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2013-14 Adirondack Phantoms (AHL), ECHL, NCAA, Juniors, International, etc. part III

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03-17-2014, 10:40 AM
  #651
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One point on Murray's coaching, it's easier to teach a young player who was a big scorer in juniors to play NHL offense, the problem with most young forwards is mastering their defensive responsibilities to the point where they can be trusted in the show. And with defensemen, it's even more important for them to understand when they can take risks and when they have to play it safe.

It won't surprise me if some Phantom players outperform their AHL numbers when they get called up, as they'll have better talent and more freedom to create, while having defensive fundamentals installed will allow them to actually get some ice time.

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03-17-2014, 11:01 AM
  #652
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One point on Murray's coaching, it's easier to teach a young player who was a big scorer in juniors to play NHL offense, the problem with most young forwards is mastering their defensive responsibilities to the point where they can be trusted in the show. And with defensemen, it's even more important for them to understand when they can take risks and when they have to play it safe.

It won't surprise me if some Phantom players outperform their AHL numbers when they get called up, as they'll have better talent and more freedom to create, while having defensive fundamentals installed will allow them to actually get some ice time.
The main problem is though, Murray's system is really starting to fall apart. I know he doesnt have a stellar defense, but he has some pretty good defensive forwards (Holmstrom for example), as well as on defense Alt and some decent other defenders (Gervias is not a bad AHL defender, also have Oliver and Manning). The games I watch there are still alot of defensive breakdowns, from the forwards to the defense. I know it takes abit to bring in a system but two years should be enough to instill it into them. I personally just dont think Murray is that good of a coach. He is strangling the offense out of a bunch of players that can create offense. His team struggles scoring goals and even defending in a pure defensive system. Now one can blame it who is on the team, but some of the teams that they have played have similar roster makeups. College FA players, some ECHL players, some AHL vets and some legit prospects. The common misconception people make is that they think the top AHL teams have a team full of AHL vets or a team full of top prospects when in reality a lot of them consist of a similar makeup as the Phantoms. Murray has an extremely more talented roster than Patterson had, yet gets less out of them.

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03-17-2014, 11:39 AM
  #653
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The main problem is though, Murray's system is really starting to fall apart. I know he doesnt have a stellar defense, but he has some pretty good defensive forwards (Holmstrom for example), as well as on defense Alt and some decent other defenders (Gervias is not a bad AHL defender, also have Oliver and Manning). The games I watch there are still alot of defensive breakdowns, from the forwards to the defense. I know it takes abit to bring in a system but two years should be enough to instill it into them. I personally just dont think Murray is that good of a coach. He is strangling the offense out of a bunch of players that can create offense. His team struggles scoring goals and even defending in a pure defensive system. Now one can blame it who is on the team, but some of the teams that they have played have similar roster makeups. College FA players, some ECHL players, some AHL vets and some legit prospects. The common misconception people make is that they think the top AHL teams have a team full of AHL vets or a team full of top prospects when in reality a lot of them consist of a similar makeup as the Phantoms. Murray has an extremely more talented roster than Patterson had, yet gets less out of them.
Terry Murray is probably the wrong fit for a successful AHL coach win wise. In the NHL you are dealing with much more experienced and talented players with many years in rigid systems plus older veterans to filter the message down to the younger players. There is also usually a high turnover rate at the AHL level where you are essentially starting fresh each year plus losing and adding players on short notice. I am not sure if that is a great situation for a system oriented ex-NHL coach at the edge of retirement.

The real test though will be the legitimate NHL prospects, like Alt, Straka, Cousins, perform when they get called up. If the Phantoms continue to be a dumpster fire going forward but these guys become true NHL players, then does it really matter how the team performs?

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03-17-2014, 04:47 PM
  #654
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Murray's job with the Phantom is to groom NHL players not necessarily win games. If the two go hand in hand, more the better. On that front, Alt looks to have become a future NHLer; perhaps a second pair defender. Cousins seems to understand that he needs to work to build up his physique or he has no shot in the NHL. Straka also looks like he has seen th elight and has to work seriously on his defensive game.
With the youth that the team has in Philly, the competition between these young players for jobs in the League is going to be red hot when Ghostisbehere, Hagg, Morin, Leier, Laughton and Ghilbourne are added to the mix.

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03-18-2014, 08:06 AM
  #655
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Any word if the flyers are interested in Greg Carey, who it looks like is becoming a package deal with his brother? Is a goal scoring left wing which is an area of need for the flyers system.

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03-18-2014, 09:24 AM
  #656
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Wow + 48. Very nice

Also if timo doesn't get hurt and we don't go very deep or make the playoffs i bet he is back next year. He is still out best dman and on our top pair. He looked slow to start but great ever since. I think he may be back next year
5 other people on his team had a +40 or higher this year http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...054022014.html .

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03-18-2014, 01:17 PM
  #657
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i don't know if this was posted


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03-18-2014, 01:28 PM
  #658
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Morin is such a beast. It's going to be exciting watching him in those battles with the other teams top players because that is what he will be tasked to do at the NHL level. I'm hoping he has a strong camp along with an impressive preseason. Then if he sticks for a 9 game tryout and forces mangement to keep him on the roster because of his play that will show that he's improving his game. There will be ups and downs so we must be patient.

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03-18-2014, 01:33 PM
  #659
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Any word if the flyers are interested in Greg Carey, who it looks like is becoming a package deal with his brother? Is a goal scoring left wing which is an area of need for the flyers system.
It looks like those two are going out west.


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03-18-2014, 01:44 PM
  #660
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Maybe I'm being overly analytical, but I don't view Morin fighting a plug like Chapman in a tie game as a very smart thing to be doing. Chapman got under Morin's skin earlier in this game and drew a penalty.

I want Morin to be tough and fight when it's critical, but he needs to be controlled and smart about it.

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03-18-2014, 01:51 PM
  #661
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Man, has Morin ever lost a fight?

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03-18-2014, 01:54 PM
  #662
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Maybe I'm being overly analytical, but I don't view Morin fighting a plug like Chapman in a tie game as a very smart thing to be doing. Chapman got under Morin's skin earlier in this game and drew a penalty.

I want Morin to be tough and fight when it's critical, but he needs to be controlled and smart about it.
That's something that will come with age. Morin will probably fight a lot when he gets to the NHL but like Pronger and Hatcher, will almost never drop the gloves as his role and importance to the team expands. Let him beat the crap out of a few guys while he is a 4-6 defenseman on the flyers in his 1st few years.

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03-18-2014, 01:54 PM
  #663
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Man, has Morin ever lost a fight?
Yes.

http://www.dropyourgloves.com/Fights...x?Player=80899

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03-18-2014, 02:05 PM
  #664
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The carey brothers are rumored to be going to either Minny, Edmonton, or Chicago

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03-18-2014, 02:06 PM
  #665
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That site gave me a seizure.

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03-18-2014, 02:07 PM
  #666
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Maybe I'm being overly analytical, but I don't view Morin fighting a plug like Chapman in a tie game as a very smart thing to be doing. Chapman got under Morin's skin earlier in this game and drew a penalty.

I want Morin to be tough and fight when it's critical, but he needs to be controlled and smart about it.
Who cares...he's friggin 18.

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03-18-2014, 02:11 PM
  #667
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Who cares...he's friggin 18.
It's a flaw in his game that needs to be corrected to succeed at the next level.

Q: Who cares?
A: People that want to see their prospects with the maturity necessary to excel at the NHL level. After maturity issues derailed Downie and Maroon, I think it's worth watching.

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03-18-2014, 02:19 PM
  #668
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
It's a flaw in his game that needs to be corrected to succeed at the next level.

Q: Who cares?
A: People that want to see their prospects with the maturity necessary to excel at the NHL level. After maturity issues derailed Downie and Maroon, I think it's worth watching.
He will be fine. You're just over analizing him fighting. When he comes to the big leagues and if he is in a major role he will not waste his time fighting plugs. Pronger had about the same amount of fights as Morin has in their junior careers. That's just a part if their game.

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03-18-2014, 02:52 PM
  #669
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It's a flaw in his game that needs to be corrected to succeed at the next level.

Q: Who cares?
A: People that want to see their prospects with the maturity necessary to excel at the NHL level. After maturity issues derailed Downie and Maroon, I think it's worth watching.
Considering he's more then likely several years away from the NHL I wouldn't worry about it. If he's 20 and still doing the same **** then I would be a bit concerned, but not now.

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03-18-2014, 02:56 PM
  #670
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Wow + 48. Very nice

Also if timo doesn't get hurt and we don't go very deep or make the playoffs i bet he is back next year. He is still out best dman and on our top pair. He looked slow to start but great ever since. I think he may be back next year
Leier plays on one of the best offensive teams in the CHL. I'm not trying to take away from him, hes a good two way player but his numbers are a bit inflated.

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03-18-2014, 03:00 PM
  #671
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Considering he's more then likely several years away from the NHL I wouldn't worry about it. If he's 20 and still doing the same **** then I would be a bit concerned, but not now.
I agree. My point was that it's a coachable (hopefully) correction that the Flyers would be wise to get involved in now, rather than having to deal with a rookie that gets a repeat offender tag in his rookie year because he goes overboard in retaliation for a guy that gets under his skin.

This isn't a new criticism for Morin nor is this an isolated incident. He continuously gets goaded into taking stupid penalties or removing himself from the ice when his team needs him. It should be a correctable flaw in his game. One that might take some time to correct, so starting now makes a lot more sense than ignoring it because he's an immature 18-year old.

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03-18-2014, 06:05 PM
  #672
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That's something that will come with age. Morin will probably fight a lot when he gets to the NHL but like Pronger and Hatcher, will almost never drop the gloves as his role and importance to the team expands. Let him beat the crap out of a few guys while he is a 4-6 defenseman on the flyers in his 1st few years.
Agreed. One thing i really like about Morin is that he is an equal opportunity fighter. It doesn't matter if you are 5'8'' 160 16 year old, or 6'4'' 200 19 year old. And that is scary, a lot of scrappy little guys like briere and giroux know they can get away with some stuff because they know a big guy won't throw down. However Morin will, if you mess with him after the whistle he won't hesitate to rough you up, and I think that menatality is why the flyers drafted him and why we should all be excited to have him.

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03-18-2014, 06:07 PM
  #673
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Man, has Morin ever lost a fight?


I don't know if lost is the right word. More like embarrassed. I think he lives by the motto that the fights not over until someone's knocked out.

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03-18-2014, 06:29 PM
  #674
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https://twitter.com/MikeMcMahonCHN/s...46469309886464

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Minnesota Wild are the clear-cut favorite to sign Greg Carey. Multiple sources saying that. Matt seems to be between MIN, EDM, CHI and PHI.

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03-18-2014, 06:36 PM
  #675
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jesus, Minny owns free agency. How did that happen. Probably going to get vanek next year too.

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