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Precisely, where did they go wrong?

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Old
04-02-2014, 02:25 AM
  #26
thadd
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The hiring of Kevin Lowe.

Allowing the Canadian dollar to recover.

Somewhere in between those two events.

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Old
04-02-2014, 09:07 AM
  #27
Up the Irons
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Positive View Post
Hiring Krueger and Eakins as head coaches was a mistake. Neither were ready. If we fire Eakins we don't have a suitable replacement out there either.

Tambellini's last season here was a huge fail, moreso than the others. He overpaid for Smithson, Fistric, and arguably Brown. There were bad FA signings too.

I don't care what management says either: we did not go hard enough after Bishop. He was there for us. We should have been desperate for a young goalie to challenge Dubnyk at that point. This is not a hindsight observation. Even if without knowing how great Bishop would be, it was the obvious move for us.

Other than that I don't see much we could have done differently. I agree with the rebuild strategy. That means fewer FAs will sign, and Tambellini didn't saddle the team with overpaid FAs like Wideman. The rebuild is not progressing fast enough but we are only one year off. We're just very eager to see this process end.
See, this is what Lowe has been telling himself. it's all just dumb bad luck. Sure, if you look at each iffy decision by itself, an excuse is available. We thought Pouliot was... Visnovsky was.... Glen Cross... Torres... . But when we add them up, and you surpass 30 iffy decisions, excuses don't matter.

Bottom line, they took the wrong approach. They gutted the team but didn't build it. They drafted and sat on there hands. The good work that MacT has done this year proves they could have been doing this two years earlier.

I would say they are two years behind. Basically wasted two years, but they have also lowered the value of Gagner and Yakupov. They miss read the forward core. Had they come to this decision a year ago, both players would have yielded much more. Might have gotten Ryan Johansen. Now, they will take a bit of a loss or just keep them. It's a hand played wrongly.

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Old
04-02-2014, 09:58 AM
  #28
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In five years the D went from:

Gilbert, Souray, Smid, Visnovsky, Grebeshkov and change

to

Petry, Ference, Larsen, Schultz and a handful of rookies.

That's where they went wrong.

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Old
04-02-2014, 10:04 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Positive View Post
Hiring Krueger and Eakins as head coaches was a mistake. Neither were ready. If we fire Eakins we don't have a suitable replacement out there either.
Todd Nelson should have been next in line for the job. If we fire Eakins, Nelson should absolutely be given the job.

Quote:
Tambellini's last season here was a huge fail, moreso than the others. He overpaid for Smithson, Fistric, and arguably Brown. There were bad FA signings too.
None of those moves really hurt the franchise. Tambellini was never really the problem here. Then again, he wasn't a solution either.
Quote:
I don't care what management says either: we did not go hard enough after Bishop. He was there for us. We should have been desperate for a young goalie to challenge Dubnyk at that point. This is not a hindsight observation. Even if without knowing how great Bishop would be, it was the obvious move for us.
Not sure what goaltending has to do with this. MacT has done a tremendous job solving our goaltending problems here.

Quote:
Other than that I don't see much we could have done differently. I agree with the rebuild strategy. That means fewer FAs will sign, and Tambellini didn't saddle the team with overpaid FAs like Wideman. The rebuild is not progressing fast enough but we are only one year off. We're just very eager to see this process end.
Seriously? How about getting some competent scouts for the last decade or so to draft at least one decent hockey player. How can you speculate we are just one year off? That's like saying you know we're going to make the playoffs next year. For all we know, the Oilers could be picking McDavid next year.

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Old
04-02-2014, 10:12 AM
  #30
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I feel like it's often oversimplifying to lay the blame of a complex problem on one person, but I think hiring Steve Tambellini is honestly where it all went wrong. Sure, we can trace the problem back to Pronger demanding a trade, but that's where the roots of the rebuild started, not where it went wrong.

Tambellini's problem was that 1) he traded away NHL talent for assets that eroded within a couple of years and 2) he was too reliant on the draft to solve all of the Oilers problems. Visnovsky to Whitney to nothing, Cole to O'Sullivan to Vandermeer to nothing, Souray to nothing, Gilbert to Schultz to a 5th round pick. Everything that man touched turned to stone. Not to mention the Barkers, Belangers, and Eagers that he brought in as part of the solution.

Chicago acquired Patrick Sharp for essentially a third-round pick. Pittsburgh didn't get quite such a windfall, but they signed Matt Cooke and Petr Sykora and traded for Pascal Dupuis and Chris Kunitz, among others, to augment their core before they truly started making noise and winning cups. Tambellini did no such things. I feel like MacTavish is finally filling in those sorts of holes in the rebuild, but had it been going on for the past couple of years as well, we'd be in a much better position today.

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04-02-2014, 10:27 AM
  #31
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Having MacT as GM now masks Kevin Lowes faults which are his ability to set the goals for the organization and create direction for his scouts, gm and minor league system.

This team has not had "identity" on the ice since lowe started working in the office.

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Old
04-02-2014, 10:35 AM
  #32
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July 2, 2008. The day Katz finally wore down the EIG and they sold him the team.

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Old
04-02-2014, 10:38 AM
  #33
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The firing of Krueger/hiring of Eakins.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Up the Irons View Post
With Mact and Eakins publicly admitting that big changes are needed and coming, it can now be said that Oilers' management has finally admitted that the rebuild has gone awry.
This is scary from the pov that the coach still seems to be in the inner circle pointing the finger of blame towards the players.

He has not proven himself to that extent at all, more to the contrary.

McDavid, kid 2015, and kid 2016 here we come. I'm just praying they keep the draft lottery instead of moving towards a relegation scenario like in soccer

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Old
04-02-2014, 01:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Tarus View Post
It started to go wrong when the lockout ended. Lowe gets the reigns taken off a bit to compete for a cup instead of just "remain competitive under a budget". He clearly isn't a good GM, and really has no business being anywhere near the job team administrative role. The moments of idiocy and bad decisions he was prone to prior to the Pronger debacle only got worse once the boundaries of what he could do were taken away.

The Cup run itself gave both Mactavish and Lowe a grace period and resigned contracts despite years of poor service and an increasingly dysfunctionally run team. Not to mention a terrible reputation around the league with the players caused by those two, which is still a major issue with the franchise today.

Katz buys the team and immediately ignores all his promises of a competently run organization, turning it into a playtoy for all his cronies.

Lowe gets bumped upstairs and is allowed to recommend a GM, which of course turns out to be a bud of his who he was friends with on the team Canada selection committee. Tambo being a guy that pretty much no one else in the league was interested in hiring, as his rep even then was that he was tentative administrator.

The actual rebuild failed before it started, when the people who created the scorched earth mess that was the 2010 team, were given free reign to undertake the rebuild themselves. The point of the rebuild should have been to rebuild the organization, not just the on-ice product, and the Oilers were just as talent starved in the management room as they were in the dressing room.

And of course, recent footnotes in the ongoing saga of the worst run franchise in the NHL, the bringing back of another Katz/Lowe buddy in the exceptionally mediocre Mactavish in yet another case of a GM hired with zero interviews to find the best candidate. A move that just adds to the pack of yes men who are good at telling each other what they want to hear, but not so good at anything else. His first move is to immediately hire the biggest bomb of a coach in the history of the franchise, and tank the franchise to it's worst season since the first Renny rebuild year where the prior GM was intentionally building a team to compete for last overall.
This is probably as accurate an assessment of what went wrong as you're going to get.

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Old
04-02-2014, 01:21 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerfan17 View Post
I feel like it's often oversimplifying to lay the blame of a complex problem on one person, but I think hiring Steve Tambellini is honestly where it all went wrong. Sure, we can trace the problem back to Pronger demanding a trade, but that's where the roots of the rebuild started, not where it went wrong.

Tambellini's problem was that 1) he traded away NHL talent for assets that eroded within a couple of years and 2) he was too reliant on the draft to solve all of the Oilers problems. Visnovsky to Whitney to nothing, Cole to O'Sullivan to Vandermeer to nothing, Souray to nothing, Gilbert to Schultz to a 5th round pick. Everything that man touched turned to stone. Not to mention the Barkers, Belangers, and Eagers that he brought in as part of the solution.

Chicago acquired Patrick Sharp for essentially a third-round pick. Pittsburgh didn't get quite such a windfall, but they signed Matt Cooke and Petr Sykora and traded for Pascal Dupuis and Chris Kunitz, among others, to augment their core before they truly started making noise and winning cups. Tambellini did no such things. I feel like MacTavish is finally filling in those sorts of holes in the rebuild, but had it been going on for the past couple of years as well, we'd be in a much better position today.
I'm not sure which were worse, the moves he made that failed or the nonmoves he didn't. Adding just two rookies in the summer of 2012 after the team finished 29th was unfathomable. Offering only a 2nd for Bishop was basically not an offer at all. Not working harder to trade up and draft Samuelson. Then basically doing nothing at the TDL of 2013, when the team sitting in 8th place, mercifully cost him his job. There were at least a dozen trades for useful players that were moved for assets he could have topped.

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04-02-2014, 01:35 PM
  #36
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Good question OP.

And there's been a lot of good points from posters but in another thread I posited what the Oiler lineup could have looked like if they had made some more conservative decisions on trades and free agency. I examined the decisions made year in and year out, and I believe the core of the problem was the entire premise of the rebuild.

That you have to destroy the team and depth utterly in order to draft the best player every year for five years. One of the major problems is that we don't know which years the Oilers were actually trying NOT to tank, versus actually tanking. How about tanking for just one or two years instead of... five? eight?

Where did the Oilers go wrong?

a) hiring the wrong people.

- Pat Quinn was one of the worst possible decisions to hire as a head coach for a young team. He was too old, out of touch with modern hockey, never mind actually coaching kids.
- hiring inexperienced staff. Steve Tambellini, Ralph Krueger, Dallas Eakins, Steve Smith.
- Steve Tambellini in particular was a crushingly bad hire. His failure to bring in useful players and his lack of action in recent years have torpedoed this club.

- who should the Oilers have hired? Experienced persons who weren't so old that they are unfamiliar with modern day hockey.

A: Tom Renney was not a bad hire, he brought experience and a patient teacher to the organization. The Oilers should have kept him.

A: Charlie Huddy, he was let go when Craig MacT resigned as coach. He should have been retained, he had done a terrific job with the Oilers defense for many years.

A: Hire from Detroit. Staff has recently left Detroit looking for more opportunity: GM Jim Nill (now Dallas), Coach Paul MacLean (now Ottawa).

A: Hire young(ish) guys who have made their NHL mistakes already with other teams. Example: Paul Maurice, Peter Deboer (NJ Devils).

b) trading/losing veterans for unproven youth. brought in poorer veterans to replace veterans.

- perhaps the blame is on the scouts for getting young players who were not ready for prime time. But the Oilers prior to 2010 had many useful young players who should be leading the team now in their prime, not expecting these 18-20 year old kids to try to battle against the Joe Thorntons, Ryan Kesler and Ryan Getzlafs of the division. Instead we traded useful players.

E.g.

- traded Stoll, Greene for Vishnovsky. traded Vishnovsky for Ryan Whitney. Whitney gets injured and is no longer NHL capable. Was this predictable? Probably not, but unequivocably, Stoll, Greene or Vishnovsky would make the Oilers look 100% better playing on the team than the now gone Whitney.

- traded Torres for Brule. Where is Brule now? Torres is older now and less useful, but he could have been an extremely useful top 9 player for the last five years instead of Brule's stint.

- failed to resign Curtis Glencross. Another extremely useful top 9 player that the Oilers could have retained for the last five years. He's not sexy, but would have helped more than the crap players that were brought in instead.

- Dustin Penner. yah yah, I get it Pancakes. But its how many years later and Oiler fans are still complaining about the lack of size in the top six. What did we get in return for losing a big, skilled forward? Colten Teubert, Oscar Klefbom and Zharkov. Who would have been more useful to the Oilers in the last five years?

- traded Tom Gilbert for Nick Schultz. Bad trade. Gilbert was better than Schultz in all areas. Soft? Yes, but Nick Schultz wasn't an improvement at all. We gave up a four 4 dman for what turned to be a third pairing defensemen that in the end, the Oilers were all too happy to give up. Minnesota bought out Gilbert, but I think that had more to do with Gilbert's season long illness and the Wild's salary cap crunch that Gilbert's effectiveness.

- Souray. Yes Souray badmouthed the organization, but I have difficulties believing that he wanted to be blackballed and ostracized. I think the Oilers could have mended fences and they could have had an oft-injured top four defenseman playing for them. But even missing so many games, he was still a big, nasty, dman with a huge shot. Couldn't he have helped over the last five years?

And.... Tambellini brought in such highlight players like Cam Barker, Kurtis Foster, Nik Khabibulin, Colten Teubert, Nick Schultz, Darcy Hordichuk, Jerred Smithson, Mike Brown, Eric Belanger. This is a terrible list of players.




c) I have no qualms about the recent Oilers first round drafting. Each time, I thought they made the right choice by drafting the BPA. They key to drafting BPA is that if these players don't fit your need, then you have to trade them for players that do. That's the entire point of drafting Best Player Available, and not drafting by Need.

2009 - MPS
2010 - Hall
2011 - RNH, Klefbom
2012 - Yakupov.

I don't disagree with any of those picks.

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Old
04-03-2014, 07:58 PM
  #37
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July 2, 2008. The day Katz finally wore down the EIG and they sold him the team.
Exactly this.

And don't get me wrong, Katz has been great. He has opened the purse strings and helped get the arena deal done. EIG wouldn't be anywhere close to an arena deal by now.

But the problem with Katz is this: under the EIG Kevin Lowe was constantly on the hot seat. The 05-06 run pretty much saved his job and he had to answer to the investors.

When Katz came into the picture, suddenly Lowe went from a guy who constantly had to justify his costs and was always looking over his shoulder to someone who will never lose his job no matter what.

On top of all that, with Katz the team can afford to make stupid mistakes like signing Denis Grebeshkov.

Add the two together and you have a team with no accountability. Assistant coaches have jobs for life even though they've been proven they can't teach a thing simply because they were buddies with the owner 20-25 years ago.

Job security for life.

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Old
04-03-2014, 08:46 PM
  #38
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......This team is a dumpster fire.

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04-03-2014, 08:51 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751 View Post
Exactly this.

And don't get me wrong, Katz has been great. He has opened the purse strings and helped get the arena deal done. EIG wouldn't be anywhere close to an arena deal by now.

But the problem with Katz is this: under the EIG Kevin Lowe was constantly on the hot seat. The 05-06 run pretty much saved his job and he had to answer to the investors.

When Katz came into the picture, suddenly Lowe went from a guy who constantly had to justify his costs and was always looking over his shoulder to someone who will never lose his job no matter what.

On top of all that, with Katz the team can afford to make stupid mistakes like signing Denis Grebeshkov.

Add the two together and you have a team with no accountability. Assistant coaches have jobs for life even though they've been proven they can't teach a thing simply because they were buddies with the owner 20-25 years ago.

Job security for life.
I doubt Lowe or Katz has much to do with assistant coaches. That's MacT's job, and Eakins' as well.

Signing Grebs was also MacT's doing, and I don't see how that move damaged our rebuild at all. It's a one year deal using cap space we had laying around, and most of it is buried in the minors. Even if you are offended by the Grebs signing, you have to recognize that it was part of a general spree of aggressive moves. Some worked. Some didn't. If you want an aggressive GM you have to accept that some bad moves will be made now and then.

I think the Team Canada stuff with Lowe is what saved his job. He has respect in many circles. I also don't think that Lowe got off of this season's problems unscathed. He wasn't fired but his position is much more fragile than it was before. If Tambi was set up as the scapegoat before, Lowe is clearly being set up now.

It's hard for me to judge if Katz is bad or good. They say we are spending a lot more money on development now. I don't know how to prove it but if it's true then that's at least one good thing. The tight purse strings of the EIG might be the reason that our rebuild had nothing in the cupboards to support it in the first place.

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04-03-2014, 09:02 PM
  #40
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I doubt Lowe or Katz has much to do with assistant coaches. That's MacT's job, and Eakins' as well.
Oh? Even though they're the same assistant coaches that existed under Steve Tambellini, Pat Quinn, Tom Renney and Ralph Krueger?

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04-03-2014, 09:09 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
Good question OP.

And there's been a lot of good points from posters but in another thread I posited what the Oiler lineup could have looked like if they had made some more conservative decisions on trades and free agency. I examined the decisions made year in and year out, and I believe the core of the problem was the entire premise of the rebuild.

That you have to destroy the team and depth utterly in order to draft the best player every year for five years. One of the major problems is that we don't know which years the Oilers were actually trying NOT to tank, versus actually tanking. How about tanking for just one or two years instead of... five? eight?

Where did the Oilers go wrong?

a) hiring the wrong people.

- Pat Quinn was one of the worst possible decisions to hire as a head coach for a young team. He was too old, out of touch with modern hockey, never mind actually coaching kids.
- hiring inexperienced staff. Steve Tambellini, Ralph Krueger, Dallas Eakins, Steve Smith.
- Steve Tambellini in particular was a crushingly bad hire. His failure to bring in useful players and his lack of action in recent years have torpedoed this club.

- who should the Oilers have hired? Experienced persons who weren't so old that they are unfamiliar with modern day hockey.

A: Tom Renney was not a bad hire, he brought experience and a patient teacher to the organization. The Oilers should have kept him.

A: Charlie Huddy, he was let go when Craig MacT resigned as coach. He should have been retained, he had done a terrific job with the Oilers defense for many years.

A: Hire from Detroit. Staff has recently left Detroit looking for more opportunity: GM Jim Nill (now Dallas), Coach Paul MacLean (now Ottawa).

A: Hire young(ish) guys who have made their NHL mistakes already with other teams. Example: Paul Maurice, Peter Deboer (NJ Devils).

b) trading/losing veterans for unproven youth. brought in poorer veterans to replace veterans.

- perhaps the blame is on the scouts for getting young players who were not ready for prime time. But the Oilers prior to 2010 had many useful young players who should be leading the team now in their prime, not expecting these 18-20 year old kids to try to battle against the Joe Thorntons, Ryan Kesler and Ryan Getzlafs of the division. Instead we traded useful players.

E.g.

- traded Stoll, Greene for Vishnovsky. traded Vishnovsky for Ryan Whitney. Whitney gets injured and is no longer NHL capable. Was this predictable? Probably not, but unequivocably, Stoll, Greene or Vishnovsky would make the Oilers look 100% better playing on the team than the now gone Whitney.

- traded Torres for Brule. Where is Brule now? Torres is older now and less useful, but he could have been an extremely useful top 9 player for the last five years instead of Brule's stint.

- failed to resign Curtis Glencross. Another extremely useful top 9 player that the Oilers could have retained for the last five years. He's not sexy, but would have helped more than the crap players that were brought in instead.

- Dustin Penner. yah yah, I get it Pancakes. But its how many years later and Oiler fans are still complaining about the lack of size in the top six. What did we get in return for losing a big, skilled forward? Colten Teubert, Oscar Klefbom and Zharkov. Who would have been more useful to the Oilers in the last five years?

- traded Tom Gilbert for Nick Schultz. Bad trade. Gilbert was better than Schultz in all areas. Soft? Yes, but Nick Schultz wasn't an improvement at all. We gave up a four 4 dman for what turned to be a third pairing defensemen that in the end, the Oilers were all too happy to give up. Minnesota bought out Gilbert, but I think that had more to do with Gilbert's season long illness and the Wild's salary cap crunch that Gilbert's effectiveness.

- Souray. Yes Souray badmouthed the organization, but I have difficulties believing that he wanted to be blackballed and ostracized. I think the Oilers could have mended fences and they could have had an oft-injured top four defenseman playing for them. But even missing so many games, he was still a big, nasty, dman with a huge shot. Couldn't he have helped over the last five years?

And.... Tambellini brought in such highlight players like Cam Barker, Kurtis Foster, Nik Khabibulin, Colten Teubert, Nick Schultz, Darcy Hordichuk, Jerred Smithson, Mike Brown, Eric Belanger. This is a terrible list of players.




c) I have no qualms about the recent Oilers first round drafting. Each time, I thought they made the right choice by drafting the BPA. They key to drafting BPA is that if these players don't fit your need, then you have to trade them for players that do. That's the entire point of drafting Best Player Available, and not drafting by Need.

2009 - MPS
2010 - Hall
2011 - RNH, Klefbom
2012 - Yakupov.

I don't disagree with any of those picks.
I just wanted to say that this is an awesome post. Well done dude

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Old
04-03-2014, 09:13 PM
  #42
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They traded vets who were locker room cancers and had to put kids in their place because the team failed under Lowe to gain depth in the organization. They tried signing vets and they wouldn't come here.
Yeah, they tried every year to sign vets. It was an ongoing joke every summer that Edmonton was trying to get every UFA, but they all want to be in warmer climates or in the NE with easier travel schedules.

Hell, they tried to sign Chara right after Pronger bailed, but he chose a lottery team in Boston over a SC finalist in Edmonton. Imagine if Chara replaced Pronger for the start of the 2007 season? None of us would be having this conversation. But when players choose crappy teams over the Oilers even when they show success, its going to be a losing battle with respect to signing vets.

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04-03-2014, 09:14 PM
  #43
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Trading Pronger. Straight downhill after that.

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Old
04-03-2014, 09:24 PM
  #44
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July 2, 2008. The day Katz finally wore down the EIG and they sold him the team.
This.

If the EIG kept control, KLowe would of been fired.

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04-03-2014, 09:47 PM
  #45
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This.

If the EIG kept control, KLowe would of been fired.
Maybe later on, but he had strong allies within EIG as well.

Katz ended up with the team pretty much because Cal Nichols felt betrayed that the EIG was even considering letting Lowe walk.

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04-03-2014, 10:10 PM
  #46
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A lot of what I think has been mentioned earlier such as hiring the wrong people for the job and then trading away assets for nothing.

One thing that I thought maybe is not the main problem but I certainly think is quite a factor is our inability to develop any prospects outside of the first round. The only player that has been developed outside of the first round is Jeff Petry since the 2003 draft. Our inability to develop our prospects can be for numerous reasons like the mismanagement of our prospects (rushing players to the AHL/NHL) and it even could be the people we had in charge of development too.

When looking at the Stanley Cup champions of the past 4 years they all were able to develop players that played some sort of role whether big or small. Chicago have developed Hjarmlsson, Bolland, Keith, and Crawford outside of the first round who helped them win a Stanley Cup. Then to add to those players they also developed Saad, Shaw, and Kruger as well. LA were able to develop Martinez, King, Nolan, Voynov, and Quick. Even Boston developed guys like Bergeron, Lucic, Marchand and Krejci. It seems this year we are finally starting to see players really developing now. Hopefully now within our own system we can develop a player like Saad or Voynov.

I think that if we were able to develop some players we would not be in this big of hole as we are in right now.

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Old
04-03-2014, 10:37 PM
  #47
okgooil
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Originally Posted by ponokanocker View Post
Trading Pronger. Straight downhill after that.
I don't think they had a choice. I think it went wrong when they didn't immediately realize it was rebuild time at that moment. Rebuilds take time, we should have started sooner. For some reason signing Penner seems like a moment it really went bad.

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04-03-2014, 10:50 PM
  #48
Tyrolean
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
Good question OP.

And there's been a lot of good points from posters but in another thread I posited what the Oiler lineup could have looked like if they had made some more conservative decisions on trades and free agency. I examined the decisions made year in and year out, and I believe the core of the problem was the entire premise of the rebuild.

That you have to destroy the team and depth utterly in order to draft the best player every year for five years. One of the major problems is that we don't know which years the Oilers were actually trying NOT to tank, versus actually tanking. How about tanking for just one or two years instead of... five? eight?

Where did the Oilers go wrong?

a) hiring the wrong people.

- Pat Quinn was one of the worst possible decisions to hire as a head coach for a young team. He was too old, out of touch with modern hockey, never mind actually coaching kids.
- hiring inexperienced staff. Steve Tambellini, Ralph Krueger, Dallas Eakins, Steve Smith.
- Steve Tambellini in particular was a crushingly bad hire. His failure to bring in useful players and his lack of action in recent years have torpedoed this club.

- who should the Oilers have hired? Experienced persons who weren't so old that they are unfamiliar with modern day hockey.

A: Tom Renney was not a bad hire, he brought experience and a patient teacher to the organization. The Oilers should have kept him.

A: Charlie Huddy, he was let go when Craig MacT resigned as coach. He should have been retained, he had done a terrific job with the Oilers defense for many years.

A: Hire from Detroit. Staff has recently left Detroit looking for more opportunity: GM Jim Nill (now Dallas), Coach Paul MacLean (now Ottawa).

A: Hire young(ish) guys who have made their NHL mistakes already with other teams. Example: Paul Maurice, Peter Deboer (NJ Devils).

b) trading/losing veterans for unproven youth. brought in poorer veterans to replace veterans.

- perhaps the blame is on the scouts for getting young players who were not ready for prime time. But the Oilers prior to 2010 had many useful young players who should be leading the team now in their prime, not expecting these 18-20 year old kids to try to battle against the Joe Thorntons, Ryan Kesler and Ryan Getzlafs of the division. Instead we traded useful players.

E.g.

- traded Stoll, Greene for Vishnovsky. traded Vishnovsky for Ryan Whitney. Whitney gets injured and is no longer NHL capable. Was this predictable? Probably not, but unequivocably, Stoll, Greene or Vishnovsky would make the Oilers look 100% better playing on the team than the now gone Whitney.

- traded Torres for Brule. Where is Brule now? Torres is older now and less useful, but he could have been an extremely useful top 9 player for the last five years instead of Brule's stint.

- failed to resign Curtis Glencross. Another extremely useful top 9 player that the Oilers could have retained for the last five years. He's not sexy, but would have helped more than the crap players that were brought in instead.

- Dustin Penner. yah yah, I get it Pancakes. But its how many years later and Oiler fans are still complaining about the lack of size in the top six. What did we get in return for losing a big, skilled forward? Colten Teubert, Oscar Klefbom and Zharkov. Who would have been more useful to the Oilers in the last five years?

- traded Tom Gilbert for Nick Schultz. Bad trade. Gilbert was better than Schultz in all areas. Soft? Yes, but Nick Schultz wasn't an improvement at all. We gave up a four 4 dman for what turned to be a third pairing defensemen that in the end, the Oilers were all too happy to give up. Minnesota bought out Gilbert, but I think that had more to do with Gilbert's season long illness and the Wild's salary cap crunch that Gilbert's effectiveness.

- Souray. Yes Souray badmouthed the organization, but I have difficulties believing that he wanted to be blackballed and ostracized. I think the Oilers could have mended fences and they could have had an oft-injured top four defenseman playing for them. But even missing so many games, he was still a big, nasty, dman with a huge shot. Couldn't he have helped over the last five years?

And.... Tambellini brought in such highlight players like Cam Barker, Kurtis Foster, Nik Khabibulin, Colten Teubert, Nick Schultz, Darcy Hordichuk, Jerred Smithson, Mike Brown, Eric Belanger. This is a terrible list of players.




c) I have no qualms about the recent Oilers first round drafting. Each time, I thought they made the right choice by drafting the BPA. They key to drafting BPA is that if these players don't fit your need, then you have to trade them for players that do. That's the entire point of drafting Best Player Available, and not drafting by Need.

2009 - MPS
2010 - Hall
2011 - RNH, Klefbom
2012 - Yakupov.

I don't disagree with any of those picks.
They also got rid of Jan Hedja.

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04-03-2014, 10:53 PM
  #49
Tyrolean
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Originally Posted by Cawz View Post
Yeah, they tried every year to sign vets. It was an ongoing joke every summer that Edmonton was trying to get every UFA, but they all want to be in warmer climates or in the NE with easier travel schedules.

Hell, they tried to sign Chara right after Pronger bailed, but he chose a lottery team in Boston over a SC finalist in Edmonton. Imagine if Chara replaced Pronger for the start of the 2007 season? None of us would be having this conversation. But when players choose crappy teams over the Oilers even when they show success, its going to be a losing battle with respect to signing vets.
Of course, you can't go blaming the GM's for everything (bad as they were). Some things are simply out of their control.

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04-03-2014, 11:15 PM
  #50
Mr Positive
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Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751 View Post
Oh? Even though they're the same assistant coaches that existed under Steve Tambellini, Pat Quinn, Tom Renney and Ralph Krueger?
I realize that quotes can be BS, but I remember that Eakins basically said that he had the option to get his own guys there but that he kept the assistant coaches because the guys he would bring in would be just another version of them (something like that). He also liked that there would be some familiarity with the players there.

Someone brought up another quote that I never saw where management kind of prodded him into keeping them but IDK about that. I mean, that's just so strange. I assume that the answer is a bit between them. Maybe MacT or Lowe suggested keeping them and Eakins just didn't object.

Personally I would have liked MacT to be more aggressive on this. He didn't like how Dubnyk developed so it would have been proactive to start the season with a new goalie coach.

I also hope that if he chooses to keep Eakins that he lets at least one assistant coach go and hires someone, someone who could maybe replace him if he lays an egg to start the season again.

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