HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must use the RUMOR prefix in thread title. Proposals must contain the PROPOSAL prefix in the thread title.

Pavelski to Toronto

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-16-2014, 01:37 PM
  #101
AimForTopCheddar
04 Bolts/Flames!
 
AimForTopCheddar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,860
vCash: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
A #1 centre is the player that plays that role, nothing less, nothing more.
So does that make Mikael Backlund...Cody Hodgson...Tyler Johnson #1 centers too? Bozak would not be a #1 on very many teams on the league and if Pavelski was placed in Toronto he would be the #1 guy. Put Bozak on SJ and he becomes the #3 guy.

Your definition of #1 center is flawed. I guess Reto Berra is a starting goalie and Jeff Petry is a #1.

AimForTopCheddar is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:37 PM
  #102
gretskidoo
Registered User
 
gretskidoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,147
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizz06 View Post
Fact - Pavelski is better than anyone the Leafs have ever had since Doug Gilmour.
He's gonna have to play till he's 50 to catch Sundin.

gretskidoo is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:38 PM
  #103
Hibachi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 748
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizz06 View Post
Pavelski > Sundin in his prime
Clearly a SJ homer, poor one at that. At least try to be creative.

Hibachi is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:39 PM
  #104
93gilmour93
Registered User
 
93gilmour93's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizz06 View Post
Pavelski > Sundin in his prime
You would think the mighty pavelski would have scored over 70 pts by now in one season considering it's his 8th season.

93gilmour93 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:39 PM
  #105
pooleboy
#chychrun2016
 
pooleboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Ontario
Posts: 6,377
vCash: 500
man that guy playing with kessel and jvr with toronto right now is tearing it up how much to get him to the leafs?

pooleboy is online now  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:41 PM
  #106
Nazemlupul
Registered User
 
Nazemlupul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Vaughan,ON
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
Top 30 center is a number 1 center, there are not 30 centers better than Pavelski but there are a good 50 better than Bozak.

Nazemlupul is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:41 PM
  #107
seanlinden
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 20,480
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
You've implied it numerous times in numerous threads. What makes you think that the power play production is dependent on Joe Thornton?
Not at all... perhaps you should read my posts with a less defensive attitude.

Thornton IMO is the best player in the league at controlling and distributing the puck in the offensive zone. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Jonathan Cheechoo a 50 goal scorer. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Pavelski, Marleau, and Couture score as much as they have over the past few years.

seanlinden is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:44 PM
  #108
seanlinden
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 20,480
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by AimForTopCheddar View Post
So does that make Mikael Backlund...Cody Hodgson...Tyler Johnson #1 centers too? Bozak would not be a #1 on very many teams on the league and if Pavelski was placed in Toronto he would be the #1 guy. Put Bozak on SJ and he becomes the #3 guy.

Your definition of #1 center is flawed. I guess Reto Berra is a starting goalie and Jeff Petry is a #1.
Absolutely. As for Pavelski on Toronto, based on their current track record, he'd probably be the #2 guy to start, and then see where it goes from there. We're not looking to change our top line at all, simply get them some secondary scoring support.

My definition isn't flawed, it's just not for somebody who needs to believe that every #1c is better than every #2c.

seanlinden is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:44 PM
  #109
AimForTopCheddar
04 Bolts/Flames!
 
AimForTopCheddar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,860
vCash: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Not at all... perhaps you should read my posts with a less defensive attitude.

Thornton IMO is the best player in the league at controlling and distributing the puck in the offensive zone. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Jonathan Cheechoo a 50 goal scorer. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Pavelski, Marleau, and Couture score as much as they have over the past few years.
Or maybe....their just good players. I guess Kessel and JVR are the only reason Bozak scores any points then?

AimForTopCheddar is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:44 PM
  #110
Ninja Hertl
formerly sharkohol
 
Ninja Hertl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: The Yay
Country: United States
Posts: 5,484
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Says who? You?

#1 centre is a role on a team, nothing more, any other definition simply opens it up to pointless debates over what title to apply, while completely ignoring the importance of actually playing the role as described.
Now you're just willfully ignoring a common sense assumption when talking about a #1 center.

Ninja Hertl is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:45 PM
  #111
coupe89
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: PEI
Country: Canada
Posts: 143
vCash: 500
First Thornton and now Pavelski who is next Toronto fans?

coupe89 is online now  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:46 PM
  #112
T M L
Registered User
 
T M L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,487
vCash: 500
Don't see SJ moving Pavs. Just not going to happen.

T M L is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:46 PM
  #113
Ninja Hertl
formerly sharkohol
 
Ninja Hertl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: The Yay
Country: United States
Posts: 5,484
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
A #1 centre is the player that plays that role, nothing less, nothing more.
Just because you tell yourself things doesn't make them true.

Ninja Hertl is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:46 PM
  #114
AimForTopCheddar
04 Bolts/Flames!
 
AimForTopCheddar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,860
vCash: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Absolutely. As for Pavelski on Toronto, based on their current track record, he'd probably be the #2 guy to start, and then see where it goes from there. We're not looking to change our top line at all, simply get them some secondary scoring support.

My definition isn't flawed, it's just not for somebody who needs to believe that every #1c is better than every #2c.
Dude you're calling players like Backlund and Tyler Johnson #1 centers....unbelievable.

AimForTopCheddar is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:46 PM
  #115
93gilmour93
Registered User
 
93gilmour93's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by coupe89 View Post
First Thornton and now Pavelski who is next Toronto fans?
Couture. Get ready

93gilmour93 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:46 PM
  #116
Nazemlupul
Registered User
 
Nazemlupul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Vaughan,ON
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by coupe89 View Post
First Thornton and now Pavelski who is next Toronto fans?
Hide Couture

Nazemlupul is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:49 PM
  #117
Ninja Hertl
formerly sharkohol
 
Ninja Hertl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: The Yay
Country: United States
Posts: 5,484
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jughead42 View Post
The term is meaningless, which is why the debates over whether Bozak is a true number one are so hilarious. One minute he's not a true number one because he doesn't score enough, then he outscores a bunch of guys who people consider "true" number one centers and some other trumped up evidence is trotted out to label him as a "number 2 or good number 3". It's all semantics. At the end of the day if he's a center playing more minutes than the rest of the centers on the team he's a number one center. If the team is winning and the player is contributing, he's probably a decent number one center. Enough already. Toronto doesn't need to recreate team USA's top line, because team USA's top line is just trying to emulate what Toronto already has in the first place. Derp.
Just because something is debatable doesn't make it meaningless. The Norris trophy is meaningless because there's no way to objectively quantify it - am I doing this right?

Ninja Hertl is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:52 PM
  #118
seanlinden
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 20,480
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja Hertl View Post
Now you're just willfully ignoring a common sense assumption when talking about a #1 center.
The common sense definition are the guys who play the role on the 30 teams.

What's your arbitrary definition?

seanlinden is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:54 PM
  #119
Aceonfire
Connor McOiler
 
Aceonfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,833
vCash: 500
It would take an overpayment as San Jose has virtually no reason to make the trade. The only 2 players on the Leafs the Sharks would want would probably be Kessel or JVR.

Aceonfire is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:54 PM
  #120
The Amity Affliction
Chasing Ghosts
 
The Amity Affliction's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 9,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
A #1 centre is the player that plays that role, nothing less, nothing more.
So being effective in that role has nothing to do with it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Honestly, I don't really care what numbers Bozak puts up. All I care about is what his line scores, and since JvRs arrival, they've been one of the most productive lines in the league.
Yes, way to dance around that.

Glad to see you admit defeat.

The Amity Affliction is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:55 PM
  #121
Bizz06
#FireDougWilson
 
Bizz06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: San Jose
Posts: 3,796
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceonfire View Post
It would take an overpayment as San Jose has virtually no reason to make the trade. The only 2 players on the Leafs the Sharks would want would probably be Kessel or JVR.
You can't be a Leafs fan, this is the most sensible thing I've read in this thread so far.

Bizz06 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:56 PM
  #122
Pinkfloyd
Registered User
 
Pinkfloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Roseville
Country: United States
Posts: 38,561
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Not at all... perhaps you should read my posts with a less defensive attitude.

Thornton IMO is the best player in the league at controlling and distributing the puck in the offensive zone. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Jonathan Cheechoo a 50 goal scorer. It's what's allowed him to make guys like Pavelski, Marleau, and Couture score as much as they have over the past few years.
You actually have whether you acknowledge it or not.

Thornton hasn't had nearly the effect that you believe he has on guys like Pavelski, Marleau, and Couture. You can look at Pavelski's goals this year and see Thornton's effect. He has assisted on 10 of his 29 goals. 6 were primary and 4 were secondary. 3 of his secondary assists were on the power play and one of his primary assists were on the power play. IOW, not the crutch that you make Thornton out to be on Pavelski's production.

Pinkfloyd is online now  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:56 PM
  #123
DuckEatinShark
GET ALL THE PPs!!!!
 
DuckEatinShark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 5,674
vCash: 500
More of this ****?

Without reading the rest of this thread, I'm guessing seanlinden is still claiming Bozak > Pavs because he's playing on the same team with Thornton, completely ignoring the fact that Pavs plays on different lines than Thornton and Couture.

Which is fine, because we wouldn't trade Pavs to Toronto.

I think I'm gonna hurl if I see anymore Pavs to Toronto threads.

DuckEatinShark is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:57 PM
  #124
Atomos2
WE ARE ABLE 340
 
Atomos2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,283
vCash: 543
Quote:
Originally Posted by DylanTheGinge View Post
Yea, I'm really high on Holland, but honestly, Gardiner looks much better than Rielly this year, I think I'd rather have him.

Gardiner, Holland, Leivo/1st + D-Prospect?
I think if do it.
I'd do this deal.

Gardiner, Holland, 1st rd pick and Macwilliam
for
Pavelski and a 3rd/B level prospect?

Tough getting rid of Macwilliam though...our marlies defence is pretty sic.

Atomos2 is offline  
Old
02-16-2014, 01:58 PM
  #125
StanleyTOR
Registered User
 
StanleyTOR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 112
vCash: 500
I must be a prophet, because I saw this coming months ago -- all these proposals of Pavelski (or any other center that plays with Kessel at the Olympics) to TOR.

Somewhat ridiculous. Kessel is effective with anyone, because he's becoming an elite player. Kessel made Bozak into an (almost) PPG man. Why does everyone thinks Kessel needs an elite center to dish him the puck? He likes having the puck himself.

EDIT: What he needs is a guy who can give him the puck to carry (face-off wins = a big plus), and that guy should also be willing to go get rebounds. So far, Bozak's doing a great job. I'm not saying Pavelski's not an upgrade, but I rather keep our core + Bozak, than giving the core up for Pavelski.

StanleyTOR is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:17 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.