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2014 NHL Draft (Hawks pick 27th)

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Old
02-15-2014, 01:01 AM
  #51
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Good article by SB Nation for NTDP prospects. Looks like Tuch didnt fare well at C.

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Alex Tuch(Boston College)- Tuch was a bit of a fish out of water this weekend, moving to the middle to play center rather than his normal wing, and it showed a bit. He was brutal in the face-off circle(1 for 10 on the game). Still, Tuch has really been rising up draft boards in recent months and it's easy to see why. He's an excellent skater for 6'3", has a really good stick, and showed some soft hands around the net to create a good scoring chance. Guys like that are really hard to find. He didn't produce a lot this weekend, but his numbers have been great on the season. He's definitely playing his way into the first round of the draft.

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02-15-2014, 10:47 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by HockeySensible View Post
Milano and Schmaltz are the guys I'd want if we're going with an American forward and they're available. Wouldn't be against Tuch, but would rather take Milano/Schmaltz if they're available.
Of those two I'd prefer Milano. If Schmaltz was available I'd love them to pick him too but I like Milano better. I don't think Milano and Tuch will fall to where the Hawks will be picking but Schmaltz could.

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02-15-2014, 02:02 PM
  #53
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I think our goalie prospects are not that hood in the pipeline...time we started drafting higher rated goalie prospects..gonna take 4 years or more from draft or 3 if a college Freshman this year in order to develop..cannot keep kicking the can down the road...no "A" goalie prospects in our system...Stan cannot ignore this sorespot in our pipeline. .Thatcher Demo of BC supposedly the only "A" rated NA draft eligible goalie for the first round...Stamp does like BC guys...so...?
OR we could trade our #1 pick down...and go double goalie stack on round two...loss of likely candidates for second founders and hopefully you hit the jackpot with onebof the 2 you select... Blake Weyrick and/or Edwin Minney from the USNTDP...Each Nagelvoort of the Michigan Wolverin es...or go Finland goalie...Kaapo Kahkkonen, and Kashmir Kaskisuo who plays im the NAHL. ..if we do not grab some of these you know other teams will and our pipeline will continue meh on goal...meh.. Time Standard acted and gambled on finding a young gem for the future net...I doubt CC.is.a Brodeir-like fixture as our#1 for the next decade let alone a decade and a half.. We must start building up better goalie quality in the pipeline..none.of.our pipeline goalie good enough for the show...ever. So gotta start re-building that poor spot of our pipeline. IT also does Rockford no good to have no top grade goalie..hard to be top AHL squad without one.


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02-15-2014, 02:21 PM
  #54
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I'm hesitant to take a goalie in the first round, let alone one that's playing college hockey. That's not a knock on the talent level of the college game but for my liking, goalies just don't play enough games at that level.

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02-15-2014, 05:30 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Blue Liner View Post
Of those two I'd prefer Milano. If Schmaltz was available I'd love them to pick him too but I like Milano better. I don't think Milano and Tuch will fall to where the Hawks will be picking but Schmaltz could.
I prefer Milano as well.. my hope is that his size will cause him to fall into the Hawks range come draft day.

But, if the Hawks manage to grab Schmaltz or have to 'settle' for him, I'd be happy with that too.

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02-15-2014, 05:44 PM
  #56
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Jonathan Quick - 3rd round pick
Craig Anderson - 3rd round pick (x2)
Ryan Miller - 5th round pick
Mike Smith - 5th round pick
Henrik Lundqvist - 7th round pick
Pekka Rinne - 8th round pick
Evgeni Nabokov - 9th round pick
Tim Thomas - 9th round pick
Jonas Hiller - undrafted
Antti Niemi - undrafted
Niklas Backstrom - undrafted
Sergei Bobrovsky - undrafted

I agree completely with Disgruntled.. you simply don't need to waste high picks on goaltenders. For every first round pick that goes on to become a great starter, you can find another in the 5th round or beyond, or even as an undrafted free-agent.

I'm not saying developing goaltenders doesn't matter.. but drafting goaltenders is a crapshoot within a crapshoot. Don't waste high picks.

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02-16-2014, 01:03 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Liner View Post
I'm hesitant to take a goalie in the first round, let alone one that's playing college hockey. That's not a knock on the talent level of the college game but for my liking, goalies just don't play enough games at that level.
I know that intellectually...but then do this thing where i convince myself that 'this year will be different' and we should grab a goalie early

luckily, Stan (and his dad) would never allow my bs to fly.

here's the link to the HF post containing the links to the NHL.com mock drafts (i'm so lazy!): http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...27&postcount=1

Kimelman has us picking Nikolaj Ehlers from the Mooseheads
Morreale has us picking Alex Tuch from NTDP
Hoffner has us picking Kevin Fiala from Swiss league.


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Old
02-16-2014, 12:50 PM
  #58
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Thread from 4/2012 about goalies and draft positions...

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1181197

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02-17-2014, 12:42 AM
  #59
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ugh... goalies are a crapshot, not sure if I want to waste a pick while you can always find a serviceable goalie

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02-17-2014, 08:33 AM
  #60
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I would have liked to take Fucale last year, but we didn't. We just used a 2nd round pick on Kent Simpson too. If we decide to burn another high pick on a goalie, it needs to hit. Can't keep throwing picks down the toilet. I'd rather just go the Euro route with goalies. You know what you're getting there. I remember Salak officially signed a 2 year deal when he came over. Do we have his rights until he hits a certain age? Does he have to finish the last year of that 2 year deal? Because ideally we can bring Raanta back next year, then slide Salak in the year after, if he still wants to play in the NHL, which he may not.

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02-17-2014, 02:28 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
I would have liked to take Fucale last year, but we didn't. We just used a 2nd round pick on Kent Simpson too. If we decide to burn another high pick on a goalie, it needs to hit. Can't keep throwing picks down the toilet. I'd rather just go the Euro route with goalies. You know what you're getting there. I remember Salak officially signed a 2 year deal when he came over. Do we have his rights until he hits a certain age? Does he have to finish the last year of that 2 year deal? Because ideally we can bring Raanta back next year, then slide Salak in the year after, if he still wants to play in the NHL, which he may not.
Salak and the Hawks mutually agreed to cancel his contract, so I doubt we have any more rights to him.

I wouldn't be surprised if Salak never plays in North America again. He seems to already have everything he's looking for in Sweden.

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02-17-2014, 02:44 PM
  #62
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Salak didn't impress anywhere near enough to just slot in on a NHL roster to begin with.

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02-17-2014, 04:08 PM
  #63
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Well why can other teams draft and find elite starting goalie...even if they overtook on them and never use them...only trade them layer? So of we are never to use first or second renders for the perceived top of a goalie crop...then short of once in a while luck or grabbing some free agent goalie or trading other assets for a goalie...your pipeline will always be short on providing you top level goalirss to push the bar on incumbents...also you never should trade unuseable skaters that you developed in your pipeline for goalies from other teams' pipelines unless say like Burner in Toronto,such traded for goalie becomes your starter or temporary back-up or unless you think that asset will after more minor league seasoning become such...in other words why trade say a Clenndening who you cannot fit into your lineup for some prize drafted goalie of another that's pipeline...just to stock the Rockgord net? You would not do that of the team getting Clenndening uses him immediately in their NHL lineup and he becomes a top player for them because they need a POD but maybe had overworked prized goalie talent and could afford to let one go elsewhere for need.. But unless that goalie you get back can push out CC and be better..if not immediately but after only another year developing in the AHL...well you could not contemplate such trade in the first place...If you saw a need to push CC for the starter job four years out...on that case you would not depleted pipeline skater assets for a goalie to stock Rockgord only for 4 more years...Rather it makes better sense to stockpile goalie talent via the draft. And develop it over four years...2 more in Jr. and another 2 in the AHL...then if you got lucky from getting other goalie who could challenge by acquiring them from free agency or college free agents or from lucky later round picks who emerge and then you do not need the Bernier you drafted 4 years earlier or more. .then you trade the they excess abundance for some other current need and or picks..My point is L.A. Drafted Bernier high when he was considered cream of a goalie crop...never used him as their elite starter for their long term because they got lucky with Quick...but had they not drafted a Jones then their pipeline would not have allowed them to give up Bernier. .but if all they had was nada in their goalie pipeline like we have with ours currently..then you see why 4 or more years outweigh need to be in a much better pipeline ready goalie situation of excess abundance. .you would only kick the can down the draft road again if you thought CC was a Broader and be our H of F goalie in net for 10-15 more years from now...but if you want a push on him in 4-5 years..you need to stockpile both quantity and cream of the crop quality via the draft starting NOW...you cannot kick that can down the road forever with insane statements like: since drafting goalie is a snapshot...never risk a high round pick on drafting one..because you willalways miss on the elite talents like a Price or Bernier or Raask...some elite goalie are drafted high.. You miss on such drafting late second or later. True some other goalirss who became lite starters were later round drafters..but the point is..not all elite goalie s come from only layer rounds...So the wisest goalie pipeline drafting strategy is to use both quality and quantity to cover the bases.. Draft a goalie early from the cream of the crop. .bit just in case do it again in round two..That way you get 2 shots to succeed from the top 5 goalies of a draft crop..Usually only 1 or 2 go in round one...you get one of those.. If 3 go in round 2...you get one of those. .So 2 chances to hit big within top 5 rated goalirss of a draft..but in case they both fail you draft another goalie round 4 or 5 and then another round 6 or 7...SURELY you hit a jackpot with one of the 4 selections...If not, fire your scouting staff because clearly they cannot recognize goalie talent in that case.. I think at some point we.must try doing this quality and quantity draft goalie strategy to fix our clearly woeful goaltending dearth of any foreseeable depth to challenge CC even as early as 4-5 years out...unless we use a revolving door or plan B of free agent quality goalie signing...From both a pipeline depth and quality point of view..I do not think most NHL teams will throw a similar situation to such a constant hope that free agent goalie saviour will bail them out if there is Nada from the pipeline to fill the net. Anyone who thinks any pipeline goalie we have in the minors college or juniors currently will ever be an elite starter in the NHL is crazy..The truth is our pipeline of goalie talent stinks and needs a drastic fix..the earlier we start fixing it the better. WE cannot keep passing on the best 4-5 rated goalie every draft and rely on just luck from later round selections in net.. We need both the consensus best at draft time plus luck in later round goalie picks. Both quality and quantity...as the best strategy to get at leather 1 top level goalie developing in our pipeline to be ready to push and be better than CC in 4 or 5 years...My friends...Stamp cannot keep kicking the dearth of top flight goaltending from below down the road again and again...just as in whatever round he takes a goalie.,he cannot afford to take only never will be NHL goalie kettle alone never will be elite NHL goalirss...ask any prospect expert andbyou will get analysis that goaltending is the weakest.link of the Blackhawks' pipeline..there are just no foreseeable goalie stars expected to come.out of our current system...We must start drafting such star goaltending talent. ..sooner than later.


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Old
02-18-2014, 07:57 AM
  #64
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We don't need an elite goalie (to challenge Crow or otherwise). It's pretty soon to write off the happy little dude in the ball cap as "will never reach NHL starter level". He's not going to be next Hasek, but it's very possible he'll be at least as good as Crow in three years.

The goalie pipeline has been poor in the past, with the only NHL starter drafted and developed in the last decade being Crow. Anderson was out of the org before he became a starter, and Niemi was undrafted and let go. I think this is part of the overall thin drafting of the Tallon years. As goalies take 4-5 years from the draft to make it, looking at the cohorts:

1999-2003: 7 goalies drafted. 2 starters (plus Leighton, lol).
2004-2008: 3 goalies drafted. 0 starters. 1 signed as UFA, 1 starter.
2009-2013: 5 goalies drafted, 1 signed as UFA. ? starters, Raanta most likely at least backup quality.

Crow was a 2nd rounder, Anderson a 3rd, and Niemi undrafted. Stan has combined the "draft lots, someone should stick" drafting of the pre-Dale years with the "top-up with more developed Finns" one.

There's an odd disparity where UFA goalies cost lots, but young goalies, even potentially elite ones, are available for not much (Bernier and Schneider traded for third-liner + backup +1M retained salary, and a first rounder. And 1B's Scrivens for a third, Khudobin let walk, Reimer will probably go for a bag of pucks at the draft.) We don't have any more development slots for goalies but if Simpson and Carruth don't look like much in another year or two, what would a goalie *prospect* cost if that's what guys with NHL backup experience under their belts go for?

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02-23-2014, 03:26 PM
  #65
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The Hawks should start trading picks - we have far too many prospects as it is toiling in Rockford that are NHL ready and would be playing in the NHL if the Hawks weren't so stacked.

Honestly the Hawks just have to worry about the bottom 6 and we have plenty of guys in the AHL that can fill those roles already.

I don't think the Hawks have many holes they need to fill at this point - upgrades are a better solution.

TT should be our 2nd line center next season so that is one hole solved.

I'm all for drafting and developing players but we just have too many prospects as it is, and it's a shame to see some NHL ready prospects go to waste because the Hawks just don't have a spot for them.

I think the Hawks should make some deals where they can upgrade their roster now and send some of these kids to teams where they will be NHL regulars.....

The Hawks are still a pretty young team and we have at least 5 more productive years out of guys like Hossa and Sharp, obviously 10 years (at least) out of Kane and Toews, TT hasen't even arrived and Saad isn't even close to his prime and is already a core piece, not to mention Shaw...

I would love to see the Hawks use some prospects or picks to upgrade against Bickell. That or even try to acquire a guy like Ryan Miller, because I'd take him over Crawford any day of the week (and I'm a huge Crawford fan)..

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02-23-2014, 05:51 PM
  #66
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The Hawks are pressed against the cap and they have one of the best rosters in the league already. What upgrading could you reasonably expect?

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02-24-2014, 12:46 AM
  #67
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Backup Goalie and 4th Line Wing

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02-24-2014, 01:55 AM
  #68
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Who, exactly, is "toiling away" in Rockford that's a legit NHL-ready player? You're not "toiling away" when you're still in your younger 20's with two or three seasons as an AHL'er.

There's also no such thing as having too many prospects, in my world. You do get to a point where you have to decide who's staying and who can be dished off to get you something in return but you can never have too many. They're assets, you can't have too many of them.

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02-24-2014, 03:11 AM
  #69
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The Hawks are pressed against the cap and they have one of the best rosters in the league already. What upgrading could you reasonably expect?
Exactly.

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02-24-2014, 07:29 PM
  #70
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That's one of the benefits of having a great team and a deep prospect pool.... you tend to have guys that could probably hack it already in the NHL developing in the AHL instead.

That's a problem that most of the league would love to have, believe me.

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02-24-2014, 08:46 PM
  #71
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That's one of the benefits of having a great team and a deep prospect pool.... you tend to have guys that could probably hack it already in the NHL developing in the AHL instead.

That's a problem that most of the league would love to have, believe me.
Exactly.. and yet, people are questioning why Bowman doesn't trade guys that are on the cusp, but not on the roster yet.

What could you expect to get back for Pirri or Morin? A 2nd round pick and a lesser prospect? Why would Bowman make that move?

What if someone on the roster suffers a devastating injury? Now, you wish you wouldn't have traded a guy like Morin, who could slide into the line-up and potentially contribute right away.

Having a whole bunch of guys being NHL (or near NHL) ready is a good thing, and their value won't magically shrink the longer they stay in the NHL.. especially within a season.

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02-25-2014, 11:35 AM
  #72
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Exactly.. and yet, people are questioning why Bowman doesn't trade guys that are on the cusp, but not on the roster yet.

What could you expect to get back for Pirri or Morin? A 2nd round pick and a lesser prospect? Why would Bowman make that move?

What if someone on the roster suffers a devastating injury? Now, you wish you wouldn't have traded a guy like Morin, who could slide into the line-up and potentially contribute right away.

Having a whole bunch of guys being NHL (or near NHL) ready is a good thing, and their value won't magically shrink the longer they stay in the NHL.. especially within a season.
Problem here is people exaggerate badly the notion of "rotting away" in the minors in relation to age, number of years of experience as pros, development; the entire big picture. You're not rotting if you're in your mid 20's or younger and in the minors, especially on a team like this. Does it kinda suck for them to be stuck there when they could be in the NHL with another club? Sure, but that's the business. You're also one phone call away from being on a Stanley Cup contending roster at any given time, especially in this organization when the AHL club is so close to home.

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02-26-2014, 12:51 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Blue Liner View Post
Of those two I'd prefer Milano. If Schmaltz was available I'd love them to pick him too but I like Milano better. I don't think Milano and Tuch will fall to where the Hawks will be picking but Schmaltz could.
If this was a bit over a year ago, there would be no way on Earth I would suggest taking Milano over Schmaltz. Milano early on was too perimeter of a player. more flash then substance. just looked like one of those guys that would be a great junior hot dog player but get hit by reality in college or the CHL when facing tougher competition.

I am happy to say that he has proven me wrong. the only issue is Milano will not be available by the time the Hawks pick. I feel pretty certain that all three of Larkin, Milano, and Tuch will be gone by pick #22-23. these guys are rising on everyone's radar, just don't see them around for us to pick. Schmaltz however has been hovering around the same space as he really hasn't lit up the USHL like say Kyle Connor (2015 eligible) has. Schmaltz has a chance to be around that 27-30 range where the Hawks will hopefully be picking again.

You really can't go wrong with Schmaltz. he is a smart cerebral player that oozes out skill. he needs to push harder and take his game to the next level but I think he will do that just fine at North Dakota next year. Bowman and co. love drafting these US kids that will take a few years to develop as we have nowhere to put them right now

Schmaltz makes a lot of sense if still on the board, but don't look past young Ryan Donato (son of NHLer Ted Donato) from Dexter HS in Massachusetts. Ryan is the top prep player from that region/country and is rising up the ranks to where some feel he won't be available come pick #30. His IQ and tenacity is out of this world. This is exactly the type of kid that Bowman loves to draft. A bit of the wall ranking wise, going to Harvard, has great bloodlines, and is considered one of the smartest players in his draft. At 6'1 175lb size isn't a concern. He isn't going to be a superstar (we have a team of those already) but he is a guy that can be a reliable 2nd to 3rd liner for a decade if it all clicks. AND HE PLAYS CENTER!

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02-26-2014, 02:00 PM
  #74
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If this was a bit over a year ago, there would be no way on Earth I would suggest taking Milano over Schmaltz. Milano early on was too perimeter of a player. more flash then substance. just looked like one of those guys that would be a great junior hot dog player but get hit by reality in college or the CHL when facing tougher competition.

I am happy to say that he has proven me wrong. the only issue is Milano will not be available by the time the Hawks pick. I feel pretty certain that all three of Larkin, Milano, and Tuch will be gone by pick #22-23. these guys are rising on everyone's radar, just don't see them around for us to pick. Schmaltz however has been hovering around the same space as he really hasn't lit up the USHL like say Kyle Connor (2015 eligible) has. Schmaltz has a chance to be around that 27-30 range where the Hawks will hopefully be picking again.

You really can't go wrong with Schmaltz. he is a smart cerebral player that oozes out skill. he needs to push harder and take his game to the next level but I think he will do that just fine at North Dakota next year. Bowman and co. love drafting these US kids that will take a few years to develop as we have nowhere to put them right now

Schmaltz makes a lot of sense if still on the board, but don't look past young Ryan Donato (son of NHLer Ted Donato) from Dexter HS in Massachusetts. Ryan is the top prep player from that region/country and is rising up the ranks to where some feel he won't be available come pick #30. His IQ and tenacity is out of this world. This is exactly the type of kid that Bowman loves to draft. A bit of the wall ranking wise, going to Harvard, has great bloodlines, and is considered one of the smartest players in his draft. At 6'1 175lb size isn't a concern. He isn't going to be a superstar (we have a team of those already) but he is a guy that can be a reliable 2nd to 3rd liner for a decade if it all clicks. AND HE PLAYS CENTER!
If all three of these guys were around by the time the Hawks picked (not going to happen) I'd take Larkin of all three. They could use a center in their system, let alone one in the power forward mold.

This is just talking of the American/USHL players, of course. Lots of good CHL and European guys available, too. I just know more about these guys because it's what I cover and watch the most.

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02-27-2014, 10:00 PM
  #75
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I wouldn't draft a power-forward centre. Ever notice that most end up wingers in the NHL? Not that it's a bad thing to have a skilled big man on the wings.. but if the Hawks take a centre, I'd prefer a guy that actually projects as a centre in the NHL.

K.Hayes and McNeill will/have moved to the wing. Teravainen may end up on the wing. Hartman and Danault both have played centre, but are currently playing wing with Plymouth and Rockford.

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