HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Flyers sign Gagne

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-09-2005, 09:37 AM
  #126
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwyddbwyll
Forget Esche and Johnsson, I cant beleive Radivojevic is being so underrated. 600k? Are you kidding me? That'll be a steal. He is probably going to be one of the better 3rd liners next year and should chalk up 40 points. He hasnt done it yet I suppose is the knock but he's well on his way. Should be $1M imo or his agent should be fired if its anything less than 900k.
you rarely get money for expectations... ESPECIALLY in a salary cap environment, earn it on the ice.

Jester is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 09:40 AM
  #127
donelikedinner
Registered User
 
donelikedinner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: In a house
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeycanada
Gagne is a good signing, and the only good signing of the offseason for the Flyers.
dude, ease up on your obvious Orange & Black envy. you're starting to sound like a little whinny 3 year old. (no offense to 3 year olds intended )

donelikedinner is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 09:44 AM
  #128
donelikedinner
Registered User
 
donelikedinner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: In a house
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper


Sorry to burst your bubble but he's not "head and shoulders" better than Aebischer, not even close.
What has Abs done better than Esche?

donelikedinner is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 09:47 AM
  #129
donelikedinner
Registered User
 
donelikedinner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: In a house
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Wins is the only stat that matters come playoff time.

donelikedinner is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 09:55 AM
  #130
i am dave
Registered User
 
i am dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Corner of 1st & 1st
Country: United States
Posts: 2,182
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davisian
The Rangers, or someone else in the division, should offer Kim Johnsson a 3 yr 3.5 contract.

If the Flyers match, they'll need to make more moves to get under the cap.

If they don't the Rangers can now trade Poti and his more affordable contract.
$3.5M equates to three 1st Round picks. Teams aren't a) dumb enough do to that, nor do they b) share the animosity of fans towards other teams. GM's often work in the you-scratch-my-back-now-I'll-scratch-your-back-later frame.

i am dave is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:29 AM
  #131
Pepper
Registered User
 
Pepper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,407
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
Should we go back and watch the 2004 playoffs again?
Should be go back to 2003 play-offs and declare Giguere the best goalie in the league ever?

Didn't think so.

Wins is the only stat that counts?? So I guess Osgood and Vernon were the best goalies in the league during Wings cup years??

For the love of god people, stop making ridiculous claims like that!

Pepper is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:35 AM
  #132
ej_pens
Registered User
 
ej_pens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ej_pens
Quote:
Originally Posted by PitkanenPower
$3.5M equates to three 1st Round picks.
Not anymore.

3.5M is a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.

ej_pens is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:37 AM
  #133
ej_pens
Registered User
 
ej_pens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ej_pens
FYI

Quote:
FREE AGENTS SUBJECT TO COMPENSATION AND RIGHT TO MATCH -- GROUP 2

The players listed below have been tendered a qualifying offer by their respective Clubs and are subject to draft-choice compensation and right to match. The draft choice compensation scale is based on compensation offered by the new Club:

OFFER
$660,000 or below - None
Over $660,000 to $1 million - Third-round choice
Over $1 million to $2.0 million - Second-round choice
Over $2.0 million to $3.0 million - First-round and third-round choice
Over $3.0 million to $4.0 million - First-round, second-round and third-round choice
Over $4.0 million to $5.0 million - Two first-round choices, one second- and one third-round choice

Over $5 million - 4 first-round choices

ej_pens is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:44 AM
  #134
Gags1288
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,354
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ej_pens
Not anymore.

3.5M is a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.
Teams aren't going to go out and start signing players to offer sheets. There's a reason it wasn't done often in the past beyond the penalty. Every team will be in a situation where they're tight with the cap at one point and have to sign a high quality RFA. They don't want other teams to take their players. I only seem a franchise type player being signed to an offer sheet and Esche is not that.

Esche is a decent goalie, but there are a lot of guys who could put up Vezina type numbers playing in the flyers system. The flyers have a very impressive combination of two-way forwards and defense that allows them to just need a solid goaltender. I would just be shocked if someone saw Esche as valuable enough to sign him to an offer sheet and give up the picks.

If someone did indeed make an offer, especially a projected bottom 10 team, the flyers would certainly consider letting Esche go.

Gags1288 is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:45 AM
  #135
i am dave
Registered User
 
i am dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Corner of 1st & 1st
Country: United States
Posts: 2,182
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ej_pens
FYI
Thanks, I was going to ask for that. I couldn't find it anywhere.

Still, a pretty significant price driven by - from the poster's POV - spite ahead of everything else.

i am dave is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 10:59 AM
  #136
Steve L*
Registered User
 
Steve L*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Southampton, England
Country: England
Posts: 11,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evileye
Is it worth demanding an extra $1M? You talk like a million dollars is nothing!
If a player makes $20m over a career where hes settled with his new family, is it really worth moving them away so he can make $21 or $22m elsewhere, particularly when hes already said he wants to stay there for life?

FWIW Forsberg also signed his contract for over a million less than he could have got elsewhere.

Steve L* is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:01 AM
  #137
Nikkowar
Registered User
 
Nikkowar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Upper Darby
Country: Greece
Posts: 11,318
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Nikkowar Send a message via MSN to Nikkowar
so this means that I need a new Gagne jersey

Nikkowar is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:04 AM
  #138
ej_pens
Registered User
 
ej_pens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ej_pens
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gags1288
Teams aren't going to go out and start signing players to offer sheets. There's a reason it wasn't done often in the past beyond the penalty.
The penalty was significant enough that those other factors were only secondary.

Now that the penalty has been lessened, you could certainly see some RFA's get offer sheets if they are unhappy with their current team's offers.

It happens in the the NFL and you don't see widespread "stealing" of players in retailiation because of it.

ej_pens is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:10 AM
  #139
ej_pens
Registered User
 
ej_pens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ej_pens
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve L
If a player makes $20m over a career
IF.........

You are running under 2 shaky assumptions. One, that the players look that far ahead and, two, that they are assured of reaching that number in a sport where the average career isn't very long.

You are correct that, looking back, 1 million isn't quite that much if you've made 20M over your career. But 1M is certainly a large chunk of change if that is 25-50% of your total salary for that season.

Quote:
FWIW Forsberg also signed his contract for over a million less than he could have got elsewhere.
Forsberg has already made a lot of money already. 2 different situations entirely.

ej_pens is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:34 AM
  #140
dolfanar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Like a midget at a urinal, I'm going to have to stay on my toes.
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
You're the one who called me a fool for thinking that Gagne would sign for a measly two million. Perhaps I knew a bit more about my team then anticipated?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolfanar
Now, if you are counting on EVERY one of those qualifying deals being signed... ouch do you have a rude awakening coming. Sharp is a gimme, as is Seidenberg so I'll grant you those, and Antero has to have an NHL clause in the 750-900 range, so lets say 800. That's 2.1 million, so their at 32 million for 18 players.

Branko would get more in arbitration than 650, probably not MUCH more mind you, so let's say as a 27-32 point scorer the last two years he gets a bit of a raise at 750. Robert Esche is the starting goalie in Philly, his comparables in arbitration are going to be interesting. He has to be somewhere in the Phillipe Boucher/Kevin Weekes range (around 1.9 though other RFA goalie signings to come may end up being better comparibles). Let's average that down between the two of our estimates to 1.7. Simon Gagne is a 21 goal scorer, 45 point guy, so somehere in the 2-2.25 million range seems about right. Let's say 2 million. Johnson is D-man who picked up 40+ points so again I agree that somewhere in the 2.5 to 2.75 range is where he'll sit. Again let's say 2.5. That's 750+1.7+2+2.5 or 6.95.
Brad... try learning to read.

dolfanar is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:39 AM
  #141
FearTheFlyers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,553
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dolfanar





Brad... try learning to read.
Ok.....you're batting around .250.


Congratulations?

FearTheFlyers is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:51 AM
  #142
dolfanar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Like a midget at a urinal, I'm going to have to stay on my toes.
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GagneOwnsYou
Ok.....you're batting around .250.


Congratulations?
How do you figure? Branko didn't choose to go to arbitration, Gagne, & Sharp signed for exactly what I suggested. Seidenberg & Esche are still up in the air...

While Brad works on his reading skills, I suggest you brush up on your basic arithmetic...

dolfanar is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:55 AM
  #143
FearTheFlyers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,553
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dolfanar
How do you figure? Branko didn't choose to go to arbitration, Gagne, & Sharp signed for exactly what I suggested. Seidenberg & Esche are still up in the air...

While Brad works on his reading skills, I suggest you brush up on your basic arithmetic...
You were right with Gagne, 20% off on Radio, wrong and Johnsson and about to be wrong on Esche. Yep, .250.

FearTheFlyers is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 11:56 AM
  #144
stanley
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,588
vCash: 500
EJ,

From where did you get the RFA compensation list? The CBA's FAQs indicate that RFA was unchanged under the new agreement. A link or something similar would help us going forward in these discussions, and settle this issue for good.

Thanks!

stanley is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 12:01 PM
  #145
ej_pens
Registered User
 
ej_pens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ej_pens
Quote:
Originally Posted by stanley
EJ,

From where did you get the RFA compensation list? The CBA's FAQs indicate that RFA was unchanged under the new agreement. A link or something similar would help us going forward in these discussions, and settle this issue for good.

Thanks!
http://www.nhl.com/players/freelist05.html

ej_pens is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 12:06 PM
  #146
stanley
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,588
vCash: 500
Thanks, EJ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davisian
The Rangers, or someone else in the division, should offer Kim Johnsson a 3 yr 3.5 contract.

If the Flyers match, they'll need to make more moves to get under the cap.

If they don't the Rangers can now trade Poti and his more affordable contract.
I don't think this is a ridiculous suggestion for a team that might have the cap money.

Based on what it seems they've allocated already, I think the Flyers could swing $3.5M/yr. What it would do is really hurt their ability to get somebody at a pro-rated amount later on, like at the deadline. Bill M. (he's a reliable source - you'll have to trust me or ask around) claimed that Johnsson wanted a three-year deal but because of the difficulty in trying to clear cap space with a back-loaded deal, it seemed the Flyers were only going to offer one. He claimed that Johnsson wanted to come back to Philly this year and was going to take it. It will mean that unless they renegotiate during the season, he'll be unrestricted at season's end, where he'll certainly cash in. THIS is where spending can come back to bite a team. Next summer they'll inevitably pay more for Johnsson or someone else.

Fellow board members: aim your barbs elsewhere, as I'm merely the messenger. I'm not one to buy that "he really loves it here" stuff, as everyone really loves it Here until some better Here comes along, but Bill's a tried and true source of information. I think you can find Bill's posting on the O&B board.

stanley is offline  
Old
08-09-2005, 12:18 PM
  #147
dolfanar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Like a midget at a urinal, I'm going to have to stay on my toes.
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GagneOwnsYou
You were right with Gagne, 20% off on Radio, wrong and Johnsson and about to be wrong on Esche. Yep, .250.
LMFAO!

20% off? So you know what he would have gotten in arbitration then?
"About to be wrong"... ok Karnac.

Hey, you might want to join in with Brad on those basic reading lessons, you obviously need them...

dolfanar is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:10 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.