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Too Many Moves!!

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08-14-2005, 02:19 AM
  #1
John Druce
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Too Many Moves!!

If Sutter has signed Hamrlik, he's done too much tinkering.

I agree that the Calgary Flames are a better team on paper now than they were at the end of the '04 season - but I can't help feeling that the Flames game is predicated on obscurity and teamplay - something that might not be possible with these new signings. I guess we'll just have to see how good a job Sutter does coaching these guys into a unit.

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08-14-2005, 02:33 AM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mallard
If Sutter has signed Hamrlik, he's done too much tinkering.

I agree that the Calgary Flames are a better team on paper now than they were at the end of the '04 season - but I can't help feeling that the Flames game is predicated on obscurity and teamplay - something that might not be possible with these new signings. I guess we'll just have to see how good a job Sutter does coaching these guys into a unit.
Lets see how many moves he has really done over the last season of play.

#1 - He keeps the same number 1 goalie (Kipper) that brought them success.
(no change).

#2 - He retains Leopold, Regher, Montador, Ference, Warrener (these guys forsure, possible Lydman traded). So he keeps 5 out of the 7 guys on defense that were here last year...so basically he has swapped out the Flames #5 guy (Gauts) and possibly the #4 guy (Lydman). No big change, hasn't touched the top 3 on defense and our #1 defensive pair hasn't been changed. Nothing drastic on the blueline.

#3 - The Flames keep Iginla, Lombardi, Kobasew, Yelle, Donovan, Nilson, Simon, Rhino upfront. That is 8 forwards out of 12 active roster spots. So he keeps 75% of the forwards intact...not a major overhaul.

So he does not change to the #1 goalie spot, he keeps 5/7 defense the same...possibly 6/7 if Hamrlik isn't signed and he keeps 8/12 active forward spots the same.

I don't really see what you are so worried about..Sutter hasn't done much "tinkering".

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08-14-2005, 04:16 AM
  #3
ForeignFlame
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I think at least a 25% turnover is pretty normal. Haven't worked out the percentages in Calgary's case, but change is a constant. Given the state of things with the lockout and so many free agents around, Sutter would have been crazy not to try and upgrade where he felt improvement was needed.

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08-14-2005, 07:09 AM
  #4
Badger Bob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick - Flames Fan
so basically he has swapped out the Flames #5 guy (Gauts) and possibly the #4 guy (Lydman).
Also, the team was used to playing without them for most of the playoffs last year. These are both useful players. Gauthier was used to help bring in a useful asset, while Lydman would be very marketable, as well, despite the dippy assessment on the Trade Rumors board ("uhhh, I've got his 'value' pegged at a 4th rounder!").

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08-14-2005, 08:33 AM
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People seem to forget a minor factor, sure last season we did great in the playoffs, but during the regular season we weren't overly convincing. You need a team which can make the playoffs and be a regular season contender beforehand. Now Sutter obviously recognized this and has made great moves to address it. I think what he's done is great ,and am excited to see what he has up his sleeves. I feel the next 72 hours will see some interesting moves

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08-14-2005, 09:40 AM
  #6
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Sutter just can't win. If he were to stand pat and keep the team entirely together, people would complain, and if he revamps the squad, people will complain. I have seen too many teams like the Ducks and Canes stand pat or even get weaker, and fall on their face the following year. I really like what Sutter has done

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08-14-2005, 11:57 AM
  #7
therealdeal
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Remember, Sutter has more hockey knowledge in his pinky finger than you do in your whole body.

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Old
08-14-2005, 10:13 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by therealdeal
Remember, Sutter has more hockey knowledge in his pinky finger than you do in your whole body.
Not to hijack your thread, but:

An Oiler fan here, browsing through threads while looking for some other info, but coming from a fan base who regularly questions their leader (I'd say there's about as many Lowe supporters as there are detractors), I thought that was an interesting comment. Are most Flames fans as confident in Sutter as you are? I personally think he's done a great job with the Flames.

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08-14-2005, 10:16 PM
  #9
HuskyFlames
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Showerhead
Not to hijack your thread, but:

An Oiler fan here, browsing through threads while looking for some other info, but coming from a fan base who regularly questions their leader (I'd say there's about as many Lowe supporters as there are detractors), I thought that was an interesting comment. Are most Flames fans as confident in Sutter as you are? I personally think he's done a great job with the Flames.
Yes, I would say 90% are very confident in Sutter.

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08-14-2005, 11:17 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Showerhead
Not to hijack your thread, but:

An Oiler fan here, browsing through threads while looking for some other info, but coming from a fan base who regularly questions their leader (I'd say there's about as many Lowe supporters as there are detractors), I thought that was an interesting comment. Are most Flames fans as confident in Sutter as you are? I personally think he's done a great job with the Flames.
its a good question

remember its not like Flames fans aren't used to questioning the GM...can anyone say Risebrough? Coates? Button??

Sutter won himself alot of goodwill in the 2003-2004 season. maybe too much good will.

he has done a very good job so far, but he's obviously not infallible. he's been WAY better than I anticipated though...this will be an important test year for him I'd think

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08-14-2005, 11:47 PM
  #11
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Sutter has gained a huge amount of trust with the Calgary fans. A lot of people know assume when Sutter makes a move that it is a good one.

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08-15-2005, 12:26 AM
  #12
Habs13
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I think this years Calgary squad is going to be pretty sick.. guess I'll be chearing for the Flames again if the Habs get knocked out.

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Old
08-15-2005, 12:43 AM
  #13
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i think its well worht it, Flames could very easily win the division and possibly the conference. The easily now have a top 3 blueline.

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Old
08-15-2005, 08:45 AM
  #14
Snap Wilson
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I just like the idea of a hockey team being "predicated on obscurity."

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Old
08-15-2005, 05:45 PM
  #15
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Indeed. But teams that come from obscurity return to obscurity real damn quick unless they adapt and improve.

Sutter has done this. A 25% turnover in two years is not significant. In fact, I would bet it is downright normal.

As far as trusting Sutter, in the 2 1/2 years he has been the head coach and GM (unofficially the GM in the last half of 02-03, but really, can anyone believe the moves we made late in the season were anyone but Sutter?) he has yet to make a bad decision. Every player he has aquired has either met or exceeded expectations.

How the hell can you argue with that kind of track record?

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Old
08-17-2005, 10:18 AM
  #16
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i think some of the moves were made with an eye to the future and to allow for more moves to be made at the trade deadline, next draft, next summer, (Hamrlik for example)

Amonte, McCarthy to give Chucko and Nystrom time to get to the NHL without rushing them and ruining their careers, plus insurance in case lombardi isn't able to play a full season or Kobasew has the ups and downs again.

How quickly fans forget or maybe most here are too young to remember one of the reasons the flames were so bad in the late 90's early 2000's was the lack of continual improvement on a year to year basis and expecting too much from their young players.

I think Hamrlik is proof that Sutter likes Phaneuf but doesn't think he will step in at an all star level right away and also a way to put pressure on Leopold to step it up on the PP. If he doesn't, Hamrlik is a proven PP QB and the Flames PP won't suffer like it did at times in 03/04.

He has a more realistic view of the team and expectations than any GM and/or coach since Fletcher.

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