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Would you move Staal for Spezza?

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Old
06-15-2014, 07:34 PM
  #76
dethomas07
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id only trade staal for ROR or Pavelski, other then that no thank you!

I also dont want to trade Miller, would be really dumb, because until he's actually given a full time opportunity wed be stupid to rush the gun and trade him.. Size skill, speed, what more do you want.. Id play him with a richards buyout..

Brass-MZA would be fine as 2c/played half the year that way anyway

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06-15-2014, 07:40 PM
  #77
The Amity Affliction
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensNation613 View Post
No Hoffman and No Kristo and I'd be happy with that deal.
Something around Staal and Miller for Spezza and Wiercoch sounds good to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by clmetsfan View Post
Inferno, as someone driving the anti-Brad Richards bus, I'm amazed you want to try a less effective, more injury prone version of Richards.
Really? Check the numbers the last 3 seasons, Spezza's been a better player than Richards and it's not even a contest.

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06-15-2014, 07:42 PM
  #78
The Amity Affliction
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What I don't get is how people are complaining about trading Staal, who everyone on here this season has complained about how he doesn't look the same and that we need to trade him for something before he walks away.

Ok, so if we need to trade him for something, why not deal him to Ottawa for a guy who can be a #1A #1B kind of center with Stepan?

He's probably just as good as Richards is defensively and offensively there's no contest as to who is better between Spezza and Richards.

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06-15-2014, 08:35 PM
  #79
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Staal for Spezza straight up and we come out on top. If need be, add a 3rd round pick or something.

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($1.600m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Jason Spezza ($7.000m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Jesper Fast ($0.805m) / Derick Brassard ($3.700m) / Mats Zuccarello ($3.000m)
Brian Boyle ($2.700m) / Dominic Moore ($1.500m) / Daniel Carcillo ($1.000m)
J.T. Miller ($0.894m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Kevin Klein ($2.900m) / Anton Stralman ($2.700m)
John Moore ($0.851m) / Raphael Diaz ($1.225m)
Conor Allen ($0.925m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,445,500; BONUSES: $1,295,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $654,500


Last edited by Amazing Kreiderman: 06-15-2014 at 08:45 PM.
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Old
06-15-2014, 08:45 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CM Lundqvist View Post
Something around Staal and Miller for Spezza and Wiercoch sounds good to me.



Really? Check the numbers the last 3 seasons, Spezza's been a better player than Richards and it's not even a contest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CM Lundqvist View Post
What I don't get is how people are complaining about trading Staal, who everyone on here this season has complained about how he doesn't look the same and that we need to trade him for something before he walks away.

Ok, so if we need to trade him for something, why not deal him to Ottawa for a guy who can be a #1A #1B kind of center with Stepan?

He's probably just as good as Richards is defensively and offensively there's no contest as to who is better between Spezza and Richards.
The point is that getting Spezza now is like getting Richards in 2011. Which worked out SO well.

Just like Drury. Just like Gomez. Just like Redden. Just like every freakin' star we've acquired on the wrong side of 30 for the last twenty years.

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06-15-2014, 09:09 PM
  #81
eco's bones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazing Kreiderman View Post
Staal for Spezza straight up and we come out on top. If need be, add a 3rd round pick or something.

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($1.600m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Jason Spezza ($7.000m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Jesper Fast ($0.805m) / Derick Brassard ($3.700m) / Mats Zuccarello ($3.000m)
Brian Boyle ($2.700m) / Dominic Moore ($1.500m) / Daniel Carcillo ($1.000m)
J.T. Miller ($0.894m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Kevin Klein ($2.900m) / Anton Stralman ($2.700m)
John Moore ($0.851m) / Raphael Diaz ($1.225m)
Conor Allen ($0.925m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,445,500; BONUSES: $1,295,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $654,500
Stralman is very, very likely to get a far better offer than the $2.7 mil per year you have him signing here for--to return next year. I'm sorry but the assumption that moving Staal means the Rangers will sign or even forces the Rangers to sign Stralman is really reaching. And reaching even more after bringing in another big ticket player like Spezza--because the money will not be there. Beyond that there are $ limits to what we should offer Stralman and IMO I wouldn't go a penny over $4 mil per--and he's likely to get a higher offer than that. Stralman is a very good player but he's not a future HOF'er. His offense has disappeared as his defense has improved. He is best suited as a 2nd pairing guy anyway. McDonagh's getting $4.7 mil per and he's at least bordering on being an elite NHL d-man. It would not be smart to break the bank for Anton but by the same token don't expect him not to take the best deal that he's offered.

IMO we'll be flirting with disaster if both Staal and Stralman are not on the team this October.

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06-15-2014, 10:11 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CM Lundqvist View Post
Really? Check the numbers the last 3 seasons, Spezza's been a better player than Richards and it's not even a contest.
I'm not talking about the last three seasons, I'm talking about the future. Richards's and Spezza's point production is remarkably similar in the years up to their 31st birthday (which is how old Richards was when we got him, and how old Spezza is now). The biggest difference is that Richards had (and still has) a much better track record for staying healthy.

But ultimately it's what comes next that matters. How many times do we have to get burned by bringing in veteran stars over 30 before people learn?

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06-15-2014, 10:16 PM
  #83
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Um, he's 31 and hasn't ever played a full season. Why would you trade a number 1 D on most teams for that?

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06-16-2014, 06:53 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensNation613 View Post
Would this deal be enough?
Jason Spezza
Patrick Wiercioch
Rights to Hemsky (?)

for

Marc Staal
Derick Brassard
Rights to Benoit Pouliot (?)
I wouldn't do this deal for the following reasons

Spezza is a 1 year contract player. His new deal is going to be very expensive, the last thing NY needs is another player over 30 with a huge contract.

Hemsky is not a solution for NY. He is a perimeter player, doesn't fight for prime space on the ice and will be very expensive to keep around. I would rather NY bring up one of their kids than have this guy taking millions off the cap and providing very little in return.

Wiercioch looks to have game and is perhaps the only guy of interest in the offering.

So I wouldn't trade Staal alone for Wiercioch, nor Brassard. Pouliot will be UFA so Ottawa can make him an offer, but remember that he got 7 PPG last year so if Ottawa is not going to give him prime PP time than he will be a bust of a contract. Never mind the boneheaded penalties he took during this years run to the finals.

Would I keep Pouliot ? yes but I suspect another team will offer him better terms than I would.

So sorry Ottawa fans. NY has no interest in this deal. But thanks for asking

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Old
06-16-2014, 07:48 AM
  #85
Larrybiv
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Before this deal (or anything close) can be entertained, we need to sign Anton first.....and quickly. The sooner we sign him, the sooner we could figure out what to do with Marc.

I posted already on this subject, but will add that Marc should recoup something MORE than just Spezza. He wants OUT, but it doesn't HAVE TO BE here. Let's not get hosed AGAIN like in MSL's case.
We can move Marc to ANYONE, to ANY TEAM that needs a slightly damaged top d man during short off season or just wait come rental time. We DON'T have to go this route.........once again.

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06-16-2014, 07:52 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by vladmyir111 View Post
Um, he's 31 and hasn't ever played a full season. Why would you trade a number 1 D on most teams for that?
Just flip it around and if you're Ottawa.......you get a #1d for someone that wants out, oft injured and lowers your cap.......then the ability to trade Staal when push comes to shove very EASILY.

WOULD WE be able to do the same with Spezza......I mean get as much? So you cannot DO this.

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06-16-2014, 08:03 AM
  #87
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I would rather have the younger ROR.

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06-16-2014, 08:29 AM
  #88
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You guys have the same shiny object fixation as Sather does. It's pretty sad at this point.

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06-16-2014, 09:00 AM
  #89
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I would not. I think center is an area of opportunity to address, but I'm not all that interested in dismantling what makes this team tick, which is 3 1st pair defensemen (at least defensively) playing in front of an elite goaltender.

Doing this kind of thing would have shades of the Rick Nash deal, which was a fundamental misunderstanding of what made the team go in 11-12. Not interested.

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06-16-2014, 09:04 AM
  #90
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Don't want Spezza. Don't want to trade Staal.

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06-16-2014, 09:07 AM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larrybiv View Post
Before this deal (or anything close) can be entertained, we need to sign Anton first.....and quickly. The sooner we sign him, the sooner we could figure out what to do with Marc.

I posted already on this subject, but will add that Marc should recoup something MORE than just Spezza. He wants OUT, but it doesn't HAVE TO BE here. Let's not get hosed AGAIN like in MSL's case.
We can move Marc to ANYONE, to ANY TEAM that needs a slightly damaged top d man during short off season or just wait come rental time. We DON'T have to go this route.........once again.
Well the question is then how much would you be willing to give Anton? $3 mil per? $4 mil per? $5 mil per? Whatever it takes? There are suggestions that in the coming UFA market that Anton might get more than $5 mil per and we're probably talking a term of 5-6 years. Is he worth that much to keep? He's a very good player but he's a second pairing guy. His offense has evaporated as his defense has gotten better. As far as the Rangers signing him quickly--they'd pretty much have to put together a pretty sweet deal up towards the $5 mil per over several years and still Anton might decide he'd like to see what other teams might over after July 1.

If we do give Anton that kind of a contract that's more than we gave McDonagh. IMO it puts our defense salaries out of kilter.

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06-16-2014, 09:22 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by BearishRiggs View Post
No. We're about to compliance Brad Richards and you guys want to start the whole process over again.

Zero interest in Spezza.
You really wouldn't be because Spezza has one year left like Staal.
If you made a deal like this it would be because you have decided that you are not going to give Staal a Girardi like extension next season.
Making this deal (and buying out Richards) might give you enough money to re-sign Stralman. I am also very concerned that we are going to throw a Richards like contract at Stastny who is a very nice player, but not a # 1 IMO.

So it comes down to....would you rather have:
Spezza (one year)
Stralman (long term deal)

or

Staal (one year)
Stastny (long term deal).

I would take the Spezza/Stralman combo.

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06-16-2014, 09:39 AM
  #93
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Glad I was the not the only one to say, NFW for obvious reasons.

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06-16-2014, 09:47 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensNation613 View Post
Okay so a lot of Sens fans are talking about moving Jason Spezza. Marc Staal has come up numerous times in discussions so I'm wondering, would the Rangers fanbase move him out in exchange for Jason? I wasn't going to post anything but I noticed that Stralman won the poll vs Staal so I thought it would be a good time to post this.

Would this deal be enough?
Jason Spezza
Patrick Wiercioch
Rights to Hemsky (?)

for

Marc Staal
Derick Brassard
Rights to Benoit Pouliot (?)


Okay so why do you guys do it?

Spezza gives New York a legit first line center and has shown chemistry with Rick Nash during international play. If the Rangers decide to buy out Richards, this softens the blow. Patrick Wiercioch is a legit PP specialist who has one of the best first passes I've ever seen, and he could help the Rangers playing on the bottom pair.

Why do we do it?
Well, we get a legit top pair defenseman to play with Karlsson, and we get a player who can step onto our 2nd/3rd line while Zibanejad develops during that time. I added the rights to Hemsky and Pouliot because it's a pretty known fact that Hemsky won't be back in Ottawa and I don't know what's going down between Benoit and the Rangers.

What would you tweak?
Is it a good basis for a trade?
Id rather trade Rick Nash than worry about bringing in players who will help with his "chemistry" and get him to score.

I don't mind a Staal/Spezza swap 1 for 1 or a small + coming from the Rangers. Staal is younger. Both have 1 year left. I don't want to trade Brassard.

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Old
06-16-2014, 11:02 AM
  #95
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Spezza is a good player but not worth the likely asking price.

I would hold off on any major player acquisitions until after seeing if Nash rebounds.

I would simply replace Richards with Brassard on the point and add Nash to play the wall on the second unit.

Miller can center Hagelin and MSL. He turns the puck over as much as Richards does.

I really wouldn't make any major moves at forward. The issues with LA stemmed from dzone breakouts.

Trade Girardi for assets, keep Staal and lock him up.

Make Stralman play with Mac, Klein with Staal and McIlrath with Moore.

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06-16-2014, 11:04 AM
  #96
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This is such a Sather move. I personally wouldn't do it.

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06-16-2014, 11:05 AM
  #97
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So we would trade Staal for a 31 year old UFA in Spezza (Richards anyone?).. but people wouldn't move him for a 22 year old ROR?

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06-16-2014, 11:14 AM
  #98
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Have another Nash type player? Shows up when he wants? Nah.

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06-16-2014, 11:18 AM
  #99
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One of our biggest strengths this year was our depth at defense. Staal and Stralman saved us during the Pittsburgh series and played solid in the final. I rather go after Spezza/Thornton/O'Rielly/Stastny in a different manner than trading Staal.

Sather will talk will Staal this off-season and look to resign him. Simple question. Do you want to play here or not. Unless he doesnt want to resign, which would be weird if he said no, then no.

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06-16-2014, 11:32 AM
  #100
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Keep the defensive depth, or find a way to move Staal for a center who isn't 30+ years old and resign Stralman.

Trading Staal straight up for Spezza is just flipping back to the first page of the book they should be closing when they buy out Richards.

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