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Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXII: St Louis vs St Louis

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02-24-2014, 08:25 AM
  #26
Mikos87
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
I think I read somewhere that, generally, the team acquiring the player who waived their NMC will agree to honor the NMC of said player.
Depends on the contract's language. San Jose made Dany Heatley remove his NTC before trading for him. Heatley was a player that demanded 2 trades prior to going to SJ. The Sharks wanted to cut their ties without complications if it came to that (and it did).

Philly traded Mike Richards and Jeff Carter days before their decade plus long NTCs kicked in. I image Holmgren saying something like Surprise *****es!!

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02-24-2014, 08:25 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
The only way this happens straight up is if Callahan agrees to a deal with Tampa Bay. Sounds to me like Tampa may have been the team that was granted permission to speak to Callahan's agent several weeks ago, as it would coincide with the alleged incident where MSL asked for a trade.

I admire Marty very much as a player. He's one of the best in the game, but he's pushing 40 and certainly can't play forever. This screams desperation from Sather. Instead of building for the long haul, he's trying to catch lightning in a bottle once again (no pun intended).
The thing is, it would give our prospects another year to develop. MSL will be better than Fast/Kristo next year. One year stop gap and we get something out of a UFA to be who is asking far too much money, which is why a 1 for 1 sounds too good to be true.

MSL instantly upgrades our 2nd line and we roll 3 lines that can score on a given night. Buying out Richards and penciling in Miller/Brass as the 2c next year doesn't hurt nearly as much when you can throw MSL out there with them.

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02-24-2014, 08:26 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by nyrpassion View Post
I don't get it. He's almost 40, we should've just got Jagr haha.
St. Louis is much better than Jagr.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrpassion View Post
Why would Tampa trade MSL their leading goalscorer for a grinder that is Cally, especially with Stamkos out.
If he asked for a trade and indicated he wants to go to the Rangers.....

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:27 AM
  #29
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Zucc learning from MSL makes me drool.

Watch Callahan get traded for Stewart now and this whole board goes bridge jumping. Haha.

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02-24-2014, 08:27 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Cliffy1814 View Post
The part that does not make sense is that Boomer must know that leaking this would essnetially kill the deal. If you are the GM of Pittsburgh, Anaheim, San Jose, LA and read that St Louis could be had for callahan wouldn't you call Yzerman with an offer that blows that out of the water.
Boomer is also regarded as an "insider" of sorts. I don't think he would want to ruin that rep and get bashed by Rangers fans for being full of it:

Only three scenarios I can come up with that make any sense are:
1 St Louis requested a deal and specifically asked for the Rangers. Out of respect for what St Louis has done for the Bolts Yzerman is complying?
2. The Ranger organization is looking to get rival GMS to up the ante for Callahan. One way to do that is to get people to think that Callahan is being dealt somewhere else. When it's all done and St Louis does not come here Boomer will talk about tthe elaborate ruse he helped pull off.
3. Boomer engaging in an exercise in the "Power of Social Media" How a few random tweets between fans can turn into a three ring circus where respected media (dreger, McKenzie, etc.) are werighing in on the subject.
allthough he is close with richards i think his source is in the FO. Richards wouldnt have known about the mdz-klien trade.

If his source is the FO 2 is a possibility.

Or its a negotiating ploy to get cally to come down a bit,

If st louis did ask out he has a nmc he dictates where he would want to go and has been stated his family lives in Greenwich which leaves 3-5 teams depending on how close he wants to be via car. that would leave phi, bos, nyr, nyi , and njd

realistically speaking only the bolded have a shot at sniffing the cup and only nyr would deal for him as bos has that veteran presance in iginla.

thats my $0.02

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02-24-2014, 08:27 AM
  #31
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If MSL has a NMC and the Rangers are pretty much the only team he'll waive to go to (because of playing with Richards again, etc etc who knows what the excuses are) then Tampa might feel like their hand is forced and will do a 1 for 1 trade, BUT that still only makes sense if Yzerman is so bent on being honorable and acquiescing to a trade request that he would take a mediocre return. If there isn't a good deal to be made he'd be better telling MSL to suck it up and play and try to win another cup with Tampa

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02-24-2014, 08:27 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Rangers Fail View Post
When he waives it, does that just mean to any team out there, or is there a list? That's what I want to know. Need details. Where's RB when you need him?
I would think he would have to agree to any trade.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:28 AM
  #33
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What's weird is that many assume Stevey Y didn't draft MSL into team Canada so he could save him for the playoffs, yet now he's ready to pick up one of the biggest grinders who did play in the Olympics

hmm

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02-24-2014, 08:28 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
The only way this happens straight up is if Callahan agrees to a deal with Tampa Bay. Sounds to me like Tampa may have been the team that was granted permission to speak to Callahan's agent several weeks ago, as it would coincide with the alleged incident where MSL asked for a trade.

I admire Marty very much as a player. He's one of the best in the game, but he's pushing 40 and certainly can't play forever. This screams desperation from Sather. Instead of building for the long haul, he's trying to catch lightning in a bottle once again (no pun intended).
I forgot about that mystery team granted permission to speak with his agent.
The timing would match up.

Marty has shown zero sign of slowing down. Do I think the Rangers will win a cup this year or next? No. Do I think they are a top 5 team in this league? No.
I think that they can/are reasonably close to being a top 10 team. A top 10 team with a world class goalie has more than a punchers chance.

It all boils down for me to what offers of young players/picks Callahan could extract from other teams. I feel like most of the posters here are over valuing the package Callahan could fetch. If he could bring back a 1st and a legitimate high end prospect who is close to being ready I make that deal over this one.

If all I can get is a # (likely in the 20's from a contender) 1 OR a prospect I am taking 1.5 years of MSL.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:28 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Riche16 View Post
Even if this is the case Stevie Y isn't gonna call Sather, explain his dilemma and say "Thanks for ur help Glen" and hang up as soon as Sather says "I've got this pending UFA who wants the moon that I can give you... He kills penalties"
The same GM that got Jagr for Anson Carter under similar circumstances?

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:29 AM
  #36
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As much as I like MSL and this deal, the way some of you minimize what Cally does for a hockey team is disgusting.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:30 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
The same GM that got Jagr for Anson Carter under similar circumstances?
yeah but that was George McPhee being a dumbass and paying for his mistake of bringing Jagr into a situation he didn't want to be in. Also everyone in Washington hated Jagr at that point and the rest of the league seemed to be thinking he was on a downslide

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:30 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
The same GM that got Jagr for Anson Carter under similar circumstances?
How are these similar circumstances?

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:32 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
How is this a similar situation?
Star player wanted out. Only one team to trade with.

Caps retained salary too to make the deal happen.

Somebody hand Glen the KY.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:33 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
Star player wanted out. Only one team to trade with.

Caps retained salary too to make the deal happen.

Somebody hand Glen the KY.
That was a financial move, not a hockey move.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:33 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
Star player wanted out. Only one team to trade with.

Caps retained salary too to make the deal happen.

Somebody hand Glen the KY.
Everyone thought said star player was basically turning into garbage and that his career was over. There's a major difference.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:33 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
If MSL has a NMC and the Rangers are pretty much the only team he'll waive to go to (because of playing with Richards again, etc etc who knows what the excuses are) then Tampa might feel like their hand is forced and will do a 1 for 1 trade, BUT that still only makes sense if Yzerman is so bent on being honorable and acquiescing to a trade request that he would take a mediocre return. If there isn't a good deal to be made he'd be better telling MSL to suck it up and play and try to win another cup with Tampa
My apologies.
I had it backwards.
Kypreos had the info. He tweeted last night at 10:34 that MSL has a full NMC NOW that expires next season.

This sounds more promising
Best of both worlds for NYR. He could be demanding a trade now (Only to NYR). Glen could then flip him at the deadline next season if need be without having to run it through the player.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:34 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
The only way this happens straight up is if Callahan agrees to a deal with Tampa Bay. Sounds to me like Tampa may have been the team that was granted permission to speak to Callahan's agent several weeks ago, as it would coincide with the alleged incident where MSL asked for a trade.

I admire Marty very much as a player. He's one of the best in the game, but he's pushing 40 and certainly can't play forever. This screams desperation from Sather. Instead of building for the long haul, he's trying to catch lightning in a bottle once again (no pun intended).
Exactly.

We need a #1C and preferably a PMD, both McDonagh's age or younger in order to finally have the infrastructure of a consistent contender. Any moves that don't lead directly to one of those players should lead to other assets that can be used to get them down the line (either in subsequent deals or directly through the draft).

Acquiring a 38 year old who plays our deepest organizational position is a short-sighted distraction that actually moves us away from what should be our long term goal, DESPITE the fact that, yes, he is better right now than the player we'd be giving up.

Someone over the weekend ridiculed the idea of getting picks and prospects by saying "what are we trying to be now, the Tampa Bay Rays"? Sticking with that analogy, no, we don't want to be the TB Rays (although they'd be great if hey had any budget at all to keep he players they develop); what we should want to be is the 1990s Yankees. Get core young players at C, SS, CF and LH SP. Then and only then you look at bringing in Clemens and Cone. If this deal went down as proposed, it would be a lot more like a lazy, name- and headline-chasing Steinbrenner move from the 80s.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:38 AM
  #44
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If the return for Callahan in young players/prospects is mediocre, moving him for a 38-year old PPG player is a better trade to make. This really isn't so simple as "I'd rather have picks and prospects" or "I'd rather take a shot at winning now." It isn't that absolute.

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:38 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
If we are able to get a good 3-4 years out of MSL, this trade is far and away a huge win for us, and more than we are likely to ever get out of a late 1st and some B prospects, which is what we would probably get for Callahan.
If we're getting MSL for Callahan straight up, I have to imagine another GM would do better than a late 1st and a B prospect. Let's not act as if 3-4 more good years out of MSL is a guarantee. All it takes is one nagging injury and he could become a shell of himself. He's a fitness fanatic, but he's still 38 years old and his body will break down eventually.

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02-24-2014, 08:38 AM
  #46
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As much as I like MSL and this deal, the way some of you minimize what Cally does for a hockey team is disgusting.
He's a heart and soul 40-50p winger. He's been a great Ranger. Nobody is diminishing that. He's also often injured, and wants to be paid like an impact player on a long term contract. Ryan Callahan is not an impact player most nights, not anymore. And those idiotic behind-the-back turnover passes he learned from Richards have been grinding on my nerves the last 3 seasons.

I still love Callahan, but he priced himself out of NY. He has every right to do so, but I just pray we're not the team that pays him.

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02-24-2014, 08:40 AM
  #47
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That would tie to Brooks's storyline from last night. Let's pray that the Rangers haven't bent over and conceded on the other part of that same story, which was TB demanding a slew of prospects and picks in addition to Cally.

Honestly, I don't care if Slats whittled him down to a 1-to-1 deal. It's the wrong move. Why for once aren't we the team recouping picks and prospects?

And can we please stop with the "Lundqvist's window" crap? He's likely got another good 7-10 years in him based on the career arcs of previous allstar goalies. And so what if he doesn't? After him it'll be McDonagh's window closing, and then Kreider's and then Duclair's (if we don't trade him for MSL), etc., etc. Someone's window is ALWAYS closing. Its a poor argument for constantly making the quick-fix move.

The right way to build a team is to continue to amass assets until you've got a complete core in place. Then, and only then, should you consider bringing in older, complementary pieces to fill in.
Because according to some, trading Callahan signals "rebuild".

It's possible to trade veterans at the end of their tenure with the team, for young assets, and still be a competitive team. There is enough veteran leadership on this team, trading Callahan for a young player (younger than St. Louis especially) won't effect "Lundqvist's window" the way some would have you believe. Didn't Henrik sign a long-term deal? His window isn't closing any time soon.

What does St. Louis do for this club? In the short term does it make us better than Pittsburgh, Boston, Anaheim, Chicago, San Jose, LA, even Tampa Bay? The answer is no. In the long term what does it do for us other than waste a perfectly good trade chip on an aging player for some dillusional shot in the dark run at a Cup we are not winning this or next season.

Lack of foresight.

Stewart + Schmaltz + pick would be better for this club going forward.

This is classic Sather, "i recognize that name, lets trade for him!".

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Old
02-24-2014, 08:41 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
If the return for Callahan in young players/prospects is mediocre, moving him for a 38-year old PPG player is a better trade to make. This really isn't so simple as "I'd rather have picks and prospects" or "I'd rather take a shot at winning now." It isn't that absolute.
Well if you are trading a guy that is the 4th best player on the team... maybe 5th after Hank, McD, Nash... arguably Zucc, Staal, and Step... for a guy that might be the best player on the team in MSL...

I'd rather win. Today, Tomorrow, even Yesterday for that matter.

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02-24-2014, 08:41 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
If we're getting MSL for Callahan straight up, I have to imagine another GM would do better than a late 1st and a B prospect. Let's not act as if 3-4 more good years out of MSL is a guarantee. All it takes is one nagging injury and he could become a shell of himself. He's a fitness fanatic, but he's still 38 years old and his body will break down eventually.
And it isn't just his body. People bring up that he's a fitness freak all the time, but the reality is that most players don't retire because their body breaks down. They retire because the reaction time deteriorates to the point where they're no longer an effective hockey player at the NHL level. There's no way to predict when or how fast that will happen.

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02-24-2014, 08:41 AM
  #50
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If MSL is getting moved to MSG these could (operative word) be some of the reasons why:

1. St. Louis is at least somewhat miffed by the Team Canada selection thing. Not hard to understand. He's carried TB's offense this year--not Stamkos--and he's a bit pissed with his own GM for bending over backwards for Stamkos and making him a last minute replacement.

2. He has roots in the NYC area + he's been talking to a former teammate of his who trained with him last summer and currently plays for the Rangers.

3. Yzerman's thinking could be that he does not want such a key player being unhappy down the stretch run and into the playoffs. It might just as well be that he moves him on just because he's been such a good soldier for such a long time and has asked out and specifically has named NYC as his desired destination.

4. Rangers determination to move Callahan--while not equal value in the offense department--Callahan is a very rounded gritty player with quite a lot of playoff experience and leadership qualities. He would be a good fit on almost any team going into the post season.

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