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Old
02-24-2014, 09:17 AM
  #951
FLYguy3911
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Originally Posted by GingerFetish View Post
Sign MSL, put em with Vinny and Schenn and have 2 amazing lines.
He's not a FA until next year.

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02-24-2014, 09:17 AM
  #952
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Adding a 38 year old forward with a substantial cap hit is not the answer to the Flyers problems. A lot of people in this thread deluding themselves into thinking we are close to being a contender. Why would St Louis even want to go to a playoff bubble team like Philly?
Because he is willing to go to the New York Rangers it seems who is sitting 1 point ahead of us with the same amount of games. He also has ties with Richards and Vinny from here. It's not that far fetched to think he wouldn't mind coming here if he is on the block.

He would be a major upgrade on our first line, even over Voracek though. It would also allow us to spread the offense around a little more with Voracek on the second line with Schenn.

I also think 5.625 for St Louis is a bargain. Not a substantial cap hit.

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02-24-2014, 09:19 AM
  #953
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
People say this team isn't ready to make a run (I agree) but they are reluctant to move pieces to attempt to upgrade.
Read's a great versatile forward we can slot in on pretty much any line in any situation. MSL's obviously better than him 1 for 1, but how long would we hold on to him?

He doesn't address our biggest need at D. We could use an upgrade there this season, but they're a serviceable group for now. They would look pretty ugly next season without Timonen though, so I think any major moves should be focused there.

Adding MSL doesn't make us real contenders for this season, and doesn't set us up for a run in the future.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:20 AM
  #954
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I would give up Laughton for Kul. How much would we need to add though?
Wouldn't do Laughton for Kulikov, perhaps for Gudbranson. Would be Laughton +.

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02-24-2014, 09:21 AM
  #955
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Why is MSL demanding a trade?

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:22 AM
  #956
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Why is MSL demanding a trade?
Apparently because he wasn't selected to TC originally and can't trust Yzerman anymore.

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02-24-2014, 09:22 AM
  #957
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Why is MSL demanding a trade?
Rumor has it he is miffed about not being selected originally to the Sochi team.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:25 AM
  #958
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I don't get the we don't need more old players with big cap hits argument here. St. Louis is still good, and 5.6 isn't a huge cap hit, and its gone in one year.

My problem is the "who are we trading for him" not the player or his contract.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:27 AM
  #959
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Originally Posted by Zod View Post
Read's a great versatile forward we can slot in on pretty much any line in any situation. MSL's obviously better than him 1 for 1, but how long would we hold on to him?

He doesn't address our biggest need at D. We could use an upgrade there this season, but they're a serviceable group for now. They would look pretty ugly next season without Timonen though, so I think any major moves should be focused there.

Adding MSL doesn't make us real contenders for this season, and doesn't set us up for a run in the future.
Everyone knows the Flyers need to bring in a upgrade on defense. This is no secret, it is just who is avaiable and for what price. If it comes down to it, would you rather have Buff, Macdonald, Daley or Martin St Louis. I think it is quite an easy answer from my perspective.

I also think Daley is the best option for the Flyers to get a puck moving dman, and he won't cost nearly as much as the other two. I think he could be had even while trading for St Louis. I have seen some people say they don't think the Flyers will be extremely active during the deadline but circumstances change. When certain players become available I have no problems trying to make a splash.

The real search for an upgrade on d starts in the summer.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:27 AM
  #960
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I don't get the we don't need more old players with big cap hits argument here. St. Louis is still good, and 5.6 isn't a huge cap hit, and its gone in one year.

My problem is the "who are we trading for him" not the player or his contract.
Matt Walker and Mez to make up for the sins of Holmgren's past.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:34 AM
  #961
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
Everyone knows the Flyers need to bring in a upgrade on defense. This is no secret, it is just who is avaiable and for what price. If it comes down to it, would you rather have Buff, Macdonald, Daley or Martin St Louis. I think it is quite an easy answer from my perspective.

I also think Daley is the best option for the Flyers to get a puck moving dman, and he won't cost nearly as much as the other two.

The real search for an upgrade on d starts in the summer.
Thing is, Daley really isn't much of a puck-mover. He's competent with the puck and capable of making a decent outlet, but he's never produced offensively the way he did in juniors. In that regard, the other two are better fits perhaps (though MacDonald is hardly more proven), though I agree that Daley is the most cost-effective option of the three.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:36 AM
  #962
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Just looking at what Iginla returned from Pitt...

1st, Kenneth Agostino and Ben Hanowski

Would a slightly better package get an older, but still signed, St. Louis?

1st + Akeson/similar forward + Laughton? I don't usually attempt trade proposals but if MSL really wants out I think that's a little better value than Calgary got.

Any thoughts?

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:38 AM
  #963
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Originally Posted by Jack de la Hoya View Post
Thing is, Daley really isn't much of a puck-mover. He's competent with the puck and capable of making a decent outlet, but he's never produced offensively the way he did in juniors. In that regard, the other two are better fits perhaps (though MacDonald is hardly more proven), though I agree that Daley is the most cost-effective option of the three.
I was just really talking about his first pass ability and mobility. He isn't an offensive type guy who racks a bunch of points up but effectively moves the puck well.

Like you said, the price for the other two will be ridiculous probably. Before, Staples said the price for MacDonald was a 2nd+5th, but who knows where that will go when the deadline approaches.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:44 AM
  #964
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Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
Just looking at what Iginla returned from Pitt...

1st, Kenneth Agostino and Ben Hanowski

Would a slightly better package get an older, but still signed, St. Louis?

1st + Akeson/similar forward + Laughton? I don't usually attempt trade proposals but if MSL really wants out I think that's a little better value than Calgary got.

Any thoughts?
Theoretically MSL could handcuff the Lightning since he is demanding a trade, while having a NMC. He can choose where he wants to go, to a point. That lowers MSL's value that the Bolts can get for him.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:47 AM
  #965
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Just remembered the whole Iginla Bruins and Pens fiasco. Disregard ^

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:54 AM
  #966
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I wouldn't deal anything of significant value for MSL. I like the idea of adding him to this team, but not at the price he would likely cost. No way we give up our top pick PLUS our top prospect for a guy that will be here for one more season and then likely retire. If this team was closer to a Cup, I would be cool with it, but MSL does not put us over the edge. Gets us closer, for sure, but not close enough to warrant that kind of deal from this team.

If this were for a younger winger that would be here a while or for a stud defenseman, that's a different story. But as good as MSL is, he's here realistically only one year guaranteed with only a slight possibility of more than that. Not worth the risk given where this team is ATM.

If there was some other move in the mix to bring in a stud D-man as well, that's a different story. Or a larger trade involving TB like MSL+Hedman for Schenn, Laughton, First and whatever else. That's a different story. But I don't see that happening...wouldn't make sense for TB.

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Old
02-24-2014, 09:57 AM
  #967
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I wouldn't deal anything of significant value for MSL. I like the idea of adding him to this team, but not at the price he would likely cost. No way we give up our top pick PLUS our top prospect for a guy that will be here for one more season and then likely retire. If this team was closer to a Cup, I would be cool with it, but MSL does not put us over the edge. Gets us closer, for sure, but not close enough to warrant that kind of deal from this team.

If this were for a younger winger that would be here a while or for a stud defenseman, that's a different story. But as good as MSL is, he's here realistically only one year guaranteed with only a slight possibility of more than that. Not worth the risk given where this team is ATM.

If there was some other move in the mix to bring in a stud D-man as well, that's a different story. Or a larger trade involving TB like MSL+Hedman for Schenn, Laughton, First and whatever else. That's a different story. But I don't see that happening...wouldn't make sense for TB.
Why do you think he'll retire? He's shown incredible durability and absolutely no sign of slowing down.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:10 AM
  #968
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I don't get the we don't need more old players with big cap hits argument here. St. Louis is still good, and 5.6 isn't a huge cap hit, and its gone in one year.

My problem is the "who are we trading for him" not the player or his contract.
Right, so we're giving a good asset up (whether it be a good roster player, a pick, a prospect) to get a good but not great player on a team not looking to add the final piece in a powerhouse team but a piece to basically "ensure" a playoff spot (middle of the road team). If the Flyers aren't close to being a serious contender this year or next, it makes zero sense to deal for St. Louis where we have to give up long term assets no matter how good he is.

If they were flush with assets (prospects / picks) it may make a tiny bit of sense but they are among the worst in the league in their current position. So to recap...the Flyers have very few good tradeable assets (among, if not, the worst farms in the league), they have glaring needs on defense, they are a middle of the road team this year and likely next year so why in the world would we trade an asset (that we can't afford to give) for a position of "strength" for a "two year" rental player on a team that is a middle of the pack team? I can't see on any level how it makes any sense to make that move. This is a perfect recipe on how to build long term mediocre teams....

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:12 AM
  #969
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Originally Posted by Banger View Post
Right, so we're giving a good asset up (whether it be a good roster player, a pick, a prospect) to get a good but not great player on a team not looking to add the final piece in a powerhouse team but a piece to basically "ensure" a playoff spot (middle of the road team). If the Flyers aren't close to being a serious contender this year or next, it makes zero sense to deal for St. Louis where we have to give up long term assets no matter how good he is.

If they were flush with assets (prospects / picks) it may make a tiny bit of sense but they are among the worst in the league in their current position. So to recap...the Flyers have very few good tradeable assets (among, if not, the worst farms in the league), they have glaring needs on defense, they are a middle of the road team this year and likely next year so why in the world would we trade an asset (that we can't afford to give) for a position of "strength" for a "two year" rental player on a team that is a middle of the pack team? I can't see on any level how it makes any sense to make that move. This is a perfect recipe on how to build long term mediocre teams....
Marty St. Louis - Good, but not Great.

I'll remember that.

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02-24-2014, 10:13 AM
  #970
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Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
Just looking at what Iginla returned from Pitt...

1st, Kenneth Agostino and Ben Hanowski

Would a slightly better package get an older, but still signed, St. Louis?

1st + Akeson/similar forward + Laughton? I don't usually attempt trade proposals but if MSL really wants out I think that's a little better value than Calgary got.

Any thoughts?
my thought is that Pitt was a Stanley Cup favorite with a decent/good farm so they can afford to make a rental move like that...the Flyers are barely in the Stanley Cup mix and have a horrible farm and such a move would be an absolute disaster.

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02-24-2014, 10:18 AM
  #971
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Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
Marty St. Louis - Good, but not Great.

I'll remember that.
he's tied for 12-16th and 2 points from 20th in the league. He's a good/very good player. If they get him are they now in the talk for a Stanley Cup favorite? If not, it makes no sense...you only make a rental move like that if it puts you over the top...which it doesn't come close to doing.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:25 AM
  #972
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
Why do you think he'll retire? He's shown incredible durability and absolutely no sign of slowing down.
Because he'll be 39 in June and 40 when his contract is over. There's a chance he'll stick around, but in all likelihood I think he will retire.

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02-24-2014, 10:33 AM
  #973
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Because he'll be 39 in June and 40 when his contract is over. There's a chance he'll stick around, but in all likelihood I think he will retire.
I got you on the age, but I think he'll likely play 3 if not 4 more seasons to be honest. Guys a gamer.

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02-24-2014, 10:34 AM
  #974
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Because he'll be 39 in June and 40 when his contract is over. There's a chance he'll stick around, but in all likelihood I think he will retire.
I said earlier, If St Louis can give you one/two more years after his contract, Read for him in my book is a no brainer. I would first like to know how long he would be willing to play for though. If it is just one year, I wouldn't do that deal.

Three years of St Louis even age the age of 40, 41>>>>> 4 years of Read.

He is a star in the league.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:44 AM
  #975
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As sweet as getting MSL would be, rumors are flying about the Rangers sending Callahan for a one for one trade with MSL.

I don't think the Flyers have anyone else to match that kind of trade with.

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