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Old
12-04-2013, 11:23 PM
  #1
predshabs
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David Legwand

I found this and thought it was interesting. What do you think?

McKenzie: "David Legwand of the Nashville Predators is not Thornton, but he is an effective member of the Predators and the first person ever taken by them in the entry draft many years ago. He's an unrestricted free agent at the end of the year and is looking for a new deal but there have been no negotiations thus far. He's a guy that wants to get locked up in Nashville but nothing's happened thus far."


http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=438137

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12-05-2013, 12:18 AM
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I'm not going to read too much into the Preds not negotiating as of yet. I have to believe that if Legwand is set on remaining a Pred, and isn't asking for a ridiculous contract, that he'll get locked up for his career. I think we need to consider moving one of Cullen or Gaustad, maybe both, out, if both Legwand and Fisher are staying around.

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12-05-2013, 03:31 AM
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triggrman
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Stand Pat Poile.

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12-05-2013, 04:01 AM
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I think we re-sign to have him retire the first career predator.

I do agree that atleast one other center will have to be moved next year because we're gonna have some young guys that are pushing to come up next season for sure. And if not, then we'll most definitely be looking for that no. 1 Center.

Paul Stastny anyone? Because that's my guess.

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12-05-2013, 07:21 AM
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It's funny we can't attract "big name free agents to come here" but guys enjoy playing here and want to re-sign here as well. I don't think there's a lot of truth in that to be honest. If that were the case, why did Rinne stay? Why is Legwand wanting to stay? Same thing with Fisher.

I hope they keep Leggy as he's a good team guy and is solid on the ice.

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12-05-2013, 08:50 AM
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It's funny we can't attract "big name free agents to come here" but guys enjoy playing here and want to re-sign here as well.
There could be a bit of a 'big fish in a small pond' thing going on here as well. There's no other team in the NHL that Legwand could join and still be as appreciated as he is in Nashville.

Now, I'm not a fan of any team, so don't take the following as a biased dig on the hockey club... but you have to admit that playing an incredibly boring defensive brand of hockey & losing hockey, is a terrible combination to attract offensively talented hockey players. Boring hockey can be sold to a city and free agents as long as it wins (see New Jersey), but if it's not culminating in strong playoff showings... well, would you want to play in that type of system?

I have to wonder how Barry Trotz still has a job with the team. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, but wouldn't it behoove the organization to give another coach, with a new (dare I say, exciting?) system a shot? You know, give the non-die-hards a reason to tune in for a change? I'm not saying they can't wait until the season is over, but it would be nice if something was done from the top on down before Filip Forsberg has lost the will to live.

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12-05-2013, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Smart Alek View Post

There could be a bit of a 'big fish in a small pond' thing going on here as well. There's no other team in the NHL that Legwand could join and still be as appreciated as he is in Nashville.

Now, I'm not a fan of any team, so don't take the following as a biased dig on the hockey club... but you have to admit that playing an incredibly boring defensive brand of hockey & losing hockey, is a terrible combination to attract offensively talented hockey players. Boring hockey can be sold to a city and free agents as long as it wins (see New Jersey), but if it's not culminating in strong playoff showings... well, would you want to play in that type of system?

I have to wonder how Barry Trotz still has a job with the team. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, but wouldn't it behoove the organization to give another coach, with a new (dare I say, exciting?) system a shot? You know, give the non-die-hards a reason to tune in for a change? I'm not saying they can't wait until the season is over, but it would be nice if something was done from the top on down before Filip Forsberg has lost the will to live.
Read my post in the negativity thread about this very thing.

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12-05-2013, 09:44 AM
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"Big fish in a small pond" is exactly right.

e.g. Martin Erat made $6m here in the height of his deal, and now is scrambling to stay relevant elsewhere.

Rinne was made the highest paid goalie in the NHL at the time, Gaustad was even given $3m+ to stick around.

I don't know if it's so much they "want" to stay, but they know their role here is amplified and that turns into $$$ for the players.

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12-05-2013, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
Read my post in the negativity thread about this very thing.
I did and I agree & understand completely.

It boggles my mind that the Predators rink still looks pretty full when I see them on Gamecenter... I do have to wonder if being in a non-traditional hockey market, with other teams in other sports having a much larger fan base (and media presence, I assume) means that the Predators management isn't being (properly, in this case) taken behind the woodshed often enough on sports stations/talk radio, etc.

I live in Vancouver, and clearly if they were in that type of situation, the fan/media pressure would have reached such a crescendo by now that no owners could possibly afford to ignore it. I dunno, as tacky as it may be, perhaps a 'Fire Trotz' campaign of some kind, including signs at the games, may be an extreme Preds-fans need to consider. Something has to give in Nashville, but hey, I've thought that for a while...

That said, most times I've visited the Predators board, I've seen a surprising number of posters perfectly happy with the direction the team is going... backing up Trotz's hockey philosophy and such. I just want to give them a shake and scream "Fun hockey is fun to watch!" until it finally sinks in... along with recommending some quiet affirmations where they repeat "I deserve to watch an exciting hockey team" in the mirror a few times each morning.

My point is perfectly illustrated by watching the rookie seasons of Tomas Hertl & Filip Forsberg, two youngsters I'm very high on whom I would consider pretty equal in the skills department. Sure, not every team can stick their rookie on a line with Thornton & Burns, but give the young rookie a chance to be a young rookie, let his confidence grow and don't stifle his creativity. I have zero doubt Hertl would be struggling just as mightly as Forsberg were he in the same situation. Forsberg could (should) be a star in a few years... but it all depends on how he's handled in his first couple seasons, and early on, it's been a downright failure. No less than a fireable offence.

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12-05-2013, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Smart Alek View Post

There could be a bit of a 'big fish in a small pond' thing going on here as well. There's no other team in the NHL that Legwand could join and still be as appreciated as he is in Nashville.

Now, I'm not a fan of any team, so don't take the following as a biased dig on the hockey club... but you have to admit that playing an incredibly boring defensive brand of hockey & losing hockey, is a terrible combination to attract offensively talented hockey players. Boring hockey can be sold to a city and free agents as long as it wins (see New Jersey), but if it's not culminating in strong playoff showings... well, would you want to play in that type of system?

I have to wonder how Barry Trotz still has a job with the team. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, but wouldn't it behoove the organization to give another coach, with a new (dare I say, exciting?) system a shot? You know, give the non-die-hards a reason to tune in for a change? I'm not saying they can't wait until the season is over, but it would be nice if something was done from the top on down before Filip Forsberg has lost the will to live.
Really?

I mean, the team hasn't even been "bad" for a full 82 game stretch, and made the playoffs 8 of 9 years before that, including 4 100+ point seasons. You make us sound like the Florida Panthers.

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12-05-2013, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
Really?

I mean, the team hasn't even been "bad" for a full 82 game stretch, and made the playoffs 8 of 9 years before that, including 4 100+ point seasons. You make us sound like the Florida Panthers.
My point is that they've appeared to peak, and now appear to be on a downward trend.

My overall point was that the style of hockey they've played for the latter half of the past decade is ONLY excusable (to me, as a hockey fan) if they were enjoying an incredible level of success. They haven't.

I know many of the die-hards will disagree with the following statement, but as a guy who likes hockey (and doesn't 'love' any one hockey club), I'd have been happier to watch even a slightly less winning hockey club that played in a somewhat entertaining style than what they've endeavoured to ice. There is no team in the NHL that currently avoids innovation and stifles creativity to the degree that Nashville does, and I wish the fans were a little more upset about it... that appears to be the only way it will ever change.

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12-05-2013, 10:30 AM
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Really?

I mean, the team hasn't even been "bad" for a full 82 game stretch, and made the playoffs 8 of 9 years before that, including 4 100+ point seasons. You make us sound like the Florida Panthers.
Exactly. I think what the team really is missing is "Focus". Some games they have it, others they seem to be lacking in that department. If they were focused every game I truly believe they would be a lot higher in the standings.

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12-05-2013, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Smart Alek View Post
My point is that they've appeared to peak, and now appear to be on a downward trend.

My overall point was that the style of hockey they've played for the latter half of the past decade is ONLY excusable (to me, as a hockey fan) if they were enjoying an incredible level of success. They haven't.

I know many of the die-hards will disagree with the following statement, but as a guy who likes hockey (and doesn't 'love' any one hockey club), I'd have been happier to watch even a slightly less winning hockey club that played in a somewhat entertaining style than what they've endeavoured to ice. There is no team in the NHL that currently avoids innovation and stifles creativity to the degree that Nashville does, and I wish the fans were a little more upset about it... that appears to be the only way it will ever change.

I will agree with the thought that the current system does result in this.

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12-05-2013, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Smart Alek View Post
My point is that they've appeared to peak, and now appear to be on a downward trend.

My overall point was that the style of hockey they've played for the latter half of the past decade is ONLY excusable (to me, as a hockey fan) if they were enjoying an incredible level of success. They haven't.

I know many of the die-hards will disagree with the following statement, but as a guy who likes hockey (and doesn't 'love' any one hockey club), I'd have been happier to watch even a slightly less winning hockey club that played in a somewhat entertaining style than what they've endeavoured to ice. There is no team in the NHL that currently avoids innovation and stifles creativity to the degree that Nashville does, and I wish the fans were a little more upset about it... that appears to be the only way it will ever change.
Um... Besides traditional market fans that have bias against us, Preds fans are more negative towards this team than anyone else. Not to say we don't like this team, but many of us are aware something needs to change.

You'll often see other fans praising or wishing they had the things we're griping about. I'm not saying we should be grateful and keep it all as is, but it's the truth.

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12-05-2013, 10:57 AM
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Um... Besides traditional market fans that have bias against us, Preds fans are more negative towards this team than anyone else. Not to say we don't like this team, but many of us are aware something needs to change.

You'll often see other fans praising or wishing they had the things we're griping about. I'm not saying we should be grateful and keep it all as is, but it's the truth.
I think what he is trying to say is the fans need to be more vocal about it with the media and at the games.

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12-05-2013, 12:18 PM
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Exactly. I think what the team really is missing is "Focus". Some games they have it, others they seem to be lacking in that department. If they were focused every game I truly believe they would be a lot higher in the standings.
Lack of focus is indicative of a younger group of core players... Hell when I was 18-20, I could barely focus on making a bowl of mac-and-cheese much less several hours of calculus, zoology, or chemistry! Plus I also liked to drink (often a lot) and have fun doing a multitude of stupid things at weird hours. In reality it took me till I was in my late-twenties to be able to not get hung up on a mistake, assume responsibility, and see a bigger picture. IMO that's what is happening and why it is so vexing. Plus I assume that we have a coaching staff that is having to provide more instruction to younger players in higher roles than years past, as well as direction. Being that that is usually the place of a developmental league like the AHL, I'm guessing that they may be over-complicating things to a degree and making the game more work instead of fun. The reality is that we have to wait for these kids to grow up enough and my guess is that we'll see Barry et al mentoring them through unless its obvious that he has 'lost' the room.

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12-05-2013, 12:28 PM
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Lack of focus is indicative of a younger group of core players... Hell when I was 18-20, I could barely focus on making a bowl of mac-and-cheese much less several hours of calculus, zoology, or chemistry! Plus I also liked to drink (often a lot) and have fun doing a multitude of stupid things at weird hours. In reality it took me till I was in my late-twenties to be able to not get hung up on a mistake, assume responsibility, and see a bigger picture. IMO that's what is happening and why it is so vexing. Plus I assume that we have a coaching staff that is having to provide more instruction to younger players in higher roles than years past, as well as direction. Being that that is usually the place of a developmental league like the AHL, I'm guessing that they may be over-complicating things to a degree and making the game more work instead of fun. The reality is that we have to wait for these kids to grow up enough and my guess is that we'll see Barry et al mentoring them through unless its obvious that he has 'lost' the room.
Yeah, this was my expectation going into the season, and I think the play has been indicative of that, lack of focus at times, lack of consistency game to game, mistakes that are typical of inexperienced teams. Very much a "growing pains" season, despite some of the veteran leadership have. I still think the team will make some strides by the time the season ends.

Thread has strayed pretty severely from the OP though. Still figure Legwand will be here for the duration.

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12-05-2013, 12:46 PM
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I think what he is trying to say is the fans need to be more vocal about it with the media and at the games.
My mistake. In that aspect, I agree. I thought he was implying we weren't aware or were okay with being mediocre.

I'm sure management knows at this point something needs to change. If the fans were to say so, I imagine that'd seal the deal.

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12-05-2013, 03:18 PM
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It boggles my mind that the Predators rink still looks pretty full when I see them on Gamecenter... I do have to wonder if being in a non-traditional hockey market, with other teams in other sports having a much larger fan base (and media presence, I assume) means that the Predators management isn't being (properly, in this case) taken behind the woodshed often enough on sports stations/talk radio, etc.
This hits the nail on the head. There's no pressure to perform in Nashville.

We're lucky enough hear to have coverage. The Preds get barely mentioned on local news. And if they do, its a quick score with one or two highlights and sometimes a standard soundbite from the locker room. The only paper in town has a writer that knows little to nothing about hockey and seems to not really care. He writes the standard fluff pieces with no insight or criticism. The bloggers seem to be very rah-rah and offer little criticism as well. No insight or real care from any of the media in town.

And the fan base isn't smart enough about hockey to either care or know and for the most part is just happy to have a team. We've been beaten over the head with the fact that we don't have the money to compete, so any win is considered a success.

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12-05-2013, 03:43 PM
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I'm just going to go ahead and vehemently disagree here. I live over 100 miles from Nashville. If I just wanted to watch hockey, there are two local options - the Huntsville Havoc (SPHL) and UAH Chargers (D1 university, WCHA). Neither of them are particularly great teams right now, but it's hockey. I can get to one of those games in about twenty minutes, while Nashville is about a two-hour drive.

But I'm still a Predators season ticket holder. Why? Because the games are fun. Yeah they lay an occasional egg but every team does that. They have a chance to win just about every game. They play a physical game that I appreciate, their defensive corps is solid and getting better every game (when they aren't all injured, anyway) ... it's fun for me to watch. If I didn't enjoy the games I wouldn't make the drive up to Nashville a dozen or so times every year during the regular season plus every playoff game.

If you can't enjoy watching these guys I don't know what to tell you. I wouldn't go to games and not enjoy myself.

Yeah, I want to see them build into a Cup-level team. I thought they were on a good track to do that until two summers ago, when everything seemed to implode. I think they're still getting their feet back under them from that. But the defense has a ton of talent. They're set in goal. The question marks are at forward, and I think Poile expected to be able to address that in the draft this year. Well they ended up with Jones instead and he's turning out to be a gem, but he doesn't help the team much up front. They're just going to have to keep trying to draft that game-breaking forward (or trade some defense for it, but that opens up more holes on the team at another position).

I still think they're only a player or two away from having an extremely solid team. Wilson seems to be coming alive lately. Maybe he's getting comfortable with his shoulders again and is getting back to the level he showed last season. Smith is also playing more like his old self. If those two can keep improving (and it's worth noting here that they're still young - they just turned 24 a couple of months ago) and Forsberg can develop, the three of them just might make up a legitimate scoring line in another year or two. That would be excellent, because Weber would still be in his prime and if the other defenders keep improving this could be a really good team.

But of course that remains to be seen.

Anyway, that was a really long-winded way to say that if I didn't enjoy watching the Preds play I wouldn't come to the games. I certainly wouldn't be a full season ticket holder over 100 miles away.


Last edited by MrJoshua: 12-05-2013 at 05:51 PM.
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12-05-2013, 03:57 PM
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This hits the nail on the head. There's no pressure to perform in Nashville.

We're lucky enough hear to have coverage. The Preds get barely mentioned on local news. And if they do, its a quick score with one or two highlights and sometimes a standard soundbite from the locker room. The only paper in town has a writer that knows little to nothing about hockey and seems to not really care. He writes the standard fluff pieces with no insight or criticism. The bloggers seem to be very rah-rah and offer little criticism as well. No insight or real care from any of the media in town.

And the fan base isn't smart enough about hockey to either care or know and for the most part is just happy to have a team. We've been beaten over the head with the fact that we don't have the money to compete, so any win is considered a success.
I think the team has a lot of the media in its hands. Most of the local MSM aren't knowledgeable enough to be critical, even if they wanted to. The team threatens to yank credentials for bloggers who post content too negative--essentially using the blogs as propaganda machines.

Poile and Trotz have been "pretty good" for the Predators, and have done a lot with a little at times. They've also done a little with a lot a few times. In most markets, I think there would have been a change a few times, but Trotz has a long leash with Poile, and Poile has a long leash with admittedly-not-hockey-savvy ownership.

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12-05-2013, 04:12 PM
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We're lucky enough hear to have coverage. The Preds get barely mentioned on local news. And if they do, its a quick score with one or two highlights and sometimes a standard soundbite from the locker room. The only paper in town has a writer that knows little to nothing about hockey and seems to not really care. He writes the standard fluff pieces with no insight or criticism. The bloggers seem to be very rah-rah and offer little criticism as well. No insight or real care from any of the media in town.

And the fan base isn't smart enough about hockey to either care or know and for the most part is just happy to have a team. We've been beaten over the head with the fact that we don't have the money to compete, so any win is considered a success.
Very very interesting, Stranger (and Preds33), this was what I assumed, but not living in Nashville, it's difficult to know what kind of coverage you're getting.

The most fascinating thing you mentioned was the 'just grateful to have an NHL team' meme, which I can totally empathize with, having been a Winnipeg Jets fan in my childhood. And that's exactly the feeling I get from 'MrJoshua's post just a short while ago. Joshua: if you enjoy watching this team now, you won't believe how much fun you'll have when they ice a team that is unequivocally entertaining!

You all can certainly find solace in the fact that you picked up the unquestionably greatest 4th Overall pick in many many years in Seth Jones, who along with F.F. should be perfect cornerstones to build a winner around... so long as they (Please Flying Spaghetti Monster!) axe the current front office staff.

The future could be, oh, so bright...

And thanks, ALL, for not jumping down the throat of an 'outsider' with some strong opinions.

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12-05-2013, 05:56 PM
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Frankly, I find your attitude insulting and demeaning. I've watched this team ice players like Radulov, Peter Forsberg, Paul Kariya... The list goes on. There were several years where Nashville had one of the highest scoring teams in the league. I know exciting hockey.

If the only thing that gets you excited is scoring, go watch basketball. And stop patronizing the rest of us by insinuating that we don't know enough about hockey to tell good from bad.

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12-05-2013, 08:23 PM
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I think the team has a lot of the media in its hands. Most of the local MSM aren't knowledgeable enough to be critical, even if they wanted to. The team threatens to yank credentials for bloggers who post content too negative--essentially using the blogs as propaganda machines.
Very interesting...


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Frankly, I find your attitude insulting and demeaning. I've watched this team ice players like Radulov, Peter Forsberg, Paul Kariya... The list goes on. There were several years where Nashville had one of the highest scoring teams in the league. I know exciting hockey.
Are you touting Alexander Radulov as a Nashville Predators success story?

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If the only thing that gets you excited is scoring, go watch basketball. And stop patronizing the rest of us by insinuating that we don't know enough about hockey to tell good from bad.
And THIS was the type of response I had initially feared, and the very reason I post as little as I do.

It's clear that everybody else who responded to me didn't feel as though I was patronizing them, and clearly that wasn't my intention. But then, you read what you wanted to read.

If it did nothing else, I do hope that by expressing your righteous indignation, you felt at least a little bit of happiness.

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12-05-2013, 08:41 PM
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Really?

I mean, the team hasn't even been "bad" for a full 82 game stretch, and made the playoffs 8 of 9 years before that, including 4 100+ point seasons. You make us sound like the Florida Panthers.

...You weren't here 11 years ago.

2002 was the absolute worst year in Nashville Predators history. It wasn't one consecutive season, but it was godawful. In fact, with the exception of that brief period from December 2002 through February 2003, the Predators were horrid for 14 months.

And during most of that time, Toof was out with injuries.

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