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Caps - Wings (yeah, Green)

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Old
07-13-2014, 10:23 AM
  #26
Capathetic
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Originally Posted by aOvechkin8 View Post
Offering a High end prospect, for Green is just ridiculous!!!! The guy has never played a full season before. Lets face it, this Mike Green isnt the one from 08-10, that put up 70+ points. Detroit isnt in the need for a guy like this, for just one year especially if they give up a future #2 Center. Detroit needs to let one of their young RHD's into the line up, and that's that.
....and as a Caps fan I hope they do just that.

Last year the Wings just edged the Caps into the playoffs. Washington has made a significant effort to improve their blueline and hopefully all around 5v5 play with Trotz. Detroit hasn't had a great power play and giving them Green would make them a better team as he fills a need in multiple ways. The core in Detroit wants to win now and I'm not sure Sproul is ready to eat up 20+ mins a game and hit the net like Green is proven capable of.

I'd be reluctant as a wings fan for one year of Green as well. Looking back at the Ribeiro deal,Eakin would possibly look nice on the third line or even second lol. Guess it all depends if Holland thinks they have a legit shot for a deep run.

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Old
07-13-2014, 12:35 PM
  #27
Mount Suribachi
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Originally Posted by wings95 View Post
Thanks. I would do that trade.
Me too, you're trading from a strength to fill a weakness. Sheahan for Green is fair value but leaves us too thin down the middle.

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Old
07-13-2014, 01:14 PM
  #28
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These threads are ridiculous. Any trade involving Green would be done with a new contract already worked out with the new team. So the one year rental thing is a joke. The asking price will be a high end prospect and a 1st round pick. The only question remaining is it done now or at the trade deadline.

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Old
07-13-2014, 02:04 PM
  #29
wings95
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Fedfed what is wrong with that trade?

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Old
07-13-2014, 02:26 PM
  #30
ashenhigh
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Originally Posted by Efactor View Post
These threads are ridiculous. Any trade involving Green would be done with a new contract already worked out with the new team. So the one year rental thing is a joke. The asking price will be a high end prospect and a 1st round pick. The only question remaining is it done now or at the trade deadline.
This isnt soccer. New contracts are not decided on before completing trades. In previous threads some caps fans have said he will play third pairing 5v5 minutes against weak competition. If that's the case come trade time, his value will drop even further. Thus, no way he'll bring back a high end prospect and a 1st.

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Old
07-13-2014, 02:36 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Efactor View Post
These threads are ridiculous. Any trade involving Green would be done with a new contract already worked out with the new team. So the one year rental thing is a joke.
Has this happened even, like, once in NHL history...?

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Old
07-13-2014, 04:30 PM
  #32
The Zetterberg Era
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Originally Posted by Liberati0n View Post
Has this happened even, like, once in NHL history...?
Hasek to Detroit kind of, we were also led to believe Chelios agreed before that trade was pushed through.

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Old
07-13-2014, 05:04 PM
  #33
searle
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Originally Posted by Liberati0n View Post
Has this happened even, like, once in NHL history...?
I imagine the idea behind the post was a high end prospect, conditional 1st round pick on Green resigning, and the Caps would probably only do it if they had spoken to Green and he had indicated he was likely to do so.

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07-13-2014, 05:17 PM
  #34
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I'm sure it has happened very occasionally, but it's hilarious how he presented it as if that's the norm and everyone treating him as a "rental" is an idiot, when in reality such a scenario is almost unheard of.

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Old
07-13-2014, 06:02 PM
  #35
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Price is pretty much what he said, but recently these deals usually involve conditional pick. Likely 2nd rounder which turns to 1st if the player resigns or gets traded further.

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Old
07-13-2014, 06:24 PM
  #36
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Fedfed what is wrong with that trade?
The fact that between Burakovsky, Vrana, Kuznetsov, Wilson, and Barber "youth on the wings" is the last thing Caps need.

Basically this trade is filling the need for one team while giving nothing of huge value to another because with logjam at wings another young skilled winger isn't of huge value for the Caps.

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Old
07-14-2014, 08:06 AM
  #37
d99gr81
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Originally Posted by tsweeney View Post
Nope.

We can make do with our kids on D if the price is Sheahan or similar. Only way the Wings should want Green is if they can get him at a bargain because Washington wants out from under his $6M cap hit for this year.
Washington doesn't want him out... only some Green Hating Caps fans.

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Old
07-14-2014, 12:25 PM
  #38
CKJohn
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I enjoy reading everyone over value their own team's prospects and players.

There are two possibilities in this situation.

1) Holland will pull off a Legwand trade and give away a nice prospect for nothing in return. (Yes Holland is that kind of idiot)

2) Holland will pass if the trade is even (Yes, Holland is that kind of idiot)

Either way, Detroit will overpay or the trade won't happen and that's coming from the Detroit side.

I have completely lost all faith in our upper management. I love the Wings, but I HATE the state of the team. The majority of the fans don't want to see the Wings acquire aging vets. We want to see the kids play even if that means we miss the playoffs.

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Old
07-14-2014, 03:49 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by JohanFranzenstein View Post
Not worth giving up a piece of our future top 6 for a UFA, especially when we have Sproul who in a year or two's time could be our PP QB waiting in the wings.
You must be really high on Sheahan, if he becomes a top 6 center we should all be ecstatic, but right now he's looking to be a career third line center, possibly a tweener.

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Old
07-14-2014, 04:06 PM
  #40
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Tatar should only be offered if Green will sign with the Red Wings. The Wings aren't one season of Mike Green away from a Stanley Cup. Please keep in mind this is a team that's going to have Dan Cleary trotting out on the ice come playoff time.

10 seasons of Tatar >>> 1 season of Mike Green

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Old
07-14-2014, 05:15 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Shaman464 View Post
You must be really high on Sheahan, if he becomes a top 6 center we should all be ecstatic, but right now he's looking to be a career third line center, possibly a tweener.
On what do you base this?

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Old
07-14-2014, 05:21 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Shaman464 View Post
You must be really high on Sheahan, if he becomes a top 6 center we should all be ecstatic, but right now he's looking to be a career third line center, possibly a tweener.
So you base this on what a partial first season.

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Old
07-14-2014, 05:24 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by fedfed View Post
The fact that between Burakovsky, Vrana, Kuznetsov, Wilson, and Barber "youth on the wings" is the last thing Caps need.

Basically this trade is filling the need for one team while giving nothing of huge value to another because with logjam at wings another young skilled winger isn't of huge value for the Caps.
Of that group, only Kuznetsov and Wilson have realistic chances of being on the roster this upcoming season, and only Kuznetsov in the top six. If Ovechkin is indeed at right wing, the Capitals' top six left wing options are Troy Brouwer, Brooks Laich, Marcus Johansson, and Evgeny Kuznetsov. You'll notice that those players are also the candidates for 2RW, 2C, and 3C, and there are serious questions about Laich's health and productivity. The Capitals have a definite immediate need for top-six LW help, which Tatar provides. You don't let a prospect pipeline stand in the way of addressing concerns on your NHL team. Depth is a "good problem" to have, and adding Tatar would allow for the Capitals to use some of that prospect depth to address concerns elsewhere (namely, center).

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Old
07-14-2014, 07:36 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
Of that group, only Kuznetsov and Wilson have realistic chances of being on the roster this upcoming season, and only Kuznetsov in the top six. If Ovechkin is indeed at right wing, the Capitals' top six left wing options are Troy Brouwer, Brooks Laich, Marcus Johansson, and Evgeny Kuznetsov. You'll notice that those players are also the candidates for 2RW, 2C, and 3C, and there are serious questions about Laich's health and productivity. The Capitals have a definite immediate need for top-six LW help, which Tatar provides. You don't let a prospect pipeline stand in the way of addressing concerns on your NHL team. Depth is a "good problem" to have, and adding Tatar would allow for the Capitals to use some of that prospect depth to address concerns elsewhere (namely, center).
I agree with some of what you're saying.

I don't think Caps have immediate need at LW. I don't think Ovi at RW is for long (maybe even not until the regular season starts) and Trotz said that he'll start at him at RW and "we'll see". Well, I think he'll see very soon

Ovechkin - Backstrom - Johansson (or Johansson - Backstrom - Ovechkin)
Laich - Kuznetsov - Brouwer

Is that second line good? No. But I think the right way to address it is to put Kuznetsov or Brouwer on wings and then acquire a center. C is a weakness here, not LW. The fact that we have Laich at 2 LW here is a result of trying to cover up for that weakness at C.

I think that the Caps should look to get a center of Tatar's age and caliber (hence Sheahan proposal) instead of getting Tatar and thinking "oh, maybe Kuznetsov or Burakovsky can play center".

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Old
07-14-2014, 11:21 PM
  #45
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On what do you base this?
Scouting reports, his production in the AHL (I live near GR and my father is a season ticket holder), and his play style. He's good, but he really projects to be Helm with a bit more scoring ability, or a poor man's Jordan Staal. A great asset to have, and I don't want to lose him, but, it's extremely unlikely he will be a top 6 center on a contending team.

PS I think it's pretty obvious I am really conservative in my assessments, I think a lot of time people overvalue players and get disappointed. In my case I get surprised from time to time, but when I am wrong, it's a good surprise.

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Old
07-14-2014, 11:23 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Shaman464 View Post
He's good, but he really projects to be Helm with a bit more scoring ability
Wait, Sheahan projects to be like Helm? In no world is this true. Sheahan is a slightly slow-footed playmaking two-way guy. Helm is a super fast energy guy with no playmaking or offensive sense. One slows down the game, the other speeds it up. One passes, the other shoots... and passes poorly.

We must be talking about Larkin here. Helm with more offensive ability is a good way to describe him.

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Old
07-15-2014, 07:49 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by fedfed View Post
I agree with some of what you're saying.

I don't think Caps have immediate need at LW. I don't think Ovi at RW is for long (maybe even not until the regular season starts) and Trotz said that he'll start at him at RW and "we'll see". Well, I think he'll see very soon

Ovechkin - Backstrom - Johansson (or Johansson - Backstrom - Ovechkin)
Laich - Kuznetsov - Brouwer

Is that second line good? No. But I think the right way to address it is to put Kuznetsov or Brouwer on wings and then acquire a center. C is a weakness here, not LW. The fact that we have Laich at 2 LW here is a result of trying to cover up for that weakness at C.

I think that the Caps should look to get a center of Tatar's age and caliber (hence Sheahan proposal) instead of getting Tatar and thinking "oh, maybe Kuznetsov or Burakovsky can play center".
We are not trading Green. I see this playing out to start the season. Wilson will provide a ton of room for Ovie and Backstrom and Brouwer provides power as well to second line. Laich is not top 6 and the Claw line will be in place once again. Burakovsky will get a chance to start the season the way hes been playing in previous camps, as well as the dev camp that just ended. I think they will give him the ten games to start the season to see how it goes. Due to the abundance of RW's they either try Wilson on LW or move Ovie back. They will give Wilson a chance to succeed this season and will not be playing 6 minutes a night on the 4th line. If Burakovsky doesn't pan out this year then you slot Mojo back up and put Beagle in on the 4th line. If we make any deals at this point it will be to unload Erskine and if Burakovsky does well probably move Mojo as well. Personally I would keep Mojo with his very nice contract.

Ovechkin - Backstrom - Wilson

Burakovsky - Kuznetsov - Brouwer

Chimera - Laich - Ward

Fehr - Mojo - Latta

Beagle



Orpik/Green

Niskanen/Carlson

Alzner/Orlov

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Old
07-15-2014, 09:22 AM
  #48
searle
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Originally Posted by d99gr81 View Post

Ovechkin - Backstrom - Wilson

Burakovsky - Kuznetsov - Brouwer

Chimera - Laich - Ward

Fehr - Mojo - Latta

Beagle



Orpik/Green

Niskanen/Carlson

Alzner/Orlov
I would be very happy with this lineup once you realised you accidentally put Orpik and Alzner in the wrong places

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Old
07-15-2014, 09:48 AM
  #49
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Losing Sheahan is not worth one year of Green. Caps would be dumb not to make that trade though in my opinion. They need centers and you aren't gunna get much more for an often injured Green in the last year of his contract. Sheahan will be good and scored at a 47 point pace in his rookie season (half season) while being solid defensively as a 3C. The Wings aren't getting rid of him.

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Old
07-15-2014, 09:54 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Shaman464 View Post
You must be really high on Sheahan, if he becomes a top 6 center we should all be ecstatic, but right now he's looking to be a career third line center, possibly a tweener.
He produced at just under a 50 point pace over 42 games while playing very solid defensively. If he's a 50+ point player + great/solid defense in his prime, or basically what we were hoping for when we signed Weiss, than he's an excellent 2C. He's only 22, he has that potential in my opinion.

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