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Are the sens in trouble without Havlat?

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Old
10-02-2003, 07:38 AM
  #1
Skrymir
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Are the sens in trouble without Havlat?

Things look pretty grim between the sens in Havlat. And I'm beginning to doubt he'll be signed for openning night.

Do they people still have the same expectations of the Sens without Havlat in the lineup for an extended period of time?

Many publications have chosen Ottawa to win the northeast division, eastern conference and Presidents trophy. Are any or all of theses still feasable?

Personally I think they are, but I'm a sens fan and I'm just looking for what other people think.

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10-02-2003, 08:11 AM
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discostu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skrymir
Things look pretty grim between the sens in Havlat. And I'm beginning to doubt he'll be signed for openning night.

Do they people still have the same expectations of the Sens without Havlat in the lineup for an extended period of time?

Many publications have chosen Ottawa to win the northeast division, eastern conference and Presidents trophy. Are any or all of theses still feasable?

Personally I think they are, but I'm a sens fan and I'm just looking for what other people think.
As a fellow Sens fan, you probably aren't looking for what I think, but here it goes anyways.

I think they won't notice much of a difference. Reason being is that Hossa's been looking like a machine in camp and the exhibition games. I originally expected him to produce at about the same level this year as last, however, many analysts are now expecting him to improve on his incredible season last year. If he's performing at that high a level, he'll have no problem with the increased ice time.

The other reason is the Jason Spezza factor. He's been another strong performer in camp, and looks to be an improved player over the summer, thanks to a strict work-out program. He's had enough exposure to the NHL game that I think he'll be a valuable contributor right from the get go.

Havlat is a definite asset to this team, but we can be compete without him. He'll improve our chances at the titles you've described, but we're still among the favourites for it, with or without him. Also, the regular season isn't going to mean much to this team. I think they're all aware that the test is going to be in the playoffs, where the focus is on the Stanley Cup. I'm certain that the Havlat situation will get resolved before then, so I'm not too concerned.

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10-02-2003, 08:13 AM
  #3
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The Sens won the President last season, that was with Havlat injured for nearly 20 games, and without Smolinkski and Jason Spezza for nearly 60. If any team could overcome the loss of a top 6 scoring forward, it be the Sens. Especially when you consider that Spezza alone would and could make up for his absence, let alone when you add Smolinski.

Sure they are less stronger without him, but it won't affect their season as much as it would affect the Nucks or Bolts to name some.

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10-02-2003, 08:21 AM
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John Flyers Fan
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Even without Havlat the Sens should be a lock for the division crown.

I would also still have them in the small group of teams that will compete for the Presidents trophy & the Stanley Cup.

However, I would drop them from "favored" status.

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10-02-2003, 08:34 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Even without Havlat the Sens should be a lock for the division crown.

I would also still have them in the small group of teams that will compete for the Presidents trophy & the Stanley Cup.

However, I would drop them from "favored" status.
Now...if it was Hossa, Alfie, Redden, Chara or Lalime..yeah...I could feasibly agree with you. But Havlat???? Kid is good and has value, but I don't think that the Sens would miss him THAT much.

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10-02-2003, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensGod
Now...if it was Hossa, Alfie, Redden, Chara or Lalime..yeah...I could feasibly agree with you. But Havlat???? Kid is good and has value, but I don't think that the Sens would miss him THAT much.
Re-read my post.

I said lock for division, and still as good a chance as any to win the Cup or Presidents Trophy.

Right now I consider the Senators the favorites for both, without Havlat I would drop them slightly and have them as equals to a few other teams.

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10-02-2003, 09:15 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Re-read my post.

I said lock for division, and still as good a chance as any to win the Cup or Presidents Trophy.

Right now I consider the Senators the favorites for both, without Havlat I would drop them slightly and have them as equals to a few other teams.
Gotcha...I'll go clean my glasses

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10-02-2003, 09:24 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensGod
Gotcha...I'll go clean my glasses

Might be too much SoCo.

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10-02-2003, 09:29 AM
  #9
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Word is going around that he is prepared to sit out the WHOLE season if he doesnt get his 4 million and change over two years....sad

Havlat is one of those players that can sell tickets and provide excitement for the fans but if he doesn't want to do that we still have THe Hoss and Spez factor to work with.

NOte to Havlat: Dont be dumb, you are possibly throwing away a stanley cup ring!

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10-02-2003, 09:42 AM
  #10
discostu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
Word is going around that he is prepared to sit out the WHOLE season if he doesnt get his 4 million and change over two years....sad
Don't read too much into that. What else is he going to say? I'm going to hold-out until December 15th, so if you don't give me what I want, you'll have to wait until then!

It doesn't provide much of a threat. This isn't to say that he may not be willing to sit out that long, but if he wasn't, he wouldn't be sharing that information.

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10-02-2003, 09:53 AM
  #11
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I think the Sens will be fine.

The only worry is that they will be a little less deep, and sometimes bad things can happen in the NHL.

Let's say, for instance, there are a couple of bad injuries to some key players... well... then it's going to be harder for the Sens to stay on top.

I think Havlat is also a really dynamic player and sometimes he's a game-breaker. This doesn't make him essential, but it give the team a few more points here and there.

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10-02-2003, 10:02 AM
  #12
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The sens are not in trouble without Havlat we have tremendous depth.

They like every other team would be better with Havlat in the lineup but its not the end of the world.

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10-02-2003, 10:05 AM
  #13
south-sentral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by discostu
Don't read too much into that. What else is he going to say? I'm going to hold-out until December 15th, so if you don't give me what I want, you'll have to wait until then!

It doesn't provide much of a threat. This isn't to say that he may not be willing to sit out that long, but if he wasn't, he wouldn't be sharing that information.
I see what your saying but the potential is still there..

if Havlat wants a real shot at the cup and not jeopardize his development as a young player he should just suck it up and sign with the sens! There's no way sens management is going to blink first.

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10-02-2003, 10:38 AM
  #14
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They haven't lost a preseason game yet if that is any indication....

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10-02-2003, 11:08 AM
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As others here have noted the Sens have the depth to make up for the loss of Havlat. This is where the Senators differ from the Edmonton Oilers and their contract issues with Mike Comrie. Edmonton doesn't have the depth. Particularly among proven scorers in the lineup.

The only way this could be seriously detrimental is if injuries start cropping up, or guys start to tire as the season grinds along in February and March. Particularly Spezza who has not played a full 82 game schedule yet.

In the short term though I don't see that this will slow them down overmuch.

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10-02-2003, 12:07 PM
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If Havlat holds out the entire year, I still think it's 50/50 the Sens score more goals than they did last year.

Even if they lost Havlat's 25 and Arvedson's 15, Spezza and Smoke will most likely come close to matching that.

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10-02-2003, 03:13 PM
  #17
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I don't think it will be a problem. If any other contending team were missing it's third line right winger, we wouldn't be having the same discussion. Havlat is better than a third liner, but you know what I mean.

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10-02-2003, 04:34 PM
  #18
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I think the sens will be fine without Havlat.

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10-02-2003, 05:25 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
Word is going around that he is prepared to sit out the WHOLE season if he doesnt get his 4 million and change over two years....sad

Havlat is one of those players that can sell tickets and provide excitement for the fans but if he doesn't want to do that we still have THe Hoss and Spez factor to work with.

NOte to Havlat: Dont be dumb, you are possibly throwing away a stanley cup ring!
The sens are messing up bigtime if they dont sign him for 2 mill, he's worth that and then some. Will it affect the season? Maybe, if Ottawa gets hit by the injury bug.

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Old
10-02-2003, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syc
The sens are messing up bigtime if they dont sign him for 2 mill, he's worth that and then some. Will it affect the season? Maybe, if Ottawa gets hit by the injury bug.
$2 mil is too much for what type of role Havlat plays for the Senators. Especially when you consider Hossa is only making $2.75 mil.

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Old
10-02-2003, 10:12 PM
  #21
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i think ottawa holding out has more to do with principle than it does with havlats role on the team. According to other contracts being handed out, havlat deserves the high dollars that have been given out, but they dont need to, so they are sticking by their guns. Same thing happened last year with Rachunek, there is no way that many other teams would have waited that out, but in the end, ottawa got the deal they wanted.

Back to the original topic, Ottawa still has the deepest lineup in the East, with or without havlat, and thats saying alot

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Old
10-02-2003, 10:20 PM
  #22
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The Sens are not REALLY in troube but I am not as optimistic as others here.

He is one of my favorite young players and one of the most talented too, IMO.

I think the difference will be meaurable. Especially if injuries to other key players happen. In the playoffs, the possibility of having a lethal 3rd line when guys are overworked after a full season and long playoffs battle is invaluable.

Havlat may regret doing this but so may the Senators. Havlat is still growing as a player. It's a great opportunity for him and for the team.

IMO, they should ship him if they're not going to use him. He deserves a more important role anyway and the Sens can still get better, particularly by getting a fierce player with great leadership.

Add to this I am still not sold on Lalime, probably never will be. I don't think they're a "lock" for anything. The Eastern Conference does suck, though. That helps them tremendously on their quest.

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Old
10-03-2003, 06:50 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler
The Sens are not REALLY in troube but I am not as optimistic as others here.

He is one of my favorite young players and one of the most talented too, IMO.

I think the difference will be meaurable. Especially if injuries to other key players happen. In the playoffs, the possibility of having a lethal 3rd line when guys are overworked after a full season and long playoffs battle is invaluable.

Havlat may regret doing this but so may the Senators. Havlat is still growing as a player. It's a great opportunity for him and for the team.

IMO, they should ship him if they're not going to use him. He deserves a more important role anyway and the Sens can still get better, particularly by getting a fierce player with great leadership.

Add to this I am still not sold on Lalime, probably never will be. I don't think they're a "lock" for anything. The Eastern Conference does suck, though. That helps them tremendously on their quest.
Missing Havlat for the playoffs would be BAAADDD, but I don't think either side would let that happen. Ottawa will CLEARLY be OK if Havlat misses half the regular season even, and let him come up to speed for the second half (though I doubt it even goes THAT long). Havlat left Europe before he had to, which is a sign that he will cave before he misses too much action.

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Old
10-03-2003, 04:22 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Egil
Missing Havlat for the playoffs would be BAAADDD, but I don't think either side would let that happen. Ottawa will CLEARLY be OK if Havlat misses half the regular season even, and let him come up to speed for the second half (though I doubt it even goes THAT long). Havlat left Europe before he had to, which is a sign that he will cave before he misses too much action.
Ottawa has looked awsome in the pre-season...so far undefeated I believe........would be nice to have Havlat on board but this roster is a very deep one.......I think they're going to finish first place overall this season.

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Old
10-04-2003, 04:58 AM
  #25
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With Spezza, Schastlivy, Smolinski, and Varada on the team for a full season, Ottawa should be at least as good as last year without Havlat. But it bears keeping in mind that last year the Sens didn't win the Cup. so 'at least as good as' isn't good enough.

They can get by without him, but I hope Ottawa is able to get Havlat signed this season.

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