HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Columbus Blue Jackets
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

2014 Trade Deadline Thread II (All General Trade Talk/Proposals/Blog Rumors in here)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-15-2014, 10:22 PM
  #51
RDriesenUD
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,633
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarelaces View Post
Hejda. Wiz is playing his best hockey for us in his last 20 games I admit. The body of his work, however, has been atrocious. He also makes almost double what Jan makes. He is either our slowest player or second slowest. That would be Savard. Wouldn't it be nice to have Hejda rather than him?
Wisniewski = 76pts and -15
Hejda = 43pts and -12

So, they are basically even when it comes to +/-, with Wisnieski scoring a ton of pp points which helps Columbus win games without counting as a + for him.

RDriesenUD is online now  
Old
02-15-2014, 10:45 PM
  #52
Sore Loser
HF Partner
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Spokane, WA.
Country: United States
Posts: 6,413
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by major major View Post
You should know better than to judge a shutdown defenceman by point totals.
Do you ever even read my posts, or do you just pick the parts you don't agree with?

I'll re-post my comment, for you to be able to read all of it:

Quote:
You're right, he has played well. Since signing with Colorado (at a $3.25/year cap hit):

181 games played, 12 goals, 31 assists, and a -12 overall rating in that time.

Not dominant numbers, but not bad ... for a second/third pairing guy. That averages out to about 6 goals and 16 assists, a -6 rating over full seasons. Would he make us a better team right now? I highly doubt that ... maybe he keeps us from struggling so much in the year right after he left, but let's not get too upset over his loss. Long-term, I think we're better off without him.
I'm not "judging" him for his numbers, don't take it that way ... I actually agreed that he has played well. I'm making the point that for a second or third pairing guy, he's been O.K. Does that mean he's worth what they're paying him, or what it would have taken for us to keep him? That's the debate. The fact that he's a "shutdown" defenseman that's progressively seen his +/- rating drop over the last five years should be the only sign needed to prove that he's on the tail end of his career, and thus, not worth what he was when that contract was thrown on his lap.

Sore Loser is offline  
Old
02-15-2014, 11:23 PM
  #53
blahblah
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 17,326
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarelaces View Post
Hejda. Wiz is playing his best hockey for us in his last 20 games I admit. The body of his work, however, has been atrocious. He also makes almost double what Jan makes. He is either our slowest player or second slowest. That would be Savard. Wouldn't it be nice to have Hejda rather than him?
Oh dear. Wow... I wouldn't want Hejda on this team again.

Wiz has 35 points (tied for 6th in assists and 11th in points for D-Men) and is a -1. After this season he has 13 million left on his contract over 3 years. We're fine, thanks.

If you want to fantasize about a stay-at-home look elsewhere please. I have no interest in another year of him next season (not even for Savard and we know how much I love Savard). We aren't going to win the Cup because we acquired Hejda, so I don't see the point.

We finally get the guy playing the way we want and we have those complaining about him.

blahblah is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 06:52 AM
  #54
EspenK
Registered User
 
EspenK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,941
vCash: 500
I'm too lazy to cut and paste stats but if you go look at Hejda's stats the first two years in Columbus he was fine but for the next 4 seasons he didn't look so hot. Only this season when the whole Colorado team has turned around has his +/- returned to positive.
No thanks, I'll take a Wiz any day. (and most days, more )

EspenK is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 08:29 AM
  #55
squarelaces
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 584
vCash: 500
This place is great. A page full of responses over a made up debate. I can't wait for the Olympics to be over. Then we can get back to the substantive argument over the merits of Jared Boll.

squarelaces is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 09:25 AM
  #56
cbjfaninmo
Jarmo von Raschke
 
cbjfaninmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Lake Ozark, MO
Country: United States
Posts: 917
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarelaces View Post
This place is great. A page full of responses over a made up debate. I can't wait for the Olympics to be over. Then we can get back to the substantive argument over the merits of Jared Boll.
Jared Boll plays better D than Hejda AND Wiz.

cbjfaninmo is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:40 PM
  #57
major major
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,170
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Do you ever even read my posts, or do you just pick the parts you don't agree with?
Both. Wow your head has gotten big if you don't think you can be challenged on your analysis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
I'm not "judging" him for his numbers, don't take it that way ... I actually agreed that he has played well. I'm making the point that for a second or third pairing guy, he's been O.K. Does that mean he's worth what they're paying him, or what it would have taken for us to keep him? That's the debate. The fact that he's a "shutdown" defenseman that's progressively seen his +/- rating drop over the last five years should be the only sign needed to prove that he's on the tail end of his career, and thus, not worth what he was when that contract was thrown on his lap.
Do you even read your posts? You provide a stat as the "The only sign needed" after saying you're not assessing based on numbers? If you want to know how good a shutdown defender is playing you have to watch him play, so ask Colorado fans. If +/- was "the only sign needed" then Jack Johnson would have had his skates taken away. Do you think we should get rid of him or watch him play before assessing?

And for what its worth, Hejda is a +8 this year despite facing the hardest opposition.

major major is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:45 PM
  #58
stevo61
Registered User
 
stevo61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,358
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by major major View Post
Both. Wow your head has gotten big if you don't think you can be challenged on your analysis.



Do you even read your posts? You provide a stat as the "The only sign needed" after saying you're not assessing based on numbers? If you want to know how good a shutdown defender is playing you have to watch him play, so ask Colorado fans. If +/- was "the only sign needed" then Jack Johnson would have had his skates taken away. Do you think we should get rid of him or watch him play before assessing?

And for what its worth, Hejda is a +8 this year despite facing the hardest opposition.
While playing over 22 minutes a night

stevo61 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:49 PM
  #59
leesmith
Still in.
 
leesmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,971
vCash: 500
The defenseman I'd like back on the team is Beauchemin.

leesmith is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 02:01 PM
  #60
Mayor Bee
\/me_____you\/
 
Mayor Bee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 15,725
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Very well stated. I think this is a perfect look at why the Jackets didn't pony up the big money for Jan Hejda a few years back.
I figured it was because he looked old and slow, like Vyborny in his last year here. Most guys don't suddenly rebound when they hit age 33.

Mayor Bee is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 02:06 PM
  #61
Jaxs
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Jaxs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 7,704
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
I figured it was because he looked old and slow, like Vyborny in his last year here. Most guys don't suddenly rebound when they hit age 33.
This. He was having knee problems if I recall.

Jaxs is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 02:09 PM
  #62
squarelaces
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 584
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
The defenseman I'd like back on the team is Beauchemin.
You're crazy to prefer him to Spacek. If he would have stayed here a few years longer he would have been + 500 and cured cancer! Hey, this is kinda fun!

squarelaces is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 02:27 PM
  #63
Sore Loser
HF Partner
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Spokane, WA.
Country: United States
Posts: 6,413
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by major major View Post
Both. Wow your head has gotten big if you don't think you can be challenged on your analysis.



Do you even read your posts? You provide a stat as the "The only sign needed" after saying you're not assessing based on numbers? If you want to know how good a shutdown defender is playing you have to watch him play, so ask Colorado fans. If +/- was "the only sign needed" then Jack Johnson would have had his skates taken away. Do you think we should get rid of him or watch him play before assessing?

And for what its worth, Hejda is a +8 this year despite facing the hardest opposition.
I'm confused, are you arguing with me or against me?

Again, for reference:

Quote:
Not dominant numbers, but not bad ... for a second/third pairing guy
I used his stat line as proof that he hasn't been bad. I also pointed out that he's seen declining numbers for the last five years. This year, he's playing for one of the most explosive young offensive teams in the league. I would expect his numbers to see an improvement ... but let's see if he can keep it up for the entire year. He is 35 years old, after all.

All things aside, the point you're arguing is moot. The thought process behind my post was that the team wouldn't be better off if they had kept Jan Hejda, and I stand by that. In our top-6 right now, Hejda (who plays the left side, by the way) would easily be beaten out by Johnson, Tyutin, and Murray. He would be playing a role similar to Nikitin, who is a essentially the same type of player anyhow.

Add in that if we had kept Hejda, we would probably not have one of Johnson or Wisniewski, and it further bolsters the actual point of the discussion.

I have no problem being challenged on my an analysis ... but you're challenging against something that you're essentially agreeing with me on. Hence my getting argumentative. I'll overlook the "big head" comment, for the sake of being a gentleman.

Sore Loser is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 02:48 PM
  #64
leesmith
Still in.
 
leesmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,971
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarelaces View Post
You're crazy to prefer him to Spacek. If he would have stayed here a few years longer he would have been + 500 and cured cancer! Hey, this is kinda fun!
Seriously, Beauchemin - even at age 33 - would bolster our blue line. I do think we undervalue both Tyutin and Nikitin though.

leesmith is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 04:25 PM
  #65
Crede777
Deputized
 
Crede777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 8,193
vCash: 500
For what it's worth, Hejda would have been beaten by Methot who was moved because he was 3rd or 4th on our left side depth chart.

Crede777 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 04:49 PM
  #66
major major
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,170
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
I have no problem being challenged on my an analysis ... but you're challenging against something that you're essentially agreeing with me on.
I don't really have a dog in the Hejda hunt, I just don't think its fair to use statistics as definitive assessments of shutdown defenders.

major major is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 06:33 PM
  #67
Xoggz22
HFB Partner
 
Xoggz22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 4,491
vCash: 500
As I recall, Hejda was asking for $500k per from Columbus and a year longer in term. For the money and his skill set I don't think he was worth it. Good D man but not who I would target

Xoggz22 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 08:13 PM
  #68
FANonymous
Registered User
 
FANonymous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,911
vCash: 500
We need a defenseman that can throw some good hip checks though. I miss that with Hejda and to a lesser extent Methot.

If we were winning and there was less than a minute left in the game, you KNEW Hejda was going to throw an awesomely unnecessary hip check.

FANonymous is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 08:29 PM
  #69
Sore Loser
HF Partner
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Spokane, WA.
Country: United States
Posts: 6,413
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by major major View Post
I don't really have a dog in the Hejda hunt, I just don't think its fair to use statistics as definitive assessments of shutdown defenders.




Done with the Hejda debate ... or whatever this was.

Sore Loser is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 12:15 AM
  #70
jackets4life
Nosebleed Native
 
jackets4life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Section 206
Country: Norway
Posts: 1,388
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Done with the Hejda debate ... or whatever this was.
A growing part of me longs for the Olympics to wrap up so this board can at least try to get back to relevant banter.

jackets4life is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 12:06 PM
  #71
pete goegan
HFBoards Sponsor
 
pete goegan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,263
vCash: 500
An interesting analysis of potential roster moves from The Coach at UnionBlue:

http://www.theunionblue.com/2014/02/.../#comment-8657

pete goegan is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 12:28 PM
  #72
EspenK
Registered User
 
EspenK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,941
vCash: 500
Nice analysis. Of course I don't agree with every detail but in general I like his thinking. I don't see Umberger as being very good this year. okay is more like it imo. I hope he is right about Erixon and like his thinking of bridge deals for both he and Joey.

Looking forward to his big picture look. Pete, make sure you give us a heads up because I'll forget to look on my own. Keep up the good work.

EspenK is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 12:45 PM
  #73
Cash for Nash
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,824
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
Nice analysis. Of course I don't agree with every detail but in general I like his thinking. I don't see Umberger as being very good this year. okay is more like it imo. I hope he is right about Erixon and like his thinking of bridge deals for both he and Joey.

Looking forward to his big picture look. Pete, make sure you give us a heads up because I'll forget to look on my own. Keep up the good work.
Yep. Good read. Seems to echo the thought that there is a need for an experienced shutdown dman type. Gilbert or Derek Morris would certainly fit the bill.

Cash for Nash is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 02:40 PM
  #74
Mayor Bee
\/me_____you\/
 
Mayor Bee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 15,725
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
An interesting analysis of potential roster moves from The Coach at UnionBlue:

http://www.theunionblue.com/2014/02/.../#comment-8657
Comeau was acquired for a 5th-rounder, not picked up off waivers as the article says.

I also strongly disagree with the idea that MacKenzie is easily replaceable, and should be replaced by "the next MacKenzie" instead of the real thing if a choice is to be made. It would smack of what so many here have decried: the idea that players are completely interchangeable based entirely on their on-ice play with no consideration for other factors. To me, it would be like the much-derided move to let Malhotra walk and then replace him with Sammy Pahlsson.

Mayor Bee is offline  
Old
02-17-2014, 04:24 PM
  #75
pete goegan
HFBoards Sponsor
 
pete goegan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,263
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
Comeau was acquired for a 5th-rounder, not picked up off waivers as the article says.

I also strongly disagree with the idea that MacKenzie is easily replaceable, and should be replaced by "the next MacKenzie" instead of the real thing if a choice is to be made. It would smack of what so many here have decried: the idea that players are completely interchangeable based entirely on their on-ice play with no consideration for other factors. To me, it would be like the much-derided move to let Malhotra walk and then replace him with Sammy Pahlsson.
I'm a big fan of DMac and agree that he's not that easily replaced.

pete goegan is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:53 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.