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Old
04-09-2014, 03:58 PM
  #26
usiel
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Wasn't it after game 4 the capitals go way delayed due to fog and had to land at BWI? Or am I confusing that with another series.

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04-10-2014, 07:43 AM
  #27
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Wasn't it after game 4 the capitals go way delayed due to fog and had to land at BWI? Or am I confusing that with another series.
Right. Montreal series if I recall. Still the Caps played a strong game and got Halaked.

One of BBs gutsiest moves (I was talking to my friend - who you know - prior to the game) was game 2 vs the Rangers in 08-09.

Theodore krapped the bed in game 1 along with broken ankles sarge. I told my friend that I had a feeling Boudreau would start Varlamov (who only had a couple NHL games in his belt up to that point) b/c if Theo messed up again you don't want a young goalies first game to be played in MSG with your team down 0-2. That took serious guts but it was 100% the right call at the time and it turned out to be anyhow.

His worst mistake in my book also had to deal with Varlamov...in 10-11 trailing 0-2 to Tampa I really thought he should have started Varlmov in game 3. Varlamov had an excellent record and sv pctg vs Tampa but BB was too loyal to Neuvirth at the time and I think that decision is what ended up costing him. I truly feel with Varlamov we would have came back and won that series. Neuvirth wasn't bad in the first 2 games but Roloson was CLEARLY better.

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04-10-2014, 09:53 AM
  #28
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There's one more thing that Boudreau even admits he probably wouldn't do again. After blowing another big series lead to Montreal in 2010, the Caps started out the 2011 season struggling. Boudreau had always had the Caps playing a wide open offense first style that suited his players. But when that style got shut down by the Habs, and then they struggled to open the next season, BB changed them over to a defense first system. While it took a few weeks for the team to gel around that system, they eventually did. And they eventually made the playoffs scoring something close to 100 goals fewer than the season before. But in the playoffs in 2011, even after beating NY in round 1 by 4 games to 1, they took on Tampa Bay and laid a complete egg. Got swept. Lost confidence, lost identity, eventually BB got fired partly into the following season.

Ultimately on his way out of town, BB commented that he needed to coach the team his way, and not change things up so much when they have a little adversity. One could say that a coach needs to adapt to his talent. Another take would be that a coach needs to run his system and make the players adapt - which Dale Hunter did with some success after BB was fired. BB inherited a team that was playing a defensive system, with offense minded talent. He let them play offense and they thrived, but failed in the playoffs. He then switched them back to a defensive system, and they bristled, and he ultimately lost the team. In the end, losing the team cost him his job.

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04-10-2014, 01:07 PM
  #29
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Orla Lawrie ‏@OrlaLawrie 59m
#TBT: Bruce Boudreau feelin' the love from a fan on @WayneGretzkysTO radio show!

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04-11-2014, 06:34 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by TheJoeMan View Post
I'm writing a column about Boudreau and his perceived inability to win in the playoffs. I would love some feedback from Caps fans on this subject. Specifically what do you guys think went wrong in the playoffs during his tenure in D.C. It's been well documented how dominate his teams have been in the regular season and how they haven't had much success in the playoffs. Do you guys feel he was out-coached or ran this team poorly when it mattered most? Was there some other factors that a causal observer like myself wouldn't be aware of? What about the leadership on the ice? I see Ovechkin's captaincy seems to be a hot button issue right now. Do you think he shares as much of the blame?

As Ducks fans we've been hearing this since he got here and there seemed to be some truth to it since we got bounced in the first round last year. Personally I feel there were a lot of things working against us last spring and the least of which was his coaching abilities. But I would love to hear what you guys have to say on the subject.
If you really want the answers you have to find it yourself. Study and analyze the playoff games Caps failed in. You will not get the answers you need by asking fans that think they know everything but clearly knowing nothing, at least almost nothing. Its never just black and white. Caps had an all star team but in tight games they seemed to choke. The best players didnt play as good as they had to and thats probably the main reason why they failed. Why this happened is almost impossible to know if you havent been very close to the club.

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04-11-2014, 06:56 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by SergeiMakarovStyle View Post
If you really want the answers you have to find it yourself. Study and analyze the playoff games Caps failed in. You will not get the answers you need by asking fans that think they know everything but clearly knowing nothing, at least almost nothing. Its never just black and white. Caps had an all star team but in tight games they seemed to choke. The best players didnt play as good as they had to and thats probably the main reason why they failed. Why this happened is almost impossible to know if you havent been very close to the club.
Nice post but completely uniformed.

Caps had an "all star" team? Here were our main Defensemen during 08-10...Jeff Schultz, Tom Poti, Mike Green, Milan Jurcina, John Erskine, Shaone Morrison and Brian Pothier.....so basically we had 2 NHL dmen on the roster.

Our best players didn't play good? Like when Ovechkin scored 8 goals and 14pts vs Pit? Then 5g+5a vs Montreal? Ovechkin/Semin/Green/Backstrom basically a PPG vs Philly?

So basically you tell him not to ask the fans of the team and you (who are not a fan) come in and have an explanation for all that is wrong followed up with little evidence.

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04-11-2014, 07:23 AM
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Plus, the Caps organization was clearly baffled as to why they lost each of those series. I'm betting you get just as many diverse opinions if you go around and ask a bunch of people in the org back then. Chances are one of these fans is closer to the answer than the Caps brass.

About the only thing the organization could come up with was to play more and more of a "defense first" style that worked against the star players and peaked with a 2nd round exit, followed by the coach quitting.

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04-11-2014, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by SergeiMakarovStyle View Post
If you really want the answers you have to find it yourself. Study and analyze the playoff games Caps failed in. You will not get the answers you need by asking fans that think they know everything but clearly knowing nothing, at least almost nothing. Its never just black and white. Caps had an all star team but in tight games they seemed to choke. The best players didnt play as good as they had to and thats probably the main reason why they failed. Why this happened is almost impossible to know if you havent been very close to the club.
just a thought. I bet many of us are far closer to "the club" than you have been.

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04-11-2014, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeiMakarovStyle View Post
If you really want the answers you have to find it yourself. Study and analyze the playoff games Caps failed in. You will not get the answers you need by asking fans that think they know everything but clearly knowing nothing, at least almost nothing. Its never just black and white. Caps had an all star team but in tight games they seemed to choke. The best players didnt play as good as they had to and thats probably the main reason why they failed. Why this happened is almost impossible to know if you havent been very close to the club.
I wasn't looking for answers. I wanted the opinion of Caps fans. I plan to catch an old playoff game or two but without the reference of watching the entire regular season that preceded them I won't really be getting answers that way either. A lot of what everyone has said bears a lot of semblance to what has happened with the Ducks the last two seasons so everyone's input has been very helpful.

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04-12-2014, 08:33 PM
  #35
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he was a good coach to win a cup requires a bit of luck

he makes the playoffs and team has a chance

you dont make playoffs no chance

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04-12-2014, 09:58 PM
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In the Montreal series, from what I can recall, many of the shots were taken from low percentage areas. The Habs pushed everything to the outside and blocked as much as possible. Halak faced only shots that were easy for him to stop. Boudreau had nothing for this.

That said, I'd trade all the heartbreak and angst for what is currently going on with the Caps. I'd take and exciting regular season and 1st or 2nd round exit every season for this any day of the week. At least with Boudreau, it was a forgone conclusion that te Caps would make the playoffs as a 3 seed at worst.

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04-12-2014, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpringfieldSkins View Post
In the Montreal series, from what I can recall, many of the shots were taken from low percentage areas. The Habs pushed everything to the outside and blocked as much as possible. Halak faced only shots that were easy for him to stop. Boudreau had nothing for this.

That said, I'd trade all the heartbreak and angst for what is currently going on with the Caps. I'd take and exciting regular season and 1st or 2nd round exit every season for this any day of the week. At least with Boudreau, it was a forgone conclusion that te Caps would make the playoffs as a 3 seed at worst.
My recollection of the Montreal series not only did the caps dominate in offensive zone time but they had plenty of ten bell chances and then Montreal would come down on their one offensive chance and score. I'll be scarred from that series to my grave.

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04-13-2014, 11:23 AM
  #38
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Well he's better than Adam Oates in not missing the playoffs.

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04-14-2014, 07:19 AM
  #39
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My recollection of the Montreal series not only did the caps dominate in offensive zone time but they had plenty of ten bell chances and then Montreal would come down on their one offensive chance and score. I'll be scarred from that series to my grave.
Thats how I remember it.

Not only that but Montreal blocked a ton of shots and we fired quite a few wide. Our Corsi and Fenwick must have been through the roof.

There was no fault in the coaching there despite people trying to assign blame at the easy target in BB.

Funny thing was the experts were raging on us and how we didn't play the right way...the next series they said "Pitt will show the Caps how its done!!!"...it started with the announcers right from the first goal Pitt scored.

Halak was insane for a few weeks. Montreal (Cammaleri especially) just found a way to score on every single one of their chances.

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04-14-2014, 07:29 AM
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I don't remember a ton of 10 bell saves by Halak. When we did break down their box, Ovi and Semin missed the net on countless high quality chances, much more than Halak saved their D's ass.

Halak racked up a ton of saves but it was by design. Most of them were routine, perimeter stuff. The biggest play he made, was falling over backwards after the puck went through his legs on the potential game tying goal in the 3rd period. Hal Gill throws up his arms, the dumb ass refs bought it hook line and sinker, and our balloon popped.

That was the beginning of the end.

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04-14-2014, 07:40 AM
  #41
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I don't remember a ton of 10 bell saves by Halak. When we did break down their box, Ovi and Semin missed the net on countless high quality chances, much more than Halak saved their D's ass.

Halak racked up a ton of saves but it was by design. Most of them were routine, perimeter stuff. The biggest play he made, was falling over backwards after the puck went through his legs on the potential game tying goal in the 3rd period. Hal Gill throws up his arms, the dumb ass refs bought it hook line and sinker, and our balloon popped.

That was the beginning of the end.
Probably due to your advanced age my man....that or all the time spent with Marion Barry hitting the pipe...

Halak was insane. Stood on his head.

His game 6 performance alone was one of the all time greatest in a single NHL playoff game (which didn't go to OT). But the other games were strong too.

Price lost one game and Halak couldn't hold the fort under relentless pressure in the other two.

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04-14-2014, 08:06 AM
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I have never been one to blame Halak and Halak alone. Hockey is rarely about uncontrolled destiny.

Green was bum rushed for 2 critical goals in that series including the eventual game winner in game 7.

Varly barely played that year, our clear backup, yet there he was in game 7. Does anyone think Theo could not have made those 18 saves in game 7 to haunt his former team? Bruce had his number 1 goalie on a short leash and never tried to go back.

Flash was featured on our listless PP over our PP regular all year, Laich. Front of the net screener, exactly what has been used for a 50 years to beat a "hot" goalie.

There was more to the series than Halak. We beat great goalies all year long. We ran into a smart coach as much as a hot goalie.

The hot goalie thing haunting us in the playoffs started long before Halak came to the US. That excuse got old with me long ago.

If we never ever win a cup, will be blame hot goalies? I won't.

Just my two cents.

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04-14-2014, 08:30 AM
  #43
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Probably due to your advanced age my man....that or all the time spent with Marion Barry hitting the pipe...

Halak was insane. Stood on his head.

His game 6 performance alone was one of the all time greatest in a single NHL playoff game (which didn't go to OT). But the other games were strong too.

Price lost one game and Halak couldn't hold the fort under relentless pressure in the other two.


First half is vs the Caps. Not great video quality but you can see his best saves are gloves on shots from bad angles or far enough away to track them. Some might not have even been on net. Mostly he was in position and the puck was shot right into him. He made a few pad saves on weak shots by extending on the ice. Not the flip-flopping acrobatic performance some have reconstructed in their memories to protect the "hot goalie" narrative.

Here's game 6:



Best save is at 1:30 or so. Notice lots of shots from outside the dots and/or right into the crest. The flashy save around 2:40 was right into his glove and he hammed it up with a Roy-esque flourish.

At about 3:50 he has the kind of multi-save series you'd expect based on the recall of those who credit Halak for winning everything by himself. That was a good series of saves on a PK that one migh consider beyond routine. There's another series soon after that where he's flopping around again and the net comes off, which looks like a shot that was going wide and and hit a defender before being covered up.

There's no doubt he made some good saves, and didn't let in a lot of softies, but MOST of the time he just had to get his stick on the ice and square up to the shooter, who was often beyond the dots and/or at a bad angle. The enthusiasm of the fans and the Habs players, and Caps fan frustrations, may have made it look like more than it was.

Another note: Do you see a single fake from the Caps players?

Game 7:



Pay particular attention to how many Habs are around the net and the puck on every shot/save. Halak's best work in that series came on the few times there was a loose puck that didn't get scooped up. But most of the time he was in position and the Caps just fired at his body. Then the puck was frozen or cleared.

Caps fans that year were used to the team just firing the puck and seeing it go in. The Habs played a great team defensive game, Caps goalies let in softies, Caps PP stunk, and Halak was solid to good. Halak by himself did NOT steal that series with inhuman play.


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04-14-2014, 08:30 AM
  #44
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I have never been one to blame Halak and Halak alone. Hockey is rarely about uncontrolled destiny.

Green was bum rushed for 2 critical goals in that series including the eventual game winner in game 7.

Varly barely played that year, our clear backup, yet there he was in game 7. Does anyone think Theo could not have made those 18 saves in game 7 to haunt his former team? Bruce had his number 1 goalie on a short leash and never tried to go back.

Flash was featured on our listless PP over our PP regular all year, Laich. Front of the net screener, exactly what has been used for a 50 years to beat a "hot" goalie.

There was more to the series than Halak. We beat great goalies all year long. We ran into a smart coach as much as a hot goalie.

The hot goalie thing haunting us in the playoffs started long before Halak came to the US. That excuse got old with me long ago.

If we never ever win a cup, will be blame hot goalies? I won't.

Just my two cents.
The Moore goal was more on Carlson than Green in game 7. But you would have liked to see Varlamov stop that.

Varly barely played the year before too but came up big in the playoffs. BB's big mistake was starting Theodore who cost us game 1 and almost cost us game 2 with that awful start and 2 bad goals. If anything Varlamov should have started that series knowing how mentally fragile Theodore was.

Agreed on Flash. That was BBs boy. He did eventually bench him and reduced his TOI I thought as the series went on. I don't believe he dressed for game 7 (walker too little too late)

Sometimes a hot goalie IS the reason. That year certainly was for the most part. But in the end I thought it was an error to start Theodore after what he showed the prior year. Hindsight is 20/20

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04-14-2014, 08:40 AM
  #45
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The Moore goal was more on Carlson than Green in game 7. But you would have liked to see Varlamov stop that.
I call bunk. Green had the puck to the left of Varly and coughed it up.

Why did Bruce have Carlson out with Green anyways? Bruce was desperate for a goal and that may explain Carlson over on left point aggressively trying for a keep in. Somewhere he did not play all year. C's always cover the LD pinch under Bruce. Always. Who came in late to help? Knuble.

That was the series clinching goal. Carlson was just a greenhorn doing what Bruce wanted.

Green was our Norris candidate vet that should have made a simple play - hard around. Green should not need a kid holding his hand there.

Look at the big picture, if it was simply Halak that held us back, why did our team crumble in the 4 years since? We should have won the cup the next year or come damn close.

Fact is the book was out on us. A "hot" goalie was no longer needed to beat us. Teams focused on Ovi doing his move, and the rest is history.

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04-14-2014, 08:46 AM
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I call bunk. Green had the puck to the left of Varly and coughed it up.

Why did Bruce have Carlson out with Green anyways? Bruce was desperate for a goal and that may explain Carlson over on left point boards aggressively trying for a keep in. C's always cover the LD pinch under Bruce. Always.

That was the series clinching goal. Carlson was just a greenhorn doing what Bruce wanted.

Green was our Norris candidate vet that should have made a simple play. Green should not need a kid holding his hand there.

Look at the big picture, if it was simply Halak that held us back, why did our team crumble in the 4 years since? We should have won the cup the next year or come damn close.

Fact is the book was out on us. A "hot" goalie was no longer needed to beat us. Teams focused on Ovi doing his move, and the rest is history.

Yup. That was an entitled team that believed the hype coming from its owner and marketing. They believed everything would come easily and on a "linear progression", as Langway said. They admitted they didn't take the Habs seriously enough.

Montreal had a gameplan and a solid goaltender. The Caps had goalie issues, PP issues and nothing but the belief that if you fire enough pucks on net you'll score like you did all year.

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04-14-2014, 08:49 AM
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Another note: Do you see a single fake from the Caps players?
....
Great post.

I think Bruce's counter to a great game plan from Montreal was to just keep shooting. We all know the line.

One has to go in when you shoot a hundred times.

No, it does not.

There was no visible adjustment that I saw from Bruce other than he had Ovi do a few forays down RW to get away from the left shot RDs stuffing his every move.

Its high time we start acknowledging our failures, instead of simply crediting others for our collective playoff choke jobs over the past 30 years.

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04-14-2014, 08:51 AM
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I call bunk. Green had the puck to the left of Varly and coughed it up.

Why did Bruce have Carlson out with Green anyways? Bruce was desperate for a goal and that may explain Carlson over on left point aggressively trying for a keep in. Somewhere he did not play all year. C's always cover the LD pinch under Bruce. Always. Who came in late to help? Knuble.

That was the series clinching goal. Carlson was just a greenhorn doing what Bruce wanted.

Green was our Norris candidate vet that should have made a simple play - hard around. Green should not need a kid holding his hand there.

Look at the big picture, if it was simply Halak that held us back, why did our team crumble in the 4 years since? We should have won the cup the next year or come damn close.

Fact is the book was out on us. A "hot" goalie was no longer needed to beat us. Teams focused on Ovi doing his move, and the rest is history.
I'll have to watch it again. I remember the first few times I viewed it that it was a rookie error by Carlson more than Green.

Also I actually AGREED with BB playing both of them together at the time. They were our two best offensive D and we were having trouble scoring. I had no problem there. I believe Poti was out of the lineup. Who else did we have at the time...Sloan? Schultz? 1st game Alzner? ..I guess Corvo but he kinda sucked

We crumbled since due to management's overreaction to that loss and change in philosophy that resulted. I think we all can agree on that in large part.

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04-14-2014, 08:58 AM
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I'll have to watch it again. I remember the first few times I viewed it that it was a rookie error by Carlson more than Green.

Also I actually AGREED with BB playing both of them together at the time. They were our two best offensive D and we were having trouble scoring. I had no problem there. I believe Poti was out of the lineup. Who else did we have at the time...Sloan? Schultz? 1st game Alzner? ..I guess Corvo but he kinda sucked

We crumbled since due to management's overreaction to that loss and change in philosophy that resulted. I think we all can agree on that in large part.
No. Management did not overreact to that loss. At least not entirely or immediately. This is a persistent myth that is not borne out by fact.

BB went to the trap, after talking to GMGM, following the losing streak and the 7-0 loss to the Rags the following season. The scoring dried up and the only way BB could think of to fix the situation was to make the defense better. If the Caps had continued to simply outscore teams that next season there would have been no change.

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04-14-2014, 09:16 AM
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No. Management did not overreact to that loss. At least not entirely or immediately. This is a persistent myth that is not borne out by fact.

BB went to the trap, after talking to GMGM, following the losing streak and the 7-0 loss to the Rags the following season. The scoring dried up and the only way BB could think of to fix the situation was to make the defense better. If the Caps had continued to simply outscore teams that next season there would have been no change.
This situation was still mysterious...did BB initiate it? Did GMGM? Did the voices convince both?

Japers did an article on that....during that 4 or 5 game losing streak the Caps actually had strong possession numbers if I recall and just had a tough time shooting wise and their goalies didn't save much of anything.

Its debatable if we even needed a change. I was against the trap then and pretty vocal about it. I was against the trap when Hanlon switched to it out of the blue as well. In general...I am against the trap!

EDIT: Also...lets go back to when Wilson was hired by McPhee and Polin. He was an all out offensive coach from the high flying Ducks.

In 97-98 we played an aggressive style backed by Kolzig and made it to the finals. I believe we missed the playoffs the following year if I'm not mistaken.

The year after...we went to the...wait for it.....TRAP! ..actually they called it the "Center Lock" built around an aging 1st line center who couldn't skate up and down the ice anylonger.

Bondra's production went way down to the point of requesting a trade.

Wilson had NO PREVIOUS history of trapping. I just found that curious....

Hanlon too...he was a very aggressive forcheck and physical play type coach. Suddenly he was not ...


Last edited by BobRouse: 04-14-2014 at 09:23 AM.
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