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Acq/ Rost. Bldg./ Cap Part XXX

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Old
03-27-2014, 09:53 AM
  #76
Stewie G
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Originally Posted by PRicci09 View Post
If Kuz plays center next year, we should trade Ward this offseason. Contract year and his value will never be higher.

Then move Grabo to 3C (assuming hes resigned) and Fehr 3RW
I vote to keep the playoff performing RW, trade the playoff ghost RW, and give 2nd line minutes to the youngin'.

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03-27-2014, 09:58 AM
  #77
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Let's talk about whether Ward will get a contract extension or not (his contract is up at the end of next season), and how that may affect the RW plans.

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03-27-2014, 10:06 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by ChibiPooky View Post
Let's talk about whether Ward will get a contract extension or not (his contract is up at the end of next season), and how that may affect the RW plans.
I think it's one of the tougher decisions this offseason. I wonder if he'd take a one year extension through the 2015-16 season or if he's going to be looking for one last payday?

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03-27-2014, 10:08 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by ChibiPooky View Post
Let's talk about whether Ward will get a contract extension or not (his contract is up at the end of next season), and how that may affect the RW plans.
I'd prefer to let one of him or Brouwer go via trade or whatever and move up Wilson to the third line after next year.

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:30 AM
  #80
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Last summer, I had proposed benching ward at times during the season, since he seemed like all he really brought was his classic post season heroics.

Little did I know our top 2 lines would be crap this year and his 3rd line would be carrying the team at ES.

About retaining him, that's tricky. Does he like the area. Lets say yes. Does he like Oates, probably. Starts every game, gets a little PP time. Does he want a big payday, probably. He could fetch a small fortune in a trade next year. Lets face it, Brouwer can do no wrong, neither can Ovi, and Willy isn't going anywhere soon.

Regardless, I would think a 3 x 4.5 extension is looming. Especially if George is retained, as he never deals from a position of strength. RW.

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:34 AM
  #81
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if Ward commands $4.5m per season on an extension, i'm trading him pronto while he is hot

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:37 AM
  #82
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Inflation, coupled with overpayment of good foot soldiers seems common.

Yeah he is red hot. If we make the playoffs, dare I think he gets hotter

Who do you want at 4.5, him or Laich.

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:38 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by AlexBrovechkin8 View Post
I think it's one of the tougher decisions this offseason. I wonder if he'd take a one year extension through the 2015-16 season or if he's going to be looking for one last payday?
there is not a single chance that ward takes his time with the caps to now and signs a one year extension. not a chance.

the safe move it to trade ward this offseason and keep brouwer. ward is getting up in age and his next contract term will certainly run him into that danger zone of rapid performance falloff do to aging. brouwer is much younger.

the second safe move is to keep ward for the one more year and let him walk after. he was a ufa coming and he will certainly put his best skate forward with another ufa payday coming.

the risky move is to trade brouwer and keep ward with a 3 year contract. or to trade brouwer and keep ward unsigned and risk losing him as a ufa.

I vote to keep ward, trade brouwer and move up Wilson up the chain

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:43 AM
  #84
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I like Ward, but it's a great opportunity to trade him while his value is high.

At the end of the day, he's 33 and a competent organization should be able to develop 3rd liners.

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:45 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Stewie G View Post
I vote to keep the playoff performing RW, trade the playoff ghost RW, and give 2nd line minutes to the youngin'.
I am 100% against pencilling in Wilson as the 2RW next year. I would rather pencil in Fehr, and even that is tenuous. There's the hope that Wilson eventually becomes a top six player, but it's pretty obvious that he's not that player at this time. Unless we're going back to rebuild mode, he shouldn't be rushed into that role. If we want to give him more minutes and offensive responsibility, which I am a fan of, they should be in Hershey, not Washington. At this point he's no more than a 4th line banger in the NHL ranks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChibiPooky View Post
Let's talk about whether Ward will get a contract extension or not (his contract is up at the end of next season), and how that may affect the RW plans.
It's something I'm on the fence about. He's been an ideal 3RW the past couple seasons, is a quality player in the playoffs, has terrific chemistry with Chimera, is one of the few Caps players who can win board battles, and provides good scoring depth at a reasonable price. I was skeptical at first, but he's won me over. I'm a big Wardo fan.

On the other hand, he's already 33 and the organization is overloaded with RW players. If the coaching staff (be it Oates or otherwise) softens their position on handedness, it does potentially free up some options (especially if Ovechkin returns to LW), but LW is quickly becoming crowded as well. Additionally, we have an internal option in Fehr that can play 3RW at a capable level and has shown to be productive in limited minutes at only half the cost of Ward (though Fehr's contract only runs through next season).

On another note, is anyone else surprised that Ward isn't wearing a letter?

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Old
03-27-2014, 10:52 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Capitlols View Post
I like Ward, but it's a great opportunity to trade him while his value is high.

At the end of the day, he's 33 and a competent organization should be able to develop 3rd liners.
most teams don't trade players when their value is at its peak because players that fit and do the job are hard to find. yes, even 3rd liners. 20 goal scoring 3rd liners are hard to find. at present fans here have had long stretches where they wanted to dump chimera and ward and brouwer....add Wilson to the list as someone they think shouldn't be on the team yet. oh yea and the now buy out laich bandwagon. the only one of this category winger that you guys consistently want to keep is fehr.

what do you expect to get in return for a pending ufa 33 year old winger even with his 20 goals and his playoff rep?

I still say trade brouwer

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03-27-2014, 11:01 AM
  #87
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Ruh roh ....

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...ribeiro-again/

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:04 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
most teams don't trade players when their value is at its peak because players that fit and do the job are hard to find. yes, even 3rd liners. 20 goal scoring 3rd liners are hard to find. at present fans here have had long stretches where they wanted to dump chimera and ward and brouwer....add Wilson to the list as someone they think shouldn't be on the team yet. oh yea and the now buy out laich bandwagon. the only one of this category winger that you guys consistently want to keep is fehr.

what do you expect to get in return for a pending ufa 33 year old winger even with his 20 goals and his playoff rep?

I still say trade brouwer
He's never scored 20 goals in his career before this year and to do it again seems lofty. If you believe he can consistently produce at his rate for a few more years, sure keep/extend him, I'm not a believer.

I'm sure they can find a playoff team that would give up solid assets for him and it'd be better to get something for him than lose him for nothing.

His value to the Caps was to help propel a post-season run and if they continue to barely sneak in/miss the playoffs altogether, what's the value in keeping him?

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:05 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
I am 100% against pencilling in Wilson as the 2RW next year. I would rather pencil in Fehr, and even that is tenuous. There's the hope that Wilson eventually becomes a top six player, but it's pretty obvious that he's not that player at this time. Unless we're going back to rebuild mode, he shouldn't be rushed into that role. If we want to give him more minutes and offensive responsibility, which I am a fan of, they should be in Hershey, not Washington. At this point he's no more than a 4th line banger in the NHL ranks.
If all he's been allowed to be is a 4th line banger in the NHL, is it terribly surprising that's all he's shown so far? I'm one of Fehr's biggest fans, so if he's not centering the 3rd line, I'd be fine with him at 2RW. If that happens, and one/both of Brouwer and Ward are still here, the logical move is Wilson to Hershey, which makes their decision to keep him in DC this year rather baffling.

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:13 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Capitlols View Post
He's never scored 20 goals in his career before this year and to do it again seems lofty. If you believe he can consistently produce at his rate for a few more years, sure keep/extend him, I'm not a believer.

I'm sure they can find a playoff team that would give up solid assets for him and it'd be better to get something for him than lose him for nothing.

His value to the Caps was to help propel a post-season run and if they continue to barely sneak in/miss the playoffs altogether, what's the value in keeping him?
if you think its lofty, then why would an nhl gm think its not?
whats your definition of "solid assets"?? he's not going to bring in what the caps need most.

and....if the caps make the playoffs as a lower seed, they shouldn't worry about retaining top playoff performers because they cant win anyway and shouldn't try?

this is always my favorite. the caps aren't going to win so why put in the effort.

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:17 AM
  #91
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Not really. The point I'm illustrating is that there are certainly times when things don't look so good. Perhaps nearly impossible or at least improbable.

Some of my greatest Caps memories are those that things looked such a way yet didn't end that way. Flyers series 88. Beating the Pens in 94.



Well the Flyers were down 3 games to 0 vs the Bs a few years back and fought back to force game 7. They were down 3-0 in that game and won.

Look...you probably believe you are being realistic and that I'm sticking my head in the sand. From my perspective I feel you are doing little good for yourself by being Hudson.

There maybe a situation where there is a 95% chance we won't succeed. I prefer to look at the 5% where we can and focus on that.

I just hope I'm not stuck with you and Brooklyn when the impending zombie apocalypse occurs....or worse..be stuck on LV-426 with you two
Lol. Fighting to the death or trying to win -- and here is the fun part -- *When You Are Actually On The Team*, is not the same as being witness to something stupid that doesn't work.

We are not on the team, fighting to the end. We are on the sidelines, witnessing a wasted generational talent, and a wasted use of player/talent management.

Look, you invest your money in someone, and their returns are poor. Worse than what you want, and you know you can do better by looking at other money managers performance. What do you do?

In my world, you pull your money and invest with someone new. It might end up worse, but it could also end up way better. In the end, you know it's not working where it is, so you need to change it.

In your world, you leave your money, knowing the guy can't really do it, but you .....drum roll.....HOPE it improves and that he eventually figures it out.

It's fine you want to live in your world, Bob. I just don't.

Make sense?

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:20 AM
  #92
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Ward's offense is nice but if you're going to pay for goals, I'd much rather go after real talent for the second line (Vanek/Gaborik/Stastny) and get someone like Ott or Fiddler for the third line.

A lot depends on whether we're going to live another year under the tyranny of handedness.

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03-27-2014, 11:20 AM
  #93
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Regarding contracts, I believe they're at 48 since Copley & Herbert don't start until next year. Stephenson's Pats are down 3-0 to Brandon so you'd figure he'll be signed and join Hershey soonish.

I'd guess that Folin goes somewhere he'd be able to get PP time sooner than later as his shot is probably his biggest asset. There's still another 6-10 college UFAs that are interesting. Surprised there haven't been more signings around the league this week with all but 16 teams still in action. It's not a great group but there's enough there to at least stock your AHL affiliate with some fringe projects.

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:21 AM
  #94
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if you think its lofty, then why would an nhl gm think its not?
whats your definition of "solid assets"?? he's not going to bring in what the caps need most.

and....if the caps make the playoffs as a lower seed, they shouldn't worry about retaining top playoff performers because they cant win anyway and shouldn't try?

this is always my favorite. the caps aren't going to win so why put in the effort.
Not all NHL GM's think alike. B/B+ prospects/picks as opposed to losing him for nothing. The Caps have a bevy of needs.

You expect the Caps to do damage as a lower seed and that one playoff performer in Joel Ward will be the difference?

This is always my favorite. Take someone's words and completely distort them.

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03-27-2014, 11:22 AM
  #95
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Personally, I'm in the "keep 'em all and let Ward walk" camp (unless they can miraculously turn Ward or Brouwer into a top-4 D).

Next year, I don't think Wilson will be ready for a 2nd-line role. That means one of Ward, Brouwer, or Fehr at 2RW. Ward has proven to be much more effective with Chimera, and I have zero interest in seeing Chimera at 2LW. That leaves Fehr or Brouwer. Fehr has shown some ability to play C (minus faceoffs), which unfortunately makes him important depth there, even if Kuznetsov successfully makes the position switch. To boot, Fehr is more or less unknown as a top-6 quantity, while Brouwer has an extablished (mediocre) body of work.

In other words, I'd use Ward's contract year to buy time for the development of Wilson (and Brown).

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:24 AM
  #96
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Lol. Fighting to the death or trying to win -- and here is the fun part -- *When You Are Actually On The Team*, is not the same as being witness to something stupid that doesn't work.

We are not on the team, fighting to the end. We are on the sidelines, witnessing a wasted generational talent, and a wasted use of player/talent management.

Look, you invest your money in someone, and their returns are poor. Worse than what you want, and you know you can do better by looking at other money managers performance. What do you do?
In my world, you pull your money and invest with someone new. It might end up worse, but it could also end up way better. In the end, you know it's not working where it is, so you need to change it.
In your world, you leave your money, knowing the guy can't really do it, but you .....drum roll.....HOPE it improves and that he eventually figures it out.

It's fine you want to live in your world, Bob. I just don't.

Make sense?
It begs the question...why are you still a Caps fan? Why aren't you investing your time, money(?) and emotional energy on another team that would bare more fruit?

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:31 AM
  #97
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I am intrigued in Chris Brown. It seems like he is flying under the radar.

A big RH shot that seems pretty well cooked and ready for new challenges. Suddenly, Oates's tyrannic dream of perfect harmony in handedness at center is coming to fruition.

LHC
Nick Grabo Laich MJ

RHC
Brown Beagle Fehr Latta

Oates can finally sleep at night.

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Old
03-27-2014, 11:35 AM
  #98
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It begs the question...why are you still a Caps fan? Why aren't you investing your time, money(?) and emotional energy on another team that would bare more fruit?
Cause there is only one team in the market.

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03-27-2014, 11:40 AM
  #99
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Cause there is only one team in the market.
Seems to me Washington area is transient and there are all kinds of fans of various teams around here. Heck more than half the guys on my last hockey team were Pens and Flyers fans.

At work there are 3 Caps fans, 4 Penguin fans and 2 Flyers fans that I know of.

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03-27-2014, 11:53 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Capitlols View Post
Not all NHL GM's think alike. B/B+ prospects/picks as opposed to losing him for nothing. The Caps have a bevy of needs.

You expect the Caps to do damage as a lower seed and that one playoff performer in Joel Ward will be the difference?

This is always my favorite. Take someone's words and completely distort them.
not distorting your words.

the caps have a bevy of needs. trading a ward as a pending ufa would bring back 2nd tier picks and prospects. assets that would fall into the chris brown category perhaps. at best. chris brown and a 3rd will often times turn out to be nothing. so you are still letting him walk for nothing only you are doing it one season early.

all gm's don't think alike. am I wrong? you are saying you think he should be traded to manage assets correctly and thinking there are gm's that wont see that and overpay for the player you are selling?

I am not trying to be combative. maybe I am not getting my point across the right way. if trading a player that is a pending ufa is what a competent gm would do, don't you expect that the other gm's know that?

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