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Kypreos: OTT shopping Spezza to the West

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05-12-2014, 10:42 AM
  #101
shifting
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Spezza on the surface seems like a good fit in STL, but when you look at his stats 5on5, it shows he isn't what the team needs. Along with his 7 million dollar cap hit.

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05-12-2014, 10:52 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Marty Straka View Post
Although many people may hate it simply because he's been tainted in Toronto.. I think a deal surrounding a Phaneuf - Spezza swap wouldn't be all that bad... although I wouldn't want that entire salary coming back and wouldn't do it straight up.

Karlsson and Phaneuf together on the PP!
I respectfully pass. No Phaneuf please

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05-12-2014, 11:16 AM
  #103
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Spezza is not worth Shattenkirk or Oshie.

He would be worth a late first.

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05-12-2014, 11:17 AM
  #104
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Spezza is not worth Shattenkirk or Oshie.

He would be worth a late first.
Spezza is easily worth Shattenkirk.

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05-12-2014, 11:22 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by SixthSens View Post
Spezza is easily worth Shattenkirk.
If he was signed a little longer and if he wasn't going to be above 30 or injury prone. You can't move a piece like Shattenkirk for someone who could walk that next summer. That's horrible asset management.

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05-12-2014, 11:24 AM
  #106
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what does ottawa need?
A new owner.

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05-12-2014, 11:27 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
If he was signed a little longer and if he wasn't going to be above 30 or injury prone. You can't move a piece like Shattenkirk for someone who could walk that next summer. That's horrible asset management.
If Blues fans wont give up Shattenkirk for Spezza, then we are so screwed.

If fans value Spezza so low, i wonder what Gms think?

I rather just extend Spezza if we can't get a good return.

Damn you, Melnyk!

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05-12-2014, 11:29 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
If he was signed a little longer and if he wasn't going to be above 30 or injury prone. You can't move a piece like Shattenkirk for someone who could walk that next summer. That's horrible asset management.
If you're not willing to take risks, then you probably won't end up winning anything. I think Spezza is probably a perfect fit in St. Louis since he can slot right in and just be the offensive guy he is, and he can just fit into the culture of the team rather than trying to establish one himself.

I think his return should be around the same as the Ryan return, he's a point per game, highly offensively talented #1 center, albeit soft. Does he get that? I have no idea, nor does anyone else, which is why I avoid the cesspool of this forum known as trade rumours and free agent talk.

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05-12-2014, 11:30 AM
  #109
Dick Whitman
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
If he was signed a little longer and if he wasn't going to be above 30 or injury prone. You can't move a piece like Shattenkirk for someone who could walk that next summer. That's horrible asset management.
If he was signed a little longer, younger and not injury prone, he'd have the value of a top 10 player in the league and wouldn't be available.

Unfortunately for teams looking for an elite centreman, he is the best that is available and from the sounds of it, a lot of teams are interested which means the price is going to go up. If Vanek can return what he did and if Miller can return what he did, Spezza can certainly return something similiar or perhaps even more.

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05-12-2014, 11:31 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by OttawaSenators11 View Post
If Blues fans wont give up Shattenkirk for Spezza, then we are so screwed.

If fans value Spezza so low, i wonder what Gms think?

I rather just extend Spezza if we can't get a good return.

Damn you, Melnyk!
This isn't on Melnyk, imo. This is a hockey decision, and one that I begrudgingly agree with.

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05-12-2014, 11:33 AM
  #111
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Somebody will overpay for a shot at Spezza, whether he is signed or not. He is definitely worth more than a late 1st - that's ridiculous. His elite status may be in question, but his skills certainly are not.

He will bring back a lot more than people think -- not worth Shattenkirk?! Perposterous.

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05-12-2014, 11:35 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by PeterSidorkiewicz View Post
If you're not willing to take risks, then you probably won't end up winning anything. I think Spezza is probably a perfect fit in St. Louis since he can slot right in and just be the offensive guy he is, and he can just fit into the culture of the team rather than trying to establish one himself.

I think his return should be around the same as the Ryan return, he's a point per game, highly offensively talented #1 center, albeit soft. Does he get that? I have no idea, nor does anyone else, which is why I avoid the cesspool of this forum known as trade rumours and free agent talk.
Well I'm glad you brought Ryan up. Ryan was much younger and didn't have an injury history. Ryan also didn't receive an Oshie, Shattenkirk, or Schwartz. You guys were expected to make the playoffs, so the value of the 1st was more in the 16-20s range.

People are asking for more than what Ryan got, who had more trade value than Spezza does.

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05-12-2014, 11:35 AM
  #113
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We took a risk with Miller and look how that turned out. Don't get so upset when teams aren't willing to give up much for your aging and injury prone player.

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05-12-2014, 11:35 AM
  #114
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It seems quite easy to piece a trade here together for Spezza if it is St Louis. Berglund has been in rumors before and Ottawa wants to get bigger at center and more physical. Berglund will probably be the piece going back IMO. Now he alone is not a large enough fetch for Murray though and they don't have a 1st rounder. Next best thing? second rounder! I would think from 2015. Now we have Berglund+2nd rounder(I don't think Army is giving up another first in 2015, he needs to stock that cupboard). Now that just isn't enough right now, we have Rattie who is there!

I think the offer or deal will be something around this:

To Ottawa:

Berglund
Rattie
2nd rounder(2015)

To St Louis:

Spez Despenser(the player not the poster!)

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05-12-2014, 11:37 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
It seems quite easy to piece a trade here together for Spezza if it is St Louis. Berglund has been in rumors before and Ottawa wants to get bigger at center and more physical. Berglund will probably be the piece going back IMO. Now he alone is not a large enough fetch for Murray though and they don't have a 1st rounder. Next best thing? second rounder! I would think from 2015. Now we have Berglund+2nd rounder(I don't think Army is giving up another first in 2015, he needs to stock that cupboard). Now that just isn't enough right now, we have Rattie who is there!

I think the offer or deal will be something around this:

To Ottawa:

Berglund
Rattie
2nd rounder(2015)

To St Louis:

Spez Despenser(the player not the poster!)
That's a deal I would do. But that's about as high as I would go.

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05-12-2014, 11:37 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Dick Whitman View Post
If he was signed a little longer, younger and not injury prone, he'd have the value of a top 10 player in the league and wouldn't be available.
Please read what I wrote. Signed a little longer meaning he wouldn't be a rental. Rentals always have less value, that shouldn't even be a debate.

My next point was an or, so say he was 27 and injury prone or 30-32 with no injury history. He's neither of those.

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05-12-2014, 11:37 AM
  #117
Dick Whitman
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Only on hfboards is a 30 year old considered to be too old.

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05-12-2014, 11:39 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Well I'm glad you brought Ryan up. Ryan was much younger and didn't have an injury history. Ryan also didn't receive an Oshie, Shattenkirk, or Schwartz. You guys were expected to make the playoffs, so the value of the 1st was more in the 16-20s range.

People are asking for more than what Ryan got, who had more trade value than Spezza does.
Spezza is a #1 center, Ryan is a #1 winger, I think a #1 center value is a lot more, which is why taking everything into consideration I think their value is equal. But once again, none of us really have a clue. This has happened time and time again, us fans think we know what a trade will return, and almost everyone ends up being completely wrong.

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05-12-2014, 11:39 AM
  #119
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This isn't on Melnyk, imo. This is a hockey decision, and one that I begrudgingly agree with.
I am not so sure. This guy hasn't spend for years now.

I have no problem moving anyone on our roster if the return is a good one.

It kinda sounds like they're set on moving him to free up money for guys like Ryan and perhaps Mac despite being ranked nearly dead last in payroll.

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05-12-2014, 11:40 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
It seems quite easy to piece a trade here together for Spezza if it is St Louis. Berglund has been in rumors before and Ottawa wants to get bigger at center and more physical. Berglund will probably be the piece going back IMO. Now he alone is not a large enough fetch for Murray though and they don't have a 1st rounder. Next best thing? second rounder! I would think from 2015. Now we have Berglund+2nd rounder(I don't think Army is giving up another first in 2015, he needs to stock that cupboard). Now that just isn't enough right now, we have Rattie who is there!

I think the offer or deal will be something around this:

To Ottawa:

Berglund
Rattie
2nd rounder(2015)

To St Louis:

Spez Despenser(the player not the poster!)

Theres no point making that deal on the Sens side,

We dont need Berglund - Have 5 centers that would work fine.
We dont need Rattie - Have Puempel, pretty much the same kinda player.
Anyone could use a 2nd rounder but its not enough.

And the reason Blues fans would do this deal, its a home run. dont give up anything good for a quality #1 C.

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05-12-2014, 11:40 AM
  #121
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Only on hfboards is a 30 year old considered to be too old.
That's not even what I'm saying. You don't trade young very good players like Shattenkirk or Schwartz for players above 30, especially when their body will be breaking down sooner than the average NHL player. Back injuries don't go away.

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05-12-2014, 11:41 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by SixthSens View Post
Spezza is easily worth Shattenkirk.
Doesn't mean it's smart for the Blues to make that trade though. If the trade is fair value and involves nothing but roster players than St Louis would have to have someone in their system capable of taking Shattenkirk's minutes or else it doesn't improve the Blues, it just shifts their problem.

If Spezza is moved it's likely going to be at least a prospect and a 2014 1st rounder. Additional parts would likely be determined by the quality of the pick and prospect.

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05-12-2014, 11:41 AM
  #123
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If I was Ottawa fans I would worry about re-signing other key free agents on your team now as well. Spezza is still a very good center who will provide loads of offense. He is moved your team is worse. It depends on what other moves your GM makes but this could hurt the team going into next year big time, with actual points and attracting free agents.

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05-12-2014, 11:44 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
If I was Ottawa fans I would worry about re-signing other key free agents on your team now as well. Spezza is still a very good center who will provide loads of offense. He is moved your team is worse. It depends on what other moves your GM makes but this could hurt the team going into next year big time, with actual points and attracting free agents.
Don't tell sens fan this.
We have many naive on the sens forum who believe everything will be just fine.

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05-12-2014, 11:45 AM
  #125
Dick Whitman
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Please read what I wrote. Signed a little longer meaning he wouldn't be a rental. Rentals always have less value, that shouldn't even be a debate.

My next point was an or, so say he was 27 and injury prone or 30-32 with no injury history. He's neither of those.
Teams would have an entire year to get Spezza re-signed to a deal. I wouldn't call that a rental. If you wouldn't be able to get something done in a year, what makes you think that you'd be able to if he were there for 2 years or 3 years?

He's going to be 31 in June, not 41. He had 65 points this year, so even though he's old and injury prone, he'd still be the best offensive player on the Blues.

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