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Old
08-25-2005, 01:04 PM
  #51
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
I didn't say that. Right now, you guys are over $43 million. To get under the cap with trading one player, you have to trade either Brodeur, Elias, or Rafalski.

To get under the cap trading two players, you have to trade Madden, Malakhov, or Mogilny plus one other player... or trade any two of Friesen, Gomez, and McGillis.

Sure, other teams will be circling New Jersey like vultures, but you also can't get under the cap trading away one player unless you trade away one of your high profile stars. You realistically need to trade away at least two players, and you can't get any decent player back in return because then you'll get back over the cap... so you're stuck with picks. And nobody would dump a high pick or top prospect to do New Jersey a favor.

And again, after you trade away a couple players, you'll need to sign low value scrubs or acquire them in trade.

You have zero leverage. If one player (you're willing to trade) could save the day for you, then you'd have more leverage. Even then... teams that are in cap hell are lucky to get anything of value in return.
Thats why having great rookies like Parise and Suglobov comming up along with Rheaume as a 4th liner will help. Don't worry about our team.

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Old
08-25-2005, 01:10 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
Thats why having great rookies like Parise and Suglobov comming up along with Rheaume as a 4th liner will help. Don't worry about our team.
I didn't see any indication in KingsPawn post that he was worried about the Devils. He was just stating facts.

It is a fact that New Jersey is over the cap.

It is a fact that they will have to trade away at least one player to get back under the cap.

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Old
08-25-2005, 01:11 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
Thats why having great rookies like Parise and Suglobov comming up along with Rheaume as a 4th liner will help. Don't worry about our team.
I'm not worried at all. I'm just making the point that you will not get any good return for any trade you make. If you don't need to sign some scrub, good on you... but you still need to have cap room.

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08-25-2005, 01:13 PM
  #54
Jason MacIsaac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
I didn't see any indication in KingsPawn post that he was worried about the Devils. He was just stating facts.

It is a fact that New Jersey is over the cap.

It is a fact that they will have to trade away at least one player to get back under the cap.
It is also a fact that Lou is the best GM in the league who has won 3 cups in the last 12 years on a tight budget.

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08-25-2005, 01:15 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
I'm not worried at all. I'm just making the point that you will not get any good return for any trade you make. If you don't need to sign some scrub, good on you... but you still need to have cap room.
We will get under the cap....but enough with these stupid trde proposals that start with NJ giving up White, Friesen and Kozlov for a 4th round pick and future considerations for the 2012 season.

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Old
08-25-2005, 01:22 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
It is also a fact that Lou is the best GM in the league
Actually that is an opinion. One that is mostly held by Devils fans.

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Old
08-25-2005, 01:26 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
We will get under the cap....but enough with these stupid trde proposals that start with NJ giving up White, Friesen and Kozlov for a 4th round pick and future considerations for the 2012 season.
Then answer these questions.

If Clarke could not get more than "future considerations" for his salary dump what makes you think Lou can?

If Brian Burke could not get more than picks and a low rated minor leaguer for his salary dump what makes you think Lou can?

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Old
08-25-2005, 01:43 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
Actually that is an opinion. One that is mostly held by Devils fans.
Instead of having pictures or posters of their star players NJD fans all have posters of Lou sitting over their beds.

Lou has had a great run over the last decade where the system they played was more important and responsible than the players they had but from this point going forward we'll see just how great he is as NJ is in a tough spot cap wise and that after having lost his 2 best defenseman and anchors in Nieds-Stevens and IMO he bigtime overpaid for Malakhov(3.6 million? ) and Mogilny(3.5 million at 36?) and both of them are huge injury risks.

This yr will do alot to either solidify Lou's makr as a top GM or to see some of the shine come off his tenure depending upon what moves he has up his sleeve.

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Old
08-25-2005, 02:56 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9
Instead of having pictures or posters of their star players NJD fans all have posters of Lou sitting over their beds.


Your post would have been 100x better if you just left it at that hahaha.

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Old
08-25-2005, 08:28 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
Actually that is an opinion. One that is mostly held by Devils fans.
That is the opinion of most hockey people, maybe not yours per say, but most people in the hockey industry. Plus, add 4 cup appearances and 3 championships in ten years, without buying major free agents... Enough said about Lou's credentials. How about your GM?

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Old
08-25-2005, 09:04 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
Actually that is an opinion. One that is mostly held by Devils fans.
Name a GM who is better

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Old
08-25-2005, 09:07 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongebob
Then answer these questions.

If Clarke could not get more than "future considerations" for his salary dump what makes you think Lou can?

If Brian Burke could not get more than picks and a low rated minor leaguer for his salary dump what makes you think Lou can?
White and Friesen are both players that many teams will want. When there is a large demand for a certain type of player you usually get better offers then when there is only one team interested. Lou has the respect of other GM's and has allways made trades that helped out both teams.....GM's remember that sort of stuff.

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Old
08-25-2005, 10:48 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
Name a GM who is better
Pierre Lacroix

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Old
08-25-2005, 10:51 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nocturn
Pierre Lacroix
3 > 2

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Old
08-25-2005, 11:48 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nocturn
Pierre Lacroix
Lou has gotten more results with less money and talent.

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:06 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9
Instead of having pictures or posters of their star players NJD fans all have posters of Lou sitting over their beds.

Lou has had a great run over the last decade where the system they played was more important and responsible than the players they had but from this point going forward we'll see just how great he is as NJ is in a tough spot cap wise and that after having lost his 2 best defenseman and anchors in Nieds-Stevens and IMO he bigtime overpaid for Malakhov(3.6 million? ) and Mogilny(3.5 million at 36?) and both of them are huge injury risks.

This yr will do alot to either solidify Lou's makr as a top GM or to see some of the shine come off his tenure depending upon what moves he has up his sleeve.
I was going to reply but you really aren't worth it. You hate the Devils, I get it. You're the first poster I'm adding to my ignore list.

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:15 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinnie
I was going to reply but you really aren't worth it. You hate the Devils, I get it. You're the first poster I'm adding to my ignore list.
Seriously, what was wrong with that post? I can understand it hit a nerve, but it's not like it was taking liberties with the facts.

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:19 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bland
Seriously, what was wrong with that post? I can understand it hit a nerve, but it's not like it was taking liberties with the facts.
Mainly it's because it's JR#9. 85% of his posts are in Devils threads. He's. So. Annoying.

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:34 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Devil
Mainly it's because it's JR#9. 85% of his posts are in Devils threads. He's. So. Annoying.
Exactly.

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:39 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR#9
This yr will do alot to either solidify Lou's makr as a top GM or to see some of the shine come off his tenure depending upon what moves he has up his sleeve.
Since Lou has been GM:

1988 1 Game away from the the Stanely Cup Finals

1994 1 Game away from the the Stanely Cup Finals (1 goal away)

1995 Stanely Cup Champions

2000 Stanely Cup Champions

2001 1 Game away from the the Stanely Cup

2003 Stanely Cup Champions


When Lou took over in 87 the Team NEVER made the playoffs....Since then the team has missed the playoffs twice in 17 years.

And the year the missed the playoffs in 1996, they went 37 33 12 86points. There win percentage that was 0.524, for comparsion in 2000, one of their Cup winning years, they had a 0.598 win%. Their record would have given them HOME ICE in the Western conf. that year .

The last time the Devils had less than 40 wins season was 1996

Since 1993-94 the Devils have had 8 100+ point seasons

Lou is now approaching 2 decades of success, And you think the moves he makes in this off season will be a defining moment for Lou??

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Old
08-26-2005, 12:40 AM
  #71
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alright, please stop talking about each other and get back to the topic...

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Old
08-26-2005, 02:02 AM
  #72
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And by the way, I am not convinced the Devils need to make any major moves.

1. Sources close to the Team are reporting the Devils were at 40.2 before the Elias signing.

2. Other Sources show that a team can not be over the Cap + 10% threshold until October 1. The Cap + 10% is $42,900,000

The Cap + 10% is 42.9M. 40.2 + 4.1 for Elias is 44.3. (which is what NHLPA is reporting $44,256,929.00 )

There is problem here; You can't be over the cap + the threshold. So how are the Devils at 44.25 or the 43.75 that TSN is reporting???

Both of these numbers are more the threshold, but there can be some explaination:

1. All Salaries reported are not correct. The 2005/06 Compensation maybe 100% correct, but the yearly compensation may NOT be what is hitting the cap. In the case of John Madden, his salary this year is listed as $3,861,561.00. Many have said (including Madden himself) that his cap hit is only going to be 2.2M this year. That is a 1.67 difference in his 2005/06 compensation.

If this is true, the Devils are Now within the threshold (42.58), which is mandatory, so I tend to believe this is case.


2. What about Elias' long term illness? Does his salary count against the Cap? If yes, we are at the 42.58 corrected number for Madden's salary. If No, the Devils the Devils are at 38.48. Wait, there is more! What if it is yes 42.58, but the Devils get a "replacement" player for Elias longterm illness and use Mogilny's salary as the replacement? Well that would mean Elias counts (42.58) but Mogilny doesn't (42.58 - 3.5) 39.08.

With these question not answered the Devil can be anywhere from 42.58 to as low as 38.48 right now....

If the Devils are at 42.58, I figure they would need a 4.58 reduction to get to at least 38 Million for the Start. If this is the case you can bet Friesen, Kozlov and a role player are gonners 4,028,000 + another 760K for someone like Grant Marshall. for a savings of 4,788,000. Which would put the Devils at $37,792,000.00. And Yes we probably wouldn't get much for these guys.

But if the Devils get any relieve from the Elias illness, they could be at either 39.08 or 38.48 depending on how the relieve would work. This would mean the Devils could literally start the season with almost NO moves whatsoever.

It would however mean the Devils would have to move someone(or multiple players) once Elias comes back. But then there are even more questions! Does ELias Salary get prorated if Salary doesn't orginally hit the books? If Mogilny is considered "replacement" and the team gets his services free of cap hit until Elias comes back then the 3.5 would come on the books and the Devils would then have to get back under the cap. But it means the Devils get to start the season with just about ALL of their players and get to make decision once the season starts.

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Old
08-26-2005, 03:13 AM
  #73
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What if Scott Stevens decides to return? Have there been any recent reports on his status? I did read that Lou Lamoriello commented that if Stevens decided to return, he would manage to find a way to bring him back.

My guess is that with or without Stevens, one of the Devils' blueliners will be a goner. Then there is also the issue of the necessity of both Oliwa and Langdon. One or the other has to go as it appears to be a waste to keep both on the roster.

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Old
08-26-2005, 03:38 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
Name a GM who is better
Dave Taylor is by far the best in the league. I doubt any other GM is near as good as he is on the ice.

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Old
08-26-2005, 04:05 AM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV

1. All Salaries reported are not correct. The 2005/06 Compensation maybe 100% correct, but the yearly compensation may NOT be what is hitting the cap. In the case of John Madden, his salary this year is listed as $3,861,561.00. Many have said (including Madden himself) that his cap hit is only going to be 2.2M this year. That is a 1.67 difference in his 2005/06 compensation.

I have heard you and a few others say that Maddens cap hit would only be $2.2 million. I am sure is cap hit is lower than the $3.86 million he is making this year. But it is very unlikely that the salary average on his contract is $2.2 million. For that to be true then he would only be making about $1.65 million/year for the remaining 3 years on his contract. That just does not sound likely.

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