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Sather must decide: Is dealing Girardi best for Rangers?

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01-10-2014, 11:57 AM
  #601
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Originally Posted by free0717 View Post
We have little depth on the RH side. Just McIlrath. After that its taking lefties and forcing them to play the right side.
Allen is a skilled RD despite being a lefthanded shot. (Now, the fact that the Rangers have historically preferred righthanded shots at RD is a separate question.)

The Rangers have two guys who are near ready to play (neither at a top pairing level, but that's the sacrifice you make if you are retooling). They are Allen and McIlrath. The former can play both sides and the latter is a RD. (Interestingly, I personally believe that Allen is ready and McIlrath needs more work.) After that, they have Skjei, who is likely 1-2 years away, Noreau and Andersson who are 2-3 years away they make it, Graves and Donnay who are all 3-4 years away if they make it.

It's not phenomenal depth, but it's enough to trade 2-3 of Staal/Girardi/DZ (especially if you get some defensive assets back), IF you are willing to accept that this year and potentially next you will be out of contention as a result of retooling.

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01-10-2014, 12:17 PM
  #602
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Brown got less than $6M but he got the 8 year MAX. Brown negotiated the contract by himself with Lomabardi. Brown could have gotten more money per as a free agent over 7. LA gave him the security of an 8th year.

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01-10-2014, 12:24 PM
  #603
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it's upsetting to me that we (every year) get into the PO's with the mindset that "anything can happen" or "if Hank gets and stays hot"

What I would like to see is the New York Rangers heading into the PO's against any team and be able to say that assuming everyone (on both teams) plays to their capabilities we have a good shot at winning.

Similar to Boston and Pitt.

They can play each other 10 times in the PO's (everyone healthy) and I can envision each team winning 5 series each.

Each team has their strengths and weaknesses

We could play Pitt 10 times in the PO's and I would be shocked to take 2 series from them. Same with Boston.

Everyone else in the Eastern Conference are pretty much in the same boat as the Rangers.

Hope to have a super-human effort just to squeek by.

We have not the players nor the front office staff talented or capable enough to put together that team.

unfortunate

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01-10-2014, 12:31 PM
  #604
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I don't know if the "team" is underachieving but there are certainly "players" that are underachieving.

Putting the crazy schedule and new coach things aside we've had a few important players with some significant injuries. Nash. Staal. Hagelin. Callahan. Stepan has been slow to find his game since his holdout. Even a role player like Dom Moore's game is only now coming around after sitting out last year following the death of his wife. And of course Lundqvist was nicked up in October and hasn't been up to his usual Vezina standards. Which is putting it generously.

We've also had some players play above expectations. Zuccarello. Kreider. Talbot. Pouliot (lately anyway).

But I think there are more players capable of improving their game than not.

Out of Girardi, Callahan and Del Zotto, it is only Girardi that would be problematic to replace in the short term. And Girardi hasn't exactly been stellar this season.

If you can't sign Cally and Girardi to reasonable contracts then deal them. The teams record might improve regardless.

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01-10-2014, 12:40 PM
  #605
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
The Rangers have a habit of letting the end result of the season dictate their strategy. Most successful teams do not do that. They know where they stand every single day, and how each move they make fits into their plan. This team never seems to have a plan, or if they do, it never seems to extend beyond one calendar year.
That's cause upper management is interested in playoff revenue not winning per se. They will not miss the playoffs for two or three years to win a Stanley Cup. While the fan base would certainly take that deal. Year to the next early playoff exit year; that's how it rolls in Rangertown.

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01-10-2014, 12:44 PM
  #606
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I would consider trading Girardi or Callahan. Girardi is a top commodity because he is a RH defenseman who can shut down the other teams top LWs. There are a shortage in the league of this type of player. Trading him will depend on two items, 1. How much can we get back in return and 2. What will it take to sign him. If Girardi is asking for 7 years 42 million dollars and we can get a real good return say Emerson Etem and a first round pick from the Ducks, then I have to make this trade. If Girardi will sign for 5 years and somewhere south of 25 million dollars, then I really have to keep him because he will be real hard to replace. Its these variables that will ultimately decide if we keep or trade Girardi.

As far as Callahan goes, a lot of teams would love to have his combination of Grit, Goal scoring ability and leadership on the RW. He could fetch a real good package at the deadline. The Clarkson contract really drove up Callahans price. With Callahans injury history and the way he plays, I could not give him a 7 year deal. 5 year maximum at 5.5 million dollars per year. If we have to go north of that and longer than 5 years and the right trade package comes along, I would be on board for trading him.

The next month will decide if we trade these players. If the win against the Hawks was a stepping stone and if we gain enough traction to believe that we can contend, I hold on to these players and take my chances in Free Agency. If we continue the win one, lose one trend and both these players are asking for the moon then I would be on board to getting what we can get.
Not nearly enough considering that the Ducks pick will be really late and Etam is Kreider lite. Need to get more to move Danny to the Ducks. Let's start with Vatenan (sp.?)

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01-10-2014, 12:46 PM
  #607
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
I'm definitely not in favor of trading Boyle and I'm still on the fence about Cally.
Of course you're not

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01-10-2014, 12:54 PM
  #608
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Allen is a skilled RD despite being a lefthanded shot. (Now, the fact that the Rangers have historically preferred righthanded shots at RD is a separate question.)
The last 8 Stanley Cup winners have had an average of 32.8% of their games played by defensemen by right handed shooters. That's an average of less than two per game.


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01-10-2014, 01:03 PM
  #609
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
That's cause upper management is interested in playoff revenue not winning per se. They will not miss the playoffs for two or three years to win a Stanley Cup. While the fan base would certainly take that deal. Year to the next early playoff exit year; that's how it rolls in Rangertown.

Even if we stunk it up bad enough to get the 1st overall in 2015, I wouldn't put it past this teams management hierarchy to trade that pick, with Eichel and McDavid on the board, to a team for a $7m Ryan O'Reilly or aging Zetterberg; something stupid along those lines.

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01-10-2014, 02:07 PM
  #610
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Of course you're not
As a 4th line player, strictly that role, I think he's excellent.

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01-10-2014, 02:25 PM
  #611
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My favorite ranger. I would love him on the devils, and I think he would fit in nicely. Whatchu want?!

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01-10-2014, 03:12 PM
  #612
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wow this discussion has surely had a lot of nice contributions...very interesting...thanks

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01-10-2014, 03:16 PM
  #613
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Originally Posted by idrinkalone View Post
My favorite ranger. I would love him on the devils, and I think he would fit in nicely. Whatchu want?!
Gelinas pls

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01-10-2014, 03:20 PM
  #614
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Gelinas pls
lol you can't do that.

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01-10-2014, 03:23 PM
  #615
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lol you can't do that.
Ok how about just your '14 1s...nvm sry

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01-10-2014, 03:28 PM
  #616
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Ok how about just your '14 1s...nvm sry
that stings. i would give up merrill

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01-10-2014, 03:55 PM
  #617
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The amount of assets it'd take to actually get the Rangers to trade Girardi to the Devils would be comical.

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01-10-2014, 04:03 PM
  #618
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The amount of assets it'd take to actually get the Rangers to trade Girardi to the Devils would be comical.
Yeah, nothing on the Devils really makes me want to jump up and down.

Maybe Kovalchuk + this years 1st?

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01-10-2014, 04:09 PM
  #619
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The Rangers haven't won anything with any of these guys. Its paying players because there is no else to pay. Boyle is living off his 10-11 season. Its his 5th year as a Ranger. One really good year. That's it. The Rangers can't find another player to play on the 4th line and PK. Girardi will be 30 soon. Is it really necessary to pay him until he is 37? Callahan is a small player. All of the injuries. Do you want to pay him until he is 36? Both players will command 7 years. They can get 7 as free agents. You have to figure Callahan wants at least $6M or more. Brooks mentioned $7M for Callahan if he gets to free agency. Is Callahan is worth $6M-$7M? 7 years at $42M-$49M. Really? Clarkson got $5.25M for 7 and he turned down more from Edmonton with the cap going down. Clarkson couldn't skate a 40 second shift without falling down until a few years ago and now he has a $5.25M cap hit. All of the Leaf people are asking themselves "why is Clarkson struggling?". Should they be surprised? Weiss with the Wings is another bad signing. Brown got 8 years and $47M from LA and that was viewed as a discount. He has 9 goals and 15 points in 44 games and the 8 years don't begin until next season. Good luck to them.
Boyle is a no brainer to let go. Take the pick or younger 4th liner

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01-10-2014, 04:23 PM
  #620
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Brown got less than $6M but he got the 8 year MAX. Brown negotiated the contract by himself with Lomabardi. Brown could have gotten more money per as a free agent over 7. LA gave him the security of an 8th year.
I agree Brown could've gotten more, but Brown is also painfully overpaid even if you disregard this season. He's been riding Kopitar's and Williams' coattails to that contract.

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01-10-2014, 04:53 PM
  #621
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I agree Brown could've gotten more, but Brown is also painfully overpaid even if you disregard this season. He's been riding Kopitar's and Williams' coattails to that contract.
Brown has played some good hockey too in his career. Steady 50 pts player.

Is he struggling this year or breakin down? If he is breakin down, Cally can break down.

I am not that afraid of Cally breaking down. Cally is skating well, he got a light body. No reasons to expect him to turn into a meatball like Drury. But he could of course break down.

My experience is just that hockey players don't break down that often... At the end of a 7-8 year deal, Cally is the same age as guys like Briere, Asham, Matt Cooke, E Cole and guys like that. Even if his play is a bit on the low side in terms of what he makes, he is on the other hand of course a legend in NY in terms of games played etc and makes up for it with his experience and locker-room presence.

As I've said many times, his AAV in year 1-4 scares me a lot more than how long the contract is. From my point of view, Id easily pack 2 years on to bring down the AAV in year 1-4.


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01-10-2014, 04:57 PM
  #622
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Brown has played some good hockey too in his career. Steady 50 pts player.

Is he struggling this year or breakin down? If he is breakin down, Cally can break down.

I am not that afraid of Cally breaking down. Cally is skating well, he got a light body. No reasons to expect him to turn into a meatball like Drury. But he could of course break down.

My experience is just that hockey players don't break down that often...
The term of that contract is the problem, I don't think Brown has more than a few good years left in him TBH.

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01-10-2014, 05:03 PM
  #623
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Brown has played some good hockey too in his career. Steady 50 pts player.

Is he struggling this year or breakin down? If he is breakin down, Cally can break down.

I am not that afraid of Cally breaking down. Cally is skating well, he got a light body. No reasons to expect him to turn into a meatball like Drury. But he could of course break down.

My experience is just that hockey players don't break down that often...
Even smaller ones that play big?

Mike Peca, Mark Parrish, Darcy Tucker, Chris Drury etc. all didn't last too far into their 30s.

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01-10-2014, 05:07 PM
  #624
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Boyle is a no brainer to let go. Take the pick or younger 4th liner
I think Boyle is a good asset and I wouldn't be in a hurry to get rid of him, but there does seem to be a risk that someone will give him 3rd line money and given how relatively easy it is to pick up a good 4th lineer nowadays for a cheap buck, you might not want to tie up 2m per in a 4th lineer.

Would love to have him back at 1.5m though.

We have just seen such a tremendous amount of changes on the roster in NY the last handful of years that we really should try to keep everyone we can.

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01-10-2014, 05:25 PM
  #625
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Even smaller ones that play big?

Mike Peca, Mark Parrish, Darcy Tucker, Chris Drury etc. all didn't last too far into their 30s.
But what is the reason for this, that the game changed tremendously after the 05' lockout and these guys were just beaten up by that time (Peca, Tucker and co surely were completely banged up by that time), or that the game is faster now? There was a big generational turnover there, a ton of decent D's went from being solid one year to hopelessly behind the play the year after the lockout (Pilon, Daneyko, Hatcher and co).

There just isn't much hitting out there, and the PO's are hardly the battles it used to be.

I don't know. I honestly would for example be a lot more afraid of Rick Nash breaking down due to how he skates plays than Ryan Callahan. Nash is really big and lives on his skating, seems to struggle a bit with literary adjusting his game. Someone like Jagr could be a sniper one year and a playmaker the next. As a scorer, you gotta score. Cally is more of a straight forward 2nd line winger who easily can adjust to a 2b role to a 3rd line role.

And I mean, if he does really break down, we all know he would "retire" by going to the doctor. I mean, lets say Cally plays 3 more Cally years here in NY, then really loose his skating and becomes a border line 12/13 forward, does anyone actually see him staying on the roster? All he needs to do is go to the doctor. Any player like that can point at a number of reasons for a doctor to collect the insurance money (like Drury did)..

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