year.

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07-31-2005, 09:14 PM
  #27
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Here's why he got this type of money.

"Since the start of the 1993-94 season, Zubov ranks third among all NHL defensemen in points with 575 (trailing only Brian Leetch, 628, and Nicklas Lidstrom, 625) and is the only active defenseman to have posted 40-plus points and 30-plus assists for nine consecutive seasons.

Zubov, 35, has played in 627 games for Dallas over the course of eight seasons and ranks second among defensemen in franchise history in both assists (303) and points (385), and fifth among blue-liners in games played. Among all players in franchise history, Zubov ranks eighth overall in assists, 10th in games played and 12th in points. "

http://www.dallasstars.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=2978

He's a much, much more effective player than most give him credit for. He took a 1/3 reduction in pay from his last salary ($2 million). I don't know why people thought he'd sign for much less. Will he be worth $4 million in 3 years? Perhaps. But he doesn't play an overly physical/speed-based game that makes me think he's going to physically have problems as he ages.

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07-31-2005, 09:18 PM
  #28
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He's probably one of the top-5 defensive FA's available (Gonchar will probably get $4-$4.5 million, though I wouldn't put it past teams to offer him less because he's never won anything). Neidermayer will probably get $5-$5.5 million.

Again, the top-end players aren't going to drop much. It's the third/fourth liners, the backup goalies and the second/third d-men that are going to drop significantly.

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07-31-2005, 09:19 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starsman93
well first of all, is that a reliable source? i havent seen that listed anywhere else. dallasstars.com said the contract was indisclosed. second of all its not way too overpriced. he was one of the best 3 players on the stars last year.
you do know that teams are not allowed to disclose contract information? That information always comes the agents or NHLPA. Check the DMN or FWST.

Like Kritter pointed out he is a much more effective player than people give him credit for. Because he's not a big flashy player with a high profile personality I think most people don't realize how good of a player he is. I have watched him make fools out of the other team because of the slick moves he makes. With the new NHL era, the offensive defensemen will be much more important than the big banging defensemen. Zubie is rarely out of position, almost is never hurt or out of a game, and logs a ton of minutes.

Each team places priorities on certain players. SOme teams pay out the nose for their goalies (NJ, Toronto, etc.), others put on their forwards (Colorado, etc). Dallas has choosen to spend their money on Zubov. I don't think that's a mistake. On the ice he is much more important than Modano.

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07-31-2005, 09:25 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
Here's why he got this type of money.

"Since the start of the 1993-94 season, Zubov ranks third among all NHL defensemen in points with 575 (trailing only Brian Leetch, 628, and Nicklas Lidstrom, 625) and is the only active defenseman to have posted 40-plus points and 30-plus assists for nine consecutive seasons.

Zubov, 35, has played in 627 games for Dallas over the course of eight seasons and ranks second among defensemen in franchise history in both assists (303) and points (385), and fifth among blue-liners in games played. Among all players in franchise history, Zubov ranks eighth overall in assists, 10th in games played and 12th in points. "

http://www.dallasstars.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=2978

He's a much, much more effective player than most give him credit for. He took a 1/3 reduction in pay from his last salary ($2 million). I don't know why people thought he'd sign for much less. Will he be worth $4 million in 3 years? Perhaps. But he doesn't play an overly physical/speed-based game that makes me think he's going to physically have problems as he ages.
I just really believe we would have been better served to let him hit the UFA market, with a solid contract offer from us in hand. Instead, we bid against ourselves which is never a wise move. Let him go get some contract offers and i think youd see him end up signing for less than he did.

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07-31-2005, 09:25 PM
  #31
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But he's 35 and only decent defensively. Plus it sets the Stars back a fair chunk, don't they only have eight or so guys under contract anyway? With about a twenty-two million dollar payroll? I'm glad Dallas gave him that much and not my team. Ozolinsh got too much, and so did Zubov in my opinion.

As mentioned above, if he would've heard what some other teams were prepared to offer him, I believe he could've got signed for less. I don't see many other teams offering that much.

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07-31-2005, 09:27 PM
  #32
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turgeon was bought out so we have 21 mill left well 17 after this

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07-31-2005, 09:28 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neelynugs
why are you clapping? the stars just overpaid IMO
Big time. It'll hurt them in the long run, especially the no trade clause.

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07-31-2005, 09:30 PM
  #34
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I just posted this under the Stars thread, but you didn't see it.

One - it puts the Stars at about $32 million with 20 players under contract if the QOs are accepted.
Two - for "NHL ready" guys, it puts them at 15 players for about $28.5 million if the guys who were QOs today sign at about what they qualify for.

What they lack for NHL ready guys - backup G, 3-4 third/fourth line wingers (a scoring winger would be nice, but I'd rather bring up a prospect), 1-2 centers (fourth line), 1-2 defensemen (in the vein on Sweeney from last season).

That's really, really doable. I'd love to see them sign Modano for less, though with this signing that's a little less likely to happen. But it doesn't put them in a real bind.

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07-31-2005, 09:34 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
I just posted this under the Stars thread, but you didn't see it.

One - it puts the Stars at about $32 million with 20 players under contract if the QOs are accepted.
Two - for "NHL ready" guys, it puts them at 15 players for about $28.5 million if the guys who were QOs today sign at about what they qualify for.

What they lack for NHL ready guys - backup G, 3-4 third/fourth line wingers (a scoring winger would be nice, but I'd rather bring up a prospect), 1-2 centers (fourth line), 1-2 defensemen (in the vein on Sweeney from last season).

That's really, really doable. I'd love to see them sign Modano for less, though with this signing that's a little less likely to happen. But it doesn't put them in a real bind.
Reasons I dont like the contract
1. Doesnt leave alot of room for Modano
2. we bid against ourselves
3. may have overpayed
4. No trade clause is a big no no with a salary cap
5. we've gotta sign turco and boucher next year and billy gs contract will still be on the books

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07-31-2005, 09:34 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txomisc
I just really believe we would have been better served to let him hit the UFA market, with a solid contract offer from us in hand. Instead, we bid against ourselves which is never a wise move. Let him go get some contract offers and i think youd see him end up signing for less than he did.
I don't believe that. It's something that could have happened, but I think there were enough teams looking for #1 defensemen that had cap space that they would have paid this much.

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07-31-2005, 09:38 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txomisc
Reasons I dont like the contract
1. Doesnt leave alot of room for Modano
2. we bid against ourselves
3. may have overpayed
4. No trade clause is a big no no with a salary cap
5. we've gotta sign turco and boucher next year and billy gs contract will still be on the books
1.) The Stars needs aren't at center, they're at defense. I'll deal with an Arnott/Barnes/Kapanen/veteran at center more than I'll deal with a Boucher/Klemm/Daley/Erskine/Belle/veteran at defense.
2.) So did the Ducks for Ozolinsh, and remember, he didn't get a raise here.
3.) Debateable, but I don't think so
4.) No trade clauses are how you sign him for less money than he originally wanted.
5.)Rumors are they're going to buy out Guerin next year and just deal with the $2.2 million hit for the next two seasons. Turco's salary won't go up much, nor will Bouchers.

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07-31-2005, 09:39 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
I just posted this under the Stars thread, but you didn't see it.

One - it puts the Stars at about $32 million with 20 players under contract if the QOs are accepted.
Two - for "NHL ready" guys, it puts them at 15 players for about $28.5 million if the guys who were QOs today sign at about what they qualify for.

What they lack for NHL ready guys - backup G, 3-4 third/fourth line wingers (a scoring winger would be nice, but I'd rather bring up a prospect), 1-2 centers (fourth line), 1-2 defensemen (in the vein on Sweeney from last season).

That's really, really doable. I'd love to see them sign Modano for less, though with this signing that's a little less likely to happen. But it doesn't put them in a real bind.
28.5 but dont we have a tentative self imposed cap of around 35? I think ive read that somewhere. Itd leave 6ish million to sign 8 players with one of them being modano for at least 4? wont work

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07-31-2005, 09:42 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txomisc
28.5 but dont we have a tentative self imposed cap of around 35? I think ive read that somewhere. Itd leave 6ish million to sign 8 players with one of them being modano for at least 4? wont work
Back up goalie - $500,000
4 fourth line wingers - $2 million total
2 veteran d-men - $1.2 million total

LEaves you at 22 players with about $2.5-$3 to sign Modano for. Will it happen? Not likely, but again, the Stars need d-men more than they need centers.

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07-31-2005, 09:43 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
I don't believe that. It's something that could have happened, but I think there were enough teams looking for #1 defensemen that had cap space that they would have paid this much.
I don't know about that. Maybe if he wasn't thirty-five. Maybe if he didn't care about the no-trade clause. He'll be thirty-eight when his contract ends. Without the no-trade clause this deal wouldn't seem as poor to me, but then again the salary may have been higher without it. What if his skills deteriorate or he begins to suffer chronic injuries in the future?

I'll just agree to disagree and quit putting down this contract. Lord knows Bob Clarke is destined to offer up a poor contract or two in the coming weeks as well.

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07-31-2005, 09:52 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
5.)Rumors are they're going to buy out Guerin next year and just deal with the $2.2 million hit for the next two seasons.
I was under the impression that buyouts that do NOT count against the cap were a one-time thing, last week. Going forward, any buyout would in fact count against the salary cap.

So, why would any team buy a player out from now on? I'm curious.

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07-31-2005, 09:57 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag68Vlady27
I was under the impression that buyouts that do NOT count against the cap were a one-time thing, last week. Going forward, any buyout would in fact count against the salary cap.

So, why would any team buy a player out from now on? I'm curious.
The Stars said they "couldn't afford" to buy-out Guerin and Turgeon this year (which is b.s., but that's another story), and that if they ran into cap trouble next year, they'd buyout Guerin (being the most expensive player) and just take the cap hit, which would be about $2.2 million a season.

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07-31-2005, 09:58 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
Back up goalie - $500,000
4 fourth line wingers - $2 million total
2 veteran d-men - $1.2 million total

LEaves you at 22 players with about $2.5-$3 to sign Modano for. Will it happen? Not likely, but again, the Stars need d-men more than they need centers.
Ok so move Arnott for picks and sign Modano for 4.5-5 with that leftover + arnotts potential salary.

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07-31-2005, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txomisc
Ok so move Arnott for picks and sign Modano for 4.5-5 with that leftover + arnotts potential salary.
*laughs* I wouldn't mind that.

But speaking of old and probably gonna lose his wheels... I'd say Modano is exponentially more of a risk to sign long-term than Zubov, based on where his skill set is.

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07-31-2005, 10:02 PM
  #45
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i wouldnt mind getting rid of arnott

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07-31-2005, 10:03 PM
  #46
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Overpayment, Ozonlish is 2.75 and Zubov is 4?

and at 3 years with a no-trader at that! *whistles*

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07-31-2005, 10:12 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
Back up goalie - $500,000
4 fourth line wingers - $2 million total
2 veteran d-men - $1.2 million total
If the figures you are using are true the Stars are in trouble.

Basically you are talking about signing 7 guys for a little above league minimum.
I am sure you will get alot of talented free agents with offers like that.

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07-31-2005, 10:17 PM
  #48
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Plain and simple every team has priorities and each teams priorities will be different. Phoenix is going to try and sign the Bullin Wall for $4M. Is that stupid? It would be if you don't have a decent team in front of him. Some teams are willing to pay Thorton and Iginla $7M is that stupid? It is if you have no defense and no goaltending. Simple truth is Zubie was Dallas's priority and not Modano. Modano's ON ICE production could be replaced, Zubie's couldn't. Zubie has played for Dallas for 8 seasons, I think he has earned his no trade clause. Most of the no trade clauses in Dallas also include a window which they can trade them, such as Guerins. There is normally a 6 week window they can be traded to teams on an approved list.

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07-31-2005, 10:20 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
If the figures you are using are true the Stars are in trouble.

Basically you are talking about signing 7 guys for a little above league minimum.
I am sure you will get alot of talented free agents with offers like that.
The back up goalie is more of a wish item. If none are available for near league minimum then can use one of the two decent kids they have in the system.

Don Sweeney signed the last two years for $500,000, no reason to think he wouldn't do that again. Same for Rob DiMaio. They will need to pay a little more for one of the d-men, but the rest can be had for league minimum. We are talking about 4th liners here, not the first line.

I also think the number of players we need is off. I don't think we need 4 - 4th line wingers, I think the Stars need 2 wingers, and that makes a big difference. Last I heard they had 20 players under contract for $28M.

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07-31-2005, 10:27 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
If the figures you are using are true the Stars are in trouble.

Basically you are talking about signing 7 guys for a little above league minimum.
I am sure you will get alot of talented free agents with offers like that.
But they don't need talanted FAs.

Goalies - Turco (need cheap backup)
Defense - Zubov, Boucher, Klemm, Daley, Erskine. They need two third pair d-men. The guy they had in that role last year made $550,000 which, with the rollback, is less than league minimum is now. So two guys in that vein would be fine.
Centers - Arnott, Barnes, Kapanen. A typical 1-2-3 punch. Need a fourth liner and a backup C. Would love to have Modano, but as Icey said, their on-ice concern rightly should have been Zubov.
Wings - Guerin, Lehtinen, Morrow, Miettinen, Ott, Svoboda. Needs - third/fourth line wingers. The wings in those roles in 03/04 (namely Rob DiMaio) made $550,000 which, as mentioned above, is now essentially the league minimum.

They don't need a lot of money to sign high-priced FAs because they don't have a lot of holes to fill. Because of that, I fail to see why 5-7 guys at league minimum is out of the question.

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