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10-03-2003, 08:55 PM
  #26
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David Legwand is a helluva player, but Oilers fans have been waiting a long, long time for a guy like Hesmky. We haven't had a chance to use words like "potential impact player" or "future Hart candidate" since they sent Messier away.

I know there are players with more value in the NHL, but part of being a fan is watching these kids grow up and reach their potential. And after years of Steve Kelly's and Jason Bonsignore's, Lowe would be crazy to trade Hemsky.

He's worth the price of admission. And he's 20. Lordy.

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10-03-2003, 09:07 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
David Legwand is a helluva player, but Oilers fans have been waiting a long, long time for a guy like Hesmky. We haven't had a chance to use words like "potential impact player" or "future Hart candidate" since they sent Messier away.

I know there are players with more value in the NHL, but part of being a fan is watching these kids grow up and reach their potential. And after years of Steve Kelly's and Jason Bonsignore's, Lowe would be crazy to trade Hemsky.

He's worth the price of admission. And he's 20. Lordy.
Yep every time he touches the puck you sit up in your seat and watch what he is going to do.

From 27 rows up you can usually anticipate the play that is going to happen but Hemsky does the unexpected and Lowe is not going to trade him away. A lot of players have more value now but there are few that have the potential value he has.

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10-03-2003, 09:12 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by spaz44

May I ask how many times have you seen Hemsky play?
I'm from Edmonton, I'm an Oilers fan and we have season tickets. I'm not trying to bash Hemsky(huge fan of his), I just honestly think Legwand is and will be the better player.

Hemsky can dangle the puck with the best of them, and he is only going to get better, he's got great vision and is tougher than people give him credit for. IMO he is going to a very good player, 1st line potential. But the hype he gets from some people. Datsuyk in terms of pure skill is among the leaders in the league, but he's still a second line player. Not saying Hemsky will top out there but it does happen.

I would be incredibly suprised is Legwand didn't surpass 60 points next year. Hemsky will perhaps end up scoring more points than him at his top potential, but Legwand plays an incredible two way game. I know I have mentioned this before, but Legwand reminds me of Mike Modano. The difference is Legwand obviously will never be able to handle the puck like Modano at full speed, but also keep in mind that Legwand has mastered the defensive aspect of the game at a younger age than Modano (I do realize there is more emphasis on the defensive game now than there was back than)

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10-03-2003, 09:13 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
David Legwand is a helluva player, but Oilers fans have been waiting a long, long time for a guy like Hesmky. We haven't had a chance to use words like "potential impact player" or "future Hart candidate" since they sent Messier away.

I know there are players with more value in the NHL, but part of being a fan is watching these kids grow up and reach their potential. And after years of Steve Kelly's and Jason Bonsignore's, Lowe would be crazy to trade Hemsky.

He's worth the price of admission. And he's 20. Lordy.
I completely understand that, and there are very few players that I would trade Hemsky for, but Legwand is one of them.

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10-03-2003, 09:16 PM
  #30
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Mentioning Legwand in the same breath as Gaborik, Heatley, and Kovalchuk is nearly an insult to those three. He's not in the same class. By the end of this season, I think you'll be able to look at Hemsky and Gaborik and say they're very comparable in terms of the level they are at, supposing Gaborik plays this year. I believe the key here is what you said, you've never seen him play. Having never seen him play, you really can't say much about trade value and comparing him to Legwand. I've watched Legwand every chance I've had since he started, and he's not the player Ales is. Nearly everyone agrees, when you watch Hemsky, you're watching a player who's going to be a superstar. I found it quite interesting that, the day he was profiled on TSN, he goes out and dominates a hockey game. Before, every time an Oiler or the Oilers as a team had been featured, they would flounder that night and thereafter. Not saying that's why, but an interesting thing to see.

There are so many downright scary things about the way this kid plays the game it's mind-boggling. There are things he does, plays he makes, that NOBODY else makes. And the guys is TWENTY. Having gotten on this train at the beginning of last season, I relish the fact that I've seen this coming for over a year now. Enjoy it, we're in for a serious display this season.

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10-03-2003, 09:25 PM
  #31
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Sorry, but Legwand isn't there with Kovalchuk. He's quite a bit older and has no where the skill. I MEAN NOT EVEN CLOSE!!! Hemsky is capable (and probably likely) to out score Legwand this season - and the rest of their careers. Legwand has played four season in the NHL and his level of play does not even compare to Hemsky offensively. Defensively he's developed greatly - but if I had the choice between Mike Peca and Naslund I wouldn't even think of who to pick. The skill just isn't there for Modano comparisons.... Peca, maybe. Hemsky will probably lead the league in points some day (or atleast be a steady presense in the top 5) It's a pretty easy choice IMO. I mean just imagine what Hemsky will do in three seasons, and compare that to Legwand at this point. If Hemsky develops to half of what all the scouts/analysts/fans think then he'd still be a superior player.

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10-03-2003, 09:28 PM
  #32
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[QUOTE=LoudmouthHemskyfan#1]I believe the key here is what you said, you've never seen him play. Having never seen him play, you really can't say much about trade value and comparing him to Legwand. I've watched Legwand every chance I've had since he started, and he's not the player Ales is.[QUOTE]

Where did I say i've never seen him play. I said I'm from Edmonton, an Oilers fan and have season tickets. I've seen him plenty and he has impressed me greatly.

But you really have no idea what Legwand is capable of. Last year he was on pace for 70 points until he got injured. He completely shut down Modano when they played and may have replaced Marchant as the biggest pain to play against. M=G will tell you about it if you really want, but than he'll start talking about Morrow, and than Turco and it will turn into a big mess Also, consider his linemates last year, and the style they play in Nashville. It's an incredibly defensive system. I stick by what I said earlier, he is up there with Gaborik, Heatley and Havlat.

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10-03-2003, 09:29 PM
  #33
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When thinking about Legwand's past seasons, remember he was playing with some incredibly crappy players. Legwand could easily become a superstar in the league, regardless of his age. (He's all of what? 23?)

That said, so could Hemsky, and that's why I see it as a no go from both teams.

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10-03-2003, 09:32 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
Sorry, but Legwand isn't there with Kovalchuk. He's quite a bit older and has no where the skill. I MEAN NOT EVEN CLOSE!!! Hemsky is capable (and proba bly likely) to out score Legwand this season - and the rest of their careers. Legwand has played four season in the NHL and his level of play does not even compare to Hemsky offensively. Defensively he's developed greatly - but if I had the choice between Mike Peca and Naslund I wouldn't even think of who to pick. The skill just isn't there for Modano comparisons.... Peca, maybe. Hemsky will probably lead the league in points some day (or atleast be a steady presense in the top 5) It's a pretty easy choice IMO. I mean just imagine what Hemsky will do in three seasons, and compare that to Legwand at this point. If Hemsky develops to half of what all the scouts/analysts/fans think then he'd still be a superior player.
I actually meant to type Havlat, not Kovalchuk (Kovalchuk=entirely different level) my bad. You honestly don't understand how good Legwand can be. The skill is there for the Modano comparisons (once again not quite as good or as dominant as Modano)

I won't guarantee it but I'm 95% sure that Legwand will outscore Hemsky next season. He would have passed 60 (on pace for 70) last season but he was injured. He isjust now starting to break out.

Quote:
If Hemsky develops to half of what all the scouts/analysts/fans think then he'd still be a superior player
oh please, by the sounds of it the only way that would be is if he developed into half of what YOU think he could be.

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10-03-2003, 09:39 PM
  #35
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OK, I exagerated. But do I think what I said about Legwand having Peca potential is much more accurate then Modano.

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10-03-2003, 09:40 PM
  #36
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[QUOTE=Malmo_Mike][QUOTE=LoudmouthHemskyfan#1]I believe the key here is what you said, you've never seen him play. Having never seen him play, you really can't say much about trade value and comparing him to Legwand. I've watched Legwand every chance I've had since he started, and he's not the player Ales is.
Quote:

Where did I say i've never seen him play. I said I'm from Edmonton, an Oilers fan and have season tickets. I've seen him plenty and he has impressed me greatly.

But you really have no idea what Legwand is capable of. Last year he was on pace for 70 points until he got injured. He completely shut down Modano when they played and may have replaced Marchant as the biggest pain to play against. M=G will tell you about it if you really want, but than he'll start talking about Morrow, and than Turco and it will turn into a big mess Also, consider his linemates last year, and the style they play in Nashville. It's an incredibly defensive system. I stick by what I said earlier, he is up there with Gaborik, Heatley and Havlat.
I'd trade nearly anyone on the Oilers to get Legwand here...but I just couldn't reconcile trading Hemsky. Not right now. Maybe I'll change my mind a year from now if Legwand bounces back and Hemsky loses both of his legs in a freak lawnmower accident, but not right now.

If Legwand develops, he's a poor man's Modano.

If Hemsky develops, he won't be a poor man's version of ANYTHING. He'll be one of those players that other prospects are compared to. I just wish we could afford him if/when he acheives that level.

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10-03-2003, 09:42 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by thome_26
OK, I exagerated. But do I think what I said about Legwand having Peca potential is much more accurate then Modano.
I'd say 70+ points(*if* he reaches his potential....I think he will) and a solid two way game is more Modanoish than Pecaish. Add in the Modano like speed minus the stickhandling.

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10-03-2003, 09:43 PM
  #38
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[QUOTE=Digger12]

If Legwand develops, he's a poor man's Modano.

QUOTE]
But to be fair, a poor mans Modano is still probably a top 15 player in the league

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10-03-2003, 09:54 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malmo_Mike
But to be fair, a poor mans Modano is still probably a top 15 player in the league
You're a crazy man!

Top 20 at least...

Isn't there a soul we could barter to get BOTH guys on the team?

Smyth - Legwand - Hemsky *Homer drool*

Maybe I could sell my wife's, it's not like she's been using it lately...

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10-03-2003, 10:08 PM
  #40
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"""Where did I say i've never seen him play. I said I'm from Edmonton, an Oilers fan and have season tickets. I've seen him plenty and he has impressed me greatly.

But you really have no idea what Legwand is capable of. Last year he was on pace for 70 points until he got injured. He completely shut down Modano when they played and may have replaced Marchant as the biggest pain to play against. M=G will tell you about it if you really want, but than he'll start talking about Morrow, and than Turco and it will turn into a big mess Also, consider his linemates last year, and the style they play in Nashville. It's an incredibly defensive system. I stick by what I said earlier, he is up there with Gaborik, Heatley and Havlat"""


I read something you said as saying that you didnt' feel you'd seen him play, so n/m on that point. But I'm being serious in the fact that I've seriously watched Legwand's game. He and Gaborik were the two guys I was really excited about at the time, and I'd always check the stats, highlights, and watch whenever they were on or here or even listen sometimes, and David Legwand, although a good hockey player, is not in the same league as the three guys I mentioned before. You mentioned Datsyuk in an earlier post, if Ales Hemsky played in the same position as Pavel Datsyuk, not only would he be heralded as the next superstar in every magazine around, he'd be getting the Gaborik, Heatley, Kovalchuk comparisons, and you'd be shot down for saying otherwise.

I really don't like the comparisons between Datsyuk and Hemsky. They're different types of players.

I think the fact that he is the best player in an Oilers uniform right now, and has taken charge of the offence in under a season, says enough. By the end of the year, whenever this guy touches the puck, there's going to be a buzz in the building. There's something there, it's hard to describe, but he's got it. All the elite players have it. They touch the puck, and you know if they get it in their head that a goal for their team is coming, there's no stopping them. Compare him to Comrie in this light. Comrie, he's a very talented hockey player, but you always kind of have to hope for him, and when he pulls it off you're happy, but a little surprised. This is the amazing stuff I'm talking about, not popping in ordinary goals that should be scored. Comrie is and should continue to be an offensive leader here, but, when Hemsky has a chance to do something amazing , or make a defender look stupid, or put a pass on a guy's tape with 10 whole seconds to place it in the net, you're not hoping, you expect it.


I'd also like to add, that Mike Comrie was on pace for 80 points, but you'd probably shell me if I said he's a better player than David Legwand..........which I will now in fact do. Mike Comrie is a better player than David Legwand IMO, at this stage. They are very comparable, but Comrie has a slight edge, especially a healthy and stronger Mike Comrie.

The mind boggles at a healthy and motivated Mike Comrie playing with Hemsky and Smyth and York and the others this year. We might actually have a complete powerplay! Who'da thunk it?

SIGN MIKE COMRIE!

and

Sign, Mike Comrie

had to get that in just for LawnDemon

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10-03-2003, 10:58 PM
  #41
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shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.........

everybody be quiet about Ales Hemsky and tell Pierre Mcguire to keep his mouth shut too. the less we talk about him, the better the chance that he won't be covered like Micheal Jackson's nose every time he hits the ice.

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10-04-2003, 02:17 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malmo_Mike
I'm from Edmonton, I'm an Oilers fan and we have season tickets. I'm not trying to bash Hemsky(huge fan of his), I just honestly think Legwand is and will be the better player.

Hemsky can dangle the puck with the best of them, and he is only going to get better, he's got great vision and is tougher than people give him credit for. IMO he is going to a very good player, 1st line potential. But the hype he gets from some people. Datsuyk in terms of pure skill is among the leaders in the league, but he's still a second line player. Not saying Hemsky will top out there but it does happen.

I would be incredibly suprised is Legwand didn't surpass 60 points next year. Hemsky will perhaps end up scoring more points than him at his top potential, but Legwand plays an incredible two way game. I know I have mentioned this before, but Legwand reminds me of Mike Modano. The difference is Legwand obviously will never be able to handle the puck like Modano at full speed, but also keep in mind that Legwand has mastered the defensive aspect of the game at a younger age than Modano (I do realize there is more emphasis on the defensive game now than there was back than)
Thanks. Looking back at my post I should have worded my question about you having seen him play differently, but I think you understand my intent anyway.

The reason I asked was as Edmonton fans we have seen him play every game and fans in other cities are probably thinking. What is all the hype about?

Legwand is a great player but I think Hemsky is going to be one of those special few. Time of course will tell the tale.

But I think both of us agree that neither GM makes that deal, and I think you are one of the few Edmontonians that would risk sending Hemsky away because we think he is that special. I have centre ice and I haven't seen anybody in the NHL that is 20 that sees the ice and makes plays like Hemsky does.

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10-04-2003, 08:14 AM
  #43
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WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA... stop everything, lol

everybody needs to take a breath a realize that this kid just turned 20!!! hey no pressure right? jebus people.... i hear all this talk about gretz and messier and hart and 100+ point seasons and future superstar etc ec etc etc

what happens if he stumbles and only score like 25-30 points this year? what if he gets injured and cant play very much? there a million things that could go wrong. everybody needs to be patient and quit putting all these expectations on him. i think hes gonna be a very good player, but a superstar? a hart candidate? i dont know, maybe (hopefully, lol) but the fact that it seems that some people are almost *expecting* this is very wrong IMO

give him time and some sapce and i think he will be very good..... but all this hoopla about him doesnt help his cause one little bit

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10-04-2003, 08:14 AM
  #44
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Hemsky has a lot of talent, but I think you guys can be called on having very emotional bonds with Hemsky. How about this:

Who'd you rather have: Chistov or Legwand?

Chistov is probobly a similar talent level with Hemsky (okay, if any Russian fans are gonna come here and baloney me how Chistov has top 5 talent in this league, you're going on my ignore list!). I see both as being good players in this league.

However, I still feel Legwand is a cut above.

On pure offensive skill, I feel Legwand is very underrated. This guy is a late-bloomer wherever he's gone, and the Preds management knew this when they took him. Legwand's stickhandling is right up there with Ales. I would say Hemsky has better on-ice vision & passing, but Legwand has better moves 1 on 1, more speed, and better position all over the ice.

They are both good players. Who has more value? Well, right now, Legwand. Legwand is a proven commodity who GM's out there KNOW will probobly score 60 points at least for a team. Hemsky is still an unknown - I think Oilers fans sometimes forget this guy hasn't even played a full season of hockey yet. We've seen great starts from Alexander Daigle. Hemsky has a TON of potential, that I won't argue, but I think he needs to be heralded as 'the next one' a little less, and fans should be in a 'wait and see' mode with Ales.

Down the road, I feel Legwand will be the better player. I compare Ales Hemsky with Sergei Samsonov - I feel he will score less goals but more assists, mind you, than Sergei. I do not feel Legwand comparing to Modano is a poor one at all. And for those saying he is a 'poor man's Modano', well, he may not have the consistancy Modano does, but I would not consider it out of the question for Legwand to one day post 85 points a season at say, 27 years of age & talented linemates like Bill Guerin & Jere Lehtinen, or similar players.

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10-04-2003, 08:16 AM
  #45
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and i concur.... SIGN MIKE COMRIE!!! SIGN MIKE COMRIE!!! everybody together now ... SIGN MIKE COMRIE!!! hehe maybe if imaginaryilly (well that aint a word) chant on an internet message board, klowe will hear us

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10-04-2003, 09:47 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
Hemsky has a lot of talent, but I think you guys can be called on having very emotional bonds with Hemsky.
I don't think there's any doubt Oiler fans are racing way ahead of reality with this kid, but so the heck what? We deserve it, after all the broken down prospects that have come through here. When I was growing up in Saskatchewan, I'd see one of those "custom cars" every once in awhile. You knowm front from a Ranchero and a pickup back end?

Well, I've seen THOSE kinds of prospects, so you can hardly blame me when a top end sports car drives by.

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10-04-2003, 09:52 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jadeddog
WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA... stop everything, lol

everybody needs to take a breath a realize that this kid just turned 20!!! hey no pressure right? jebus people.... i hear all this talk about gretz and messier and hart and 100+ point seasons and future superstar etc ec etc etc

what happens if he stumbles and only score like 25-30 points this year? what if he gets injured and cant play very much? there a million things that could go wrong. everybody needs to be patient and quit putting all these expectations on him. i think hes gonna be a very good player, but a superstar? a hart candidate? i dont know, maybe (hopefully, lol) but the fact that it seems that some people are almost *expecting* this is very wrong IMO

give him time and some sapce and i think he will be very good..... but all this hoopla about him doesnt help his cause one little bit
It may very well help him. We all pretty much think he's gonna be something special and have faith in him to succeed. If I'm a player and reading that in the paper, I'm getting a boost from it, not getting scared. If he has the mentality to be an elite player, which, based on the way he's handled himself so far, I think he does, then this attention will only add to his confidence.

They're not expectations, they're hopes, but, I also like to speculate on what Ales thinks he can accomplish this year. I would guess (pure guess) that he'd be dissapointed if A) no playoffs and B) less than 60 points.

I can't even see 25-30 points as a possibility. This guy isn't Shawn Horcoff. Too much sheer talent there to have that happen, given an 82-game season.

And remember, it's Lowe and MacTavish making the comparision. That says alot.

I think the fact that he has just turned 20 is even more reason to get excited is all. This kid has the ability to control an offence, and he is nowhere near the top of his potential yet.

I'm also not gonna waiver on my position because alot of people say we should let up. I got on this train from the very beginning, and I'm gonna still be on it when it's so crowded you've got people hangin off this side and standing on the roof.

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