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Prospects Part 4: IceHogs/Fuel/College & Juniors/Int'l

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Old
04-23-2014, 01:52 PM
  #351
ClydeLee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLarmer28 View Post
Hjalmarsson in his first full season in the NHL received more ice time on the penalty killing unit than Bryan Campbell.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...Name=timeOnIce

http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...Name=timeOnIce

Hjalmarsson in subsequent seasons was never removed from the penalty killing unit.
Because it was a role that Hammer was better suited for and he achieved better results.

Leddy was pushed on the PK and had more playing time prior to Oduya/Roz because they were lacking depth and had to rely on the next best option. Leddy is behind any other D man but Runblad as best suited to fit their PK.

You seem to try to associate a direct connection of less ice time = stagnant development which is illogical and irrational to conclude.

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04-23-2014, 02:03 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
pretty simple... you don't trade a Top4 D like Oduya and replace him with a rookie while you want to win now and can trade Rozsival
That is for this year. You still would have to make a decision about Oduya or Leddy for 15-16.

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04-23-2014, 04:34 PM
  #353
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Wouldn't surprise me or disappoint me to see one of Oduya or Leddy involved in a package for some young C (on their ELC still ideally) who has already played a few games in the least in the NHL. That's what I'd be targeting.

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04-23-2014, 04:43 PM
  #354
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Originally Posted by HawksFan37 View Post
Wouldn't surprise me or disappoint me to see one of Oduya or Leddy involved in a package for some young C (on their ELC still ideally) who has already played a few games in the least in the NHL. That's what I'd be targeting.
If Hawks are as high on TT as we are led to believe trading for another young C wouldn't make too much sense ,, Would it?

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04-23-2014, 04:57 PM
  #355
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
If Hawks are as high on TT as we are led to believe trading for another young C wouldn't make too much sense ,, Would it?
They could think that ideally he's a wing.

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04-23-2014, 08:46 PM
  #356
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Wasn't sure where to put this but I'm running a mock draft (Gillies32's 7 Round Mock Draft) and tye one team we've needed for a while is Chicago. If anyone is interested please join

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Old
04-24-2014, 09:17 AM
  #357
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
If Hawks are as high on TT as we are led to believe trading for another young C wouldn't make too much sense ,, Would it?
Maybe they would rather see TT on the W? Or Shaw on the W?

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04-24-2014, 09:21 AM
  #358
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Originally Posted by SLarmer28 View Post
Nick Leddy is one the most sheltered defenseman in the NHL.

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...4+45+46+63+67#



Defenseman NHL Rank:

Hjalmarsson - #5
Oduya - #6

Brookbank - #187
Rozsival - #192
Leddy - #195

Hjalmarsson and Oduya do all the dirty work, yet receive all the criticism.
come on Larmer, just a terrible post all around. others have stated the BEYOND obvious flaw with your logic, but I will dump on too. saying Leddy has gone stagnant or that he is one of the most sheltered dmen in the league is just beyond stupid. he plays on a blue line that arguably has the best top 4 around (though my feelings on Oduya are well known), his playing time just maybe has something to do with that....

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04-24-2014, 11:02 AM
  #359
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
If Hawks are as high on TT as we are led to believe trading for another young C wouldn't make too much sense ,, Would it?
Like others have alluded to, it's less pressure for TT to play on the wing in his first year that it is to be the "answer" at 2C. Also, to me Shaw is more effective as a 3rd line winger than he is a center. He's done well in a pinch to play there this season for the most part, but his game is better suited to the wing IMO.

And lastly, it never hurts to have more NHL-ready center depth. Going forward, who are the players that grew up playing/being developed as centers on this roster? Toews, Kruger and Sharp (and not to beat a dead horse, doesn't play C for whatever reason) by my count as Handzus will not be back next year I'd figure. Why not add another legit C there if you can?

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Old
04-24-2014, 01:14 PM
  #360
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That is for this year. You still would have to make a decision about Oduya or Leddy for 15-16.
that's something I worry about... 1 year later.

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04-24-2014, 06:45 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by AmericanDream View Post
come on Larmer, just a terrible post all around. others have stated the BEYOND obvious flaw with your logic, but I will dump on too. saying Leddy has gone stagnant or that he is one of the most sheltered dmen in the league is just beyond stupid. he plays on a blue line that arguably has the best top 4 around (though my feelings on Oduya are well known), his playing time just maybe has something to do with that....
I will agree with most of that. The Hawks are very picky when they play their 3rd D Line. In line matchups, they like most other teams... are very picky when play 3rd line D.

Think it's more of Rosival and Brookbank as partners than Leddy. But the stats tell the story.

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04-24-2014, 09:17 PM
  #362
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You cannot just keep the vets..especially 3rd pair d if they cost too much..Hawks prospect pipeline is well stocked at D...DAHLBECK and JOHNS ARE ready for the NHL you cannot keep them on the farm without them wanting to leave. ..so in the next year or two you must move them in and replace others.. Condemning would help our pp but I still am not sold on his size or defense in the done..Other prospects are also going to push for jobs in a 2-3 year time frame..so we cannot keep allocating cap that is too high when raises come up...as long sour core top 3 D. .Keith Seabrook and Hammer still anchor our doors at their higher cap numbers..the rest have to allocate at reasonable numbers for the cap..We cannot and should not give a big raise to Teddy as long as he is just a 3rd pair guy and he cannot move up with our structure as is.. So logically he will get moved.. AS FOR oduya. .I guess it depends whether Johns or DAHLBECK can fit with Hammer or whether they pair as 3d pairing.. IF they are only on the third pair the other option is maybe Van Riemsdyck who can provide more offense with Hammer..but....they will never infuse 3 new D into the roster in the same year..two max..So i think Oduya stays one more year...Hoping they trade Teddy for a 2015 first. .but if the right deal..perhaps a package comes for a 2014 first that is high enough for a target Stan wants..so be it.

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04-24-2014, 10:23 PM
  #363
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You cannot just keep the vets..especially 3rd pair d if they cost too much..Hawks prospect pipeline is well stocked at D...DAHLBECK and JOHNS ARE ready for the NHL you cannot keep them on the farm without them wanting to leave. ..so in the next year or two you must move them in and replace others.. Condemning would help our pp but I still am not sold on his size or defense in the done..Other prospects are also going to push for jobs in a 2-3 year time frame..so we cannot keep allocating cap that is too high when raises come up...as long sour core top 3 D. .Keith Seabrook and Hammer still anchor our doors at their higher cap numbers..the rest have to allocate at reasonable numbers for the cap..We cannot and should not give a big raise to Teddy as long as he is just a 3rd pair guy and he cannot move up with our structure as is.. So logically he will get moved.. AS FOR oduya. .I guess it depends whether Johns or DAHLBECK can fit with Hammer or whether they pair as 3d pairing.. IF they are only on the third pair the other option is maybe Van Riemsdyck who can provide more offense with Hammer..but....they will never infuse 3 new D into the roster in the same year..two max..So i think Oduya stays one more year...Hoping they trade Teddy for a 2015 first. .but if the right deal..perhaps a package comes for a 2014 first that is high enough for a target Stan wants..so be it.
Who is Teddy? If you mean Leddy.. he is only 23 and about to reach his physical prime. We should resign Leddy to a 3-5 year deal. But the money is all dependent on how much Kane and Toews resign for. That resigning comes first and dictates all other re-signings.

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Old
04-25-2014, 05:43 AM
  #364
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Leddy develops good so far. He is on the right track. He'll stay one more year on the 3rd pair. He'll get to play with whoever UFA depth guy we sign or keep + Dahlbeck + maybe another UFA depth guy.

Then 1 year later he gets to play with Hjammer while Oduya looks like a guy we are going to trade for Cap Reasons

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04-25-2014, 09:08 AM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
Leddy develops good so far. He is on the right track. He'll stay one more year on the 3rd pair. He'll get to play with whoever UFA depth guy we sign or keep + Dahlbeck + maybe another UFA depth guy.

Then 1 year later he gets to play with Hjammer while Oduya looks like a guy we are going to trade for Cap Reasons
One year later Oduya's contract is up. So he will not be traded unless it is this year.

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04-25-2014, 02:39 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Tone King View Post
One year later Oduya's contract is up. So he will not be traded unless it is this year.
Oduya is certain on the chop block. I agree. I personally hate Oduya, as many goals in this postseason and last postseason can be linked to his positioning. Oduya is a great 2nd Line D right now.

But it will come down to supply and demand when his contract ends. If we can't get a young guy to fill in his spot.. it will be interesting.

Not easy to get 2nd line D on FA.

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04-25-2014, 02:40 PM
  #367
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
Leddy develops good so far. He is on the right track. He'll stay one more year on the 3rd pair. He'll get to play with whoever UFA depth guy we sign or keep + Dahlbeck + maybe another UFA depth guy.

Then 1 year later he gets to play with Hjammer while Oduya looks like a guy we are going to trade for Cap Reasons

Agree 100% with this statement and analysis.

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04-26-2014, 04:15 PM
  #368
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I go back and forth with Leddy, but I'd be fine if the Hawks traded him in the right deal for a 2nd line centre.

Trade Leddy, roll with:

Keith-Seabrook
Oduya-Hammer
Dahlbeck/Vet UFA-Rundblad
Vet UFA

Get a couple looks at Clendening to see if he fits in on this team, and if not, you have Johns ready to step in, with Fournier, Van Riemsdyk, Norell and Dahlstrom in the system for if/when Oduya leaves.

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04-26-2014, 04:22 PM
  #369
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Originally Posted by HockeySensible View Post
I go back and forth with Leddy, but I'd be fine if the Hawks traded him in the right deal for a 2nd line centre.

Trade Leddy, roll with:

Keith-Seabrook
Oduya-Hammer
Dahlbeck/Vet UFA-Rundblad
Vet UFA

Get a couple looks at Clendening to see if he fits in on this team, and if not, you have Johns ready to step in, with Fournier, Van Riemsdyk, Norell and Dahlstrom in the system for if/when Oduya leaves.
NO!!!!
Leddy is 23 and will eventually replace the 33 year old Oduya. Writing is on the wall.

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04-26-2014, 05:29 PM
  #370
Marotte Marauder
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Originally Posted by HockeySensible View Post
I go back and forth with Leddy, but I'd be fine if the Hawks traded him in the right deal for a 2nd line centre.

Trade Leddy, roll with:

Keith-Seabrook
Oduya-Hammer
Dahlbeck/Vet UFA-Rundblad
Vet UFA

Get a couple looks at Clendening to see if he fits in on this team, and if not, you have Johns ready to step in, with Fournier, Van Riemsdyk, Norell and Dahlstrom in the system for if/when Oduya leaves.
Too funny. Leddy has tons of NHL experience comparatively speaking and was a mid 1st rounder and you think the guys that you listed will leapfrog Leddy?

Too funny.

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04-26-2014, 08:45 PM
  #371
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I do think we will need to make some tough cuts in a few years... one of Leddy, saad will need to go I'm thinking. I think Leddy fetches more in trade, and we have more defensive prospects ready to replace him than saad, and I think our team needs saad more going forward anyways. if it came down to it I'd be ok trading Leddy.... though the obviously preferable scenario is keeping both.

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04-26-2014, 09:09 PM
  #372
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zytz;84152613]I do think we will need to make some tough cuts in a few years... one of Leddy, saad will need to go I'm thinking. I think Leddy fetches more in trade, and we have more defensive prospects ready to replace him than saad, and I think our team needs saad more going forward anyways. if it came down to it I'd be ok trading Leddy.... though the obviously preferable scenario is keeping both.
It certainly will be interesting. Fun to think of all the possibilities and play fanyasy GM. This is why I keep saying Toews and Kane comes first. Their salaries are huge and can be a 8 million total swing in salary cap. Both Going from 6 mill a year to possible 10.

I guess the both sign for 9 mil a year.

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04-27-2014, 11:54 AM
  #373
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Too funny. Leddy has tons of NHL experience comparatively speaking and was a mid 1st rounder and you think the guys that you listed will leapfrog Leddy?

Too funny.
Where did I say anyone would leapfrog Leddy? Your comprehension skills are unparalleled MM.

The Hawks have tons of options for their bottom-pairing.. so if you can use a bottom-pairing Dman to significantly improve upon your 2nd line centre, I think the Hawks would do it.

Leddy's not going to replace Oduya on the 2nd pairing next year. That's not the reason you'd move him, but the fact that he'd still only be a third pairing Dman (on this team) next year means you can explore your options.

Oduya's older than Leddy. He's also a far more well-rounded Dman and him and Hammer are an outstanding pairing. For a team that wants to win-now, the idea of moving a third pairing Dman in a package for a significant improvement to their biggest weakness would be tempting.. especially, as pointed out, when the Hawks have tons of options to plug into the third pairing that would be solid.

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04-27-2014, 08:14 PM
  #374
Marotte Marauder
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Where did I say anyone would leapfrog Leddy? Your comprehension skills are unparalleled MM.

The Hawks have tons of options for their bottom-pairing.. so if you can use a bottom-pairing Dman to significantly improve upon your 2nd line centre, I think the Hawks would do it.

Leddy's not going to replace Oduya on the 2nd pairing next year. That's not the reason you'd move him, but the fact that he'd still only be a third pairing Dman (on this team) next year means you can explore your options.

Oduya's older than Leddy. He's also a far more well-rounded Dman and him and Hammer are an outstanding pairing. For a team that wants to win-now, the idea of moving a third pairing Dman in a package for a significant improvement to their biggest weakness would be tempting.. especially, as pointed out, when the Hawks have tons of options to plug into the third pairing that would be solid.
So you'd like to weaken a major strength the Hawks have, defensive depth to improve at 2C?

I'd rather trade Oduya in another year or 2, move Leddy to top 4 and then have the players you mentioned ready to fill in underneath.

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04-27-2014, 08:50 PM
  #375
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So you'd like to weaken a major strength the Hawks have, defensive depth to improve at 2C?

I'd rather trade Oduya in another year or 2, move Leddy to top 4 and then have the players you mentioned ready to fill in underneath.
Next year is the last year of his contract. So he can walk then.

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