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Looking back on the EJ trade

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Old
02-12-2014, 11:13 PM
  #26
bohlmeister
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Originally Posted by expatriated_texan View Post
Am I really alone in not being overwhelmed by EJ's game?

I keep seeing folks calling him a beast. He's been very good but not otherworldly. I simply don't remember too many games where he's been the difference maker.
I have been one of the few who criticized EJ before this season, and still do. I am not one of the people that calls every game he plays "beastly" and I am neither one of the posters who goes to the main boards to rave about him. The biggest difference I see in his play is that he wants the puck on his stick. The first time Hejda and EJ were pairing together, EJ always gave the puck to Hejda. It didn't work at all because Hejda is poor at moving it. EJ ended up playing with SOB and Hunwick because he always gave his partner the puck. This season he wants it on his stick, and he is an excellent puck mover. All of this is because he is confident. He did make a few plays in the past few weeks that were amazing. Carrying it through NJ neutral zone, the drop pass to Mac. I think the more he gets comfortable, and if we find him a good minute eating partner, he will continue very solid defensive play, along with great outlet passing. He is turning into the anchor that we needed when we made the trade.

The more I watch him, the more he reminds me of Suter. Similar style players.

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02-12-2014, 11:20 PM
  #27
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EJ has made a difference through his constant, steady presence on the ice as a defender, and with the puck in his own zone. That has been huge for our boys up front and varly, most of the game may involve walking the tightrope of disaster, but for 20-24 minutes a night Hejda and EJ are out there taking care of business. That's the difference he makes. He's been wearing down so I'm glad he'll have a nice long rest with the olympic snub and suspension so that he can refresh and finish the season the way he played the first 40(?) games, where he was a rock who just shut it down and took control when the puck came to him and we needed to get going the other way.

I'm glad this trade worked out for Shatty cause I loved that dude, but this trade has been great for us. Especially with the steps EJ and Barrie have taken this season. Really hope that Barrie gets those two games next to Hejda after the break so that he can remember what it was like with a partner who wasn't a skating-disaster.

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Old
02-12-2014, 11:33 PM
  #28
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I've always liked the trade. Blues fans act like they robbed us but it sure doesn't feel like it.

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02-13-2014, 12:11 AM
  #29
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He's been integral to the team's success this year. It's amazing how large an improvement he's made to his game from last year. As bohlmeister points out, he used to shy away from the puck, now he's taking it end to end, making crisp outlet passes, and just playing a confident game. Unlike previous seasons, he's been a lot of fun to watch.

He's not elite, and he never will be. But that's fine. I never thought the trade required him to be so in order to be a win for the Avs. All he needed to be was a legit top-pairing guy. And he absolutely has been that.

The trade was costly, yes, but looking back now, it was a good deal for both sides. EJ never would have flourished in St. Louis the way he is now for Colorado. And conversely, Shattenkirk is doing excellent playing 2nd pairing role on an elite defensive corps.

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02-13-2014, 12:15 AM
  #30
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Hard to say. Don't care about Stewart.

Wish we still had Shattenkirk, but enjoy having EJ on the team.

The picks haven't done anything yet.

Would have been nice if McClement had signed.

I think we gave up a bit too much value but overall I think both teams filled needs. Just gotta hope that Duncan pans out as well.

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Old
02-13-2014, 12:34 AM
  #31
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Definition of a win-win deal.

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02-13-2014, 12:49 AM
  #32
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Love it.

I honestly feel Sherman never lost a trade he made.

It was either a wash or a win.

Fleischman (spelled it wrong) for Hannan? Win - if it was him who made the trade
McGinn + for winnik or something of that nature ? Win
Quincey for ultimately Downie ? Win
Vincour for Gaunce? Win
Erat for Varlamov?! Win

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02-13-2014, 01:11 AM
  #33
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Was the O'Byrne trade before his time? And you are forgetting the Jones for Tanguay trade! Or do we put that in the Sakic/Roy column?

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Old
02-13-2014, 05:48 AM
  #34
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I was furious back then because I loved Stewart but EJ won me over pretty quickly. Also, I adored McClement. I didn't care about Shatty all that much because I've always thought (and still think) Barrie would become at least as good as him. And now we even have Siemens whom I love almost as much as Barrie. Great trade imo. Just a shame McClement decided to leave.

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02-13-2014, 08:05 AM
  #35
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Good trade, although it's a shame we couldn't keep McClement.

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Old
02-13-2014, 08:11 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatriated_texan View Post
Am I really alone in not being overwhelmed by EJ's game?

I keep seeing folks calling him a beast. He's been very good but not otherworldly. I simply don't remember too many games where he's been the difference maker.
It seemed like he was really putting it together, and then he hurt his back.

From December till he got hurt his stats were:

20 games played, 5 goals, 7 assists, +0, 12 points 24:15 Avg TOI/Game

and then he got hurt in that Chicago game.

Since that injury he has played 12 games 0 goals, 4 assists, and is -10. Only recently looked like he was comfortable skating with the puck again.

I wouldn't be surprised if he has a really good stretch into the playoffs now that he will have had a 3 week rest.
-----
EJ has 15 even strength points. Shattenkirk has 16. Which just illustrates the major weakness in EJ's game- the powerplay. He's just not really a threat there. He randomly is, but not consistently. The Avs could seriously use Shattenkirk's PP skills. He's got 20 points on the powerplay already. By contrast EJ only has 9 and Barrie only has 6.


Last edited by Avs71: 02-13-2014 at 08:57 AM.
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Old
02-13-2014, 09:14 AM
  #37
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When I woke up to the news of the trade I wasn't happy. Honestly I was pretty high on both Stewart and Shatty.

However, looking back and seeing how EJ has developed I am happy with the trade. Right now I see it as a win-win, but if Siemens turns into a NHLer I would say we won the trade from our team's POV.

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Old
02-13-2014, 09:58 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by 18007 View Post
Opening up the can of worms- Well, glad Stewies gone, love EJ, miss Shattenkirk, wish McClement would have signed, not sure about the draft picks yet. Pretty fair trade IMO.
this is 100% accurate.

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Old
02-13-2014, 10:02 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Avs71 View Post
It seemed like he was really putting it together, and then he hurt his back.

From December till he got hurt his stats were:

20 games played, 5 goals, 7 assists, +0, 12 points 24:15 Avg TOI/Game

and then he got hurt in that Chicago game.

Since that injury he has played 12 games 0 goals, 4 assists, and is -10. Only recently looked like he was comfortable skating with the puck again.

I wouldn't be surprised if he has a really good stretch into the playoffs now that he will have had a 3 week rest.
-----
EJ has 15 even strength points. Shattenkirk has 16. Which just illustrates the major weakness in EJ's game- the powerplay. He's just not really a threat there. He randomly is, but not consistently. The Avs could seriously use Shattenkirk's PP skills. He's got 20 points on the powerplay already. By contrast EJ only has 9 and Barrie only has 6.
The reason EJ is not a threat is because he is not a PP quarterback, and the Avs don't have one. EJ should really just get open for one timers and have the other 4 guys move the puck around. The Avs PP isn't set up for point shots. They move it to the side of the net and try and create something in the slot or try the cross crease play.

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02-13-2014, 11:12 AM
  #40
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I guess we will have to wait and see how Siemens pans out. Anyone know how his development is coming along?

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02-13-2014, 11:18 AM
  #41
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It was a win-win trade. Siemens and Rattie are similar level prospects, with an edge to Siemens. The Avs would rather have EJ than Shatty, and the Blues would rather have Shatty. The Avs are happy to be rid of Stewart and are better off without him, the Blues want to get rid of him. I just wish the Avs could have re-signed McClement.

Each team got what they needed out of the trade, but had to give up good pieces to get it.

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I guess we will have to wait and see how Siemens pans out. Anyone know how his development is coming along?
With his injury... slowly. I doubt we see him in the NHL full time before the 15-16 season. Next year's training camp will give a real good idea of where he is.

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02-13-2014, 11:23 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by bohlmeister View Post
The reason EJ is not a threat is because he is not a PP quarterback, and the Avs don't have one. EJ should really just get open for one timers and have the other 4 guys move the puck around. The Avs PP isn't set up for point shots. They move it to the side of the net and try and create something in the slot or try the cross crease play.
Roy's and Army's powerplay structure is not made for defensemen, it's made for players like MacKinnon, ROR, and Landeskog (if they decided to put him in the slot). A lot of down low play with trying to give the target man a one timer in the slot. They really only use the defensemen when they're in a pinch with aggressive penatly killers. Barrie is the only exception since his skating is pretty damn impressive when he plays against four guys and has that much room.

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02-13-2014, 11:33 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Tigervixxen View Post
Was the O'Byrne trade before his time? And you are forgetting the Jones for Tanguay trade! Or do we put that in the Sakic/Roy column?
Sherman made the O'Byrne trade. It's hard to hold that one against him since it addressed a serious need in a big way and allowed Liles to flourish. It's just too bad they followed up that deal by trading Liles away and loading up on more O'Byrne types.

Jones/SOB for Tanguay/Sarich was the first big trade of the new regime.

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Originally Posted by bohlmeister View Post
The reason EJ is not a threat is because he is not a PP quarterback, and the Avs don't have one. EJ should really just get open for one timers and have the other 4 guys move the puck around. The Avs PP isn't set up for point shots. They move it to the side of the net and try and create something in the slot or try the cross crease play.
From what I can see he doesn't have a great one-timer. More often than not he has to take a little time setting up his shot. Barrie probably has the best one-timer from the point. I still don't understand why Roy doesn't try O'Reilly on the power play point. Right now the fact that there isn't a scary shot from up high makes the power play a little to easy to defend against. The opposition usually just collapses down low and blocks shots. They also send someone in to crash the net rather than have a guy just stick himself in the crease to wreak havoc and pick up rebounds and deflections. Unfortunately the opposition has kinda picked up on that too.

The power play has been pretty effective all things considered. It's just that given the amount of talent and potential this team has, just a couple things would make the power play unstoppable.

Incidentally does Siemens have a good shot from the point?

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02-13-2014, 11:37 AM
  #44
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By the way if anyone looks at what made Sheldon Souray's shot so scary (say that three times fast) wasn't the fact that it was powerful and he had a quick release--it was that he could hold onto it, keep it away from the opposition, and wait for all the blockers to slide out of position before letting it rip. My point is that I think there are a lot of ways they can make the power play more effective. The key is to spread the PKers apart, get them out of position.

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02-13-2014, 11:38 AM
  #45
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We should just run with the 11F 7D lineup and call up Elliott (sit Bordy). His wrist shot would be dangerous on the PP, and IMO he has the ability to be a better PP QB than anybody else on the team. I'm only half joking...

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Old
02-13-2014, 11:51 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
Sherman made the O'Byrne trade. It's hard to hold that one against him since it addressed a serious need in a big way and allowed Liles to flourish. It's just too bad they followed up that deal by trading Liles away and loading up on more O'Byrne types.

Jones/SOB for Tanguay/Sarich was the first big trade of the new regime.



From what I can see he doesn't have a great one-timer. More often than not he has to take a little time setting up his shot. Barrie probably has the best one-timer from the point. I still don't understand why Roy doesn't try O'Reilly on the power play point. Right now the fact that there isn't a scary shot from up high makes the power play a little to easy to defend against. The opposition usually just collapses down low and blocks shots. They also send someone in to crash the net rather than have a guy just stick himself in the crease to wreak havoc and pick up rebounds and deflections. Unfortunately the opposition has kinda picked up on that too.

The power play has been pretty effective all things considered. It's just that given the amount of talent and potential this team has, just a couple things would make the power play unstoppable.

Incidentally does Siemens have a good shot from the point?
IMO that is because he has poor passers and for whatever reason, is always on the right side. He has the ability.

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Old
02-13-2014, 12:09 PM
  #47
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IMO that is because he has poor passers and for whatever reason, is always on the right side. He has the ability.
This is very true. Seems the passes when he is looking for one timer are always off. It is also why I want to see Johnson-O'Reilly on the point on the powerplay. Both have hard shots, and are good passers.

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Old
02-13-2014, 12:51 PM
  #48
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IMO that is because he has poor passers and for whatever reason, is always on the right side. He has the ability.
That might be true but I'm not completely convinced. Barrie seems able to get decent one-timers done, and he is also on the right side a lot of the time.

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02-13-2014, 01:12 PM
  #49
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Shattenkirk should send us a thank you card for getting him out of this environment before Succo turned him into a trainwreck. Does anybody believe he'd be as revered today as he is on HF if had to go through the same toxic environment that EJ did?

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02-13-2014, 01:18 PM
  #50
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Shattenkirk should send us a thank you card for getting him out of this environment before Succo turned him into a trainwreck. Does anybody believe he'd be as revered today as he is on HF if had to go through the same toxic environment that EJ did?
Good point.

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