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Rangers send Petr Prucha to Hartford

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Old
10-31-2005, 01:33 PM
  #101
Fletch
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Nobody really looks good...

on Jagr's line. That's what happens when you defer everything to one guy...

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11-01-2005, 11:14 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Fletch
on Jagr's line. That's what happens when you defer everything to one guy...
Move Rucchin to left wing on Jagr's line. Straka can play second line center.

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11-01-2005, 12:25 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by AXN
Move Rucchin to left wing on Jagr's line. Straka can play second line center.
Forget that, put prucha on Jagr's line. And for ***k sake call up Hollweg. Let's have hollywood out there hitting everything that moves like a human wreckingball on skates

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11-01-2005, 12:47 PM
  #104
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Axn...

that puts two people out of position (yeah, Straka's played center, but really a wing).

I really do not know who to put there. Crazy enough as it sounds, perhaps it's a guy who doesn't have a lot of skill - like a Nieminen, or someone along those lines, who may just drive to the net and shoot. At even strength, the line's not getting much done, so there's little hard.

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11-01-2005, 07:21 PM
  #105
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shouldn't Prucha be up by now? Hartford doesn't play in the next 2 days, and I don't think Renney is warming to FedFed and Taffy.

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11-01-2005, 11:00 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davisian
I think its pretty clear.. ANY amount of time in the NHL, is better than lots of time in the AHL. ESPECIALLY when we're talking about a kid who's already been playing in a pro league for a couple of seasons, and has earned his spot with the varsity.
Manny Malhotra or Jason Spezza?

Ignore the talent levels and first-round expectations for a second. Just compare their development paths. Are you willing to tell me that Manny Malhotra benefited, at all, from 6 minutes a game when he could have been playing 12-15 minutes in junior or the minors? Now look at Spezza. Ottawa took their time, got him the proper minutes, and let him play in crucial situations at all times. It's not necessarily the number that is significant, it's the situations that these guys are playing in. The six minutes that Prucha is getting are not coming in key situations; hell, they're not even coming in normal situations. That line is put out against the other fourth line, or in place of the third line after a recent PK. No tactical situations, no must-win battles...they're just playing filler minutes.

You're also very much making an assumption that Prucha was playing big minutes in the Czech Republic last year. Truth is, he was on the kid/energy line, getting 10-12 max, often times 8-10 minutes. They were used more efficiently than the 4th line here, but 4th line is 4th line, none the less. Give this kid a season, let him play big, important minutes in a North American game, and then watch him become a solid contributor next year. And hey, it doesn't even have to be next season. What is 30 games going to hurt? Furthermore, if we're in some sort of rebuild and crying for younger players to garner minutes, what is the rush? Why does he need to be here now, and what is it going to help having him develop that much quicker (the probability of that option making it so risky it's not even worth it anyways)?

I've already stated my opinion on why I believe Hossa, Federov and Taffe being here is the right move for the immediate future. I don't necessarily feel like delving into it again, because there isn't much more to explain; rather I'd be re-stating, which is pointless. I will say this however, the point isn't necessarily about earning ice because none of the fourth have stood out by miles. As I said earlier, Prucha is a sentimental favourite, and I hold to my suggestion that he receives special, "tinted glasses" treatment from some of you. When he makes a good play it's amplified all the more, and when he makes a bad one it is marginalized. The same is true for the ones he competes with, only opposite; their mistakes are amplified and contributions marginalized. Not one of the four mentioned have separated themselves so much that they deserve the permanent position. So, eligibilities and experience factors being what they are, I think the right decision was made.

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11-02-2005, 12:12 AM
  #107
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I don't think Manny's problems stemmed from the fact that he only got limited ice time. His first season, he played regularly, getting around 8-10 minutes a game and I think most people thought it was a rather successful rookie campaign. His problems started 1999 when the Rangers signed Tim Taylor at the insistance of Muckler. That season he didn't even get into games regularly, much less get regular ice time, before finally being sent back to Juniors. If he had continued to receive ice time in the first 3-4 years of his career, I think things would have been quite different. As it turned out, he needed to be traded and then waived before finding a situation when he now gets solid ice time and is finally showing that he deserves it.

As for Prucha, I believe he's ready for the NHL. And while he needs to be eased in--he shouldn't be playing a ton of minues, but should be getting a fairly regular shift at even strength and some power play time thrown in. Somewhere around 11-13 minutes--what Hossa is getting now. And if he uses that ice time contructively, then we can argue about more.

The only reason why he can't learn at the NHL level is because he's waiver exempt. I have real doubts about Fedorov and am quickly souring on Hossa (Taffe, I haven't seen enough, but he's already used up several of his chances and doesn't have to much time left); I think Prucha has a much greater chance of being here and productive for the long haul. Why spin our wheels with a bunch rejects from other teams, when we can be easing a player into our lineup who might very well become a core member of something good?

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11-02-2005, 12:23 AM
  #108
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Why the souring on Hossa? I don't get that at all. Did I miss something? Taffe has only around 4 minutes of ice time in two games right? and Fed Fed yeah I agree, somewhat lazy and doesn't give his all I could care less if he went back to Hartford or not. Prucha is definitely someone who should be up here while Rucinsky is injured.

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11-02-2005, 12:59 AM
  #109
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Minutes for a developing hockey player are like milk for growing bones. If I'm the Rangers I bite the bullet put Prucha in Hartford and let him play his *** off. Let him pile up game after game where he's getting between 15-20 minutes a night. Sure, bringing him up right now sounds good especially with Ruca's injury. I hope they only bring up if he's going to get at least 10-12 minutes a game

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11-02-2005, 01:39 AM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE
Manny Malhotra or Jason Spezza?

Ignore the talent levels and first-round expectations for a second. Just compare their development paths. Are you willing to tell me that Manny Malhotra benefited, at all, from 6 minutes a game when he could have been playing 12-15 minutes in junior or the minors? Now look at Spezza. Ottawa took their time, got him the proper minutes, and let him play in crucial situations at all times. It's not necessarily the number that is significant, it's the situations that these guys are playing in. The six minutes that Prucha is getting are not coming in key situations; hell, they're not even coming in normal situations. That line is put out against the other fourth line, or in place of the third line after a recent PK. No tactical situations, no must-win battles...they're just playing filler minutes.

You're also very much making an assumption that Prucha was playing big minutes in the Czech Republic last year. Truth is, he was on the kid/energy line, getting 10-12 max, often times 8-10 minutes. They were used more efficiently than the 4th line here, but 4th line is 4th line, none the less. Give this kid a season, let him play big, important minutes in a North American game, and then watch him become a solid contributor next year. And hey, it doesn't even have to be next season. What is 30 games going to hurt? Furthermore, if we're in some sort of rebuild and crying for younger players to garner minutes, what is the rush? Why does he need to be here now, and what is it going to help having him develop that much quicker (the probability of that option making it so risky it's not even worth it anyways)?

I've already stated my opinion on why I believe Hossa, Federov and Taffe being here is the right move for the immediate future. I don't necessarily feel like delving into it again, because there isn't much more to explain; rather I'd be re-stating, which is pointless. I will say this however, the point isn't necessarily about earning ice because none of the fourth have stood out by miles. As I said earlier, Prucha is a sentimental favourite, and I hold to my suggestion that he receives special, "tinted glasses" treatment from some of you. When he makes a good play it's amplified all the more, and when he makes a bad one it is marginalized. The same is true for the ones he competes with, only opposite; their mistakes are amplified and contributions marginalized. Not one of the four mentioned have separated themselves so much that they deserve the permanent position. So, eligibilities and experience factors being what they are, I think the right decision was made.
Though you gotta add that Spezza could run a PP really well in the NHL at the age of 18, he didn't have a good overall game but he where still great on the PP. Thats one of the reason the little ice time he got where in key situations.

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11-02-2005, 03:30 AM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
that puts two people out of position (yeah, Straka's played center, but really a wing).
Just to comment on this really quickly...

If you guys are having problem at centre.... Straka has played C extensively in his career, and only in 2001 was he moved to wing on a nightly basis playing with Kovalev and with lang between them.
Last year in Czech Republic he switched from C to wing pretty much all the time in Plzen.

I agree, though... In the new NHL, he's better suited as a winger, and he offers his team more on that position.

Also, I've only seen 3 or 4 Ranger games... And I didn't notice on the point on the PP. Was it just me...? Or he doesn't play there for the Rangers? (IMO; MUCH better than having Malik there...and you rarely get scored on by the SH team, cos of Marty's speed).

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11-02-2005, 04:55 AM
  #112
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The most logical candidate to replace Rucinsky would be Petr Prucha, a 23-year-old Czech winger. The organization is high on him, but hasn't been able to find consistent ice time for him. Prucha went down to AHL Hartford on Friday and played Saturday and Sunday for the Wolf Pack, scoring a goal in each game, and adding an assist. But the Rangers haven't recalled him, and coach Tom Renney indicated they might not rush to do so.

"We're looking at people," Renney said. "We have to get a feel for who can do what. We're not experimenting. We put a lineup on the ice (Monday) that we think can win for us. At the same time, we do have to see how people will react and respond to the various dynamics of the game. Some of the kids in Hartford, we know what they can offer. Some of the acquisitions that we've made, we're not quite sure yet."

Renney was most probably talking about Fedor Fedorov, whom the Rangers acquired from Vancouver three weeks ago. The 6-4, 240-pound Fedorov, who is Sergei Fedorov's kid brother, has played the last three games but has been barely noticeable
http://www.nj.com/rangers/ledger/ind...640.xml&coll=1

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11-02-2005, 05:10 AM
  #113
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Center Jeff Taffe was sent to Hartford (AHL) on a conditioning assignment
http://www.thejournalnews.com/apps/p.../1108/SPORTS01

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11-02-2005, 08:04 AM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken
Why the souring on Hossa? I don't get that at all. Did I miss something?
Becuase unless his linemates get the puck to him when he is exactly in the right spot right near the goal, he is utterly invisible. He refuses to do any of the work that is required to create chances himself.

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11-02-2005, 08:13 AM
  #115
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Why send Taffe on a conditioning assignment when you've already got an empty roster spot you're not using? Are 2 players coming up? Prucha and Purinton?

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11-02-2005, 08:32 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE
Manny Malhotra or Jason Spezza?

Ignore the talent levels and first-round expectations for a second. Just compare their development paths. Are you willing to tell me that Manny Malhotra benefited, at all, from 6 minutes a game when he could have been playing 12-15 minutes in junior or the minors? Now look at Spezza. Ottawa took their time, got him the proper minutes, and let him play in crucial situations at all times. It's not necessarily the number that is significant, it's the situations that these guys are playing in. The six minutes that Prucha is getting are not coming in key situations; hell, they're not even coming in normal situations. That line is put out against the other fourth line, or in place of the third line after a recent PK. No tactical situations, no must-win battles...they're just playing filler minutes.

Apples and Oranges..

Manny didn't have the time to develop, he didn't play against Men in Europe for 2 seasons before coming to the Rangers.

And regardless of the time in Europe, he was still playing against Men. And 6-8 minutes in the NHL is better for his development than anything else.Hossa, Fedorov and Taffe have not earned the time that Prucha did.

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11-02-2005, 08:27 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davisian
Apples and Oranges..

Manny didn't have the time to develop, he didn't play against Men in Europe for 2 seasons before coming to the Rangers.

And regardless of the time in Europe, he was still playing against Men. And 6-8 minutes in the NHL is better for his development than anything else.Hossa, Fedorov and Taffe have not earned the time that Prucha did.
If you believe that Prucha was miles ahead of the other two (and I say two because Fedorov has clearly shown LESS than the other three), you're not watching.

Prucha moves his feet and that's why people like him, but since when is simply putting in an effort synonymous with earning time? Have your standards here become so low in the last seven years that you will simply take anyone that gives a damn?

No, Prucha showed little more than the rest of them and absolutely nothing on the top line, and it's because of that, in combination with the eligibility and asset management issues, that he's been sent down.

Let me also address this: And 6-8 minutes in the NHL is better for his development than anything else.

As I said, he isn't learning anything by playing 6-8 minutes a game. You have to understand that there is so much more to learn other than the mental side, once you get the biggest stage. Sitting on the bench and playing the odd filler shift doesn't cut it for a rookie in Petr's position. Just because he's played against men for two years doesn't mean he's ready, and doesn't mean that he's got nothing left to prove at the minor league level.

And to be honest it all showed when he was playing. He clearly looked like a 170 lbs. forward who couldn't adjust to the size of opponents in the corners and the defensive positioning required of him during the game. Everyone marvels at his shot, but they all forgot that he was nearly as bad as Fedorov in the defensive zone in many of the games he played.

That's why you send him to the minors. There he can learn the defensive side, play important, big-role minutes, and adjust himself to the North American game at a level much closer to what he was playing at home.

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11-02-2005, 10:17 PM
  #118
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I disagree. I think that Prucha showed that he was completely at home in the NHL. Yes, he still has to learn some things. But he showed that he is at least worthy of being given a chance to play 12-13 minutes on the 2nd line.

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11-03-2005, 08:04 AM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE
If you believe that Prucha was miles ahead of the other two (and I say two because Fedorov has clearly shown LESS than the other three), you're not watching.

Prucha moves his feet and that's why people like him, but since when is simply putting in an effort synonymous with earning time? Have your standards here become so low in the last seven years that you will simply take anyone that gives a damn?

No, Prucha showed little more than the rest of them and absolutely nothing on the top line, and it's because of that, in combination with the eligibility and asset management issues, that he's been sent down.

Let me also address this: And 6-8 minutes in the NHL is better for his development than anything else.

As I said, he isn't learning anything by playing 6-8 minutes a game. You have to understand that there is so much more to learn other than the mental side, once you get the biggest stage. Sitting on the bench and playing the odd filler shift doesn't cut it for a rookie in Petr's position. Just because he's played against men for two years doesn't mean he's ready, and doesn't mean that he's got nothing left to prove at the minor league level.

And to be honest it all showed when he was playing. He clearly looked like a 170 lbs. forward who couldn't adjust to the size of opponents in the corners and the defensive positioning required of him during the game. Everyone marvels at his shot, but they all forgot that he was nearly as bad as Fedorov in the defensive zone in many of the games he played.

That's why you send him to the minors. There he can learn the defensive side, play important, big-role minutes, and adjust himself to the North American game at a level much closer to what he was playing at home.



I'm not watching??

Hossa DOESN'T move his feet, and yet he's more deserving of 2nd line time than Prucha?? Who has scored with his little time. Have your standards sunk so low that you'll simply take someone who doesn;t seem to give a damn, but has some size?

Prucha played ONE game on the top line.. ONE..

YOU have to understand that 6-8 minutes in the NHL is better for a guy like Prucha than 20 mins a night in Hartford. The speed of the game, the lifestyle, the coaching, the system, the bonding with the teammates all comes into play.

He was not anywhere near as bad as Fedorov in the D zone, and he was much better than the bigger Hossa in the corners, as far as fighting through checks.


As I 've said before, AHL is not the end of the world for Prucha, but it does nothing to advance his game at this point.

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