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(Apr. 15, 2014) Flyers extend Andrew MacDonald [six years $30 million, per media]

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04-29-2014, 02:00 PM
  #276
Ryker
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Yeah, his upside is definitely higher. I just struggle to believe it's enough to justify trade and contract.
It's hard to say, because we don't know how the cap will look like in the future, and what other assets we might have gotten if he didn't eat as much cap space as he will. And I wasn't a fan of the trade (I hated it) nor am I a fan of the contract (I can deal with it), but it has to be said that it's tough to compare cap hits directly, since there's no nice relationship in terms of how much more the better player should be paid. On one hand, if he's better and his cap hit can fit within the available space, then anything is fine. On the other hand, there are cap considerations and if you "overpay" one player, you might not get another player who would improve your team more than the "overpaid" guy. So, really, I'm trying to stay away from cap considerations for now, since there's a lot of uncertainty, but if I was to have to form a judgement on it, the extension just barely fits below the upper cut-off point of money I'd give MacDonald.

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04-29-2014, 05:21 PM
  #277
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I think MacDonald helped the Blue Line getting to the playoffs, but he's slowed down somewhat. But his attributes, shot blocker with mobility that can clear the zone, is needed. $5M per year is likely what he would get as a FA. The Islanders offered him $4.5 and he turned them down.

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04-29-2014, 07:15 PM
  #278
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His defensive zone turnovers have been brutal the last two games. He was pretty solid in this category since he's been here. Hopefully he gets out of the funk.

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04-29-2014, 09:32 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by jabba2 View Post
I think MacDonald helped the Blue Line getting to the playoffs, but he's slowed down somewhat. But his attributes, shot blocker with mobility that can clear the zone, is needed. $5M per year is likely what he would get as a FA. The Islanders offered him $4.5 and he turned them down.
The Islanders offered him 16 mil for 4 years and wouldn't go any higher. We knew he would get more on the open market but we never thought he would double up that.

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05-01-2014, 10:16 AM
  #280
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The playoff AMac was pretty much what he did during his Islanders tenure. Some nice play, lots of shots blocked (because opponents spend too much time in his end), but also some poor decisions and a maddening tendency to be in the TV picture while the other guys celebrate a goal. He's a good person and teammate, but the cons have more impact than the pros. Knowing the Philly fans, before long he will be your next whipping boy.

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05-01-2014, 10:30 AM
  #281
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Originally Posted by Chardo View Post
The playoff AMac was pretty much what he did during his Islanders tenure. Some nice play, lots of shots blocked (because opponents spend too much time in his end), but also some poor decisions and a maddening tendency to be in the TV picture while the other guys celebrate a goal. He's a good person and teammate, but the cons have more impact than the pros. Knowing the Philly fans, before long he will be your next whipping boy.
Thanks man, we all slept through the playoffs. Good thing you caught us up on it. There's a much bigger picture as to why AMac and the rest of the defense struggled, but I'm sure you're not here to talk about that. Run along and let me know Donovan and Strait prove capable of replacing what the Islanders miss in Streit and MacDonald.

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05-01-2014, 10:49 AM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jabba2 View Post
I think MacDonald helped the Blue Line getting to the playoffs, but he's slowed down somewhat. But his attributes, shot blocker with mobility that can clear the zone, is needed. $5M per year is likely what he would get as a FA. The Islanders offered him $4.5 and he turned them down.

I don't know where you got that number from. Staple (who is a very solid source) reported 4 x 4. So, Flyers offered 14 million more over the life of the contact.

I am not entirely sure I would call that an overpayment. The prices for ufa defenders this summer will be insane and AMac would have gotten that elsewhere, for sure.

He was a warrior for the Isles. Played in every situation and worked his butt off.

He is not an excellent dman, and he had a craptastic season. But, he should be a quality top four for years to come and will help Philly.

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05-01-2014, 10:57 AM
  #283
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I still can't help but feel like in 2-3 years this is going to be one of the worst contracts for a D-man in the league. MacDonald is basically a third pairing d-man.

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05-01-2014, 10:58 AM
  #284
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Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
I don't know where you got that number from. Staple (who is a very solid source) reported 4 x 4. So, Flyers offered 14 million more over the life of the contact.

I am not entirely sure I would call that an overpayment. The prices for ufa defenders this summer will be insane and AMac would have gotten that elsewhere, for sure.

He was a warrior for the Isles. Played in every situation and worked his butt off.

He is not an excellent dman, and he had a craptastic season. But, he should be a quality top four for years to come and will help Philly.
So Holmgren got into a bidding war with himself again?

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05-01-2014, 10:59 AM
  #285
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he needs to add something 10lbs of muscles and stop getting ragdolled.

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05-01-2014, 11:03 AM
  #286
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
So Holmgren got into a bidding war with himself again?
No, he basically forced himself into keeping MacDonald at all costs when he traded two picks to get him. MacDonald would have gotten the same number if he hit the open market, if not more. The only gripe I have about the contract is the length. Six years is a long time to committ to a guy that's not part of your core group.

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05-01-2014, 11:15 AM
  #287
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His last 3 games were brutal. Turnovers galore. That first goal last night was a direct result of his turnover behind the net.

I thought he was pretty solid before game 5. Still don't think he provides enough offense to live up to the contract.

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05-01-2014, 11:27 AM
  #288
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Originally Posted by dawkins121 View Post
I still can't help but feel like in 2-3 years this is going to be one of the worst contracts for a D-man in the league. MacDonald is basically a third pairing d-man.
He led the Flyers in TOI/G in the playoffs and was 2nd in the regular season. They probably leaned on him too much, but third pairing guys don't get that kind of ice time.

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05-01-2014, 11:32 AM
  #289
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
So Holmgren got into a bidding war with himself again?
Impending ufas will not give up their option to test the market unless they get their number.

Flyers have the dollars and the cap is going up. AMac is slightly overpaid and I don't like the term. But, sometimes you have to break a few eggs to make an omlet. Building a team in the ufa era means overpaying for a few vets and it really isn't that horrendous a contract.

I am one NYI fan who hopes this deal works out. Have a natural aversion to Philly from this days of the great battles between Trottier and Clarke. But, I respect what AMac got done in NY and think he has earned some success.

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05-01-2014, 11:42 AM
  #290
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He'll be fine as a second pairing D. They need top end talent and that won't be acquired through FA.

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05-01-2014, 12:47 PM
  #291
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
So Holmgren got into a bidding war with himself again?
stop that nonsense. that never happens.

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05-02-2014, 12:08 PM
  #292
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MacDonald will be 28 in the first year of the new deal, that's a lot better than 4 years to a 35 year old Streit. With the cap going up, if all the young defensemen come through, in three years a 31 year old McDonald will be viable trade bait. Meanwhile he buys time for the kids to grow up.

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05-02-2014, 02:22 PM
  #293
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
He led the Flyers in TOI/G in the playoffs and was 2nd in the regular season. They probably leaned on him too much, but third pairing guys don't get that kind of ice time.
He gets killed in his role so he is really a third pairing defender getting minutes he can't handle.

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05-02-2014, 02:23 PM
  #294
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Killed.

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05-02-2014, 02:27 PM
  #295
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I don't think it's any surprise that MacDonald started buckling when he was given more minutes.

He's a 4/5 defenseman and that's why his contract value is too high but, if he's used as he was when he first arrived in Philly (2nd pairing ES minutes, with PK time; please remove him from the 2nd powerpaly unit), he'll be fine.

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05-02-2014, 02:28 PM
  #296
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Who's going to play the point on the 2nd PP unit next season?

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05-02-2014, 02:45 PM
  #297
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Who's going to play the point on the 2nd PP unit next season?
Good question.

They could go 4 forawrds and 1 defenseman as they have tried in the past on the second unit (Read took the point spot before) with someone like Gus as the only defenseman.

I expect some roster movement in the off-season and I hope they find a suitable second powerplay unit defenseman among the prospects or through an acquisition. I just know that I don't want to see MacDonald in that role anymore.

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05-02-2014, 04:54 PM
  #298
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He was horrible in this series, but I really don't mind him if he can be used properly (i.e. less than 20 minutes a night)

It's going to be important to get the right pieces so this guy plays the right role. You aren't going to succeed in the playoffs with Amac playing 1st pairing

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05-06-2014, 12:01 AM
  #299
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Apparently Holmgren's requirements for a defenseman are as follows -
- Indecisive in defensive zone? - [✓]
- Cross-ice neutral zone passes to covered forwards? [✓]
- Turn over the puck every other shift? [✓]
- Left-handed? [✓]
- Low Corsi %? [✓]
- Can't shoot the puck? [✓]

This is already one of the worst contracts in the league, and it has not even started yet. These are his contract comparables for 2014/15 - http://www.capgeek.com/comparables/?...0&year_id=2014. Would legitimately take every one of those defenseman over MacDonald.

Guys like Garrison, Hamhuis, Ehrhoff, Big Buff and Yandle will be available for trade. Would've even preferred Nikitin or Stralman as the #5 defenseman over AMac.

Here is to 6 years of yelling at my television screen.

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05-06-2014, 08:28 AM
  #300
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So you'd take Pronger, the -39 Edler, the injury prone Wideman, or the 37 year old concussion-riddled Visnovksy over MacDonald? Thank god you aren't our GM. There's only really four rock solid guys on that list - McDonaugh, Hamhuis, Kornwall and Bouwmeester. The rest are far from perfect.

And I would much rather have MacDonald than trade BSchenn+ for any of the targets you named.


Last edited by Curufinwe: 05-06-2014 at 08:54 AM.
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