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Chris Kreider's Next Contract

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Old
06-07-2014, 03:11 PM
  #51
haveandare
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Originally Posted by Larrybiv View Post
History says bridge deal. Don't do it Sather.
Recent history, McDonagh. Sather finally getting with the times, signing another cornerstone for longer than a bridge, needs to be done. Showing faith towards Kreids that we want him to "be that guy", yet NOT as lucrative as McDonagh's, as he's not nearly there "yet". So,......sign him for 6 and overpay him NOW at 3.5-4mil which with the cap going up, and in years following will become "QUITE THE BARGAIN".

That'll bring Hank, McD, Girardi and Kreids into the 2020 hindsight year. Nash till 2018. A solid core.

Presuming that we buy out Richards, there should be plenty of money available to sign OUR players that we want and looking forward to Staal and Hagelin next year.
I gotta agree with this. A bridge will come back to bite them here IMO.

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06-08-2014, 11:16 AM
  #52
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
There's no good reason for the Rangers to be breaking the bank for Kreider at this point. He's a very good player now but there is still lots of potential but he's got to improve and earn a big $ contract.

Not at all sure what you're talking about with your 8 year-$2 mil? guarantee to start each year with bonus incentive? $'s--so much of it sounds like it would not be compliant with the cap and $2 mil base salary 8 years from now would certainly not do be doing Kreider any favors if he turns out to be anything like we hope we will. Somehow I don't think his agent would like it either.
Sorry not back to you earlier on this and am rushed.
Short bottom line what I had in mind.

Kreider runs thru next year (season ending 2015), this deal does not add to his #s for next year. He gives us that one.

So beginning that 1st yr (season ending 2016) and ongoing #s would be:
1st yr (2016) base $2m guar. + .5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 2.5m
2nd yr (2017) base $2m guar. + 1.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.0m
3rd yr (2018) base $2m guar. + 1.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.5m
4th yr (2019) base $2m guar. + 2.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.0m
5th yr (2020) base $2m guar. + 2.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.5m
6th yr (2021) base $2m guar. + 3.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.0m
7th yr (2022) base $2m guar. + 3.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.5m
8th yr (2023) base $2m guar. + 4.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 6.0m

Would expect chance to have first dibs on new deal in 2017, with some language to that effect.

We get a Drury buyout in case not injured enough for LTIR buyout but effed up enough to be not worth the contract.

Tradeable throughout (no NMC/NTC but will give CK a list of 10 teams and if we need to trade, we will handshake agree, if they make close to best offer, we will work on his choice of relocation) but obviously, expect him to be lifelong Ranger

Not aware of any immediate problems, consider $$ graduating and good value while locking him up for like a decade.

Did I miss anything?


Last edited by bernmeister: 06-09-2014 at 02:03 PM.
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06-08-2014, 11:30 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
The problem is Bern that draft picks are not necessarily going to be NHL let alone NHL productive players. If we did even a small % of the trades you've proposed in the past we would not be in the finals now. You have to have a now--you can't always be stealing from today for an always in the future--future.

To get back to Kreider--his upcoming contract will be interesting. There's every reason to believe that he is going to be a much better player next year and room for improvement in his play for the next several years. Still he has to prove it. He's earned a bigger payday but not a McDonagh payday. He's one of the most important of our players going forward. Kreider, Zucc and Stepan are our most valuable young forwards.
Eco's bones, I know you have good fraternal karma in your posts.
Consider me the brother who is telling you what you don't want to hear for your own good.

Win/lose this cup (and Kings could still go flat and we get lucky), short of Divine Intervention, we do not win cause we do not have the horses.

We win here only as the freakin 69 Mets.
Want to win as the fugggin 1927/61 Yankees.

On any given Sunday, or other playday, anything can happen.
But percentage wise, Swoboda is not going to best Frank Robinson.

Supply + demand + cap restricts ability to acquire best/most elite players.
You want a Getzlaf, it is NOT likely you get him for Stepan + directly. Ana keeps its jewel.

Therefore, you have to think outside the box and take a chance.
YES, I AM AGREEING WITH YOU
YOU ARE RIGHT
IT IS A CHANCE
IT IS NOT GUARANTEED

But I ask you to acknowledge it is a prudent gamble.

I remember you imploring that we need some degree of constancy and some degree of chemistry.
Those things ARE important
BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT
they are NOT more important than having enough horses.

Anybody could get lucky, and something COULD radically change,
BUT
if all other things are =,
the ducks/Kings maybe Blues/Hawks are better.

To catch up, we get lucky, but also have to grab teh bull by the horn.
You don't move for an Ekblad now --- and consider yourself fortunate that FL may be under pressure and would consider to deal --- you won't get him later.

Ekbland -- and others I've mentioned
I admit, NOT 100% guarantee.

But a prudent risk.

And as others have said, too may guys all needing increases, something has to give, have to decide who we can move
AND CONVERT EXCESS INTO AN UPGRADE
THAT IS THE TICKET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:yo :

then try and build up depth on reload with farm, FA, later.

Peace out
LGR

Oh yeah, maintaining compliance w/thread topic, 1 shrewd move is make Kreider long term cornerstone, McD type contract, but requires what I'm talking about first.

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06-08-2014, 11:49 AM
  #54
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I'd like to lock him up for 5-7 year now. Be good to have 2 studs like Kreider and McD locked up.

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06-08-2014, 09:40 PM
  #55
Larrybiv
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
I'd like to lock him up for 5-7 year now. Be good to have 2 studs like Kreider and McD locked up.
So I guess that means we agree here. Lol. Hopefully more studs to follow. Maybe Lindbergh, I think for sure Allen, and maybe Skjei. Still hoping Kristo becomes another Murdoch or Middleton.

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06-08-2014, 10:05 PM
  #56
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I don't think he's arbitration eligible - he's just coming off his elc and is under 24. Hagelin was older when he came off of his. Bridge deal, between 2.7-3.0 cap is my best guess.

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06-08-2014, 10:05 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Larrybiv View Post
So I guess that means we agree here. Lol. Hopefully more studs to follow. Maybe Lindbergh, I think for sure Allen, and maybe Skjei. Still hoping Kristo becomes another Murdoch or Middleton.
Donnie Murdoch. I never hear that name anymore. He was my first favorite player ever. I hated that we traded him.

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06-09-2014, 06:43 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Larrybiv View Post
History says bridge deal. Don't do it Sather.
Recent history, McDonagh. Sather finally getting with the times, signing another cornerstone for longer than a bridge, needs to be done. Showing faith towards Kreids that we want him to "be that guy", yet NOT as lucrative as McDonagh's, as he's not nearly there "yet". So,......sign him for 6 and overpay him NOW at 3.5-4mil which with the cap going up, and in years following will become "QUITE THE BARGAIN".

That'll bring Hank, McD, Girardi and Kreids into the 2020 hindsight year. Nash till 2018. A solid core.

Presuming that we buy out Richards, there should be plenty of money available to sign OUR players that we want and looking forward to Staal and Hagelin next year.
Larry, agree we need to sign kreids to more than a 2 yr bridge. But slats is going to have to be in that 4 mill plus range i think if he wants kreids to sign for 6 years now. Imo he is better than stepan and kid has only scratched the surface of his potential. Working with St.Louis on his shooting accuracy next camp and he has a great shot will move him to the next tier of players. If Kreider was 2 years older he would be in the conversation for team captain.

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06-10-2014, 07:55 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by mrmel329 View Post
Larry, agree we need to sign kreids to more than a 2 yr bridge. But slats is going to have to be in that 4 mill plus range i think if he wants kreids to sign for 6 years now. Imo he is better than stepan and kid has only scratched the surface of his potential. Working with St.Louis on his shooting accuracy next camp and he has a great shot will move him to the next tier of players. If Kreider was 2 years older he would be in the conversation for team captain.
Agree with everything but your last statement. I don't think age has anything to do with it. It's the immaturity he shows and there are way too many leaders already ahead of him. Thinking back to when Cally made Captain, there were not many choices. Cally was a different breed. We could only hope Kreids becomes a real good 2 way player with much more skill than Cally that we are sure he has.

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06-10-2014, 03:37 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Sorry not back to you earlier on this and am rushed.
Short bottom line what I had in mind.

Kreider runs thru next year (season ending 2015), this deal does not add to his #s for next year. He gives us that one.

So beginning that 1st yr (season ending 2016) and ongoing #s would be:
1st yr (2016) base $2m guar. + .5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 2.5m
2nd yr (2017) base $2m guar. + 1.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.0m
3rd yr (2018) base $2m guar. + 1.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.5m
4th yr (2019) base $2m guar. + 2.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.0m
5th yr (2020) base $2m guar. + 2.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.5m
6th yr (2021) base $2m guar. + 3.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.0m
7th yr (2022) base $2m guar. + 3.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.5m
8th yr (2023) base $2m guar. + 4.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 6.0m

Would expect chance to have first dibs on new deal in 2017, with some language to that effect.

We get a Drury buyout in case not injured enough for LTIR buyout but effed up enough to be not worth the contract.

Tradeable throughout (no NMC/NTC but will give CK a list of 10 teams and if we need to trade, we will handshake agree, if they make close to best offer, we will work on his choice of relocation) but obviously, expect him to be lifelong Ranger

Not aware of any immediate problems, consider $$ graduating and good value while locking him up for like a decade.

Did I miss anything?
I know Kreider has a long way to go to reach his hyped ceiling, but their is no way a player with that sort of league wide perceived potential signs a deal that locks him in a bonus laden contract with a guarantee of $2 million until he's 31 years old, 4 years after his first possible UFA year by age.

I hope this team finds divine intervention now against the Kings because there are going to be some big problems over the next few years. There will have to be a lot of changes.

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06-10-2014, 04:56 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Sorry not back to you earlier on this and am rushed.
Short bottom line what I had in mind.

Kreider runs thru next year (season ending 2015), this deal does not add to his #s for next year. He gives us that one.

So beginning that 1st yr (season ending 2016) and ongoing #s would be:
1st yr (2016) base $2m guar. + .5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 2.5m
2nd yr (2017) base $2m guar. + 1.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.0m
3rd yr (2018) base $2m guar. + 1.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 3.5m
4th yr (2019) base $2m guar. + 2.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.0m
5th yr (2020) base $2m guar. + 2.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 4.5m
6th yr (2021) base $2m guar. + 3.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.0m
7th yr (2022) base $2m guar. + 3.5 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 5.5m
8th yr (2023) base $2m guar. + 4.0 mil (half guaranteed/half bonuses based) = 6.0m

Would expect chance to have first dibs on new deal in 2017, with some language to that effect.

We get a Drury buyout in case not injured enough for LTIR buyout but effed up enough to be not worth the contract.

Tradeable throughout (no NMC/NTC but will give CK a list of 10 teams and if we need to trade, we will handshake agree, if they make close to best offer, we will work on his choice of relocation) but obviously, expect him to be lifelong Ranger

Not aware of any immediate problems, consider $$ graduating and good value while locking him up for like a decade.

Did I miss anything?

This is awful for Kreider, why would he take a contract running through his prime years with only 2m guaranteed (16m guaranteed and 18m not guaranteed)? I think he'd rather entertain the offer of your 34m over 8 years without any bonuses...to which he might still say no.

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06-11-2014, 08:28 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by lightsalot View Post
This is awful for Kreider, why would he take a contract running through his prime years with only 2m guaranteed (16m guaranteed and 18m not guaranteed)? I think he'd rather entertain the offer of your 34m over 8 years without any bonuses...to which he might still say no.
And not to mention you can't give performance based bonuses in contracts after elc and before 35+. The whole thing is a non-starter.

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06-11-2014, 10:31 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Richter35 View Post
And not to mention you can't give performance based bonuses in contracts after elc and before 35+. The whole thing is a non-starter.
As with many contract offers on these boards, it's the thought that counts.

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06-11-2014, 01:22 PM
  #64
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Sign him longterm, bridges don't usually work well with elite talent. 7 years/4.2 - 4.4 per

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06-11-2014, 01:23 PM
  #65
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Overpay now so that it will be a bargain in the future. This contract is going to be a huge part of the team's plans moving forward.

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06-11-2014, 04:49 PM
  #66
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And not to mention you can't give performance based bonuses in contracts after elc and before 35+. The whole thing is a non-starter.
I keep forgetting this and stand corrected.

It really should be part of the next CBA, that there are guaranteed mins, and partial balances guaranteed/not.

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06-11-2014, 04:49 PM
  #67
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As with many contract offers on these boards, it's the thought that counts.
Thanks.

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06-18-2014, 12:24 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Wrong signal.
Right now, we hold the cards.
When CK's time comes in the not too distant future, he will dictate terms, and terms could result in buh bye if we are not careful.

Shrewd move is to deal the correct somebody for assets and cap space and sign extensive year.
He is an RFA. By definition he has no optiosn here. Sign with us for what we offer or hit FA where teams will have to give up 1st round draft picks for him. If anyone offers him the deal you think he deserves we will get several 1st round draft picks.

Now look at the teams that have their own 1st round drafts picks, a need for Krieder, A need bad enough to sacrifice their future and burn bridges with New York, as well as the cap space to afford him, and in a market Krieder will want to play, you don't have much. Stepan who had way more value at renegotiation didn't get picked up during FA and Krieder definitely wont. It is sign the deal or don't play this season. Thats how RFA's work.

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06-18-2014, 12:27 PM
  #69
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The biggest difference between his contract negations and Stepans is Stepan has better numbers and played several full seasons with the Rangers. Kreider has yet to make the team out of training and stay with the team as well as worse numbers. He will not get a bigger bridge contract then Stepan. Ryan Mac didn't get a bridge deal because teams would 100% give up drafts picks for him. Ryan Mac is a top 5 D Man in the league who is young. Kreider is not a top 5 rookie let alone a top 5 winger in the league. He is a great player but no team will risk their future for him. Wont happen.

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06-18-2014, 12:38 PM
  #70
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Chris Kreider has so much hype that even Sather said no to the deal that would send him to Columbus for the King of All that is Hype, Rick Nash. Chris Kreider's contract negotiations this summer will be interesting.

This is a perfect example of what happens when a team doesn't strike during a window period.

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06-19-2014, 01:29 PM
  #71
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Right around what Hags got... 2 years 4.5-5M

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06-20-2014, 02:16 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Right around what Hags got... 2 years 4.5-5M
I think that may work but Sather may give him a McD type contract.

Only reason I say that is because of how high Sather is on the kid if he wouldn't trade him for Nash when that was what he thought would push the Rangers over the edge then it leads me to think like that

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06-20-2014, 02:33 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Swept In Seven View Post
Sign him longterm, bridges don't usually work well with elite talent. 7 years/4.2 - 4.4 per
We don't know if he's "elite" yet. This isn't like McDonagh, where we knew what we had. Kreider hasn't put together a consistent season yet. He has not earned a 7 year contract.

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06-20-2014, 05:46 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by NYR2047 View Post
I think that may work but Sather may give him a McD type contract.
We don't have the cap space to give him that kind of contract, and as BB said, Kreider hasn't earned that kind of contract yet.

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06-20-2014, 10:16 AM
  #75
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jmo but if kreids is just offered low bridge deal he is the type of young talent at 22 with all the invariables, size, speed, plays on edge and can score that some team out there would make a run at if the cost is draft picks. Much larger potential imo than stepan. Slats imo has to be careful with this one. I hope for our teams numbers he will take a bridge deal but I would not be surprised at all if slats gets imaginative with him here and offers something with a longer term and more money than the usual bridge job..

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