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Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXII: St Louis vs St Louis

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:48 AM
  #201
Ail
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Originally Posted by Vidic15 View Post
Boomer did mention this morning on his show that this has been in the works for 4 weeks now. So he could have come out with this sooner.
Why would he though? So everyone was debating it over the entire course of the Olympics? More importantly so Cally and MSL could stew in it while trying to win gold medals? Boomer said as of Saturday night he wasn't even sure the players involved knew about it.

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02-24-2014, 10:49 AM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Barbara Underhill View Post
Considering he's scored 116 pts in his last 106 games I find it hard to believe he's at a magical threshold in which all his offense dries up in the next 10 games or so.
With the way things go for the Rangers I could see him getting
Like 2 points in his first 10 games. And then I just goes downhill from there. Not to mention we lose what little grit we had anyway with Cally gone.

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02-24-2014, 10:50 AM
  #203
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This is what happens when the President and GM of the team will be 71 later this year. Everything moves so slow in Rangerland. The Rangers have so many decisions to make and they're in the same spot. Sather is disconnected. It sounds like Sather spent the break in Palm Springs with his wife Anne. AV made the comment about waiting to talk to Glen when he gets back to discuss any callups. Back from where? He is too old for this job. It requires a ton of hours and vision. The old guy is 71.

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02-24-2014, 10:50 AM
  #204
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The things that St. Louis will do for some of the players on this team would be magical.

I still don't see it happening though.

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02-24-2014, 10:50 AM
  #205
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Originally Posted by Barbara Underhill View Post
Tough to answer but I'd assume he still is. I imagine after getting slighted a 2nd time he decided he wanted to be traded and talked it over with his family and so forth. Once you get to that juncture and start thinking of what might be it's hard to reverse it and go the other way. Yes he got to go win a gold, but he only played 7 minutes a game and wasn't the teams first choice. It's like having the schools hottest girl turn you down for prom and then when her date gets sick last minute she asks you to go.
Yeah absolutely. There has been a severe over reaction on the main board because this did not materialize at 12:01.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:51 AM
  #206
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I think that is still a lofty return for Callahan. That is more than a tkachuk rental. Definitely more than hossa's rental price in hindsight.

I may be wrong, but I think Callahan would command an expendable roster player plus a high prospect/late first rd pick at best. Its arguable if any pick is better than 1-3 years of MSL, but I would rather have the player in this case.
To be clear, I was saying:

- a first round pick
- 1-2 other assets (prospect/pick/young player)
- a CONDITIONAL pick (if Cally walks after the season, this vanishes or becomes much less valuable)

The offer is pretty much comparable to yours with the additional conditional asset, which has become much more common over the last few years.

I would much rather have that offer than 1-3 years of MSL. I don't think MSL gets us over the hump this year and, regardless, does nothing towards building to the long-term strength of the team. The assets I've laid out can than be used directly - or in combination with other assets - to get the pieces we need.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:52 AM
  #207
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I love MSL. Love him. He's my bae. Alright but really I would love him on this team. But we need to think younger. MSL isn't showing real signs of decline, but that shouldn't give us the OK to trade for a 38 year old winger, though he's probably a HOF'er.

It's been said but our two big problems aren't fixed by MSL. #1 Center, PMD.

We're already good on RW.

And while I believe talent>size all the time, having a 5' 7", and a 5' 8" player on the same team isn't really ideal.

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02-24-2014, 10:53 AM
  #208
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I'm resigned to losing Callahan, which sucks. But what can you do? If he wants that much money, he's gotta go.

Adding a player the caliber of St. Louis could be a big boost to the team. Now, I'd absolutely love to get back young players and picks, but St. Louis is a great return in his own right. Lundqvist is in his prime, and at some point we're going to have to "go for it." Does St. Louis make us a true contender? Maybe not, but he certainly takes us closer than if we were to stand pat with Callahan, or if we were to acquire some younger assets that might not help for a couple years.

If the deal really is St. Louis for Callahan, I'm okay with it. As okay as I can be with trading the Cally, anyway.

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02-24-2014, 10:53 AM
  #209
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I don't think it would work directly with Tampa, but I could see it with a third team in.

Something like:

To San Jose: Callahan
Rangers: Nieto, picks

To Rangers: St. Louis
To Tampa Bay: Hagelin, picks

I could see being workable.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:54 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
"Young talent" is just such a vague word.

It's definitely not a given that we are better of in 5 years by getting a low percentage lottery tickets as opposed to getting better short term. If we play well, out other pieces get more value. Our young players on the roster develops more. Etc.

There is a destinct risk that we would end up trading Cally for Enver Lisin II. There is ONLY downside with that deal.
I feel like lots of posters aren't thinking about the bolded. Having a winning culture is important. Avoiding any "now" moves until the magical threshold where all these potential picks turn into something isn't the way to do it in my opinion. The young guys here now deserve to grow up on a team with a chance at winning, and I'd argue that they'll be better players for it. Seems like great teams have no problem bringing young guys up and finding a perpetual stream of young talent. Sure, some of it is just picking well and having lots of talent around them, but I do think part of it is coming up on a team that you know can win. People work harder for success when it seems like it's within reach as opposed to being impossibly far way in my opinion.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:55 AM
  #211
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Cristodero believes Yzerman wouldn't trade MSL just for Callahan.

Quote:
If we have learned anything about Yzerman, he is all about the kids, keeping and acquiring young talent that helps insulate the organization from salary cap pressures and feeds the conveyor belt from the minors to keep the organization invigorated over time.

So it is highly unlikely Yzerman would go for a straight up swap for Callahan, especially since there is the possibility he would be no more than a rental if he decided to test free agency.

Even the Post reported Sather was not willing to give up the additional prospects and/or draft choices it would have taken for Yzerman to even consider a deal.

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:56 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by Ail View Post
Old, however still somewhat relevant. Again, the question is, is MSL still upset now that he won gold?

If the answer is no, I am certain this trade will fizzle.
The family in CT seems more plausible to me and if the Olympic snub was just another example of how Stevie Y and he don't get along, maybe?

I mean, I'm not convinced... not even close.

What scares me is the tweet about "fans not being happy" and that there will be debate. But those tweets are almost trumped with the "1 for 1" talk... which I just can't believe. If it's 1 for 1 most would be happy if not ok with it, if it's not 1 for 1 then what are we adding and then I could see fans not happy.

It's like the two bits of info are diametrically opposed. Unless he thinks most of the fan base doesn't realize that Cally is almost certainly going to be dealt.

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02-24-2014, 10:56 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
This is what happens when the President and GM of the team will be 71 later this year. Everything moves so slow in Rangerland. The Rangers have so many decisions to make and they're in the same spot. Sather is disconnected. It sounds like Sather spent the break in Palm Springs with his wife Anne. AV made the comment about waiting to talk to Glen when he gets back to discuss any callups. Back from where? He is too old for this job. It requires a ton of hours and vision. The old guy is 71.
To what is this post referring?

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:56 AM
  #214
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Not going to check if this has been posted, but.

Quote:
St. Louis, who carries a cap hit of $5.625 million, is believed to have met separately and a few weeks apart with club owner Jeff Vinik and Yzerman in the wake of being bypassed by his own GM for Team Canada.
Quote:
The same holds regarding similarly pending free agents Dan Girardi and Brian Boyle.
Quote:
Sather, who is believed to have offered no more than a five-year extension at a somewhat lower average cost, has informed executives on other clubs the Rangers would deal Girardi rather than get nothing in return should he flee in July.
http://nypost.com/2014/02/23/no-trac...lahan-sources/

Found these quotes interesting.

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02-24-2014, 10:56 AM
  #215
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if this goes thorugh we hav rougly 3 years with him still producing i would think in those 3 years were gonna make a run at cup so this off season theyre gonna hav to make some big transactions

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Old
02-24-2014, 10:57 AM
  #216
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It was a mistake not to sign Callahan to a long term deal?

It is arguable whether Callahan earns his paycheck now.

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02-24-2014, 10:58 AM
  #217
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I agree completely. I'm still skeptical however until the official confirmed trade happens. I feel like this is type of trade that could easily fall though on a whim.
yep, remember the del zotto/stamkos deal....kinda similar haha

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02-24-2014, 11:01 AM
  #218
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Originally Posted by McRanger View Post
It was a mistake not to sign Callahan to a long term deal?

It is arguable whether Callahan earns his paycheck now.
While I don't agree with that statement, I don't think it was a mistake.

Signing him for another three years would have upped the AAV significantly, and while ages 29-31 look somewhat safe now, it was very much an unknown at age 25.

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02-24-2014, 11:04 AM
  #219
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That's possible as well. Namestnikov is another very good young forward. Purcell has excelled with Stamkos. Johnson. Panik. They have a lot of good young forwards.
We should be dealing with the TB, Edmonton, and Dallas of the NHL - teams with highly touted forward depth. And somehow steal Vatanen from the Quacks. I'm still not giving up

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Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
Uhhh...Drouin?
I meant short term, Kucherov could fill that slot, though not entirely.

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This is what happens when the President and GM of the team will be 71 later this year. Everything moves so slow in Rangerland. The Rangers have so many decisions to make and they're in the same spot. Sather is disconnected. It sounds like Sather spent the break in Palm Springs with his wife Anne. AV made the comment about waiting to talk to Glen when he gets back to discuss any callups. Back from where? He is too old for this job. It requires a ton of hours and vision. The old guy is 71.
I agree he's no spring chicken, still makes seat of his pants decisions. I'm sure options are discussed but its obvious year after year that there is no solid plan in place. For a guy who has really won nothing for over 20 years its hard to think that's the best way to run an organization.

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02-24-2014, 11:05 AM
  #220
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Good trade if it happens.

I like it. Sather is committing to something. Winning now.

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02-24-2014, 11:07 AM
  #221
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I'm resigned to losing Callahan, which sucks. But what can you do? If he wants that much money, he's gotta go.

Adding a player the caliber of St. Louis could be a big boost to the team. Now, I'd absolutely love to get back young players and picks, but St. Louis is a great return in his own right. Lundqvist is in his prime, and at some point we're going to have to "go for it." Does St. Louis make us a true contender? Maybe not, but he certainly takes us closer than if we were to stand pat with Callahan, or if we were to acquire some younger assets that might not help for a couple years.

If the deal really is St. Louis for Callahan, I'm okay with it. As okay as I can be with trading the Cally, anyway.
This is sort of where I am, although I am nowhere near as disappointed in not keeping Callahan as some here are. I'd love a quality prospect and a #1, but is that package that much better than getting a premier offensive player for at least this year and the next? Is it short-sided? Perhaps, but I wouldn't discount what a player like MSL could bring to this locker room, and I would think it would have a positive effect on both Richards and Nash. Frankly, as this dance has moved along I find myself more and more intrigued by the prospect of seeing MSL as a Ranger. Again, it's not a long-term move, but, I'd be a lot negative towards this kind of deal if it was an actual 'mortgage the future' move.

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02-24-2014, 11:08 AM
  #222
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
I don't think it would work directly with Tampa, but I could see it with a third team in.

Something like:

To San Jose: Callahan
Rangers: Nieto, picks

To Rangers: St. Louis
To Tampa Bay: Hagelin, picks

I could see being workable.
Boomer confirmed it was a 1 for 1.

I'm assuming the conditional pick he mentioned would be if Callahan resigned. Makes total sense.

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Old
02-24-2014, 11:08 AM
  #223
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This is what happens when the President and GM of the team will be 71 later this year. Everything moves so slow in Rangerland. The Rangers have so many decisions to make and they're in the same spot. Sather is disconnected. It sounds like Sather spent the break in Palm Springs with his wife Anne. AV made the comment about waiting to talk to Glen when he gets back to discuss any callups. Back from where? He is too old for this job. It requires a ton of hours and vision. The old guy is 71.
Couldnt have said it better myself. This has been a cushy job for Sather for years. I have nothing to substantiate this -but it sure seems like he's got the least amount of work ethic of any GM in the league. He acts like this is a part-time job and he's semi retied - because he is. Its fine if he wants to be elsewhere, enjoying time with his wife and family. Im sure he's earned that. But don't do it at the expense of an organization, its fans, and co-workers. Can't imagine how much he leaves to Gorton and others and how that makes them feel considering that some of what's handed down is above their pay grade.

Again, I have no inside knowledge of what goes on behind closed doors. But from my perspective, hearing how he's seldom with the team, his royal lack of transparency and attendance with the press, his penchant for nepotistic laziness, his lack of preparedness and scouting free agents and given the teams results over his tenure here - it sure seems like he has no clear vision and his work ethic should be questioned..

Now throw into the mix that he's had some recent health issues and hes 70. Regardless of the fact that its a group effort in building a team, you still need one person pulling the trigger and ultimately calling the shots as a leader. He is still the GM and its his team. He needs to act like it or retire. He has a dream of that one last Cup in NY, but he running out of time. He's been running out of time for 10+ years and the decisions he makes are subconsciously or consciously influenced by that.


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Old
02-24-2014, 11:09 AM
  #224
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This is what happens when the President and GM of the team will be 71 later this year. Everything moves so slow in Rangerland. The Rangers have so many decisions to make and they're in the same spot. Sather is disconnected. It sounds like Sather spent the break in Palm Springs with his wife Anne. AV made the comment about waiting to talk to Glen when he gets back to discuss any callups. Back from where? He is too old for this job. It requires a ton of hours and vision. The old guy is 71.
yup yup. stuck out when i read AV's comments the other day.

He can't give up the fix he gets from being a power player. Dude could spend the rest of his days traveling the world but he can't give up the juice.

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02-24-2014, 11:09 AM
  #225
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Boomer confirmed it was a 1 for 1.

I'm assuming the conditional pick is if Cally he mentioned would be if Callahan resigned. Makes total sense.
Yeah, and that's where I think Boomer was overambitious in his report.

I cannot see it being 1-for-1, let alone the Rangers getting a conditional pick along with St. Louis.

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