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Kings are still a very good team and will win lots of games soon

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Old
03-11-2014, 08:19 PM
  #76
Brad Doty
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Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
Not to be a Debbie downer as I have been happy with how they have been playing, but I want to see how they play against better teams like the ducks on Saturday. I mean, its not like they have had to play any really good teams during this run....
But that's kind of the point. Over a full season, things even out.

Over the stretch before the break, we had miserable travel against the top teams in the league. Now, it's evening out.

I'll take these wins because they've been mostly epic, dominating wins, not squeaking by, vs. teams we are supposed to beat. For a long time, we made even that hard on ourselves. So yes, for sure I want to see us vs. other top opponents, but for now, let's enjoy the progress.

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03-11-2014, 08:20 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by WhatTheFox View Post
As long as the road to the Cup doesn't go through Chicago again, LA looks poised to do good things.
Right now it appears it's going to have to go through St. Louis.

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03-11-2014, 08:31 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Brad Doty View Post
But that's kind of the point. Over a full season, things even out.

Over the stretch before the break, we had miserable travel against the top teams in the league. Now, it's evening out.

I'll take these wins because they've been mostly epic, dominating wins, not squeaking by, vs. teams we are supposed to beat. For a long time, we made even that hard on ourselves. So yes, for sure I want to see us vs. other top opponents, but for now, let's enjoy the progress.
Don't get me wrong, I'm enjoying how they are playing very much. I just want to see them do this against the top clubs to before being only worried about Chicago and such. Right now any of the top 6 seeds can win the cup and it would not be suprising.

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03-11-2014, 08:32 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Brad Doty View Post
LA Kings Motto: everyone laughed at my advanced stats so I became a god.

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03-11-2014, 09:01 PM
  #80
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I still stand by my post (#11 or whatever it is on the first page).

Dean needs to look at slightly tweaking and adapting the team over the summer. He needs to give Darryl and the guys in the room some different tools, that provide them alternatives.

I stand by my point that if they can add in some speed-skill element to the line up, then opponents will be hard pressed to play them. No longer can they play them knowing LA will simply play N-S and grind.

Trading for Gaborik and perhaps him re-signing is the start of this. To add in some pieces that fall out of the norm and prevent match-up issues. Right now with Gabby, Carter, Toffoli and I would include Pearson based on his last few games, this has added some good skill, speed and E-W play into the Kings game.

The team needs to get away from the mid-season slump the continue to languish through each year. I would rather see them play at a .600 clip, than having to tear off some steaks like now or 2012 to stay in the hunt or qualify for the playoffs.

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03-11-2014, 09:16 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by TwoForRoughing View Post
"But ... but ... but I thought advanced stats were useless."

Regression to the mean baby!
Love this "Regression to the Mean" crap. The Kings playing they way they were (slow breakout) makes them different them almost every other team. The Sutter slow break out with the lack of trying to generate decent scoring chances makes the Kings different then the "normal" hockey team. By not belonging to the population there is no reason to believe that there will be a regression to a mean. Get the Probability and Stats book out.

The bump in play is due to grinder out of the top 6. Pearson in a couple games and now Gaborik are keeping guys like Lewis/Clifford from destroying the offense. Also since the break the Kings have been pushing the puck up the ice faster trying to keep teams on their heals.

Now after the break the Kings are playing like an actual hockey team so they could now be considered as part of the population. The average shooting % may now apply. It was not a coincidence that the Kings shooting % was garbage and guys like Lewis were getting 15mins.

Don't celebrate too soon. In the last game Sutter got a 3 goal lead and then decided it was a great time to re-insert his head in his ass. I just love the Clifford/Richards/Carter line at the end. King/Lewis/Brown line was great and let a goal in. Pearson/Stoll/Toffoli was kind interesting but not at the cost of the other 2 lines. Guess the point is Sutters seems to have worked his issues out recently, but a regression to the mean as far as Sutter's coaching is concerned, is due.

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03-11-2014, 09:17 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
I still stand by my post (#11 or whatever it is on the first page).

Dean needs to look at slightly tweaking and adapting the team over the summer. He needs to give Darryl and the guys in the room some different tools, that provide them alternatives.

I stand by my point that if they can add in some speed-skill element to the line up, then opponents will be hard pressed to play them. No longer can they play them knowing LA will simply play N-S and grind.

Trading for Gaborik and perhaps him re-signing is the start of this. To add in some pieces that fall out of the norm and prevent match-up issues. Right now with Gabby, Carter, Toffoli and I would include Pearson based on his last few games, this has added some good skill, speed and E-W play into the Kings game.

The team needs to get away from the mid-season slump the continue to languish through each year. I would rather see them play at a .600 clip, than having to tear off some steaks like now or 2012 to stay in the hunt or qualify for the playoffs.
Where in the top9 do you see a lack of skill? And how in a capped world would you go about fixing this? Especially with the cap only potentially going to 68 next year.

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03-11-2014, 09:22 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
I still stand by my post (#11 or whatever it is on the first page).

Dean needs to look at slightly tweaking and adapting the team over the summer. He needs to give Darryl and the guys in the room some different tools, that provide them alternatives.

I stand by my point that if they can add in some speed-skill element to the line up, then opponents will be hard pressed to play them. No longer can they play them knowing LA will simply play N-S and grind.

Trading for Gaborik and perhaps him re-signing is the start of this. To add in some pieces that fall out of the norm and prevent match-up issues. Right now with Gabby, Carter, Toffoli and I would include Pearson based on his last few games, this has added some good skill, speed and E-W play into the Kings game.

The team needs to get away from the mid-season slump the continue to languish through each year. I would rather see them play at a .600 clip, than having to tear off some steaks like now or 2012 to stay in the hunt or qualify for the playoffs.
I agree with you with the Kings game needing to evolve and incorporate more skill and youth over time. Sutter doesn't seem like the coach that is going to be around for something like that. He has trouble integrating guys like Toffoli into the line up, and still favors grinders over skill players. It took Fraser getting waved to get Vey ice time.

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03-11-2014, 09:24 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Trolfoli View Post
Love this "Regression to the Mean" crap. The Kings playing they way they were (slow breakout) makes them different them almost every other team. The Sutter slow break out with the lack of trying to generate decent scoring chances makes the Kings different then the "normal" hockey team. By not belonging to the population there is no reason to believe that there will be a regression to a mean. Get the Probability and Stats book out.

The bump in play is due to grinder out of the top 6. Pearson in a couple games and now Gaborik are keeping guys like Lewis/Clifford from destroying the offense. Also since the break the Kings have been pushing the puck up the ice faster trying to keep teams on their heals.

Now after the break the Kings are playing like an actual hockey team so they could now be considered as part of the population. The average shooting % may now apply. It was not a coincidence that the Kings shooting % was garbage and guys like Lewis were getting 15mins.

Don't celebrate too soon. In the last game Sutter got a 3 goal lead and then decided it was a great time to re-insert his head in his ass. I just love the Clifford/Richards/Carter line at the end. King/Lewis/Brown line was great and let a goal in. Pearson/Stoll/Toffoli was kind interesting but not at the cost of the other 2 lines. Guess the point is Sutters seems to have worked his issues out recently, but a regression to the mean as far as Sutter's coaching is concerned, is due.
Funny how you could make a 4 paragraph rant against advanced stats have 75% of the paragraphs be wrong....

Denying advanced stats is like arguing cigarettes don't cause cancer....

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03-11-2014, 09:31 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
Funny how you could make a 4 paragraph rant against advanced stats have 75% of the paragraphs be wrong....

Denying advanced stats is like arguing cigarettes don't cause cancer....
Duck fans don't believe cigarettes cause cancer then...

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03-11-2014, 09:34 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
Funny how you could make a 4 paragraph rant against advanced stats have 75% of the paragraphs be wrong....

Denying advanced stats is like arguing cigarettes don't cause cancer....
They're not perfect, that's for sure, and the Leafs continue to defy the trend, but there was plenty to reason to believe that we were going to turn things around whether you believe in 'fancy' stats or not. I was still looking at the shooting % if nothing else. I don't care what you think about our system or how lifeless we were during that slump, there was no team in recorded history shooting THREE PERCENT. Lowest ever was around 6.5 off the top of my head. League average is near 10. No matter what kind of hockey you're playing, you're bound to get bounces even off crap.

I'm not even a big advanced stats guy, I'd like to think I'm more in the middle, but you can't just flat out deny some of the quantifications that the kings have in their favor. It also passes the eye test.

Edit: some simple homework for possession:

http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/20...ide-to-fenwick

http://theleafsnation.com/2013/10/23...e-of-corsi-did

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03-11-2014, 09:36 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
I still stand by my post (#11 or whatever it is on the first page).

Dean needs to look at slightly tweaking and adapting the team over the summer. He needs to give Darryl and the guys in the room some different tools, that provide them alternatives.

I stand by my point that if they can add in some speed-skill element to the line up, then opponents will be hard pressed to play them. No longer can they play them knowing LA will simply play N-S and grind.

Trading for Gaborik and perhaps him re-signing is the start of this. To add in some pieces that fall out of the norm and prevent match-up issues. Right now with Gabby, Carter, Toffoli and I would include Pearson based on his last few games, this has added some good skill, speed and E-W play into the Kings game.

The team needs to get away from the mid-season slump the continue to languish through each year. I would rather see them play at a .600 clip, than having to tear off some steaks like now or 2012 to stay in the hunt or qualify for the playoffs.
No argument here, I fully agree--and I think Gaborik was the missing element that allows them that. You can't play just crash-and-bang when your top 6 aren't really built for it anymore. That being said, I worry that mid-season slump is here for a while due to that grammy trip or whatever it is.

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03-11-2014, 10:22 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Ron View Post
Right now it appears it's going to have to go through St. Louis.
With their recent additions they're looking good, and I know they'd be due against us, but I still feel like LA has a good chance against them or any team for that matter save CHI. For whatever reason, they have our number.

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03-11-2014, 10:34 PM
  #89
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Gaborik is playing like he's hurt, not 100%.

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03-11-2014, 10:51 PM
  #90
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Gaborik is playing like he's hurt, not 100%.
He DID just come back from a broken collarbone. I can't imagine he did TOO much working out during that.

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03-11-2014, 11:11 PM
  #91
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If anything he's playing a bit hesitant. Like any player returning from injury would.

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03-12-2014, 12:28 AM
  #92
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If anything he's playing a bit hesitant. Like any player returning from injury would.
He's also playing for a new team and still getting to know his linemates which is probably another reason why he seems hesitant. I do see flashes of what he can bring to this team though. Once he gets the first goal, hopefully it will be like a domino effect.

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03-12-2014, 12:34 AM
  #93
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He's also playing for a new team and still getting to know his linemates which is probably another reason why he seems hesitant. I do see flashes of what he can bring to this team though. Once he gets the first goal, hopefully it will be like a domino effect.
Yeah, a lot of changes. Not worried. He's had a ton of great chances and that's all we can ask for.

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03-12-2014, 01:58 AM
  #94
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Yeah, a lot of changes. Not worried. He's had a ton of great chances and that's all we can ask for.
Yup.

And they are going to start going in soon.

And when that happens, the rest of the league is gonna be **** ting its pants.

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03-12-2014, 02:25 AM
  #95
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Where in the top9 do you see a lack of skill? And how in a capped world would you go about fixing this? Especially with the cap only potentially going to 68 next year.
I think the only way you improve it is with a kid like Pearson or Vey (players on ELCs) working their way into the lineup. To do that these kids are going to have to work hard in order to be trusted by Sutter in their own zone.

Pearson suddenly looks like he has found that switch and figured out that he has to move his feet away from the puck in order to be effective. If he can come in next season and secure himself a spot on the 4th line with the ability to move up in the lineup when injuries occur, the Kings will start to see more offense coming from the bottom six. That can only help.

It's going to be interesting to see how Gaborik does the rest of the way and if he re-signs with the Kings. I bet that Dean is already working on his sales pitch to ask Gaborik of a discount.

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03-12-2014, 06:54 AM
  #96
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Gaborik is playing like he's hurt, not 100%.
Gaborik is playing like Gaborik

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03-12-2014, 12:38 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
Where in the top9 do you see a lack of skill? And how in a capped world would you go about fixing this? Especially with the cap only potentially going to 68 next year.
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I think the only way you improve it is with a kid like Pearson or Vey (players on ELCs) working their way into the lineup. To do that these kids are going to have to work hard in order to be trusted by Sutter in their own zone.

Pearson suddenly looks like he has found that switch and figured out that he has to move his feet away from the puck in order to be effective. If he can come in next season and secure himself a spot on the 4th line with the ability to move up in the lineup when injuries occur, the Kings will start to see more offense coming from the bottom six. That can only help.

It's going to be interesting to see how Gaborik does the rest of the way and if he re-signs with the Kings. I bet that Dean is already working on his sales pitch to ask Gaborik of a discount.
K17 is on the mark. i'm not saying they don't have skill, but raising the skill level higher is needed. they have historically been a poor % shooting team and this year they continue to struggle.

the addition of the "kids" are going to raise this skill set team wide, while being able to fit in under the cap. it is part of the cap era and how a team needs to operate. the addition of Gaborik is going to bring this higher as well.

this team has enough vet leadership to put the "kids" in the line up and cover them. will they make mistakes? yes. it is part of the learning process. Sutter needs to just keep faith and know the sooner they overcome the 'rookie mistakes' the sooner he will have a deeper and better line up to work with.

having the ability to slide in Pearson, Toffoli, or Vey if needed raises the Kings skill level. it brings a bit more speed compared to some of the players they've iced the past few seasons it different situations.

where i think more impact will be felt is IF Sutter gives them PP time. this dramatically improves the PP2 unit, by adding skill on the forwards they lacked at times. now suddenly Sutter has more skilled forwards for the PP than he can put on the ice.

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03-12-2014, 12:58 PM
  #98
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But that's kind of the point. Over a full season, things even out.

Over the stretch before the break, we had miserable travel against the top teams in the league. Now, it's evening out.

I'll take these wins because they've been mostly epic, dominating wins, not squeaking by, vs. teams we are supposed to beat. For a long time, we made even that hard on ourselves. So yes, for sure I want to see us vs. other top opponents, but for now, let's enjoy the progress.
I posted something on that yesterday.

The Kings percentages were SO BAD during January, it had to regress back to the mean. There was just no way it would be that bad the remainder of the season. Things definitely even out.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Jason...ages/179/58594

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03-12-2014, 02:45 PM
  #99
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Gaborik is playing like he's hurt, not 100%.
When we got Carter he didn't even register a point until his 4th game with the team. And granted that was a 2 goal night. So we aren't even to that point until tomorrows game.

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03-12-2014, 03:04 PM
  #100
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When we got Carter he didn't even register a point until his 4th game with the team. And granted that was a 2 goal night. So we aren't even to that point until tomorrows game.
Just observation on my part. It took Williams a while too, granted I think he was "more hurt" than Gaborik.
Not worried.

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