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Carolina / Montreal Trade Proposal

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Old
10-26-2005, 10:38 PM
  #1
Queen
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Carolina / Montreal Trade Proposal

To Carolina:

Mike Ribeiro
Pierre Dagenais
Ron Hainsey

To Montreal:

Josef Vasicek
Andrew Hutchinson

Okay. Mike Ribeiro came off a breakout season in 03-04 and would add to Carolina's offensive talent. Pierre Dagenais has been underachieving in Montreal and only plays well with his buddy Mickey Ribs. Ron Hainsey needs a change of scenery to get his career on track, however that contract of his is a downer.

Andrew Hutchinson is a very strong AHL player that has shown signs of NHL-level play. He's a physical blue-liner, something Montreal needs. Josef Vasicek is a large center that could bring size to Montreal's offense. He's been a contributor over the past few years and he's coming off of a very strong campaign overseas in 04-05 during the lockout.

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Old
10-26-2005, 10:48 PM
  #2
Michael Karlstrom II
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I would definitely say that it is clear this proposal was made by a Montreal Canadien fan.

I myself, would probably think about gambling on Hainsey, but 29 other GM were given the option to and declined. His current trade value is nill.

Daignenais is okay if a team needs a forward because of injury problems or something but is a waiver wire value in a trade. Carolina has absolutely no use for him at the moment.

I don't know much about Hutchison but if he really does have an NHL future in him, then there is no way he gets thrown into the trade.

Ribeiro to me is a guy who will always cause his team some problems. He cant be predictably counted on at crunch time. He may score points, but they seem to be meaningless points largely. A team cant hitch their wagon to him and expect him to carry them.

I think the jury is out on the upper limit potential of Vasicek but his raw tool package is impressive. His contract is very nice and likely wont get ridiculous anytime soon.

If Carolina did happen to want Ribeiro and was for some reason needing to deal Vasicek, than I think probably a high draft pick would be needed thrown in from Montreal to balance out the exchange. Probably a second imo. I still wouldn't make the deal myself, but at least I think it would be close to ballpark where fair value would lay.

 
Old
10-26-2005, 10:57 PM
  #3
HuskyFlames
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
Ribeiro to me is a guy who will always cause his team some problems. He cant be predictably counted on at crunch time. He may score points, but they seem to be meaningless points largely. A team cant hitch their wagon to him and expect him to carry them.
Didn't RIberio score the tying AND winning goal for the Habs the other night?

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Old
10-26-2005, 11:12 PM
  #4
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- Hutchinson is a powerplay specialist. Not a 'physical blue-liner'.
- Dagenais has zero trade value.
- Hainsey has zero trade value.
- Vasicek is a winger these days.
- Carolina already has 8 defensemen on their roster.

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Old
10-26-2005, 11:15 PM
  #5
AvsGuy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
Ribeiro to me is a guy who will always cause his team some problems. He cant be predictably counted on at crunch time. He may score points, but they seem to be meaningless points largely. A team cant hitch their wagon to him and expect him to carry them.
and you expect to get a player like that for Josef Vasicek? Ribeiro puts up solid consistent points, which unless I'm woefully uninformed, is more than Vasicek does.

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Old
10-26-2005, 11:53 PM
  #6
Michael Karlstrom II
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Vasicek has not played up to his potential so far in his career point scoring wise... that is true, but he plays a far more complete game away from the puck than most guys do from what Ive seen. He has had some bad luck with playing on some crappy teams too. Sometimes not having good linemates or being used in the wrong ways impacts on a guys production.

Ribeiro does score a bit when I watch him but his game away from the puck seems really weak. I think the biggest selling point on him is how much his own teams fans love to put him in trade rumors. If a guy like this gets enough PP time playing with quality offensive gems like Koivu or Kovalev in a more wide open style of play like the Canadiens tend to employ, than i guess he will put up some points.

I wouldnt want Ribeiro on my team. I'd take Vasinek any day of the weak. I think my team will be better with Vasicek than Ribeiro. It would take at least a second rounder before I'd even consider changing my mind and I would still only make the deal if I had something else lined up to ship Ribeiro on.

Im not the GM of Carolina though, so i guess if someone else was, they might evaluate the deal differently. I think though that most posters make trades they think will help their own team so i would suggest that the origional poster here would admit he'd rather have Vascinek than Reibido himself.

Daignais and Hainsey are just not enough sweetner to get the deal done IMO

 
Old
10-27-2005, 12:53 AM
  #7
ChemiseBleuHonnete
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I'm not a Ribeiro fan, but as a habs fan, I've seen what he can do. It happens that what he can do is exactly what a second liner should. On top of it, he can make highlight reel plays. However, he's slow and bad defensively and that doesn't fit very well in our system since we're a very fast and defensive sound team. But he's by far the best player in the deal. There's no reason to trade Ribeiro for a such return... When I think about it, why trading Ribeiro? He's good and [according to hfboards*] carries very little trade value.

*a very bad source when it comes down to trade value

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Old
10-27-2005, 06:51 AM
  #8
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Ribeiro's developing his game away from the puck, and he doesn't get any PP time with Koivu or Kovalev.

Montreal shouldn't move him right now.

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Old
10-27-2005, 07:32 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
Vasicek has not played up to his potential so far in his career point scoring wise... that is true, but he plays a far more complete game away from the puck than most guys do from what Ive seen. He has had some bad luck with playing on some crappy teams too. Sometimes not having good linemates or being used in the wrong ways impacts on a guys production.

Ribeiro does score a bit when I watch him but his game away from the puck seems really weak. I think the biggest selling point on him is how much his own teams fans love to put him in trade rumors. If a guy like this gets enough PP time playing with quality offensive gems like Koivu or Kovalev in a more wide open style of play like the Canadiens tend to employ, than i guess he will put up some points.

I wouldnt want Ribeiro on my team. I'd take Vasinek any day of the weak. I think my team will be better with Vasicek than Ribeiro. It would take at least a second rounder before I'd even consider changing my mind and I would still only make the deal if I had something else lined up to ship Ribeiro on.

Im not the GM of Carolina though, so i guess if someone else was, they might evaluate the deal differently. I think though that most posters make trades they think will help their own team so i would suggest that the origional poster here would admit he'd rather have Vascinek than Reibido himself.

Daignais and Hainsey are just not enough sweetner to get the deal done IMO
Well are Carolina a better team than Montreal?

I see where you're getting at, but I think in this deal the guy everyone loves to hate (Ribeiro) is the best player in this deal, if you surround Ribeiro with the right linemates, his defensive deficiencies aren't as apparent...Not to mention that he's imporved defensively, he'll never be great defensively, but as long as he's responsible and puts up points in a secondary role (60pt range) he's more than fine as a second line center...

P.S.- You absolutely murdered both their names in that last paragraph no big deal, just funny....

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Old
10-27-2005, 08:32 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvsGuy
and you expect to get a player like that for Josef Vasicek? Ribeiro puts up solid consistent points, which unless I'm woefully uninformed, is more than Vasicek does.
Turns out, you're woefully uninformed.

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Old
10-27-2005, 10:14 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvsGuy
and you expect to get a player like that for Josef Vasicek? Ribeiro puts up solid consistent points, which unless I'm woefully uninformed, is more than Vasicek does.
nowhere did he state he expects a player like that for vasicek... he was making points about ribeiro...

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Old
10-27-2005, 11:07 AM
  #12
Habsaku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
Vasicek has not played up to his potential so far in his career point scoring wise... that is true, but he plays a far more complete game away from the puck than most guys do from what Ive seen. He has had some bad luck with playing on some crappy teams too. Sometimes not having good linemates or being used in the wrong ways impacts on a guys production.

Ribeiro does score a bit when I watch him but his game away from the puck seems really weak. I think the biggest selling point on him is how much his own teams fans love to put him in trade rumors. If a guy like this gets enough PP time playing with quality offensive gems like Koivu or Kovalev in a more wide open style of play like the Canadiens tend to employ, than i guess he will put up some points.

I wouldnt want Ribeiro on my team. I'd take Vasinek any day of the weak. I think my team will be better with Vasicek than Ribeiro. It would take at least a second rounder before I'd even consider changing my mind and I would still only make the deal if I had something else lined up to ship Ribeiro on.

Im not the GM of Carolina though, so i guess if someone else was, they might evaluate the deal differently. I think though that most posters make trades they think will help their own team so i would suggest that the origional poster here would admit he'd rather have Vascinek than Reibido himself.

Daignais and Hainsey are just not enough sweetner to get the deal done IMO
If anything, you'd have to throw a lot more then Vasicek to get Ribeiro. I dont see how in any circumstances someone would take an enigma over a guy who got 65 points playing 3rd line minutes. This year he has clearly improved his skills, most notably his skating and he's making a conscious effort in getting his defensive game to an acceptable level. The philly game was a clear indicator as to how he can step it up against bigger teams and how he can play when things go his way. He has struggled for the first few games yet he is only 1 point behind Koivu who's playing with a motivated Kovalev. Some people fall in love way too fast with the 6'6" argument.
Also, Ribeiro has never played with Koivu and Kovalev on the PP, righ now, he gets 2nd minute time with Bonk and Ryder. Add to the fact the Habs are no way in hell an wide open playing team, they are among the 5 most systematic teams in the league and have been since Claude Julien has took over the reigns. The offensive chances generated are a product of a very strong defensive game, we're 2nd in shots allowed for a reason. We barely give up odd man rushes, I dont think philly had a single one tuesday.
I cant see how Vasicek can come close to Ribeiro, how many times have we heard of people who dont put all their tools together, I personnally think its because they never had them to begin with. Fans just want to see it that way. Hell, they are both the same age and only one of them has developped into the scoring player he was supposed to be.

I love complete players, but Vasicek isnt a Lehtinen, right now, he's more of a Jan Bulis.

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Old
10-27-2005, 11:09 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seph
Turns out, you're woefully uninformed.
How? Ribeiro outscored him by 20 points.

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Old
10-27-2005, 11:31 AM
  #14
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Carolina has Whitney and Stillman... can't see any reason why they would want Ribeiro too. They have Brendl... so why Dagenais? Hey, didn't they have Martin Vagner and Jesse Lane? So no Hainsey either.

It doesn't really matter how Ribeiro and Vasicek compare head-to-head, because it just doesn't seem to be a trade which in any way fits with anything Carolina might need. No incentive there.

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10-27-2005, 04:49 PM
  #15
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From now on, I think I'll just ignore every trade proposal involving Ron Hainsey. Can't you people understand that Ronner has absolutely zero trade value? What's the point of trying to ship him to every single NHL team? Being a former 1st round pick makes him valuable? Your logic is flawed if that's how you see it.

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Old
10-27-2005, 06:12 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen
To Carolina:

Mike Ribeiro
Pierre Dagenais
Ron Hainsey

To Montreal:

Josef Vasicek
Andrew Hutchinson

Okay. Mike Ribeiro came off a breakout season in 03-04 and would add to Carolina's offensive talent. Pierre Dagenais has been underachieving in Montreal and only plays well with his buddy Mickey Ribs. Ron Hainsey needs a change of scenery to get his career on track, however that contract of his is a downer.

Andrew Hutchinson is a very strong AHL player that has shown signs of NHL-level play. He's a physical blue-liner, something Montreal needs. Josef Vasicek is a large center that could bring size to Montreal's offense. He's been a contributor over the past few years and he's coming off of a very strong campaign overseas in 04-05 during the lockout.
I would not even trade Ribeiro for these 2 players...

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Old
10-27-2005, 09:22 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by HABS456
I would not even trade Ribeiro for these 2 players...
Agreed. Vasicek is interesting, and Hutchinson promising, but neither do anything to improve the team now, or even next season. Hutchinson has to be at least a year away from NHL-calibre play, and Vasicek isn't as consistent as Ribeiro. Leave the team as it is.

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Old
10-28-2005, 01:11 PM
  #18
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I'm not a big Ribiero fan, and have included him in many proposals...

that being said, I don't want to throw him away either, Vasicek is intruiging but doesn't bring enough to the table to be worth ribs in my books

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10-30-2005, 10:13 PM
  #19
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Both teams would be losing at this trade.
Seriously...

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Old
10-31-2005, 03:07 AM
  #20
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i wouldnt want ribiero on the canes - certainly not for vasicek. no one seems to see any value here.

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