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Why was Snow so quick to get rid of Moulson

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03-19-2014, 10:51 AM
  #1
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Why was Snow so quick to get rid of Moulson

It sounds like Moulson's camp wanted to start the negotiations at 6 Million a year, and from there Snow was insulted and he said the hell with this guy

Did Snow think because he "found" Moulson, Moulson should play for the Islanders for way under what he thought his market value is?

I can't help but think we could have locked up Moulson for 5 years at 5 Million per year and it could have also done wonders in keeping JT around when he is set for his next contract negotiation

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03-19-2014, 10:59 AM
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It sounds like Moulson's camp wanted to start the negotiations at 6 Million a year, and from there Snow was insulted and he said the hell with this guy

Did Snow think because he "found" Moulson, Moulson should play for the Islanders for way under what he thought his market value is?

I can't help but think we could have locked up Moulson for 5 years at 5 Million per year and it could have also done wonders in keeping JT around when he is set for his next contract negotiation
Because he'd rather pay Vanek 7 mil than pay Moulson 5 mil. If you're going to pay 5+ mil for a player you might as well go for the top talent.

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03-19-2014, 11:09 AM
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Because he'd rather pay Vanek 7 mil than pay Moulson 5 mil. If you're going to pay 5+ mil for a player you might as well go for the top talent.
And how did that bet work out? Even if he did resign this season was a BIG fail for Snow!

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03-19-2014, 11:17 AM
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Because he'd rather pay Vanek 7 mil than pay Moulson 5 mil. If you're going to pay 5+ mil for a player you might as well go for the top talent.
yes great logic, lets throw a 1st and a 2nd round pick at a team in the hope of signing this guy because we think he is better

and as someone pointed out yesterday, in Moulson and Vaneks final years with the Islanders, they both had the exact same amount of points in the exact same amount of games

So who is the real better talent?

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03-19-2014, 11:20 AM
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Matt Moulson is simply not the type of player you invest 30+ million bucks in.

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03-19-2014, 11:24 AM
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And how did that bet work out? Even if he did resign this season was a BIG fail for Snow!
If he resigned it's a win for us. This season is simply not more important than next season or the one after or a season 5 years from now. Moulson dragged Tavares down. That is enough reason to justify not wanting to sign him long term. Understanding that is probably the most professional GM-y thing he's ever done.

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03-19-2014, 11:27 AM
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Matt Moulson is simply not the type of player you invest 30+ million bucks in.
and why not, do you really think he is not going to get a good offer in the off season

and like I said, 5 years at 5 Million per I am sure Moulson stays an Islander

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03-19-2014, 11:29 AM
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If he resigned it's a win for us. This season is simply not more important than next season or the one after or a season 5 years from now. Moulson dragged Tavares down. That is enough reason to justify not wanting to sign him long term. Understanding that is probably the most professional GM-y thing he's ever done.
he dragged Tavares down? Is that why Tavares said in an interview that he would be devastated if Moulson was ever not an Islander? Sure sounds like someone who is being dragged down

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03-19-2014, 11:30 AM
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yes great logic, lets throw a 1st and a 2nd round pick at a team in the hope of signing this guy because we think he is better

and as someone pointed out yesterday, in Moulson and Vaneks final years with the Islanders, they both had the exact same amount of points in the exact same amount of games

So who is the real better talent?
and if hockey players were only judged by points then you'd have a point. but they aren't. How about the positive effect Vanek had on JT & KO. Oh sure you could probably make the case that JT would have been at the top of the league in points even had Moulson stayed. But there's really no way to tell. and I think it's very fair to say that KO wouldn't have had the type of year he did having to carry Moulson.

Coaches build lines based on dynamics, and what did Moulson really do besides score goals once his teamates did the rest of the work? The reason JT was pinned in his own zone the majority of the time was because there was only 1 option for him or the D to pass the puck to while exiting the zone. You can't pass to moulson because he can't carry the puck more than 2 feet. So if JT was deep, he could only pass it to Kyle. That limits options. JT & KO need a guy who can do work on his own. In that regard, vanek is miles ahead of MM.

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03-19-2014, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Isles Junkie View Post
If he resigned it's a win for us. This season is simply not more important than next season or the one after or a season 5 years from now. Moulson dragged Tavares down. That is enough reason to justify not wanting to sign him long term. Understanding that is probably the most professional GM-y thing he's ever done.
He didn't improve the team for this season and that what should have been his first priority after the step we took last year. Vanek was not what we needed at that point. As a matter of fact I predict we would have been in better shape right now if we had kept Moulson. Snow gets a BIG fail in my book and I think he would man up to.

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03-19-2014, 11:31 AM
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And how did that bet work out? Even if he did resign this season was a BIG fail for Snow!
I really think the islanders feel that moulson is on the downside of his career and 5 million and year is alot to spend on that. I kind of think vanek may be also, after watching him play after the leak of his contract offer was out. I think even if vanek doesnt go to minnesota the islanders wont offer him another 7 year deal.

The problem is every move garth made was a fail. He didnt get a goalie, he signed the wrong free agents (regin, Bouchard), He gave up too much for vanek. However, at the time none of those moves looked so terrible. Add all that with the early defense injurys and the horrible coaching by cappy and this season was a failure. If we gave up the 11-15 pick in this draft as most expected, no one would care but now we are stuck with this impossible choice of picking this year or next year.

I expect garth will do anything to make this team contending next year, i expect him to spend money a little more over the cap floor. I really think they will try anything to right this wrong. If he gets a goalie, signs a decent free agent, and maybe gets another dman through trade of a prospect or two. Not to mention, there will be some good dman to bring up from the ahl if there are more d injures.

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03-19-2014, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Isles Junkie View Post
If he resigned it's a win for us. This season is simply not more important than next season or the one after or a season 5 years from now. Moulson dragged Tavares down. That is enough reason to justify not wanting to sign him long term. Understanding that is probably the most professional GM-y thing he's ever done.
Yup, the team that gives Moulson what he wants will regret it faster than Philly with Streit. Moulson was a good find, filled a need, Snow correctly did not give him the term or dollars he wanted.

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03-19-2014, 11:33 AM
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and if hockey players were only judged by points then you'd have a point. but they aren't. How about the positive effect Vanek had on JT & KO. Oh sure you could probably make the case that JT would have been at the top of the league in points even had Moulson stayed. But there's really no way to tell. and I think it's very fair to say that KO wouldn't have had the type of year he did having to carry Moulson.

Coaches build lines based on dynamics, and what did Moulson really do besides score goals once his teamates did the rest of the work? The reason JT was pinned in his own zone the majority of the time was because there was only 1 option for him or the D to pass the puck to while exiting the zone. You can't pass to moulson because he can't carry the puck more than 2 feet. So if JT was deep, he could only pass it to Kyle. That limits options. JT & KO need a guy who can do work on his own. In that regard, vanek is miles ahead of MM.
how about the positive effect Moulson had on the rest of the team? The Islanders were a playoff team when Moulson was here, the second they made that trade they turned into a garbage team, yea Tavares, Okposo and Vanek had a good month when the Isles were all but eliminated, but I will take a playoff team over a team that has a few good players putting up alot of points when they are out of the race

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03-19-2014, 11:33 AM
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He didn't improve the team for this season and that what should have been his first priority after the step we took last year. Vanek was not what we needed at that point. As a matter of fact I predict we would have been in better shape right now if we had kept Moulson. Snow gets a BIG fail in my book and I think he would man up to.
I'm not so sure that Sidney Crosby would really improve the Isles all that much. Doesn't mean I wouldn't love to have him on the club. We need defense and goaltending. if you want to get on snow for spending assets that filled the clubs 3rd most pressing need instead of their 1st or 2nd, then ok. I'd probably agree with you. But I really don't get on Snow (and I'm no fan of his, I think he needs to be fired) for taking the risk on Vanek.

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03-19-2014, 11:36 AM
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Yup, the team that gives Moulson what he wants will regret it faster than Philly with Streit. Moulson was a good find, filled a need, Snow correctly did not give him the term or dollars he wanted.
If we were the type of organization who would be willing to spend on Moulson & realize that he's really a 2nd liner/PP specialist then I'd be all for it. Hell the guy absolutely can score as we saw all throughout his time here. But when you're spending 6 million on a guy, he needs to be more than just a goal scorer who is truly dreadful at every other aspect of the game. unless he's scoring like 50 goals that is.

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03-19-2014, 11:38 AM
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Wow. This might just be rock bottom. People actually want to hitch their wagon long term to the likes of Matt Moulson. Matt Moulson! Seriously! Not only accepting, but embracing mediocrity. This fan base truly represents battered wife syndrome.

But, he scores points!

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03-19-2014, 11:40 AM
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and if hockey players were only judged by points then you'd have a point. but they aren't. How about the positive effect Vanek had on JT & KO. Oh sure you could probably make the case that JT would have been at the top of the league in points even had Moulson stayed. But there's really no way to tell. and I think it's very fair to say that KO wouldn't have had the type of year he did having to carry Moulson.

Coaches build lines based on dynamics, and what did Moulson really do besides score goals once his teamates did the rest of the work? The reason JT was pinned in his own zone the majority of the time was because there was only 1 option for him or the D to pass the puck to while exiting the zone. You can't pass to moulson because he can't carry the puck more than 2 feet. So if JT was deep, he could only pass it to Kyle. That limits options. JT & KO need a guy who can do work on his own. In that regard, vanek is miles ahead of MM.
You can't be a one line team and win anything. I really don't care about Vanek padding JT & KO's stats. I'd rather have a more well rounded team and a winning season. To be honest I think Vanek hurt us this year because they were trying to coddle him so he would resign. We were so top heavy with that one line that it should have been changed up but they didn't want to piss Vanek off by dropping him down.

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03-19-2014, 11:41 AM
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Wow. This might just be rock bottom. People actually want to hitch their wagon long term to the likes of Matt Moulson. Matt Moulson! Seriously! Not only accepting, but embracing mediocrity. This fan base truly represents battered wife syndrome.

But, he scores points!
he scores points and he wants to be here, good luck to whatever your plan is, I am sure it is the same as Garth

I woudln't be surprised to see Garth offer a 4 year 20 Million contract to someone like Heatley in the off season

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03-19-2014, 11:43 AM
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he dragged Tavares down? Is that why Tavares said in an interview that he would be devastated if Moulson was ever not an Islander? Sure sounds like someone who is being dragged down
JT has said that Moulson helped his career immensely, especially as he broke into the NHL. Tavares is outstanding, there aren't many wingers that can "drag him down" - none that I've seen so far, despite's Snow's best efforts to try and accomplish that.

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I'm not so sure that Sidney Crosby would really improve the Isles all that much. Doesn't mean I wouldn't love to have him on the club. We need defense and goaltending. if you want to get on snow for spending assets that filled the clubs 3rd most pressing need instead of their 1st or 2nd, then ok. I'd probably agree with you. But I really don't get on Snow (and I'm no fan of his, I think he needs to be fired) for taking the risk on Vanek.
Agreed.

Moulson is likable and he's a great scorer. But he's definitely on the downside of his career and the next 5-6 years will not likely be ones with escalating offense and improved (from the horrid) defensive play. It was the right move to not bring him back.

Was it a good trade? probably not. Partly because the Islanders didn't need Vanek when compared to the other enormous holes on the team.

The tragedy in all this red herring "noise" of Moulson and Nino/Cal and Spurgeon and AMac is that it's been seven years and the Islanders are still among the worst in the NHL with severe holes in all areas - in goal and defense especially.

Losing JT makes this team truly show it's colours and they are not pretty.

Colorado went from last to first and is younger and far more talented, accomplished in what? A year?

I know we have a dozen teenagers that may "one day really help" - but haven't we heard that before?

How was Tampa without Stamkos?

This team is a disaster.

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03-19-2014, 11:44 AM
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And how did that bet work out? Even if he did resign this season was a BIG fail for Snow!
Yeah..in hindsight.

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03-19-2014, 11:47 AM
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he scores points and he wants to be here, good luck to whatever your plan is, I am sure it is the same as Garth
Heh. If 5+ years of Moulson is a plan, get used to seeing this guy:


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03-19-2014, 11:52 AM
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how about the positive effect Moulson had on the rest of the team? The Islanders were a playoff team when Moulson was here, the second they made that trade they turned into a garbage team, yea Tavares, Okposo and Vanek had a good month when the Isles were all but eliminated, but I will take a playoff team over a team that has a few good players putting up alot of points when they are out of the race
Can we not stretch the truth here. The Isles made the playoffs by the skin of their teeth during a lockout shortened season in which they were freakishly healthy. Let's not confuse them with a consistent playoff bound team.

we were 4-5-3 with Moulson on the team. let's not pretend that everything was alright in Islanders world at the time of the trade.

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03-19-2014, 11:53 AM
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Heh. If 5+ years of Moulson is a plan, get used to seeing this guy:

I think you are forgetting that the Islanders were a playoff team last year, and this year we were in a playoff spot when Snow made that trade

and get used to seeing that guy? Well thanks to our GM that Islander logo is going to have a Sabre logo this year or next year, and any Islander fan who thinks with this current roster we are not going to be seeing those lottery's is fooling themselves

So what is your plan, when Vanek does not get the offers he is hoping for should we raise our offer to 8 years at 56 Million?

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03-19-2014, 11:56 AM
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Can we not stretch the truth here. The Isles made the playoffs by the skin of their teeth during a lockout shortened season in which they were freakishly healthy. Let's not confuse them with a consistent playoff bound team.

we were 4-5-3 with Moulson on the team. let's not pretend that everything was alright in Islanders world at the time of the trade.
4-4-3 and in a playoff spot, and the Isles did not have 1 bad game the entire season except for the night before when they were playing a Philly team that was due for a breakout game (and the Islanders had played and beat a Pittsburgh team in Pittsburgh the night before that game)

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03-19-2014, 11:56 AM
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how about the positive effect Moulson had on the rest of the team? The Islanders were a playoff team when Moulson was here, the second they made that trade they turned into a garbage team, yea Tavares, Okposo and Vanek had a good month when the Isles were all but eliminated, but I will take a playoff team over a team that has a few good players putting up alot of points when they are out of the race
There are a lot of reasons the Isles are a garbage team right now and none of them involve Moulson.

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